National ID Card Included In Democratic Immigration Bill

While I think this is in general a BAD idea, before you guys spin up too far, the whole "tracking you by satellite" thing is just wrong. I know it's a popular ATS meme, but no. Just no.

The parts used in ePassport, RealID and this kludge are what we like to call "h-field" or "near-field" parts. You can't read them at any distance. They are not the same as the parts used in toll passes or the PASS card. And, no, no new magic technology will make that work at a distance. It just doesn't work that way.

You'll have to get within a couple of feet of one to read it, even with the best stuff that's not yet on the market. Most readers will have to be within a few inches. No cell towers, no satellites, no cops driving down the street, no hacker kiddies with wardriving setups.

If they had half a brain, they'd also set the cards up so that you have to have your thumb on it for it to read even then, it's very easy to do, but being the gubmint, I'd be surprised if they were smart enough to use the very nice encryption the parts offer, much less requiring the user's assent.

BTW, Bertroche is a dolt, RFID implants are also near-field, e-field ones won't work as implants, and so "microchipping" immigrants doesn't give you a way to track them; at best his idiot plan is a "catch and release" program: If you have them in hand to implant them, just get rid of them then.

reply to post by Bedlam


From what i understood in order for some kind of actual RFID chip tracking scheme to work the whole country would have to be blanketed with readers. Then you'd have to hope and pray the power never goes out. RFID is very low power though correct? Or is it more correct to say passive? So it would have to be readers on top of readers.

A lot of the theories seem a bit unfeasible. Not that i'm for the proposal or anything. I just think people are going off on the deep end.

I'm not sure they'll get this bill through before mid-term elections though. The only other way to get it done before midterm is for the president to just come out and declare amnesty. I don't think it's gonna happen because people would get pretty stupid in this country and Obama knows that.

[edit on 1-5-2010 by antonia]

Originally posted by antoniaOr is it more correct to say passive? So it would have to be readers on top of readers.

A lot of the theories seem a bit unfeasible. Not that i'm for the proposal or anything. I just think people are going off on the deep end.

The implants are all passive. You have to be very very close, within inches for most readers, although we tooled one together that can do a couple of feet if conditions are just right.

The parts used on the ePassport, RealID and this are the same sort of part, in terms of how it's powered and read. Not that I like the idea, it's just not an OMG tracking!! thing.

That said, the Repubs could get it scuttled by tacking on an amendment requiring them to be used in a federal positive voting ID mandate - one known voter, one known vote sort of thing, which the Dems would abort in a blink.