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Originally posted by Gabo-
reply to post by loner007
I am not an expert, but the wood in these pictures looks too young to be 4800 years old. Is anyone better informed on the subject? Also i found this article that suggests that there is not enough water on earth to place a boat on that mountain, I don't know how they came up with this conclusion but it is something to consider.
cosmiclog.msnbc.msn.com...
Gopher wood or gopherwood is a term used once in the Bible, for the substance from which Noah's ark was built. Gen 6:14 states that Noah was to build the Ark of גפר, gofer, more commonly gopher wood, a word not otherwise known in the Bible or in Hebrew.
Its identity has not been established with certainty. Older English translations, including the King James Version (17th century), simply leave it untranslated.
[edit] Question over identity
The Greek Septuagint (3rd–1st centuries BC) translated it as xylon tetragonon, "squared timber".[1] Similarly, the Latin Vulgate (5th century AD) rendered it as lignis levigatis (lævigatis, in the Clementine Vulgate), "smoothed (possibly planed) wood".
The Jewish Encyclopedia believes it was most likely a translation of the Babylonian "gushure i÷ erini" (cedar-beams), or the Assyrian "giparu" (reed).[2]
Many modern English translations tend to favour cypress (although otherwise the word for "cypress" in Biblical Hebrew is brosh). This was espoused (among others) by Adam Clarke, a Methodist theologian famous for his commentary on the Bible: Clarke cited the resemblance between Greek word for cypress, kuparisson and the Hebrew word gophar.
Other suggestions include pine, cedar, fir, ebony, wicker, juniper, acacia, boxwood, slimed bulrushes and resinous wood, and even American trees such as Cladrastis kentukea (American yellowwood), although the latter did not exist in the region the ark was supposedly built.
Others, noting the physical similarity between the Hebrew letters g and k, suggest that the word may actually be kopher, the Hebrew word meaning "pitch"; thus kopher wood would be pitched wood. Recent suggestions have included a lamination process (to strengthen the Ark), or a now-lost type of tree, but there is no consensus.[3]
Cypress Pine late 12c., from O.Fr. cipres, from L. cyparissus, from Gk. kyparissos, from an unknown pre-Greek Mediterranean language. Perhaps related to Heb. gopher, name of the tree whose wood was used to make the ark (Gen. vi.14).[/qoute]
Originally posted by daggyz
So far from what I've read everyone is debunking everything else related to religion. Even if this discovery was shown to be the actual ark, people would still not believe that the Bible is an accurate record of history. For years many have debunked the possibility of a flood so recent and the existence of an ark. If this is it (and it seems it is?) it will make very little difference to those who don't want to believe it because believing it means the Bible is true and if it's true it means we are accountable to God as it says. And if we don't 'want' to be accountable then we find other things to critisize or debunk to make us feel better in our unbelief - like evolution (which actually requires more faith than one believing in God).
Apart from that, to find a 4000-6000 year old wooden structure still intact is amazing. You wonder what else lies under the ice caps and mountain tops yet to be revealed as we go through a short natural warming period.
Originally posted by stereologist
reply to post by letthereaderunderstand
The boat was not found in Khufu's pyramid. The flood in Mayan mythology is from the Popul Vuh and not a water flood.
In Maya mythology as expressed in the Popol Vuh the creator gods attempted to create creatures who would worship them three times before finally succeeding in creating a race of humans that would pay proper homage to their creatores. The three previous creations were destroyed. The third race of humans carved from wood were destroyed by a flood, mauled by wild animals and smashed by their own tools and utensils. Maya flood myths recorded by Diego de Landa and in the Chilam Balam of Chumayel holds that the only survivors of the flood were the four Bacabs who took their places as upholders of the four corners of the sky.
The result is a spectacular cedar-wood boat 43.6m (143') long, its timbers held together by ropes. It is not clear how the boat was made water-tight. Early theories that soaking in water caused the wood to swell and thus become water-tight did not prove effective with the modern reconstruction "Horizon of Min" based on boats found in the Wadi Gawasis excavation and the reconstructers had recourse to traditional fibre caulking reinforced by beeswax. There is no sign of such measures on the Khufu boat, which may simply mean that the boat was never floated. The name "Djedefre", Khufu's son and successor, is found on some of the slabs of stone that sealed the pit, indicating that the boat was put there by Khufu's son.[/qoute]
Peace
Originally posted by PowerSlave
The actual biblical tale is most likely an exaggerated story. However, the base for the story is likely real. With so many different peoples having a similar story, I would be inclined to believe there is SOME truth to the story of Noah.
I think one needs to keep their mind open in regards to the details in the bible, for example the two by two story...
Try to imagine, Noah taking two of each animal that was available to him, or perhaps just two by two domesticated or farm animals.
Now imagine a major regional flood. For one thing, how could anyone even know the true extent of the flood. Noah would more than likely assume it was the entire world, not like he could whip out the laptop hop on ATS and find out if th eflood had reached his American brothers.
Personally I think the bible needs to be a tempered read. Perhaps some of the words of god are as written and still others modified, altered, blanks filled in, and some interpretation left to the authors.
Does not mean the bible is a fabrication, nor does it mean it all needs to be taken word for word in a literal sense.
Most people tend to exaggerate when they tell a story.
I believe there was a "Noah", who experienced an incredible flood and survived with the help of spiritual guidance. Regardless this is a great find even if it is not the ark
Originally posted by SmokeytheHair
Lol... Why are they claiming to have found a story book characters boat?? Don't they know it's not real?
Tsk. Tsk. Tsk.
When will people ever learn?
rather than blind obedience and belief.
Originally posted by Xtrozero
I don't know, but 4000 year old wood 13k feet up is interesting. Also it is hard to debunk that 4k to 5k years ago the earth underwent some big changes, and whether you believe in the great flood or not that story was told across many civilizations outside the bible and the sheer physical evidence is too great to not think the earth looked rather differently before then.
Originally posted by darkbake
Originally posted by SmokeytheHair
Lol... Why are they claiming to have found a story book characters boat?? Don't they know it's not real?
Tsk. Tsk. Tsk.
When will people ever learn?
You don't know that for sure, my friend. I have a feeling that atheists are discounting a very large amount of things from religion that might be scientifically true. The more they do that, the more useless they will look in the future when everything comes to light. Which is sad, because they have some good points.
It is unfortunate that the atheist movement has degraded into an emotional, closed-minded witch hunt so fast. We really need a movement right now that is based on facts and science rather than blind obedience and belief.
[edit on 27-4-2010 by darkbake]
[edit on 27-4-2010 by darkbake]
Originally posted by Angus123
If the earth were covered in that much water... enough to submerge even Mt. Everest... the air would have been so humid that you would drown in seconds just from breathing.
Talk about a crappy way to die!
Originally posted by sirnex
Low oxygen and cold temperatures. Nor does the site the OP links to provide any visual evidence that this wooden structure is a boat. Still, even with the low oxygen and cold temperatures, there would NOT be FRESH hay existing in the structure. It screams of hoax, especially with the fresh brand spanking newly harvested hay. That and after over 4,000 years the floor planks would still have oxidized and deteriorated enough to be brittle to a point where one shouldn't be able walk and bang on as if 'proving' it's made of wood.