All Roads Lead to Rome

reply to post by serbsta


Just because the biggest and most carefully gaurded conspiracy that is still active doesn't have an internet referrence for you to verify, does not mean that the dots cannot be connected.

Let me put it to you this way, no one wanted to believe the mystery religion came from Troy either, until the open minded people started actually letting go of some of the dogmas and doing some research.

So I feel it's safe to say, my inside source, was on the money there.

There is little reason for me to believe when you start using the power of deduction, like a true detective, and looking at motive, opportunity and suspects, that the fine hand of Julius Caesar is not all over this.

Will it meet the Internet Debunkers/arm chair conspiracist theory entertainment junky's level of proof?

No, it wouldn't be an active conspiracy if it did.

Would it meet a great detectives level of proof with real world sources tied to the conspiracy who has done real time, real people, real world, off your butt into the real world research, and investigation?

Yes it would, which is why I have posted the thread, and even billed it the Mother of All Conspiracies.

Denying a conspiracy simply because it hasn't been proven in a Court of Law yet or written into the history books, does not mean that it's not real, and not true.

This is one conspiracy you have to ask yourself how would it have ended up in either of those venues when the people who control those venues at the very top are the one's carrying it out.

Conversely wishing it is so, doesn't make it so either, but denial for the sake of convenience, doesn't make it not true.

All the ellements fit as far as I am concerned, and they are based on far less speculation, and far more evidence than some of the stargate, reptillian crowd, pushing web sites for profit, and books for profit, and vested interests aimed at denial.

The same is true of people addicted to the circular logic of religious doctrine and dogma.

I am convinced, and I am a person, whom it is very hard to convince of anything.

It is only because I am convince that I am sharing the conspiracy.

However the choice to consider it further, or accept it as possiblity or fact is entirely up to you.

I can honestly say, in years of dilligent research I have uncovered nothing that elliminates this very real possibility, and have only uncovered things that make me believe resolutely it is true.

My mind is open, but skeptism is not a form of evidence.

The presence of skeptics is not a indication of innocense or being wrong either, when those skeptics haven't been able to or want to do all the research I have.

So I am more than happy to agree to disagree with anyone on this.

After all it's your world too, but needless to say, something is driving a massive conspiracy to install a one world government, and that goes back a very, very long time, into the ancient past, where there was no internet, and very few people could read or write, and the very limited sources of the most critical ellements are in the hands of the cabal still working the conspiracy.

So in other words, people ignore it at their own risk and peril.

I did my job, I spoke up and out!

Thanks.

Originally posted by serbsta
Fair enough. But again, there is zero proof whatsoever tying any of the Caesar's and their supposed world dominating ideological masterpieces with the actions taken by Constantine. You say that you are connecting the dots, but you can't connect the dots if you have no pen.

In the beginning of the Roman Empire, it was the standard practice of Rome to allow 2 things:

1) conquered lands were to be governed by locals but guarded by the legions. This freed the hands of Rome itself from ruling in distant lands and yet sustained control over those peoples in taxes, etc. They became citizens. Ceasars/Augusti controllled those districts concurrently. Often, 4 would partition the empire between themselves while conspiring to war with each other.


2) the religions pre-existing in those conquered lands were allowed to continue and even accepted into Rome itself with the construction of temples there. Rome imported religion. When the notion of One True God began to be popularised, it excluded all of the others.

In this way, ceasars had ALWAYS had a hand in using religions as a means to power. Eventually, the notion of a ceasar being LIKE God began to circulate.

My point is,the same system the Bible warns of is alive and well,and we can see the roots of it woven completely throughout our world today.

If it is as entrenched as Proto says it is,and as spiritually condemned as I say it is,it is a very serious matter,one that requires a serious study from all angles.

There is another truth to be found,and that requires acknowledging Biblical truths. Thanks to the Reformation,the word of God has gone out to all the world.

The Word of God is the Ten Commandments which I highly urge you to read.

In the Ten Commandments it is clear God condones slavery. God condones Taxation. God condones strict laws and harsh punishments. God condones expanding the state through Warfare.

No matter how much you pretty that up, with epic tales, and mythical larger than life demigod prophets, disciples who love to write poetry, and songs, that thing such delights as “Onward Christian Soldier Marching Out to War”.

There is not a snowball’s chance in Hades that was the word of any God except perhaps a God of War.

Yes the Bible warns you of this system, because the Bible is simply acknowledging this system, while telling you if you go along with the very system, that it is warning you against, you get to die in the end!

I mean please people, couldn’t we switch gears here to a story with a happy ending that makes sense.

The Ten Commandments is full of Contradictions, it claims they were delivered by God himself to Moses as he was leading the Jews out of Slavery, but tells them how to take care of their own slaves?

Hello!

It says Thou Shall Not Kill, but then turns around and says if you pay your taxes and follow the laws, God will drive your enemies before you so you kill them?

Hello!

You live in a state of mind where you just Love the Baby Jesus with all your heart, but will gladly pay taxes to a state that in the name of God and Country will drop bombs on other babies on the other side of the world, all day long, year after year?

Hello!

What good is loving baby Jesus, and your own babies, if you have that much contempt and murderous rage in your hearts for someone else’s babies!

Hello!

This is ProtoplasmicTraveler calling the people of Earth, hello Earth!

The only honest thing possibly about any of these books and religions, is that there is likely a higher source in the Universe, but it sure did not make up the nonsense in these books!

I hate to be the Grinch that stole Christmas here, but you people have got to stop justifying all this war, enmity, rancor, slavery, repressive laws, excessive penalties, and excessive taxation as being something that God wants you to do.

A real God would no sooner kill all his errant Children than you would kill yours.

However in Roman Patrician Law, the Master and Owner of the House could legally kill his wife and children and slaves, if they displeased him.

All these scriptures are pure Rome, plain and simple, and the only protesting involved in the reformation and schisms is who got to keep a cut of all the lands being stolen, and resources being stolen, and wealth being stolen, through all the killing that was being done to steal them.

Don’t believe it, go ask the American Indians, don’t believe me, go ask the Iraqis and Afghanis, none of whom dropped bombs on your babies.

Thanks for the lovely post Tex, and Hemi,

Aquarius, that's why it is called faith, but that's another topic,

Maybe we were not meant to have concrete evidence of anything, for whatever reason.



[edit on 113131p://bMonday2010 by Stormdancer777]

Originally posted by Stormdancer777
Aquarius, that's why it is called faith, but that's another topic,

Maybe we were not meant to have concrete evidence of anything, for whatever reason.

That may be so but isn't it our responsibility to at least find the truth, the bible has been changed and text taken out numerous times to fit the current dogma at the time, that isn't interpretation as Proto has pointed out over and over in this thread, it's control, I for one cannot live on blind faith.

Proto,

Many thanks for a an excellent original post and for all the effort in asking questions from other posters.

I have a couple of questions regarding this power structure from Rome.

1. You mention Rome is generally in control of most relevant power structures and institutions, but you also recognize that their power is not absolute. Do you reckon there are competing power structures looking to chip away from them and fully aware of who Rome is? Is it possible that some of these power structures even predate the establishment of Rome as such or are we to assume it was chaos and pandemonium before Rome brought it's system about.

2. As the world continues to globalize and the marketplace gets integrated, random companies have the potential of gaining dramatic power. One can think of Microsoft for example, which is actually eclipsed by a company like Google which has the ability to monitor who does what in what and to what extent online. I doubt Sergei and Larry were set up as a branch of Rome, but now they have a level of power that cannot be ignored. What happens now? Do they get reeled in to the power structure, taken over, etc?

3. Related to question #2, but going beyond business and into politics and other fields. What happens when people outside the power structure, that don't know anything about it, don't operate to strengthen it, or even care about it start to garner significant power? Do they get invited to the club and made aware of all the machinations?

4. I want to go back to the topic concerning the motivations behind all this. You answered before it's simply a larger version of "taking the hill." I'm a bit hard pressed to buy that. If you are aware that all religions are made up and you have no clarity for afterlife, it would seem logical that the best motivation is to be around for as long as possible. Another poster made reference to this and the issue of longevity. This is a topic that predates Rome, Troy or whatever. It has been an ever existing quest of humanity and one that I would assume those in power and with access to knowledge would be all over. Would welcome your comments on this.

If any of this has been answered I apologize in advanced.

Drake

In trying to get a firm grasp on this whole thing, I have been looking into stories from the Old Testament. One of them concerning Joseph who was sold into slavery by his brothers to Egypt. The story contends that Joseph was able to discern dreams and that when Pharaoh had a disturbing dream, it was Joseph he inquired of to interpret it.

Joseph explained that Pharaoh's dream was in fact a very real event that would befall all the land of Egypt in seven years. It had to do with a famine and before the famine of seven years, there would be seven years of plenty. He advised Pharaoh to store up all the food and grain that he could for the seven years of plenty so that when the famine hit, he could sell it to the masses.

The plan worked out marvelously and people from all over came to Egypt and bought food for their families. The famine persisted and the people ran out of money. They began selling to Pharaoh all their livestock and herds and assess for food for their families. The famine persisted and the people were left with nothing but themselves and their land. This is where it gets interesting.

They asked to be able to sell themselves and their land for food. Joseph began taking title to all the land and in return would give the people seeds to begin sowing the land. In return the people would have to give a fifth of everything they produced to Pharaoh. So now you have Pharaoh owning the land, the people, and the food they work to grow.

The biggest question for me is, why didn't these people have seeds to begin with and just grow their food without the divine intervention of Pharaoh and Joseph? Could the famine actually have been a planned event to consolidate the people and resources of the land? Did the Pharaoh and his minions keep the very seeds that these people needed away from them until they agreed to sell themselves and their land? It would certainly seem so.

In the story, after Pharaoh was given title to everyone's properties and their very lives, Joseph moved all the people to cities. Do not take my word for it but read it for yourselves because this could very well be the means by which we are controlled today. Just read it and tell me it wasn't planned. Who won in the end? The starving masses? No. They were now the property of Egypt and had absolutely nothing and were dependent on Egypt for everything. I see in this story a very revealing insight into what is going on now.

Not only that, but the priests and holy places were exempt from this taxation. Sound familiar? I had to share this because I believe it is significant as proof to what we are delving into. I am shocked right now. Here is the link to the scripture that will tell you the story for yourselves.

www.searchgodsword.org...

Edit to add: Proto, even if this story is a complete fabrication and never happened, using your theory I see a blue print for genocide and domination. To further edit, before the famine, Pharaoh sent his men to the fields to make sure that a proper portion was sent to the stores. This went on for the seven years of plenty. Were they sent to make sure that the famine would happen as well? Using Proto's theory one can surmise that this was in fact first a blue print as to how to elevate the leadership to a God-like status. In that, Pharaoh would be the only one that could sustain the people!






[edit on 3-5-2010 by jackflap]

reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler

"Yes the Bible warns you of this system, because the Bible is simply acknowledging this system, while telling you if you go along with the very system, that it is warning you against, you get to die in the end!"

Last I knew,we all die in the end,Proto!

I'm glad there's more to my life than seeing the whole world through Rome-colored glasses.

You're no different than Rome,re-writing history to make Jesus obsolete.

We'll all find out the truth in the end. Until then,...life goes on.

reply to post by Captain Drake

1. You mention Rome is generally in control of most relevant power structures and institutions, but you also recognize that their power is not absolute. Do you reckon there are competing power structures looking to chip away from them and fully aware of who Rome is? Is it possible that some of these power structures even predate the establishment of Rome as such or are we to assume it was chaos and pandemonium before Rome brought it's system about.

I have found no evidence of this. There are those different organizations underneath Rome that are purposefully put on a collision course to create a desired outcome through synergy, utilizing Hegelian principles. The end result of the confrontations ends up in the form of a compromise that neither side wants, but Rome very much does.

This is how Rome carries out most of its plots, by basically coercing organizations to act compulsively and aggressively towards goals of their own, which they willingly do, while encouraging a competing organization to go after it from a different angle. After the two sides collide Rome gets what it wants in the way of the compromise affected.

Kind of like the New Health Care Bill. You pit two sides against one another, knowing what the bare minimum each wants to settle the confrontation, add up to precisely what you want out of it.

This is how it works. So it might appear people are fighting against something or trying to make things better, because it’s always a two sided coin with polar opposites confronting each other, each side will in a sense loose what they really wanted through compromise and that compromise will be what Rome wanted all along, without every having to ask for or demand it.

This is how puppet masters operate.

2. As the world continues to globalize and the marketplace gets integrated, random companies have the potential of gaining dramatic power. One can think of Microsoft for example, which is actually eclipsed by a company like Google which has the ability to monitor who does what in what and to what extent online. I doubt Sergei and Larry were set up as a branch of Rome, but now they have a level of power that cannot be ignored. What happens now? Do they get reeled in to the power structure, taken over, etc?

Microsoft is not actually in the position of dominance you might think they are for a few reasons. First and foremost their profits are in the form of instrument of debt fiat de facto currency, that Rome can make virtually useless through hyper inflation, if it wants to bankrupt large corporations that don’t play ball with it.

Further Microsoft provides a product dependent on outsourced parts from companies owned by Rome, and cheap labor from companies owned and controlled by Rome.

So they can either be bankrupted through manipulation of the currency, or starved out of existence by denying them the resources to create the product.

Gates does have some leverage, only in that the government might never be able to find all the backdoors to the operating system…but…and it’s a big but, all it takes is one John Wayne Hinkley or Mark David Chatman to end your life, and that’s if they don’t want to set you up in some major criminal proceeding.

At a certain level of the business strata, when you need access to Senators and Congressmen for contracts and to facilitate ventures overseas, it’s just like getting concrete poured in New York City or getting your trash hauled, you are going to have to deal, and come to terms with the Criminal Cabal, either the little ones, or in Gates case, the big ones.

3. Related to question #2, but going beyond business and into politics and other fields. What happens when people outside the power structure, that don't know anything about it, don't operate to strengthen it, or even care about it start to garner significant power? Do they get invited to the club and made aware of all the machinations?

You can’t garner real power without running into the cabal; they control the access points and contact points at an upper level. You want 50 paper plates for your restaurant, you go see Wal-Mart, you need 10,000,000 paper plates for your chain of restaurants, and you are going to have to deal with someone a lot higher up the food chain to get them to you. They control the resources in bulk, so the more bulk resources you need, the more you are going to come in contact with them. They control the legal and legislative process, the bigger you grow the more lawsuits you are going to encounter, and the more lawyers you are going to need to acquire and merge things. Eventually you will reach a level where you are dealing with them. Your 10,000,000 paper plates can get lost in customs a long time if you aren’t someone they don’t like. However if you play ball, well they can make sure, the train runs on time, and even steer investors and others your way. Eventually they will want to get in on it, and eventually at some point they will absorb your enterprise into their umbrella of corporations having bought you out, or keeping you on, in an upper management capacity. They only thing they have to tell you at this point, is I am the guy you need to talk too, to get 10,000,000 paper plates.

They will want you to support certain politicians through donations in return, and steer certain business needs to certain firms and vendors, and this is how they operate.

Through monopolizing the resources in bulk at the top, they are only going to tell you what they need to, to make you a part of their system. The more you hang around the more you might pick up through being observant. If they want to bed you, they might tell you more. They will never tell you more than you need to know, and there is always someone still above them, that is going to only tell your point of contact what they need to know.

Think of these people as rain makers, they can shower resources, customers, vendors and money on you, or conversely, they can keep resources out of your hands, drive away your customers, chase off your vendors, or dry up your credit lines, they can cause problems with you with enforcement agencies, code inspectors, law enforcement and customs too.

There are lots of reasons to go along for someone who wants to make money and keep growing and getting bigger.

4. I want to go back to the topic concerning the motivations behind all this. You answered before it's simply a larger version of "taking the hill." I'm a bit hard pressed to buy that. If you are aware that all religions are made up and you have no clarity for afterlife, it would seem logical that the best motivation is to be around for as long as possible. Another poster made reference to this and the issue of longevity. This is a topic that predates Rome, Troy or whatever. It has been an ever existing quest of humanity and one that I would assume those in power and with access to knowledge would be all over. Would welcome your comments on this.

Of course money can’t buy you health, but it can buy you access to the best foods, recreation, stress relief, and medical treatment, but everyone has to die.

They have been looking for the fountain of youth forever, and always will be, immortality is something everyone dreams of, since we are temporal creatures, with only a finite amount of time here on this earth.

It’s hard to imagine, but imagine you were born so rich, you could go to Las Vegas everyday, loose 10,000,000 dollars every day of your life, and die leaving your children that rich.

Ultimately it’s about playing games, to alleviate boredom through real challenges. In other words addressing plots and intrigues that require you to outsmart and out leverage everyone else. This is fun, it’s like playing a game of Clue or Monopoly or World War II or other such things, and they just play the game with real people, and real nations and real property.

The other side of the coin though, is if they ever stop playing the game, and stop trying to dominate then two things will happen eventually a few people will figure out how to gain dominance over them, and then a lot of people will come on par with them, and should the extent of their crimes and machinations ever come to light, and they loose their grip on the power structure to shield and protect them, the mob and masses would literally rip them from limb to limb.

The do what they do in part out of how that’s the only way they can survive, in part because they believe it’s fun and challenging, and in part because they have deluded themselves into thinking if it weren’t for them running and controlling and rationing everything, we would just consume everything like a hungry horde of locus with no forethought on how to replace it, and we would all starve and end back up in caves.

Thanks for asking my friend.

Originally posted by On the Edge
reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler

 

"Yes the Bible warns you of this system, because the Bible is simply acknowledging this system, while telling you if you go along with the very system, that it is warning you against, you get to die in the end!"

Last I knew,we all die in the end,Proto!

I'm glad there's more to my life than seeing the whole world through Rome-colored glasses.

You're no different than Rome,re-writing history to make Jesus obsolete.

We'll all find out the truth in the end. Until then,...life goes on.

Actually I am a little different than Rome, I want to end the slave based commerce system, excessively harsh laws and excessive penalties, excessive taxation, and violent wars, and thefts of resources.

All I am doing is showing you in black and white, that the three religions of Abraham have been used from the start to promote those things and to make people believe they are part of God's grand plan.

True we all have to die sometime, but they say the best revenge is living well. All I want us to do is all live a better more peaceful, freer existence, and for us to keep more of what we labor for.

If you see that as a bad thing, because it might make Jesus obsolete, well I would prefer to see a 2,000 year old myth die, more than I would one of my own children.

I didn't write the Ten Commandmants, they speak for themselves. When you read them it's plain to see, they promote slavery, inequity, harsh laws and penalties, the state getting first choice of everything you labor for, and expanding through war.

So I think you might want to ask yourself to Jesus renounce these things?

Did he contradict who you believe to be his Father, the All Mighty God, and say these things were mistakes or wrong?

I understand that these are troubling questions to some people, and unpleasant ones, but if we can't be honest with ourselves in regards to confronting basic truths, why would or governments, politicians, leaders and clergy ever want to to be honest with us, if we can't even be honest with ourselves.

Assuming that the right answer to the test is I have faith, I believe, no matter what, might not be the right answer at all, when it comes to scriptures where many of you see two and sometimes three level of meanings too.

I am not trying to challenge you or anyone else, I am though in fact challenging myself, and think it would be in everyone's best benefit for them to challenge themselves too.

Thanks.

reply to post by On the Edge

Last I knew,we all die in the end,Proto! I'm glad there's more to my life than seeing the whole world through Rome-colored glasses. You're no different than Rome,re-writing history to make Jesus obsolete. We'll all find out the truth in the end. Until then,...life goes on.

I believe the scriptures tell us that it is appointed unto man once to die and then the judgment. I don't believe Proto is trying to make Jesus obsolete, it is what he believes and nothing more. Rewriting history is something he's not done either, he's examining it.

Now if it is appointed unto man once to die and then the judgment, I would rather know all the angles that can be a possibility so that I know in the end that I have not been tricked. Doesn't it say that some will wonder why they aren't accepted and that Jesus tells them that He never knew them? I do believe so.

If we look at the system we are in, and realize that one nation under God is its motto, then shouldn't we be doing things a little differently? In regards to some foreign relations policies I mean. This is not meant to single out the U.S. There are many, many more tentacles to this than just the U.S. There are other forces pushing policies as well.

We cannot turn a blind eye to the atrocities or wish harm on certain groups and profess that we are Christian and be offended by what Proto is theorizing. Again, he is not trying to make Jesus obsolete. He believes Jesus never existed so that's what he believes. He still has a major point as to how we are being controlled and it cannot be ignored. In my opinion anyway.

reply to post by jackflap

We cannot turn a blind eye to the atrocities or wish harm on certain groups and profess that we are Christian and be offended by what Proto is theorizing. Again, he is not trying to make Jesus obsolete. He believes Jesus never existed so that's what he believes. He still has a major point as to how we are being controlled and it cannot be ignored. In my opinion anyway.

This is not entirely true, I believe the Christ Sect existed, and was from England. I don't think they had a leader named Jesus though.

Christ does by the way sound more Old English and Germanic than it does semitic.

I simply believe that they invented a leader for the Christ Sect and named him Jesus Christ, as a metaphor for Julius Caesar.

I still contend that there is a reason why of all the Britons, they hunded down the Druids ruthelessly to extermination, that lived in the northern wilds of Britania.

By all legends and accounts they were people very in touch with nature, and the natural order of the world, and the living spirit of the planet, the trees, the rocks, the streams, etc., etc.

Nor do I discount that there could be a supreme source in the universe, along what Christians believe to be God, I just believe he would be a jovial happy fellow, who loved everyone and everything, and wouldn't be jealous, or vengeful, or to take back away what he/it/she provided to us in nature as the form of a tax, and that he/it/she wouldn't want us to kill one another, or make war, or to enslave one another.

Wouldn't it be funny, because I do believe along those lines, and live in that fashion, if there were a judgement day and my name was in the book simply because I believed and felt that way, with out the names, and the rituals, but just because I lived the right way?

reply to post by jackflap

Edit to add: Proto, even if this story is a complete fabrication and never happened, using your theory I see a blue print for genocide and domination. To further edit, before the famine, Pharaoh sent his men to the fields to make sure that a proper portion was sent to the stores. This went on for the seven years of plenty. Were they sent to make sure that the famine would happen as well? Using Proto's theory one can surmise that this was in fact first a blue print as to how to elevate the leadership to a God-like status. In that, Pharaoh would be the only one that could sustain the people!

Not only that my friend, in addition to conditioning people to indifference and needless suffering, you are in fact causing the shortages of vital resources that do make men steal and kill other men.

So in other words the good part of the Ten Commandments, Thou Shall Not Kill, and Thou Shall Not Steal, become almost impossible to follow, in a world where you are literally being forced to kill or steal, just to get a slice of bread!

You are also causing the chaos that makes people want the state to protect them from in the form of harsh laws, and punishments.

All they are in fact doing is laying the foundation for the artifical scarcity paradigm, that has had us fighting for a piece of a pie, purposefully baked to not be enough to feed us all, even though there is plenty of ingredients still on hand, plenty of pie pans still on hand, plenty of ovens still on hand, and plenty of cooks still on hand to fill everyone.

They claim to make laws they don't want us to break, and then ration out the resources they tax from us and lay claim to through divine right, rights of discovery and title, in such a way, that some of us are going to have to break the law, to get any kind of piece of the pie.

They manipulate us to compete and fight, and see the world as a harsh, and violent and unfair place and to accept that, and then they do in fact fight us, with little difference than putting two cocks or dogs in a ring.

I really have to believe that a God who made everything in nature, would naturally want everyone to have a fair and adequate portion of that bounty.

It's not like a super natural all powerful being needs money!

reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler

"The IDF sees the Bible as a guide in the deep and practical sense of the word," said Ashkenazi. "It is no accident that the IDF swears in its soldiers with a weapon in one hand and the Bible in the other – a custom that reflects the uniqueness of the IDF and the deep bond of the Jewish people to the Book of Books."

www.israeltoday.co.il

In November 2008, Ha’aretz journalist Uri Blau published an article entitled “Licence to Kill,” in which he reported that Israeli forces, with the backing of senior military commanders, ignored a 2006 supreme court ruling and shot dead Palestinian fugitives in circumstances where it might have been possible to detain them.

www.irishtimes.com

So we can see here how our perception of the Bible is trying to be shaped. Look at Israel, they believe in the Bible and they shoot terrorists. Can anyone see this for what it is?

Fascinating stuff, sir! But, I think you exaggerate the power that the Romans had in the past. You might be surprised and shocked to hear if I say that that all roads lead to Ethiopia, yes! to the African Ethiopia. Any idea why the Romans tried and failed to colonize Ethiopia? Do you know why the ancient Obelisk of Axum which was stolen by the fascist Romans and placed in Rome next to the headquarters of the United Nations' Food and Agriculture Organisation was struck by lightning when the Italians hasitated to return it to Axum in 2002? news.bbc.co.uk...

Wow Proto... As usual, you seem to be right on the money.

I found this little tidbit purely by accident, but it confirms your Apollo/Troy theory for what the founders of America seemed to be worshipping.

As I point out in Apollyon Rising 2012, novus ordo seclorum is derived from the prophecies of the Cumaean Sibyl, a prophetess of Apollo (Apollo is the Greek version of the Egyptian god Osiris) who predicted the return of this deity at a future date, when men would be rejoined by the gods. President Bush, in his official speech of record, said this scenario is "an ancient hope [plan, scheme] that is meant to be fulfilled" [emphasis added]. source

What could the coming return of Apollo/Osiris mean? I mean, I know that you aren't much into speculating on the other worldly stuff, but clearly they believe something, and this something seems to be connected to 2012.

The reason for this is that in addition to the Raising Ceremony being conducted when members reach the 33rd Degree of Scottish Rite Freemasonry, this strange ceremonial is performed without public knowledge in the Temple Room at the inauguration of every U.S. president. Why? Because deep esoteric meaning behind Egyptian and Rosicrucian magic that was incorporated in the rites and rituals of Freemasonry holds that the spirit of Osiris can be raised from the underworld and "installed" (for want of a better term) in the reigning king or president. This is why the U.S. Capitol Dome is laid out so as to face the Obelisk known as the Washington Monument, as well as other puzzling architecture in Government Center.

Well, this is what higher level freemasons seem to believe.. Is Rome trying to produce somekind of anti-christ in order to fulfill the prophecies of Revelation?

[edit on 3-5-2010 by HothSnake]

[edit on 3-5-2010 by HothSnake]

[edit on 3-5-2010 by HothSnake]

[edit on 3-5-2010 by HothSnake]

Originally posted by Adam2Enoch
Fascinating stuff, sir! But, I think you exaggerate the power that the Romans had in the past. You might be surprised and shocked to hear if I say that that all roads lead to Ethiopia, yes! to the African Ethiopia. Any idea why the Romans tried and failed to colonize Ethiopia? Do you know why the ancient Obelisk of Axum which was stolen by the fascist Romans and placed in Rome next to the headquarters of the United Nations' Food and Agriculture Organisation was struck by lightning when the Italians hasitated to return it to Axum in 2002? news.bbc.co.uk...

Ja Man this be what my brothers in Dyer Maker think, and Haile Selassie and me, and me, and I and I thinks you know!

They think Haile drove the good Queen mad, with a little dog he give her, that roar like a lion!

That Bob Marley knew all of them things man, and that why Sherrif John Brown come to kill him, and try to say it be about the heavenly weed!

Rasclad bumble clad fools!

Their day be coming.

What's that sir, to the airport, right away sir!

Jammin, Jammin, don't you want to jam with me, Jammin, Jammin, don't you want to Jam with me.





[edit on 3/5/10 by ProtoplasmicTraveler]

Originally posted by jackflap
reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler

 

"The IDF sees the Bible as a guide in the deep and practical sense of the word," said Ashkenazi. "It is no accident that the IDF swears in its soldiers with a weapon in one hand and the Bible in the other – a custom that reflects the uniqueness of the IDF and the deep bond of the Jewish people to the Book of Books."

www.israeltoday.co.il

In November 2008, Ha’aretz journalist Uri Blau published an article entitled “Licence to Kill,” in which he reported that Israeli forces, with the backing of senior military commanders, ignored a 2006 supreme court ruling and shot dead Palestinian fugitives in circumstances where it might have been possible to detain them.

www.irishtimes.com

So we can see here how our perception of the Bible is trying to be shaped. Look at Israel, they believe in the Bible and they shoot terrorists. Can anyone see this for what it is?

It's called a Holy War Jackflap, where because people's deeply entrenched beliefs are so pronounced that they believe that killing those that don't believe as they do will please God, or at least be seen as a plausible excuse for killing people, and warring.

The truth is for the amount of money we spend in nations like Israel, and Afghanistan, every one of our so called 'enemies' could have been bought a mansion on Lake Geneva. Everyone in Israel could have been made a millionaire, and everyone in the United States, could have a house in the suburbs and a two car garage.

Yet we prefer to spend that money in devising how to kill in ever more efficient and spectacular ways.

We actually do have guys sitting in Langley VA flying drones over Pakistan and Afghanistan by remote control from that far away, sipping a Latte from Starbucks and eating a Blueberry Muffin, going, I am pretty sure that's the guy! (as they squeeze the trigger and end another life while texting their significant other at home on their cellphone)

Rome is a cruel Master!

Pay your Taxes three times a year, and I shall drive your enemies before you so you may smite them down!

So that your borders may ever enlarge.

Which leads to the question, since Wars always require a pretext, how much do agencies like the CIA heavily infiltrated by the Skull and Bones 322 at the highest level play, when it comes to clandestine efforts behind the scenes to prod 'our' enemies into 'acting' to drive before us, to 'smite' them down?

Originally posted by ProtoplasmicTraveler

My point is,the same system the Bible warns of is alive and well,and we can see the roots of it woven completely throughout our world today.

If it is as entrenched as Proto says it is,and as spiritually condemned as I say it is,it is a very serious matter,one that requires a serious study from all angles.

There is another truth to be found,and that requires acknowledging Biblical truths. Thanks to the Reformation,the word of God has gone out to all the world.

The Word of God is the Ten Commandments which I highly urge you to read.

In the Ten Commandments it is clear God condones slavery. God condones Taxation. God condones strict laws and harsh punishments. God condones expanding the state through Warfare.


It says Thou Shall Not Kill, but then turns around and says if you pay your taxes and follow the laws, God will drive your enemies before you so you kill them?

You live in a state of mind where you just Love the Baby Jesus with all your heart, but will gladly pay taxes to a state that in the name of God and Country will drop bombs on other babies on the other side of the world, all day long, year after year?

I hate to be the Grinch that stole Christmas here, but you people have got to stop justifying all this war, enmity, rancor, slavery, repressive laws, excessive penalties, and excessive taxation as being something that God wants you to do.

ONE: 'You shall have no other gods before Me.'

TWO: 'You shall not make for yourself a carved image--any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth.'

THREE: 'You shall not take the name of the LORD your God in vain.'

FOUR: 'Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy.'

FIVE: 'Honor your father and your mother.'

SIX: 'You shall not murder.'

SEVEN: 'You shall not commit adultery.'

EIGHT: 'You shall not steal.'

NINE: 'You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor.'

TEN: 'You shall not covet your neighbor's house; you shall not covet your neighbor's wife, nor his male servant, nor his female servant, nor his ox, nor his donkey, nor anything that is your neighbor's.'

Proto,I don't know how you see any of this condones taxation,war,and murder. You might not like tha part that says,"Ye shall have no other god's before me",but as the creator of the universe,I think He has a right to say that.

Our governments instill what you say they state. I do not. No where in any post I've ever made here at ATS do I support the way this world is headed. Just because I am not a revolutionary with a plan to start all over doesn't mean I approve. I strive to live my life in peace,and am always quick to offer help,a smile,a word of encouragement where I can. I can control those little things,not overthrowing the Roman Empire!

God says to give to Ceaser what is Ceasar,and to God what is God's. I can see how that might be in Ceasar's favor,in the context it was given.(It was illustrated by using the coin with Ceasar's image on it.) There's so much more to life than money! I follow laws,but I don't worship the state!

One thing people always like to do is to criticize how God does things,or allows certain things to occur. I certainly cannot fathom the mind of God,but I can fathom the New Testament and God's love for us through His Son. Now,naturally,some people will say they wouldn't want to have for a God anyone that would do that to their son. All I know is that if that's the way it is,so be it. I don't look for reasons not to believe,and I have an abundance of reasons why I do believe. I think maybe Predestination plays into that. Maybe not all of us are meant to. I don't know for sure.

I'm all for people searching for meaning to their lives and searching for truth. That can and should last a lifetime. I spent years not believing what I do also,and when I accepted Christ,it was the most natural thing of all. I felt like I was finally "home". That kind of experience one has in their spirit and can't be shared through mere knowledge.

I would be happy to quote scriptures all day to illustrate why God fills me with joy,but it wouldn't matter to you. It's something you have to find on your own. I would suggest you spend more time reading the New Testament and not trying to decide what is right or wrong for God to do. That's just my opinion.

Sorry to have drifted "off topic". As for the Commandments,I just don't see what you see.

reply to post by HothSnake

Well, this is what higher level freemasons seem to believe.. Is Rome trying to produce somekind of anti-christ in order to fulfill the prophecies of Revelation?

Let us just say Rome produces one class of person to be a Martyr, and another class of person to make sure that they will become one.

Both involve a certain amount of detailed ritual, and slowly ingrained beliefs, to convince the individual of the absolute correctness and wisdom in playing out that little deadly dance.

As best I can tell, at this stage 2012 marks the end of the Age of Pisces and the beginning of the Age of Aquarius.

These are the pivotal turning points of the strategies and mindsets that are then employed in the coming age.

There is a certain school of thought amongst the elite that the universe was born out of chaos, and ordering that chaos is a work of art (Here we get back to Apollo again being the God of artists) in progress, and that artistic ordering of the universe has to be done in stages, as the cosmos themselves progress, by building the world in the right order.

This is another Masonic Concept as well, you start out with a foundation, and then build the structure, one level, and one layer at a time, bringing each element of the design and materials into place in a sequence that builds a sound structure.

2012 likely represents the date when you will see the efforts to baton down the electronic control grid, that will created the early stages of a regulated collective consciousness that is to be the focus of the next age.

The Age of Pisces (The Christian Fish) was all about pursuing individual ‘schools’ of thought, that’s what fish do, they swim around in schools. The Age of Aquarius will be about combining those schools of thought, into one vast ocean of collective thought and developing that ocean of thought, by regulating thought, and the collective consciousness.

The elites see this as the logical order of things, in their order out of chaos principles and mindset. They look at the world as a canvas, or a block of stone, and us as the brushes, and chisels and hammers that they use to paint it and shape it, to create what they envision for it. They plan things out far, far in advance, and simply see it all as a puzzle and a challenge, as well as an opportunity.

They do this in a vacuum we by and large create for them, because we do not by and large, pursue knowledge and power, with the same zeal and zest that they do. Because we are typically made to focus on individual schools of thought, we have been taught to believe, or come to believe are politically or religiously correct, in a sense shackling us, and blinding us to other things, perspectives, and ideas and notions at that point.

We have a tendency to explain events and things away, the fit into our own schools of thought.

In fact we are seeing that on this thread and we see it on many threads on ATS where people have an intense desire to make everything fit their own unique theory or school of thought that they belong too, whether it fits sensibly into it or not, as a result, many of the things aren’t seen for what they are.

They aren’t nearly as limited in part because they have access to far more knowledge about a wider variety of disciplines and history and philosophy and aren’t bound or hampered in having to fit into a school of thought to fit into their peer group.

There is something to be said for artistic vision, because the artist does take a blank canvas, block of stone or musical staff, and manifests something onto it, that simply was not there before, through the stroke of the brush, the strike of the hammer, the playing of a note, to create something, that wasn’t there before.

Our individual schools of thought however are always aimed at staying precisely within a framework and foundation that’s already been laid, in a self containing, and circular world, that in essence becomes a trap and a prison.

The Patrician Elite, does not bind them in this fashion, they bind us though, with the things that they create, which they see as artistic ways to order the universe, to their own liking and service.