It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

All Roads Lead to Rome

page: 112
607
<< 109  110  111    113  114  115 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Sep, 19 2010 @ 01:50 AM
link   
reply to post by On the Edge
 




For instance,there's a disconnect somewhere here!... If Rome wrote the Scriptures,why do they go on and insist on changing them?


It is alleged by some, that through Treaty, that Rome actually can veto any law passed in the United States, by the President or Congress.

This appears in a book, titled 50 things you don't know about America.

As far as changing the sabbath to Sun-Day not wanting to get to deeply into religion once again, my own research leads me to conclude Christianity is an unwitting Sun Cult, so holding ceremonies on Sun-Day to the Son-of-God, is of course the right way I imagine to hold a Sun Cult Meeting on Sun-Day to worship the Sun-of-God, where you dedicated all your prayers to Amen a Sun God.

Christianity seems to be about worshipping the Sun, and the Sea, hence the Son of God, and the Holy See.

This makes sense to me, as these are the two most important basic elements to life Sun and Water, which is why I live in Miami next to the Ocean, because it has Sun and Water!

You could actually say I am very religious as I always work on my tan at the sea.




posted on Sep, 19 2010 @ 01:54 AM
link   
reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler
 



Really about as far as I can go into religion, and want to go into religion is that it is being used as a form of base common law and morality, and to promote prophecies that will make it easier for Rome to install a one world Government.


Well,that interests me,too,and as I keep an eye on what Rome is doing in that department,I'll check back in here and share what I know. I'm too tired right now to go into detail,but there's alot in the works.(That change to Sunday ties in with that.)

Can we agree to bring this debate between you and I to a close then? Whaddya say? Peace? It's been a long day. I would like to read through some of the older posts again and see where we have some common ground to speak of.

I'm not your enemy,Proto. I think we can both agree there is alot at stake here.

Have a good night.


edit on 19-9-2010 by On the Edge because: typo



posted on Sep, 19 2010 @ 02:08 AM
link   
reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler
 



Were you just telling me how to address you appropriately in the future? I think I read that correctly, no?



Originally posted by ProtoplasmicTraveler

Well serbsta, no, I have no new information that would meet your threshold of evidence you require to consider such things.



It's not about "my threshold of evidence", you have not presented any evidence at all to support any of those claims that I addressed above.



posted on Sep, 19 2010 @ 02:37 AM
link   
Just a friendly reminder to make sure that everyone sticks to the topic of this thread. Please address the post, and not the poster. No more personal attacks, and no more straying from the topic!

TheBorg
Forum Member and Moderator



posted on Sep, 19 2010 @ 02:59 AM
link   
Proto,
First and foremost I would just like to say thanks for all the effort you’ve put into this theory. It’s incredibly well thought out and it’s obvious you’ve put an enormous amount of time researching and putting all this together. I for one certainly appreciate it.

I first came across this site at around the time you first announced that you would be making an “All Roads Lead to Rome” thread and although I’ve been here ever since, I’ve never actually gotten around to registering until now. Throughout the past few months I’ve read this entire thread and honestly it’s probably one of the most captivating things I’ve ever read and honestly it’s the main reason I stuck around the site.

The question I’ve had about this for a while is how can I stop this? Other than spreading the message and getting people to not empower Rome, what can be done? Realistically, there are many people who are past the point of being persuaded to let go of their beliefs and only so many people can even be reached, so there must be a better way. There must be a more effective and direct route, what do you think that would be in this case?

You mention that technology will be a vital aspect of their final push for complete control, is there any way to counter it? (In terms of personal defense or on a bigger scale such as disabling their technological weapons.)



posted on Sep, 19 2010 @ 08:24 AM
link   
Third Secret of Fatima is worth mentioning in this thread.

Previous Popes and numerous Cardinals have comment, before the allege release, that the document did contain "horrific" scenes and massive implications about the Roman Catholic Church. A Great Apostasy was mentioned by Fr. Malachi Martin (who read the final secret), who said that the final Pope would be under the influence of Satan. Cardinal Ciappi, personal theologian to Pope John Paul II, is quoted by sources as saying, "In the Third Secret it is foretold, among other things, that the great apostasy in the Church will begin at the top." Other bishops and Vatican officials have gone on record to comment about a Great Apostasy and the Catholic Church.

Pope John Paul II even gave a coded description of what was in the final secret - telling the Church to prepare for "many trials" and gave a bizarre example about a message that might depict the deaths of millions. Sister Lucy, one of the children to witness that event, even said herself the final message was in reference to the Apocalypse and was mentioned in the Bible. It was her, who wrote the final secret and gave it to the Pope. Under the orders of the Virgin Mary, it was meant to be opened and read to humanity in 1960. To warn the people. The Pope, at the time, refused because he didn't want "prophets of doom" destroying the Church.

It is widely accepted the document, that was released by the Vatican in 2000, was not the third secret - many Cardinals contradict it, by numerous statements prior to the release. The current Pope, Benedict XVI, was the Cardinal who wrote the explanation on the third secret at the time. So, why would they lie? Here is what the Virgin Mary, apparently said, during an appearance in the 1970s. After the Vatican failed to fulfill her command and release the final secret in 1960:

"How I warned and warned that Satan would enter into the highest realms
of the hierarchy in Rome. The Third Secret, My child, is that Satan
would enter into My Son's Church."
(Our Lady, May 13 1978)


edit on 19-9-2010 by infinite because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 19 2010 @ 08:50 AM
link   
reply to post by serbsta
 





It's not about "my threshold of evidence", you have not presented any evidence at all to support any of those claims that I addressed above.


Actually yes it is, when it comes to any conspiracy it's about the individuals threshhold of evidence.

For instance Scott Peterson is sitting on death row in San Quentin California after being convicted of murder entirely, let me repeat entirely on CIRCUMSTANTIAL evidence.

I have pointed to lots of CIRCUMSTANTIAL evidence that makes these three points you are still asking about months later like a broken record that does in my and many other people's opinions make them very plausible, while some like yourself still are unconvinced.

Once again it's a conspiracy site Serbsta not a College History Exam based on History Books.

Further when it comes to evidence it comes in many forms, not all of it could be presented in a one dimensional form on the Internet.

This is why conspiracies are eventually tried in three dimensional courts where things like Witnesses can be COMPELLED to tesitfy under penalties of perjury.

I am not asking anyone to believe anything that does not meet THEIR threshold of evidence. Circmunstantial evidence plays a huge part in criminal proceedings though when something becomes likely, or probablye, or even a certainty based on circumstances and events, even in absence of physical evidence.

I have presented quite a bit of circumstantial evidence for all three of the points you have in question more recently a few pages back.

So yes in fact I have provided a lot of evidence.



posted on Sep, 19 2010 @ 09:14 AM
link   

Originally posted by On the Edge
reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler
 



Really about as far as I can go into religion, and want to go into religion is that it is being used as a form of base common law and morality, and to promote prophecies that will make it easier for Rome to install a one world Government.


Well,that interests me,too,and as I keep an eye on what Rome is doing in that department,I'll check back in here and share what I know. I'm too tired right now to go into detail,but there's alot in the works.(That change to Sunday ties in with that.)

Can we agree to bring this debate between you and I to a close then? Whaddya say? Peace? It's been a long day. I would like to read through some of the older posts again and see where we have some common ground to speak of.

I'm not your enemy,Proto. I think we can both agree there is alot at stake here.

Have a good night.


edit on 19-9-2010 by On the Edge because: typo



I appreciate you posting that information in regards to how the Pope has the right to change elements in the Bible and the religion.

That's highly topical. It ties in. Tie ins are not necessarily going to prove my theory but it's to note, that because of who we are (the average person) and the limited resources we have at our disposal, discussing theories like this involves looking at a lot of circumstantial evidence, for a pattern, for trends.

Some of the few major points of contention some posters have with the theory, would literally require being able to serve a subeona on the Vatican and being able to search it's archives.

One of the interesting things about the Vatican that once more is circumstantial evidence, is that NO legal authority in the world has the power to compell it to release documents or subject itself to a search.

It's the only organization/city state/nation in the world where there is no mechanism to compell a release of information.

No court, no law, no person, no nation, stands above it.

So where as I believe there is a lot of evidence that would actually make this conspiracy fact and not just theory, stored inside the vatican, the real smoking gun evidence some people crave is just not obtainable for that reason.

Yet the truth remains when you tie enough circumstantial evidence together over a huge period of time that develops patterns and trends and points to certain indicators at play, then I do think it pays to take such things seriously and investigate further and keep trying to obtain the evidence that would nail it down.

To give you an idea, the trials of the Nazi Leadership at Nuremburg for dealing with a period of time of no more than 15 years filled up warehouses with evidence.

Now imagine trying a world wide crime that spanned 2,000 years and how much evidence would really be involved to not just sift through but to prosecute.

The logistics of a conspiracy like this are enormous, and I would caution those readers, who imagine it comes down to one smoking gun document, or confession, or link to a web site, that you really are just kidding yourself in that regard, if you are seriously trying to confirm or debunk the conspiracy theory.

I do believe if we keep the thread ON TOPIC though, and CIVIL and focus in on those individual aspects of the conspiracy that just like in the Original Piece a stronger and stronger case of circumstantial and factual evidence can be put together.

For instance what you posted in regards to the Pope being able to change ellements of the Bible and the Religion at his discretion is fact.

How that all might come into play regarding things like why the Sabbath was moved from Saturday to Sunda is circumstantial.

So no I am not out to be anyone's enemy, in fact I have asked everyone to help in piecing it all together. To do that in a civil environment that aspires to ATS's goals of quality discussion. For people to post honestly and not to purposefully misconstrue what others are saying.

I don't think the conspiracy can be debunked for the same reason it can not be entirely proved, because no one has access to the bulk of the physical documents that would refute certain ellements, which would be the same documents that would prove certain ellements depending what's in them.

I am hoping the thread can move forward again on topic, in a pleasant manner, because as you have said it's an important conspiracy to consider.



posted on Sep, 19 2010 @ 09:40 AM
link   
reply to post by Epiphron
 





The question I’ve had about this for a while is how can I stop this? Other than spreading the message and getting people to not empower Rome, what can be done? Realistically, there are many people who are past the point of being persuaded to let go of their beliefs and only so many people can even be reached, so there must be a better way. There must be a more effective and direct route, what do you think that would be in this case?


Welcome to the boards and becoming an official member.

I think presently the best we can do is not empower Rome further and to keep trying to slow it down.

Right now the number one danger is the economy. The huge problem with the economy is now that almost everything has been bought up by huge multi-national corporations, living wages as well as jobs are hard to come by. The big corporations have driven out smaller living wage competitors through their voluming purchasing power and cheaper distribution networks, and made the competitive environment nearly impossible for most sectors in the economy.

Now we can combat this by going into business for ourselves, by attempting to go after niche markets that the corporations don't see a value in or have not penetrated yet. This can help move the economy a long to a certain extent.

Now I say certain extent because your clients and customers are dependent on money trickling down from the corporations and the banks, which there is a very limited supply of that right now.

So keeping an eye towards not just cash, but considering bartering and trading services where you can, can effectively allow each of us to get some of the vital commodities that we need without having to use money.

In part, while yes, it's all been very convenient what the corporations have done is made us entirely dependent for many things as recently as 50 years ago people would do for themselves. Who still grows any of their own food, who still sews any of their own clothes, who still makes any of their own furniture, who still cans or perserves any of their own food, who still walks or rides a bike, who still bakes, etc. etc.,

Getting out from under our dependence on the big corporations for every aspect of our existence and survival is going to be a very important thing, if we are going to take changing the world to the next stage.

If we can't become semi-independent again, they can put down any riot or rebellion within days just by turning off the power, the cell phones, shutting down the banks and atms and grocery stores.

People will start going hungry within the first day, some of us live day to day, by three days most of us will be short of vital supplies, within a week most will gladly accept any condition for something to eat, within two weeks everyone but a few diehard hold outs will.

All that changes when people develop the ability to sustain themselves locally through cooperatives that actually can produce these vital necessities all on their own, with out any dependency on the big corporations to do it.

So developing or becoming a part of that kind of cooperative network is a proactive thing that really not only slows the process down but starts to reverse it.

This is one of the primary and most important objectives people should pursue if they really want to have any chance of independence and stopping the march to a global government.




You mention that technology will be a vital aspect of their final push for complete control, is there any way to counter it? (In terms of personal defense or on a bigger scale such as disabling their technological weapons.)


I believe there is, and there is a reason the FBI and Pentagon and Banks feel cyber related crime (hacking) is a greater threat than terrorism in the 21st century. There are die hard dedicated groups of techno wizes out there that can assist anyone who is interested in learning more about defensive and offensive measures. I hear they can be found in electronic gaming centers and cyber cafes. Learning some of these skills in a recreational way, for academic purposes might be a real aide to some people, befriending someone with those kinds of highly developed skills might be too.

In fact the most vulnerable point of weakness for the control grid and the Powers that Be are the electronics they use to run it.

Once again it becomes a matter of committment, and focus and that is going to be up to the individual.

The Powers that Be are two, three, four steps ahead creating the trends we react to that drive us like beasts in the direction they want us to go.

Thinking proactively and planning two, three, four steps ahead is part of how you counter that.

The other way is much simpler and that is not to react to how they manipulate and present events the way the herd does and they expect you to react.

If everyone says bomb Iran, well get over to FTD and send flowers, zig, when everyone else appears to zag because the media thinks zagging is the direction to go.

If we don't go in the direction the are trying to drive us, that alone slows them down incredibly and forces them to keep having to contrive another way.

How the powers that be function is as a thinking man's game, emotional reactions take you right out of the play, denial takes you right out of play, under estimating the lengths that they will and do go too, will take you right out of play.

Developing and evolving your own mind, focus, and cognizant abilities to reason and annalyze and ask high quality questions, puts you closer to their level, just without the money and support network.

Which is why the paragraphs above are important, to develop if you can your own independent support network they can't pull the plug on.

Thanks for posting.



posted on Sep, 19 2010 @ 09:52 AM
link   
reply to post by infinite
 




Previous Popes and numerous Cardinals have comment, before the allege release, that the document did contain "horrific" scenes and massive implications about the Roman Catholic Church. A Great Apostasy was mentioned by Fr. Malachi Martin (who read the final secret), who said that the final Pope would be under the influence of Satan. Cardinal Ciappi, personal theologian to Pope John Paul II, is quoted by sources as saying, "In the Third Secret it is foretold, among other things, that the great apostasy in the Church will begin at the top." Other bishops and Vatican officials have gone on record to comment about a Great Apostasy and the Catholic Church.


One of the things I was attempting to touch on last night, the one semi-real ellement that leads people to accept the possible presence of an unseen God that never interacts with the people, thus proving it's existence and what it expects beyond any reasonable doubt is then prophecy.

Because all three faiths have similiar prophecies as part of their books and testaments, that were supposedly handed down from God through his prophets, if current events appear to be mirroring prophecy, then the possibility that this God really exists and is driving events becomes all the more real in people's minds who are predisposed or disposed to consider such things.

A lot of people have questioned why Rome would predict it's own downfall in this way, and in part it's because it's an easy prophecy for Rome to fulfill, and through fulfilling it, it makes it much easier for people to have certainty that the entire notion of God as it pertains to everything else in the books is then real.

So yes I think we have to consider is this why the Catholic Church is being rocked with so many scandals. Was it because of 'coincidence' or was it because internally, things were encouraged that would lead to scandal and exposure that would start that process along, or make it appear like that process is starting to make it look like prophecy is coming true, to get people to buy into every other aspect of the prophecy and the religion with more conviction and to assume all these things are preordained with no way to stop.

I say yes, and I do believe the three religions through their political power structures are working hand in hand to manipulate world events to make it look like prophecy is coming true for all three.

Having said that, these prophecies have believed to be on the verge of coming true many times in history, where people were sure so and so was the Anti-Christ, and this event would lead to this, and this event would lead to that.

I think everyone should consider that while no one has actually been able to get the God that all this centered around to appear in thousands of years, that most people look for signs of that God's existence in prophecies coming true.

So yes that is something that really can be manipulated by the elites and I do believe they have been manipulating that, for the very reason of getting people to accept trends and events they might not and rebel against if it weren't for prophecy that suggests then that it's all the work of God and not just a handful of very dedicated powerful men.

I think we have to examine closely the motive for such disclosures and consider that these events are being manipulated.

Thanks for posting that.



posted on Sep, 19 2010 @ 10:03 AM
link   
 


off-topic post removed to prevent thread-drift


 



posted on Sep, 19 2010 @ 10:21 AM
link   

Originally posted by ohsnaptruth
It's funny how anything before Athens, Troy, and Sparta didn't exist.


It doesn't exist as part of the conspiracy and time line for it. I really do wish people would stop using the thread as a political platform and start focusing in on the topic.

What really does exist if you look at the actual thread, (Through thousands of off topic posts like this one) is that no one who feels these things are important has been able to establish any DIRECT TIE IN TO THIS CONSPIRACY and how they FACTOR IN TO the Roman Power Structure.

Now if you have a theory A DETAILED THEORY that actually does tie in, how about posting it, by HIGHLIGHTING the TIE INS.

No it's not an ancient civilization, religious, UFO discussion.

Over and over again I an other posters have showed how Rome eventually conquered all the other ancient civilizations none of which conquered Rome.

My dog wags it's tail, it's tail does not wag my dog.

Thanks.



posted on Sep, 19 2010 @ 10:36 AM
link   
reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler
 
Awesome work,
It certainly is evident that this would be present in todays structure.
And yes ,for a simple fact, just look at the architecture of today, that signature is everywhere.



posted on Sep, 19 2010 @ 10:41 AM
link   

Originally posted by Lil Drummerboy
reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler
 
Awesome work,
It certainly is evident that this would be present in todays structure.
And yes ,for a simple fact, just look at the architecture of today, that signature is everywhere.




The circumstantial evidence regarding this theory is truly extensive, woven all through out religion, edifices and offices of power, the law, and science heavily using latin, the tie-ins to the International Banking Cartel and many, many others, the more you look at it and the more you investigate it the more you see it all around you in everything, on our money, in our customs, in ornaments in the halls of power, that all speak of and to Rome.

Thanks for posting and reading.



posted on Sep, 19 2010 @ 11:00 AM
link   

Originally posted by Lil Drummerboy
reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler
 
Awesome work,
It certainly is evident that this would be present in todays structure.
And yes ,for a simple fact, just look at the architecture of today, that signature is everywhere.


That is certainly right, look at Washington D.C. with the Greek and Roman architecture, not only there but much of the Northern East Coast, in my area suburbs like Birmingham, The Grosse Pointes are heavily influenced by that type of architecture and they are affluent areas which is interesting in itself.



posted on Sep, 19 2010 @ 12:21 PM
link   

yes that is something that really can be manipulated by the elites


Who hasn't read this before?


The Third World War must be fomented by taking advantage of the differences caused by the "agentur" of the "Illuminati" between the political Zionists and the leaders of Islamic World. The war must be conducted in such a way that Islam (the Moslem Arabic World) and political Zionism (the State of Israel) mutually destroy each other. Meanwhile the other nations, once more divided on this issue will be constrained to fight to the point of complete physical, moral, spiritual and economical exhaustion…We shall unleash the Nihilists and the atheists, and we shall provoke a formidable social cataclysm which in all its horror will show clearly to the nations the effect of absolute atheism, origin of savagery and of the most bloody turmoil. Then everywhere, the citizens, obliged to defend themselves against the world minority of revolutionaries, will exterminate those destroyers of civilization, and the multitude, disillusioned with Christianity, whose deistic spirits will from that moment be without compass or direction, anxious for an ideal, but without knowing where to render its adoration, will receive the true light through the universal manifestation of the pure doctrine of Lucifer, brought finally out in the public view. This manifestation will result from the general reactionary movement which will follow the destruction of Christianity and atheism, both conquered and exterminated at the same time." | Albert Pike In 1871 letter to Mazzini
www.watchmanbiblestudy.com...

Again,that fits in with this,Revelation 17:17
"For God hath put in their hearts to fulfil his will, and to agree, and give their kingdom unto the beast, until the words of God shall be fulfilled."

So it would make one wonder,"Which came first? The Chicken or the Egg?"

Inquiring minds want to know!

(And truly,what one believes all comes down to faith. Faith in what we've been told,faith in what we read,faith in what we see,faith in things unseen,...)



posted on Sep, 19 2010 @ 12:25 PM
link   
reply to post by On the Edge
 

Check out All Roads Lead To Rome Part IV, it should right up your alley and on topic.
www.abovetopsecret.com...&addstar=1&on=9601042#



posted on Sep, 19 2010 @ 12:31 PM
link   
reply to post by Aquarius1
 


I'm sorry,...but who made you a moderator? Actually,what I just posted was "on topic",in case you don't realize it..."manipulation by the elites"...???

So,if it was written by Rome,the elites are following the plan,as written,...see how that ties in?

And by the way,I have seen Proto has some new threads going,thank you.



posted on Sep, 19 2010 @ 12:35 PM
link   
In a reasoned attempt to get the thread back on track, and keep it focused on the main elements of the conspiracy for sincere members who want to have a topical discussion, I have gone ahead and created three additional threads, to give posters who are focused on other ancient civilizations who have not been able to create a direct and sound tie in to this theory, posters who are focused on Star Gates, UFO's and Extra Terrestrials who have not been able to create a direct tie in to this theory, and posters who want to discuss Religious aspects that have not been able to create a direct tie in, to discuss these things as it pertains to this theory.

Now before the critics assail this, Undo tried to do this herself 5 months ago, in a thread she created to discuss how her theories should be included. It barely grew to two pages.

So hopefully with me personally involved it will encourage more people who's central focus seems to be on me, and secondary focus on these other topics, to get together in these threads in a positive collabrative way, to develop some sound full theories that actually can then show a direct tie in to my own.

This will eliminate the clutter in the thread and of course CHALLENGE such minded posters to actually come up with some sound arguments that don't just involve a negative focus towards me.

Sound theories will be strongly considered and if anyone can prove how these things really tie in, then yes I will tie them in to my own theory.

So lets expand Rome into the specific areas many of you claim to be so passionate about and feel you can make strong cases for a greater tie in to this thread but haven't., lets take the snipes and gripes about them there too, so people who want to enjoy the conspiracy, the general conspiracy discussion as it topically pertains to this thread can.

People who want to discuss other ancient civilizations this is your thread.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

People who want to discuss UFO's, Star Gates this is your thread.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

People who want to discuss Religion this is your thread.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

I will be very impressed with those who display a genuine enough passion about these things to actually display that same passion in a thread aimed at collobrative discussion and producing something productive, beyond the snipes and gripes many are using them for in an attempt to derail the thread with these things.

Work it out, enjoy, and I will keep my eye on them too.

Thanks.



posted on Sep, 19 2010 @ 12:35 PM
link   
reply to post by On the Edge
 


Just letting you know about the new thread that talks about religion nothing more.




top topics



 
607
<< 109  110  111    113  114  115 >>

log in

join