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Why soldiers get a kick out of killing

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posted on Apr, 24 2010 @ 08:56 PM
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Warrior gene? Sounds like utter bull#. Kind of like the cancer gene, or the "I'm fat because I got bad genes, not because I sit on my ass all day eating donuts" gene. People are the way they are by the collection of events within their life, whether by their choice or not. My mother has skin-cancer because she sunbathed without wearing sunscreen for decades. No bad genes there other than low melatonin levels because she's white.

The Maori seem to have the "warrior" gene because the warrior culture is ingrained into their society. Of course many of their men are going to be warriors! There are dozens of cultures all across the world that are the same way. A human being is a human being, genetic differentiation is merely limited to the adaptions people have made to various climates. To think that there are genes that make whites "naturally-inclined to imperialism" or makes blacks "super-athletes" is rather racist and unfounded.

To label soldiers as aggressive psychotics because they carry a "warrior" gene, or just merely labeling them with any stereotype, is wrong. This science is unfounded and IGNORANT. I choose to deny ignorance on this one. You should do the same.




posted on Apr, 24 2010 @ 09:17 PM
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Originally posted by Thermo Klein
The author goes on to talk about neurochemicals. One so-called "warrior gene" is carried by 56 percent of Maori men, who are renowned for being "fearless warriors," and only 34 percent of Caucasian males [same article].


"Warrior Gene" does sound cool, but not as cool as what we call it:

"The Mean Gene."



posted on Apr, 24 2010 @ 09:29 PM
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reply to post by Thermo Klein
 


Of course some people get a kick out of killing but when its for their "country" or when they're killing someone who is armed its seen as less morally reprehensible (and even heroic to some people).

In order for a soldier to steel himself against the horrors of war he must believe his enemies as less than him, as subhuman or evil. Once he has detached himself from the truth of his actions he can be an effective killing machine. If they weren't desensitized and dehumanizing their enemies we'd have every single soldier coming home with intense mental trauma. They have to put up these rather sickening defense mechanisms which we back here on safe American soil can't understand. They have to make themselves feel that completing the mission, even if it means ending a life, is for the good of their nation or in their own self-interest.

War and killing are terrible terrible things and I used to think everyone understood the psychology involved but after the Wiki-Leaks video was released the uproar didn't seem to match the crime involved. If you were a soldier trying to get back home to your family and saw a guy peaking around a corner with an RPG you would want to open fire as well rather than risk your own life to let that guy get a shot off at your chopper or let them live to shoot your fellow soldiers some time down the line.

If we humans would just learn to unite and work together we'd be able to avoid wars like this, of course we'd also have to stop listening to the super-rich and Elite power interests that drive empty horrific wars like Iraq.



posted on Apr, 24 2010 @ 09:29 PM
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Originally posted by Awolscout
Later on in OSUT after talking to a lot of the other PVT, PFC, and SPC's I realized that most of them were certifiably insane, however based on the hero worship this country hold's it would be thought of that way.


And you happen to have a degree to back up your judgement that they were "certifiably insane"? Or are you just running your suck?


Originally posted by Awolscout
I have the piece of paper framed on my wall to let me know that I value life above my own comfort.


No, what you value is your own comfortable life.


Trust me, Homeschool. No one in the military respects you, and your "friends" laugh at you behind your back. Especially after they get stuck humping a ruck in A-stan.

[edit on 24-4-2010 by jerico65]



posted on Apr, 24 2010 @ 09:39 PM
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Beats being killed.
Big time.



posted on Apr, 24 2010 @ 09:58 PM
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Originally posted by jerico65

Originally posted by Awolscout
Later on in OSUT after talking to a lot of the other PVT, PFC, and SPC's I realized that most of them were certifiably insane, however based on the hero worship this country hold's it would be thought of that way.


And you happen to have a degree to back up your judgement that they were "certifiably insane"? Or are you just running your suck?


Your right, I don't have a degree in Psychology or any form of Psycho Therapy, but I'm pretty sure that seeing as the bulk of them wanted to get paid to murder people, keep in mind they never listed defending their country as a reason, these guy's all joined up to blow stuff up and get paid to cause mayhem, and I'm not exaggerating at all before you suggest it.

For instance one Pfc. and I had a conversation closer to the end of OSUT, he hated me most of the way through and I hated him but we eventually got to a sort of neutral respect between each other. This guy tell's me that he's never done anything of worth in his life, and that everything he's tried
just hasn't felt right, until the other day when he was shooting at the target's at the Short Range training, namely the one's with people on them not silhouettes, picture's of people, that he finally realised that he was given a gift to kill people from God.

Now maybe I'm the crazy one, but uh wouldn't someone of your ignorance level call that a terrorist if I didn't mention they were in the army?



Originally posted by Awolscout
I have the piece of paper framed on my wall to let me know that I value life above my own comfort.

No, what you value is your own comfortable life.


Trust me, Homeschool. No one in the military respects you, and your "friends" laugh at you behind your back. Especially after they get stuck humping a ruck in A-stan.

[edit on 24-4-2010 by jerico65]


Homeschool? what does that even mean? Is it an insult? seeing as I was in public school my entire life, not to mention school's that you'd probably get scared and run away from just thinking about attending them...

I didn't have a comfortable life btw, unless you call living with a a physically abusive alcoholic step-father for eight years before I turned 18 comfy or maybe living on the street's comfy or maybe working three job's just to find out that you couldn't afford both your rent and car payment's comfy? Once again you know nothing about me besides what I told you but you assume because you have some image in the back of your head already made up... seriously that will get you in trouble one day.

and as for my friend's laughing at me behind my back... well I can't exactly comment on that one except to say that if they do, oh well, they still want me around and the still help me out of tough situation's form time to time. I know I say stuff about them occasionally and I'm sure they say stuff about me, but what really matter's is what someone DOES to your face not what they SAY. So that point doesn't matter to me at all, even though I know you just wanted to make me mad.

Also are you gonna respond to every single point I made in my post, or just one's that you can try and make work to your very narrow-minded point of view on the matter?

EDIT: Once again had to fix my typing... I know I know I'm terrible at it


[edit on 24-4-2010 by Awolscout]



posted on Apr, 24 2010 @ 10:14 PM
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Originally posted by drwizardphd

Originally posted by adifferentbreed
An expert on chimpanzees.........look, the title alone is insulting to every soldier, and yet this liberal, yup harvard don't ya know, expert makes statements like this.


Why does the author have to be liberal if he is educated and went to Harvard?



And yet whenever some authority is needed they refer to Harvard or its like. And so they have become the benchmark for educated dumba**es.


War is a form of organized insanity.



posted on Apr, 24 2010 @ 10:26 PM
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First off, being a soldier and being a warrior are two different things. If you want to involve semantics then a merc is almost the same as a soldier. Except the merc is better trained and gets paid much more to kill.

The romanticism about going to war and killing the enemy for democracy is pure fantasy. They'd be better off labeling it vengeance than whatever it is that they call it now. Its really just an all out hellzone for everyone involved. Even Dick Cheney called that region a 'quagmire, with no hope of anything other than occupation for years, or decades.' In 1992. Where we at now? (and don't make me dig up that quote, please)

The true soldier, or warrior, will fight for his unit, his friends. Once inside the hellzone, you just want all your buds to get out alive. Political ideologies are for the NCOs and the grunt has to serve it up for 'them'. Once inside, you gotta do what you gotta do if you ever want to go home.

The real coward is the one who possesses superior firepower only to use it against anyone weaker regardless of combat status. Tactics like those breed an improvised enemy. Amazing how well 'shock and awe' worked, it would've except we didn't do that.

Soldiers became employees. Kill fever is ramped up and everyone is all the worse for it. The ones who can handle the mental stress go on to productive careers, yet the others who don't become broken fragments of society, even if they are entirely virtuous.

People get used all the time. If your son was killed in war it would be tragic, no press for you.

If you're an admirals son and you fff off and cause 168 sailors deaths... You move on to an heroic senate career. Its fake as all heaps.

My point is that we should protect our areas in order to prevent terrorism. Like our families, properties, and personal supplies. Life is not a video game battling insurgents that really prefer to be left alone.



posted on Apr, 24 2010 @ 10:31 PM
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Originally posted by Awolscout
Well if you wanna get technical on that swear to serve the country statement, I swore to uphold the constitution and protect the people of the united states. the thing about that is that I don't see foreign soldiers waging war against the people on our shores and seeing as every single foreign war we are in right now is unconstitutional I think I'm in the right.


Bravo!


I respect your "dishonorable" discharge - thank you for valueing life and the Constitution over other options.



posted on Apr, 24 2010 @ 10:42 PM
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Originally posted by Thermo Klein

Originally posted by Awolscout
Well if you wanna get technical on that swear to serve the country statement, I swore to uphold the constitution and protect the people of the united states. the thing about that is that I don't see foreign soldiers waging war against the people on our shores and seeing as every single foreign war we are in right now is unconstitutional I think I'm in the right.


Bravo!


I respect your "dishonorable" discharge - thank you for valueing life and the Constitution over other options.


Thank you it mean's a lot, I had a discussion with my family a little while ago, where they asked if I'm a total pacifist and whether or not I would be willing to fight if our country was under attack and they were threatened and I told them that I swore an oath to protect the american people and that if need be I would...

So it's nice when people recognize that my reasoning was sound



posted on Apr, 24 2010 @ 10:50 PM
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Originally posted by Awolscout
Your right, I don't have a degree in Psychology or any form of Psycho Therapy, but I'm pretty sure that seeing as the bulk of them wanted to get paid to murder people........


You don't murder in wartime. You kill. There's a difference.


Originally posted by Awolscout
keep in mind they never listed defending their country as a reason, these guy's all joined up to blow stuff up and get paid to cause mayhem, and I'm not exaggerating at all before you suggest it.


No sh!t, Sherlock. That's part of being in the Infantry. Didn't you catch on when they gave you a rifle, grenades and sharp, pointy objects? Infantry are suppose to kill people and break their sh!t. It's part of the job.

Or maybe even a perk.


Originally posted by Awolscout
For instance one Pfc. and I had a conversation closer to the end of OSUT, he hated me most of the way through and I hated him but we eventually got to a sort of neutral respect between each other. This guy tell's me that he's never done anything of worth in his life, and that everything he's tried
just hasn't felt right, until the other day when he was shooting at the target's at the Short Range training, namely the one's with people on them not silhouettes, picture's of people, that he finally realised that he was given a gift to kill people from God.


That is a "gift". Not one of the better ones, but some people can be Infantry and some can't. One of the tasks is to close with the enemy and kill him. And you better have some sort of "gift" or you'll be the one killed.


Originally posted by Awolscout
Now maybe I'm the crazy one, but uh wouldn't someone of your ignorance level call that a terrorist if I didn't mention they were in the army?


Uh, no, Von Braun. Terrorists aren't Soldiers.


Originally posted by Awolscout
Homeschool? what does that even mean? Is it an insult? seeing as I was in public school my entire life, not to mention school's that you'd probably get scared and run away from just thinking about attending them...

I didn't have a comfortable life btw, unless you call living with a a physically abusive alcoholic step-father for eight years before I turned 18 comfy or maybe living on the street's comfy or maybe working three job's just to find out that you couldn't afford both your rent and car payment's comfy? Once again you know nothing about me besides what I told you but you assume because you have some image in the back of your head already made up... seriously that will get you in trouble one day.

and as for my friend's laughing at me behind my back... well I can't exactly comment on that one except to say that if they do, oh well, they still want me around and the still help me out of tough situation's form time to time. I know I say stuff about them occasionally and I'm sure they say stuff about me, but what really matter's is what someone DOES to your face not what they SAY. So that point doesn't matter to me at all, even though I know you just wanted to make me mad.


"Woe is me! I came from the streets, my life sucks, I was so deprived!" Words, words, words. Dude, you went AWOL ( or so you say). That speaks volumes about your own integrity.

And "Comfort" can be taken many different ways. Couldn't make the rent? Sucks to be you, but no one was shooting at you at the same time, were they?


Originally posted by Awolscout
Also are you gonna respond to every single point I made in my post, or just one's that you can try and make work to your very narrow-minded point of view on the matter?


Just the ones that are clownshoes.



posted on Apr, 24 2010 @ 11:06 PM
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Originally posted by dfens
Except the merc is better trained and gets paid much more to kill.


Better trained? Really? That's interesting.


Originally posted by dfens
The real coward is the one who possesses superior firepower only to use it against anyone weaker regardless of combat status. Tactics like those breed an improvised enemy. Amazing how well 'shock and awe' worked, it would've except we didn't do that.


If you fight fair, you're doing something wrong.


Originally posted by dfens
If you're an admirals son and you fff off and cause 168 sailors deaths... You move on to an heroic senate career. Its fake as all heaps.


Hmmmm...someone hasn't been doing their research. No-go at this station.


Originally posted by dfens
My point is that we should protect our areas in order to prevent terrorism. Like our families, properties, and personal supplies. Life is not a video game battling insurgents that really prefer to be left alone.


You think that if we don't fight them, they'll leave us alone? Interesting.



posted on Apr, 24 2010 @ 11:26 PM
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Originally posted by jerico65

You don't murder in wartime. You kill. There's a difference.

No sh!t, Sherlock. That's part of being in the Infantry. Didn't you catch on when they gave you a rifle, grenades and sharp, pointy objects? Infantry are suppose to kill people and break their sh!t. It's part of the job.

Or maybe even a perk.

That is a "gift". Not one of the better ones, but some people can be Infantry and some can't. One of the tasks is to close with the enemy and kill him. And you better have some sort of "gift" or you'll be the one killed.




You have some serious issues to work through if you think any of what you said here is true... Murder is murder, it doesn't change because it's a "war" either you kill someone out of cold blood or you don't there is no shade of gray in this area.

Killing is a perk? I really have no idea how to respond to that... You need to seriously re-evaluate your view's on the importance of life if this is truly what you believe.

god doesn't give gift's of death, so this one in this context I can flat out prove you wrong. If we are in fact talking about the God of the Bible, which is what the soldier who told me this was referencing so that is what we are talking about, then the Bible discuss on different "gift's of the spirit" which are meant to help spread the gospel and the teachings of Christ's love.

You turning that into a gift for murder, sounds vaguely like other extremists attempting to change they're holy book to better suit their own insanity.

I'm done with you... I don't understand how you manage to truly believe any of what your saying, and I hope that you just want to troll me for no reason... I'd rather that than someone truly having these thought's. The sad part is that I know it's possible for someone to believe these thing's based off my own experience dealing with them.

Good luck to you trying to escape a very bad train of thought's.



posted on Apr, 24 2010 @ 11:36 PM
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Originally posted by Awolscout
You have some serious issues to work through if you think any of what you said here is true... Murder is murder, it doesn't change because it's a "war" either you kill someone out of cold blood or you don't there is no shade of gray in this area.


Nope, no issues. Just speaking from experiences you don't have.

Shoot someone for his sneakers or iPod, that's murder.

Shoot him in combat, that's killing.


Originally posted by Awolscout
Killing is a perk? I really have no idea how to respond to that... You need to seriously re-evaluate your view's on the importance of life if this is truly what you believe.


You need to run down to 7-11 and buy a Big Gulp and a sense of humor.


Originally posted by Awolscout
god doesn't give gift's of death, so this one in this context I can flat out prove you wrong. If we are in fact talking about the God of the Bible, which is what the soldier who told me this was referencing so that is what we are talking about, then the Bible discuss on different "gift's of the spirit" which are meant to help spread the gospel and the teachings of Christ's love.

You turning that into a gift for murder, sounds vaguely like other extremists attempting to change they're holy book to better suit their own insanity.


How about this: Instead of "gift", you need an aptitude or talent for combat to succeed.


Originally posted by Awolscout
I'm done with you... I don't understand how you manage to truly believe any of what your saying, and I hope that you just want to troll me for no reason... I'd rather that than someone truly having these thought's. The sad part is that I know it's possible for someone to believe these thing's based off my own experience dealing with them.


Troll? Nope, not at all. Just busting your balls over coming on this board and bragging about being an AWOL, then running your suck about Soldiers when you don't have Clue One about what you're talking about. As you admitted, you never finished training, so how can you go on about killing and the Warrior Gene when you obviously don't have it?


Originally posted by Awolscout
Good luck to you trying to escape a very bad train of thought's.


Good luck with living without honor and integrity.



posted on Apr, 25 2010 @ 11:01 AM
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Originally posted by Awolscout

Originally posted by jerico65

You don't murder in wartime. You kill. There's a difference.

No sh!t, Sherlock. That's part of being in the Infantry. Didn't you catch on when they gave you a rifle, grenades and sharp, pointy objects? Infantry are suppose to kill people and break their sh!t. It's part of the job.

Or maybe even a perk.

That is a "gift". Not one of the better ones, but some people can be Infantry and some can't. One of the tasks is to close with the enemy and kill him. And you better have some sort of "gift" or you'll be the one killed.





god doesn't give gift's of death, so this one in this context I can flat out prove you wrong. If we are in fact talking about the God of the Bible, which is what the soldier who told me this was referencing so that is what we are talking about, then the Bible discuss on different "gift's of the spirit" which are meant to help spread the gospel and the teachings of Christ's love.

You turning that into a gift for murder, sounds vaguely like other extremists attempting to change they're holy book to better suit their own insanity.

I'm done with you... I don't understand how you manage to truly believe any of what your saying, and I hope that you just want to troll me for no reason... I'd rather that than someone truly having these thought's. The sad part is that I know it's possible for someone to believe these thing's based off my own experience dealing with them.

Good luck to you trying to escape a very bad train of thought's.



Yes God dosent give gifts of death....thats just standard fair.

Anyway your ideas are what should be expected when you try to mix Jesus in with what has no application. Not to mention some Jesus of your own making. Dont break your neck judging others by your ideas of Jesus.

It is said that when he returns He will slay his enmies with a sword out of His mouth. What Jesus are you talking about? Are you going to lecture Jesus about how He deals with his enemies?



posted on Apr, 25 2010 @ 06:49 PM
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Maybe a better question would be, "Why do anti-military trolls keep posting generalized false statements, that have nothing to do with any conspiracy?" FYI, soldiers do not "get a kick" out of shooting people. That video was of a valid, legal, action, against people that had been firing on vehicles, and thus were taken out by air support. Yes, our military members will kill as needed, but that doesn't mean they "get a kick out of it". Most would rather such action was never necessary. However, in a world where fanatics fly planes into buildings, bomb embassies, ships, school buses, subways, etc, such actions are necessary. I am sick to death of this sort of crappy post. it isn't about any conspiracy, and is a clear blanket attack of our entire military. Why it wasn't summarily removed is beyond me. I know military people. I am a veteran, married to a career soldier, and most of the people we have known over the 17+ years he's been in are military, and not one single one of these people gets a kick out of killing anyone. Those claiming to know someone that did or either full of BS, or met a rare, sick person that should never have been allowed to enlist. Now, do you know of some actual conspiracy involving the military, or is this all we get?



posted on Apr, 25 2010 @ 10:49 PM
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Many people like the satisfaction of 'killing' things, perhaps especially other people.

The trouble with soldiers having this raw savage characteristic of humanity exposed & directing their actions is because they are armed & trained to kill.

It exposes any semblance of a 'high' or 'honorable' mission to crass wanton savagery that has no redeeming values except as a means of looting the treasury of some hard working nation.



posted on Apr, 25 2010 @ 11:18 PM
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reply to post by Awolscout
 


To say all members of the military are certifiable is, well, certifiable. By pointing out some garbage a knucklehead in BCT spouted off as substantial proof of a study which was admittedly inconclusive, is anemic at best.

Did the study cover the immediate relief mixed with a confused retrospective one feels when surviving an engagement where you have had to kill someone? There is no way that can be confused with "the enjoyment of killing" although, to the uninitiated, it may appear similar.



posted on Apr, 25 2010 @ 11:45 PM
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A more perfect military is cold, clinical, scrupulous.

They have a job to do. They have well thought out reasons for doing it. They have standards of behavior & discipline.

They don't do it for the pleasure of it. They don't do it for fun. They don't do it to fulfill sadistic tendencies.

They do it, simply, coolly because there is a job that must be done,
done by adults, not by drunken savages who will screw everything up at every turn.

The fact is that militaries are staffed by mere mortals, & usually not the most lofty of the mortals either.

Militaries left purely to their own devices invarably degenerate into treasonous, tyrannical, violent blood lust organizations, just like the US Pentagon & contractor war machine.

That is why having a draft is so important, & why having a standing army is a very dubious policy.



posted on Apr, 26 2010 @ 12:51 AM
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Originally posted by LadyGreenEyes
Maybe a better question would be, "Why do anti-military trolls keep posting generalized false statements, that have nothing to do with any conspiracy?"
...
I am sick to death of this sort of crappy post. it isn't about any conspiracy, and is a clear blanket attack of our entire military. Why it wasn't summarily removed is beyond me.


Did you actually read this before you "foe'd" me???

The title of the thread is the title of an article from Scientific American - I posted it because it should be debated. It's not even my point of view!

By the way - it's about genes not military bashing...

[edit on 26-4-2010 by Thermo Klein]



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