It's actually quite surprising to me that Hawking thinks that we shouldn't seek contact.. why? I'd love to hear his reasoning for this.

To my logic, if the hypothetical aliens have mastered intergalactic travel etc, would they really be some barbaric morons? I think we're reflecting our own idiocy to other possible species here.

Oh yeah, he's not saying that "aliens" actually exists, he's saying that the probability of extraterrestrial life is very great. There's a huge difference.

[edit on 24/4/2010 by Tryptych]

Originally posted by Schaden

Originally posted by Bob Sholtz
"Astrophysicist Hugh Ross has calculated the probability that these and other constants (122 in all) would exist today for any planet in the universe by chance (I.e., without Divine design). Assuming there are 10^22 planets in the universe (a very large number: 1 with 22 zeros following it), his answer is shocking; one chance in 10^138, that’s one chance in one with 138 zeros after it. There are only about 10^70 atoms in the entire universe."

do i believe that life exists elsewhere? meh, i'm not sure. but to claim that the odds are in favor of life existing elsewhere is silly when the chances of life existing on our own planet is so slim.

If he calculated the odds as greater than all of the atoms in the universe, and yet humans are here, his estimate appears severly flawed and invalid.

My personal guess is there are perhaps dozens of planets with advanced life, in our galaxy alone. It could be in the hundreds of thousands, millions even, considering the size of the entire universe.

thats what the odds are...based on anthropic constants, for life to exist without intervention.

though your train of logic is interesting. preconsieved belief>confronted with data>life exists, so data must be wrong>preconsieved belief holds.

nothing really wrong with it, though either you misread, didn't read the link, or tossed out the possibility of an overarching god figure.

Originally posted by Tryptych
It's actually quite surprising to me that Hawking thinks that we shouldn't seek contact.. why? I'd love to hear his reasoning for this.

To my logic, if the hypothetical aliens have mastered intergalactic travel etc, would they really be some barbaric morons? I think we're reflecting our own idiocy to other possible species here.

broadcasting "WE ARE HERE!" to civilizations with unknowable intentions and unknowable natures is almost certainly a bad idea. like hawking postulated, a civilization vastly beyond ours in terms of technology has likely mined out their homeworld - they are constantly on the hunt for resources. what would humans do if they found an oil deposit directly below a giant ant colony?

Actually what he's saying in this article is: "Watch out if you would meet an alien. You could be infected with a disease with which you have no resistance."

Yeah he seem to have a few reason why contact is bad. I think it was the national geographic appearence where he metioned we should hide because we are on a resource rich planet also full of genetic diversity, neither of which we seem to be respecting, but alluded to from memory that it was the fact they propbably dont give a dam about us and may just remove us to get to our rich planet. He cited conflicts in our own past between advanced beings and primitives natives often not ending well for the latter.

[edit on 24-4-2010 by polarwarrior]

Originally posted by killuminati2012
The issue isn't so much if life exists outside of this little blue ball we call Earth. I have yet to see a scientist deny that as probable. The real debate is about intelligent life visiting Earth.

This I agree with 100%. We are quick to say that in the vastness of space alien life must be there but then we shrink unlimited space conveniently down to the point that we can also suggest this alien life can actually find us.

But I agree that so far intelligence on earth tends to be in carnivores more than grass eaters, so if that day comes just what do you all think they might be?

Also when that day comes I’m talking even upwards of billions of years from now. I see that the likelihood of us meet another alien race would be when we are traveling intergalactic too.

Lastly, one of our greatest minds that is in the know on many levels never suggests aliens are among us or ever were.



[edit on 24-4-2010 by Xtrozero]

Originally posted by grantbeed
I completely disagree with this thinking. Surely a civilisation so advanced would not be dependant on fossil fuels such as Oil?

It was an analogy.

They would be living on clean,green energy, harnessing energy sources that we can not even comprehend now on Earth.

Why would they be so advanced on one hand, but humanly barbaric on the other?

You are making assumptions. broadcasting our position is playing cosmic russian roulette with the fate of our species.

Bear in mind the most intelligent animals on the earth are all either predators or omnivores. predators have aggressive instincts.

Originally posted by ghostsoldier
I very much doubt that any species that can travel between stars and galaxies would be a war-like people. They would be an extreme rarity in anycase.

If we do not wipe ourselves out we will be traveling and most likely war like. I just run with the examples that I have available and I don’t like it….hehe

This is something that Dr. Michio Kaku has been saying too, that trying to contact extraterrestrials may not be a good idea yet. It just sounds like really cynical thinking to me. I don't feel that barbarism is an eternal trait of a species. Those days should be ancient for a race of extraterrestrials capable of interstellar travel. Maybe they aren't here because they can't teach us anything we would accept right now. They best they could do is guide us subtly and secretively.

Originally posted by Tryptych
It's actually quite surprising to me that Hawking thinks that we shouldn't seek contact.. why? I'd love to hear his reasoning for this.

To my logic, if the hypothetical aliens have mastered intergalactic travel etc, would they really be some barbaric morons? I think we're reflecting our own idiocy to other possible species here.

Oh yeah, he's not saying that "aliens" actually exists, he's saying that the probability of extraterrestrial life is very great. There's a huge difference.

Well we might see it as barbaric... they might see it as food. Is eating an apple barbaric? You kind of superimpose what we think and feel on aliens. They might (most likely) don’t even have thought process like ours. Earth could just be edible carbon with us and plant life all bunched together in the same category. Also Hawking suggests that this life form might be traveling without spaceship and so they might not be very intelligent as we think and just travel around eating like a giant whale eating shrimp, or disrupt life on earth without a thought at all.

Originally posted by grantbeed
This is Earth, how do we know this is the system anywhere else off the Earth?

Actually, no, I am pointing out a pattern. Intelligence most often arises due to the need to plan an attack. Herbivores do not need to plan how to eat plants. Carnivores do need to plan how to catch herbivores.

Obviously extraterrestrials will be from an entirely separate biosphere, but if they have predators, it is very likely they will develop the most intelligence.