What Does ATS's Motto "Deny Ignorance" Mean To You?

reply to post by redoubt


Excellent answer.

We are not infallible humans.

But we can learn, grow, and have a better understanding.

If we only focus on what we know we will never learn more.

reply to post by SpartanKingLeonidas


To me deny ignorance means just one thing, don't let myself be ignorant to the fact that i don't know everything, and that what i do know may be wrong!

Every day is a school day, we should never stop learning

reply to post by SpartanKingLeonidas


What a great question! When I first joined this site and saw that motto, I was certainly confused by it. When I deny it is usually me denying charges or accusations brought against me. There is a difference between refuse and deny. Denial is a derivation of deny.

The biological fact of us all is that no matter how hard we try to be objective, we certainly can not be wholly objective while relying upon our biology to understand a truth. We just quite simply can not know the truth from all angles at all times when we are looking at that truth from our own personal view point.

Ignorance is not a crime and I have never met a soul free from it. I offer as evidence phrases such as "you learn something new everyday", or "I did not know that!" It takes great wisdom to admit when we don't know the answer or truth, and ignorance is not anything to be ashamed of, certainly not worth denying, but just as certainly worth shedding as best we can.

Ignorance should never be a badge of honor, but I fail to see how it should be a mark of shame. The motto actually, in my humble opinion, illustrates all that is wrong with motto's. A simple sound bite that works more as a platitude than any source of knowledge. Knowledge is not easily gained by collecting motto's, or worse, choosing one motto over all others and offering such motto as some sort of beacon of truth. Truth is far more complex than that and you would think a site dedicated to conspiracy theories would understand that.

It is hard for me to imagine just how long one would have to live, coming from a distinct personal viewpoint, and somehow shed the affliction of ignorance. We can't possibly hold a personal point of view and be omniscient at the same time...at least from my point of view...but what do I know?

reply to post by Jean Paul Zodeaux


i liked reading your post jean paul zodeaux, but just a thought

what what you do if you see intelligent reality infront of you ? maybe it is the motto standing point, i agree with it here

most people would deny knowing so they would mean expecting from that reality anything or powership rules on themselves,
worse they would isolate themselves away from it and accept a lesser actualisations of themselves for meaning no changing point

denying ignorance there is saying, go on attack bigger knowledge would follow when obviously it is intelligence field
i like that, but what i am more there is the real interest in inovating infront of what is more, free will life

i mean logically objective intelligence is always advanced and the reference of all absolute reality
but to think that you can be real with from that free will living even small step just intention for you that you could follow in mind and make it a whole base if you like or want
i mean most people fear what is objectively living, i love it it is always an opportunity to know something you didnt since it is obviously positive somewhre truly
so usually people hang on to their previous motives as to justify their moves so they can walk blind to what is around and never free

reply to post by imans


I am not at all advocating ignorance. I am suggesting that no matter how hard you may try, as long as you are coming from a singular point of view, there will always be things you will remain ignorant of. I will offer more evidence; The discovery of new planets in the universe become moments where ignorance has been "denied", but not all ignorance, merely the ignorance we previously held prior to our discoveries.

reply to post by Jean Paul Zodeaux


right i know that, only freedom life is true knowledge from what it mean truth ignorance being all there and you

but what i meant is to say my perspective of that motto being like an answer to someone calling you ignorant or something facing you as bigger or more, so in that perspective it is right absolutely to deny any ignorance it might justify, because you are always you unikness reality absolute positive source justifications and life

Originally posted by imans
reply to post by Jean Paul Zodeaux

 

right i know that, only freedom life is true knowledge from what it mean truth ignorance being all there and you

but what i meant is to say my perspective of that motto being like an answer to someone calling you ignorant or something facing you as bigger or more, so in that perspective it is right absolutely to deny any ignorance it might justify, because you are always you unikness reality absolute positive source justifications and life

Just to make sure I understand what it is you are saying, please allow me to put this thought in my own words, are you suggesting that an accusation of ignorance should always be denied simply because I or you or whomever has been accused of ignorance, is not at all ignorant of what is known, even if you or I or someone else may be ignorant of what is unknown? That what is known is more important than what is not known, and in that regard a denial of ignorance has merit?

To me it means that there are always different sides to the story and there are still truths in nature yet to be generally excepted. I search for the truth, whatever it may be.

reply to post by Jean Paul Zodeaux


you bring up an interesting perspective, especially the point of living accusator, yea right, we are all absolutely real noother knows more, bravo my friend

Classic denial.

If you deny it you never have to face up to it & deal with it.

And don't give me that stuff about denying it to starve it & not let it live, etc.

We all know ATS & everything on the planet is run by the NWO.

[facetious for raging flaming purposes only, lol]

[edit on 25-4-2010 by slank]

In one of my very first threads I took my local experience of the Freemasons and tried to make it a bit jovial. At the time navigating ATS from BTS was still quite tricky, so I hardly went there. In any case I spoke a truth for my context and then FINALLY I got one reply which baffles me to this day: "This thread should be used by ATS mods as an example not to deny ignorance". Surprisingly it still lurks: www.abovetopsecret.com...
I understand the multiple meanings of the motto, but in that context it had me lying awake pondering for weeks...

For me is it very simple. "Deny Ignorance" albeit a very broad declaration simply means to me that I am taking a stance, separating myself from the rest of the word, able to make my own decisions based on the evidence, and determine what is, for me, the "truth".

Denying ignorance is something you say to yourself before making any major decision.

Originally posted by uptheirons!
reply to post by SpartanKingLeonidas

 

To me deny ignorance means just one thing, don't let myself be ignorant to the fact that i don't know everything, and that what i do know may be wrong!

Every day is a school day, we should never stop learning

Another excellent post.

I have seen many people, myself included, grow in knowledge after finding ATS.

And that's what I believe is the fundamental purpose of that motto.

It leaves the answer to itself as up to you without completely defining parameters.

And as well, it questions, challenges, and assists us as members in our own perceptions.

The biggest problem is when of course people do not understand that to do this, we must treat each other as respected members, of a respected community.

In the end it comes down to two words defining an over all mission statement.

Deny Ignorance.

[edit on 26-4-2010 by SpartanKingLeonidas]

reply to post by Jean Paul Zodeaux


All fascinating ideas and thoughts.

In the end we are all human but it is how we treat each other as human which defines us.

If we only understand our own limited perspective we might miss out on an avenue we had not seen prior to our scope, and step past something we had been searching for, because we limited ourselves, through denying both ourselves and others to come to a better understanding about how the world works.

Imagine if you will, that ATS were like America's Intelligence Agencies, everyone keeping their piece of the puzzle, until an event like 9/11 happens.

By then it is too late to have stopped it and through an entrenched system by narrowing our focus to only one perspective, and not that of other people, we stovepipe our own understanding, and cause a choke-point for our own knowledge growth.

Instead, we are ourselves committing an atrocious lack of action through being reactive, instead of trying to understand other people, and becoming proactive.

To me it means hit the "ALERT" button on a post when someone makes an ignorant statement that violates T&C, so that their post will get DENIED!

But on a more serious side, the Deny Ignorance theme is kind of like a "Is the glass half full or half empty" question.

Sometimes the ignorance abounds here on ATS, other times I'm very proud of my fellow members for seeing the truth behind a story despite the MSM's agenda.

In-other-words, sometimes ATS'rs are denying they are ignorant themselves, and sometimes ATS'rs are rejecting the ignorance being pushed onto them by the outside world. So it's appropriate to have a phrase that can be used both ways, IMO.

[edit on 26-4-2010 by harrytuttle]

reply to post by imans


After watching the interaction between you and Jean Paul Zodeaux, and you two asking questions and answering in like kind, I have to say is the perfect example in a microcosm of two people's interaction within a thread in attaining exactly what the ATS motto embodies.

You both had ideas, questions, and came to a better understanding of each other's perspectives.

Quite literally, through general discussion, polite interaction, and discussion you did it.

You did not give ignorance a chance to exist.

Both of you assisted each other in raising your perspectives through awareness, simultaneously.

Deny Ignorance.

reply to post by SpartanKingLeonidas


this is the dimension of absolute, each point is alive absolutely from being aware of itself reality being necessarly absolutely, the awareness freedom there is necessarly a positive true living reality, that what we meant to by saying deny ignorance is for

and yes as you said it exactly, it is very hard to say and and not saying because your word as real is as valuable then other word there real too, so to detach yourself as a living to you true because of objective reality that is true and not you there, very rare are at least disoposed to mean it a bit, thx for a heart beat lols

reply to post by SpartanKingLeonidas

What do you believe ATS's motto of "Deny Ignorance" means?

I think it just means "Agree with me" or "you're wrong, im right". This is the only way i see it used. It is only added on to the end of posts to insinuate that the other person is not denying ignorance and is therefore ignorant.

Originally posted by SpartanKingLeonidas
reply to post by imans

 

After watching the interaction between you and Jean Paul Zodeaux, and you two asking questions and answering in like kind, I have to say is the perfect example in a microcosm of two people's interaction within a thread in attaining exactly what the ATS motto embodies.

You both had ideas, questions, and came to a better understanding of each other's perspectives.

Quite literally, through general discussion, polite interaction, and discussion you did it.

You did not give ignorance a chance to exist.

Both of you assisted each other in raising your perspectives through awareness, simultaneously.

Deny Ignorance.

Thanks for your perspective on that. It is always fun to interact with imans, and not just because of his quirky and poetic use of language, but because the ideas he has behind that language demand thought be applied in understanding what is being said.

We are less ignorant today individually because of the collective effort of humanity and all that has been done to discover truth. What a great thread. I hope it stays with us for a while.

reply to post by SpartanKingLeonidas


It means refuse to believe that ignorance exists. Maybe I am reading it wrong. In another thread I mention, unless you are using "deny" as in to keep from life giving nourishment, therefore causing it to die...it doesn't quite click.
Ignorance can be minimized, eradicated or cured but I don't think it can be denied. It is after all, everywhere.