'I can't afford surgery in the U.S.,' says bargain shopper

What everyone ignores in this whole healthcare debate is this exact scenario. Cheaper drugs in Mexico, Canada, and cheaper operations abroad. But why is this? Democrats and Republicans alike have been in the pockets of these insurance companies and pharma for decades. Tell them to take care of that before thinking about universal healthcare. Fools

reply to post by lee anoma


I have to agree in how it appears shady but if you think about it, do you recall the popular trend of going to mexico to get prescription drugs?

I mean if they have the means to synthesize heroin to medication, I would think that would be proof of their medical capabilities.

As someone hailing from the UK, and now living in NZ, I simply can't get my head around having to pay such extortionate money to have surgery done, or for that matter ANY money. I am pretty clueless about the US system - but do I assume that you can't go on a waiting list to have treatment done via a free national system?

Excuse my ignorance

reply to post by MoorfNZ


What you call ignorance I call being blissfully unaware - don't feel bad, a lot of us yanks wish we had no conception of paying such money for surgery...

No, there is no national single-payer healthcare system. It's all free market. Hospitals charge what they want, health insurance companies charge what they want. In other words, a lot. It wouldn't even be an issue if, like in most other areas of a free market, there was competition. But there's not. Consumers get stuck with financially-ruining bills for surgery and care, and then get told by hospitals and insurance companies that it's because of freeloaders, or maplpractice suits, or government interference, or whatever the goat of the week is to keep their wallets full. It's crooked and corrupt. And IMO, you are much better off not knowing about it.

reply to post by HunkaHunka


It's sad really how much medical treatment and really anything medical is in the US. My father had a heart attack years ago, almost died, and unfortunately our insurance we had at the time got in trouble for some sort of fraud - long story short we ended up owing hundreds of thousands of dollars... totally screwed a lot of things up for my family

I feel for those out there who have been through similar situations and those who are going to [unfortunately] go through the same sort of thing some day.

reply to post by Legion2112


So what happens if you have an accident and have to be taken to hospital and be treated immediately and you have no insurance and/or are, say, unemployed?

Originally posted by sos37
These arguments are all well and good but isn't the problem with inflated costs of medical care in the U.S. all because of insurance companies and frivolous malpractice suits?

Doctors know insurance companies will cough up the money, even though they have to negotiate a payment with them (FYI, the amount doctors want and the amount insurance will pay are two separate things - that does NOT mean that you, the insured, are liable for the remainder). However, doctors will still overshoot by a wide margin what they want because they know insurance companies will come down off that figure. The reality of what they actually get is still pretty high, comparatively.

I don't know why insurance companies agree to pay even half of what doctors ask for when they know the value of the service isn't worth that much. Seems like if insurance companies put their collective feet down then maybe doctors and pharma would quit overshooting their quotes. Of course I'm not in the insurance biz, so I really lack a lot of knowledge in this area.


[edit on 26-4-2010 by sos37]

My dad's general practitioner doctor charges him 40.00-65.00 because he is uninsured. He charges much more (around 150.00) for an appointment with the insured because he spends hours doing the paperwork at times.

My dad offered cash payment for appointments and around that amount is what the doctor accepted so he wouldn't have to fill out a bunch of insurance forms. Rather than lose a "customer" to another Dr. he accepted that offer.

As far as medication goes my dad's heart medication costs 400.00 per month. My neighbor's pit bull takes the exact same medication for 5.00 per month. The difference is that one has a bottle labeled for dogs and the other bottle is labeled for humans. Same drug company, same dosage.

There was even a crackdown once with veterinarians purposely misdiagnosing the pets of seniors so the owners could get this medication at that cost because they could not afford the human equivalent.

It was a very scary time with his actual triple bypass as he was refusing treatment due to not having insurance to cover it. One of the kindest nurses leaned in and told my dad, "Take the treatment!" "Pay what you can and if goes beyond your abilities then screw it!." Luckily there was a lot of grants and stuff that significantly cut down his treatment costs.

First of all, N.of norml - sorry for what you are going through. Best of luck with a good outcome.

Here in the US, hospitals will charge outrageous amounts for what they do, but they will also bill you for what they didn't do. Sound crazy? It is. Here is a site where the person is outing a cover-up about billing mistakes and refusal to let a patient present their side.

poudrevalleyhospitalbillingerror.webs.com...

Seems there's some law about what is or isn't a trauma in case of a car accident. The people on site wrongly said it was a trauma. Person says $2400 to wash his/her face. That's all the treatment that was done, face washing. Outrageous billing, right on that call.

Man.

Here in Australia, on a Medicare Card you can see a Doc for $10.

I see mine for free! I get my Epilepsy Medication for $5.40 on my health care card, which lasts me about 1 month.

My rides in Ambulances are free. My MRI's and ECG's are free.

I get everything for free because the Medical System knows that I, being an Epileptic, need to have these Medicines and Procedures done.

I feel for you guys in the States.

reply to post by HunkaHunka


How come operations cost so much in the US?
Do they use surgical instruments made of gold and fly you around in a hight tech surgery room aboard a 747 during the operation?

Unrealised oh my God!
What happened with your avatar? I hope this is not you IRL! Unless you did a surgery in the US (knock wood) and never had enough money for it?

[edit on 27-4-2010 by spacebot]

Some people in the US (probably) comment about going abroad, for instance Canada or Mexico. That only postpones the problem. Eventually a similar cartel will get wind of all the dollar influx and will impose higher prices for drugs and treatments there too, also making it more difficult for the locals that would have one more reason now to cross the border to the other side to find a better paycheck. (at least probably from Mexico)

[edit on 27-4-2010 by spacebot]

Well at least we don't have to worry here in Australia it's free for medical and medication is so cheap it doesn't really bother you

reply to post by AshleyD


$300 bucks? What in the world are you taking if I may ask? Lifetime asthmatic myself and my monthly medication costs 13 bucks without insurance. With my insurance it's 7. Never had a single insurance provider refuse to cover that medication cost either as a preexisting condition.

Edit: Forgot to mention I am in the US as well.

[edit on 4/27/10 by Hypntick]

Something is seriously wrong with US healthcare system, if this is true. We generaly directly pay nothing or just a few euros for medication and a doc visit, few tens of euros a month in the worst case, if the condition requires hospitalisation or is chronic. Average monthly income is around 700 euros around here. And for those who want to pay for the best, there are excellent private medical centers.

I have asthma and I need to take two types of inhalers -

To buy one of them privately would cost me £35 but I get TWO for £7.60!

Long live the NHS!

I've had my apendix out (FREE) - shoulder reabilitation (FREE), Root Canal (£30). Many broken bones - (I play rugby ya see!) all treated for FREE!..

And in Wales you don't pay for ANY medication - at all!! and you get free dental check ups....

I love our NHS, its a socialist concept but every civilised country should look after its people - nobody should ever have to worry about medical costs - they should only be worrying about getting better.


I feel sorry for you guys in the US - is Obama-care really that bad?




[edit on 27-4-2010 by OptimusPrimate]

reply to post by sos37


well, let's see, I need an operation, which would cost me three or four times my yearly income, even with the insurance.
okay, so, I go ahead and have it done, and start paying what I can on the bill, which the hospital doesn't want to keep on it's books, so they turn it over to a collection agency....for less money than the original bill..(is this the same as selling the debt...ya know, cdo's and all that mess that got us into trouble with the housing market?)
do these collection agencies then sell them to someone else, who slices and dices and bundles them up into some kind of financial product that they can then peddle?

I'm not really sure of the answer here. but well, if this is what is happening, then I would propose this is why the cost is so high, our debt is someone's road to financial wealth, so by all means, allow the fools to go as far into debt as they desire!!! they'll just hedge themselves by betting the fools will never be able to pay it off before they die!!

I am one of those who would never be able to pay off the debt, if I actually made the bills, and I believe that spiritually, there is something wrong with owing that much to others when you die, and I think it's gonna come back and bite alot of people in their afterlife!!
so, lose a leg, lose an arm, allow the body to contort itself into all kinds of crazy positions, lose a life, don't care!! If I can't see a way to pay for it, well, I'll just bypass this "greatest in the world" healthcare system...
let the other fools be fodder for their money making machine in this life, and their power trip in the spiritual plane.

reply to post by Hypntick

one of my kids was born asthmatic, even in the late 80's and 90's, his inhalers cost alot more than $7. ALOT MORE. can't imagine what the stuff would cost now (he outgrew his asthma.)

reply to post by AshleyD


An inhaler in the UK would cost you £7.60 per month. You could even sweet talk your doctor and get 2 months worth on one prescription for the same amount. Even better, live in Wales, their prescriptions are FREE!

I couldn't even consider paying $300 a month for the medication I take.

USA: Land of the free, where the rich get richer and the poor get sicker.

ETA:

I was born with a genetic defect that took 4 years and 8 operations to fix. I've had a septo-rhinoplasty, a hernia repair and god knows how many emergency stitches etc. Total cost: Bugger all!

As the previous poster said, long live the NHS! It may not be perfect, but it does work!

[edit on 27-4-2010 by nik1halo]

My mother had a stroke last year in the UK and it has been the talk of my relatives in the US for quite a while.. (my Grandfather was Cherokee so my American relatives know very little about the UK)

They where shocked that no money changed hands, no forms where filled, and nothing was expected more than the patient get well and get out of hospital and rehab as soon as possible (the NHS is not perfect)

But their opinion was that they could not afford to have either a heart attack or stroke for the financial burden it would put them and their family, and they would rather die quickly than have either of the them happen.. Which is quite hard to hear to be honest..

Nor are they supporters of the new healthcare bill since they do not expect better coverage, or improved GP services.. they live in the poorer parts of Milwauke.

One or two of the slightly wealthier ones are seriously thinking of emigrating outside the US as they are of the age that one or the other (stroke/heartattack) could happen.. it is a sad world that people are looking else where other than their home country for health treatment they can afford.

Ha ha, what a crap system you US guys have, you're all moaning about paying yet the real problem seems to be your insurance and pharmaceutical companies taking your cash and laughing in your face. You could probably be insured for $5 a week on the government scheme if you weren't taken for such a ride.