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Why soldiers get a kick out of killing

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posted on Apr, 24 2010 @ 06:47 PM
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This is from Scientific American online: Why soldiers get a kick out of killing


Do some soldiers enjoy killing? If so, why? This question is thrust upon us by the recently released video of U.S. Apache helicopter pilots shooting a Reuters cameraman and his driver in Baghdad in 2007.


The exchange reminds me of a Times story from March 2003, during the U.S. invasion of Baghdad. The reporter quotes Sgt. Eric Schrumpf, a Marine sharpshooter, saying, "We had a great day. We killed a lot of people." Noting that his troop killed an Iraqi woman standing near a militant, Schrumpf adds, "I'm sorry, but the chick was in the way."


Does the apparent satisfaction—call it the Schrumpf effect—that some soldiers take in killing stem primarily from nature or nurture? Nature, claims Richard Wrangham, an anthropologist at Harvard University and an authority on chimpanzees.



[edit on 24-4-2010 by Thermo Klein]




posted on Apr, 24 2010 @ 06:47 PM
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I don't really agree 100% with survival of the fittest but I guess it's the best working model.

The author goes on to talk about neurochemicals. One so-called "warrior gene" is carried by 56 percent of Maori men, who are renowned for being "fearless warriors," and only 34 percent of Caucasian males [same article].

Interesting article that gets into history quite a bit.

What u all think?
Do some of us have a warrior gene due to survival of the fittest??


[edit on 24-4-2010 by Thermo Klein]



posted on Apr, 24 2010 @ 06:56 PM
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Generalizing tripe like this is a joke as well as an insult........those that can do and those that can't sit around on their fat asses and postulize articles like this....................



posted on Apr, 24 2010 @ 06:58 PM
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reply to post by adifferentbreed
 


The source is a geneticist measuring something in our bodies, taken from a very respectable source.



posted on Apr, 24 2010 @ 07:05 PM
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An expert on chimpanzees.........look, the title alone is insulting to every soldier, and yet this liberal, yup harvard don't ya know, expert makes statements like this. yes, certains males are more agressiv e that others, wow who'd have thunk it. However the getting a kick out of it part......seems like over generalizationas well as more typical liberal bs. What's next, he'll figure out that people with Porsches pay more in insurance?



posted on Apr, 24 2010 @ 07:10 PM
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Well, the so called experts who want to sit around and blame everything
on neurochemicals are a bunch of nuts. Have any of these people who
are so expert in these things ever been in a war or killed anyone? And it
is really sick to put a blanket explanation on all soldiers. After all, it was
stated in the original thread that "soldiers" meaning all, instead a few or
a certain percentage, enjoyed killing. That is so sick. They don't have a
clue as to what it is like. Enough of this type of crap.



posted on Apr, 24 2010 @ 07:16 PM
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reply to post by Thermo Klein
 





Do some soldiers enjoy killing? If so, why? This question is thrust upon us by the recently released video of U.S. Apache helicopter pilots shooting a Reuters cameraman and his driver in Baghdad in 2007.


That is not hard to answer, see when people play video games too much they adapt to it..

This is reality, they don't see the human side to those who they kill..

Let's not forget, it those who they killed, were accidentally American soldiers, then you would see the grief? Why is that?

It is because they are programmed, to think, and feel that way for one side, and one side only..

Speeches are important for that reason.. Why are some better leaders than others? It is due to the speeches they make, that is the only thing which separates a good leader from a bad leader, hence Hitler..



posted on Apr, 24 2010 @ 07:16 PM
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If they're measuring a gene, then they are comparing ALL PEOPLE.

And, putting it in the title that way might be slightly "marketing" but doesn't mean all soldiers, not even "all soldiers who have killed"; it means soldiers who have killed and enjoyed it.

I don't see how measuring a gene is putting anyone down....



posted on Apr, 24 2010 @ 07:23 PM
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Because there is something wrong with them.



posted on Apr, 24 2010 @ 07:32 PM
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Day 1 of my OSUT we had to find out something about our battle buddy's, my buddy had decided that he was bored of his job managing a restaurant, and when I asked him why he decided to join he replied "I want to get paid to kill people" I decided right then that I had royally screwed myself.

Later on in OSUT after talking to a lot of the other PVT, PFC, and SPC's I realized that most of them were certifiably insane, however based on the hero worship this country hold's it would be thought of that way.

Check my name the AWOL is there for a reason, I went AWOL later turned myself in and proudly got my dishonorable, I have the piece of paper framed on my wall to let me know that I value life above my own comfort.

So to the OP, yes they do enjoy it, but I think that's around the same line's as do certain thing's attract certain people? Yeah I would say so I really highly doubt that it would be a nurture situation, and I think that if your survival of the fittest mechanism attract's you toward's a primal hunter situation, your gonna try and find some work that's along those lines.

Based on what I said in the first part you might think that I hate every single soldier, and while I think that no one in their right mind can support the military, two of my best friend's are still overseas,l so don't even try and start a flame war with me.



posted on Apr, 24 2010 @ 07:43 PM
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post removed because the user has no concept of manners

Click here for more information.



posted on Apr, 24 2010 @ 07:45 PM
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off-topic post removed to prevent thread-drift


 



posted on Apr, 24 2010 @ 07:57 PM
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Originally posted by adifferentbreed
An expert on chimpanzees.........look, the title alone is insulting to every soldier, and yet this liberal, yup harvard don't ya know, expert makes statements like this.


Why does the author have to be liberal if he is educated and went to Harvard?

Are only liberals allowed to be smart? Do conservatives have a monopoly on stupid?

I must have missed the memo...



Why is there such a vitriolic response to any intellectual thought from the conservative right? What are you people afraid of?



posted on Apr, 24 2010 @ 07:59 PM
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Behaviors generally come from a complex mix of genes - I wonder if this warrior gene also plays in everyday accomplishment? Is there an office politics gene?



posted on Apr, 24 2010 @ 08:11 PM
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reply to post by Nomad451
 


Actually using thunk was a way to point out how ridiculous the statements are. However, thank you for your adding to this thread in such an obviously well thought out superior manner. Perhaps, if you added to the conversation, rather than interjecting childish comments I might take you seriously..........



posted on Apr, 24 2010 @ 08:16 PM
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reply to post by drwizardphd
 

Hmmm, so there are conservatives teaching at harvard? I thought since, as you pointed out, only conservatives are stupid, obviouly he'd have to be a left leaning moonbat. Intillectual thought.......stop the presses, some people may or may not be aggressive, those that are more aggressive may be in jobs requiring them to be aggressive.......who da thunk it?



posted on Apr, 24 2010 @ 08:17 PM
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Sure there few are soldiers that enjoy killing. A small majority. Most come back from war and suffer serious PTSD from the orders of their commanders. Soldiers do what they are told and it takes such a toll on the soldiers psyche... for the rest of their lives. They get to re-live what they did, what they saw happen to their brothers and sisters in arms and what they did to the considered enemies. Life is not a bowl of cherries for the war veterans.

Sorry


Veteran



posted on Apr, 24 2010 @ 08:20 PM
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reply to post by Awolscout
 
So, you are less than honorable, don't honor your contacts, and are proud of this? On top of this, you make the statement those you encountered were certfiable........wow, now you're a shrink? Get a clue, those that can do, others teach, postulize things everyone else already figured out, or they complain about the very country they failed to serve.......where do you fit in?




posted on Apr, 24 2010 @ 08:21 PM
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Originally posted by endtimer
reply to post by Awolscout
 


Well I guess that is a really good thing to brag about. Being dishonorably
discharged? And then frame it on the wall for all to see who comes into
your house? Good luck lugging that around with you the rest of your life.


Yup in fact it makes me so proud that I tell employer's about it in interviews, and explain to them exactly why I have one, and you know what the funny thing is? I still have two job's plenty of friend's and am more respected by most people I know than I was before I got in.



Couldn't hack it huh? Did you even make it past boot camp? Probably
didn't want to get up before noon. Or maybe was too traumatized not
having video games to play 17 hours a day? Probably all violent ones too!!


Couldn't hack it? I was in for two year's trying to request an MOS change to a non-combatant through a conscientious objector status that was rejected multiple time's before my NCO suggested that if I was truly serious about my conviction, that I should leave and turn myself in a month to two down the road. The funny part is that when I did turn myself in, my unit didn't care and treated me like they had before because they wanted me to be able to get my CO status and it was only the higher up's that didn't. Not to mention my abject hatred of violence in video games, movies, even in book format makes me nauseous at the thought. So nice job trying to generalize me without knowing me but sorry for the fail on your part.


Do you have any so called friends that have actually gotten a kick out
of killing, or just wannabe make believe friends that live in the same
world you live in?


nope your right I don't have any friends that enjoy killing. you know why? because I don't associate with cold blooded murderers, I do however have friend's that hate what they do and tell me that they wish they weren't too scared to go AWOL, friend's that are in the military who respect what I did if not support it, because I did something that actually take's a lot more courage than having an issue and keeping your mouth shut about it because your scared to stand out.

Did that answer your pointed question's probably brought on by some false image in the back of your mind of a big beefy guy with a gun being a "real" man?



posted on Apr, 24 2010 @ 08:25 PM
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Originally posted by adifferentbreed
reply to post by Awolscout
 
So, you are less than honorable, don't honor your contacts, and are proud of this? On top of this, you make the statement those you encountered were certfiable........wow, now you're a shrink? Get a clue, those that can do, others teach, postulize things everyone else already figured out, or they complain about the very country they failed to serve.......where do you fit in?



Well if you wanna get technical on that swear to serve the country statement, I swore to uphold the constitution and protect the people of the united states. the thing about that is that I don't see foreign soldiers waging war against the people on our shores and seeing as every single foreign war we are in right now is unconstitutional I think I'm in the right.

I think you mean contract's in that first part of your post? and in answer to that aspect no I don't uphold contract's. Just like I'm sure you wouldn't continue to let someone rent your house if you found out they were a murderer.

The second part, sorry but I really don't get your meaning, if you wanna clarify it then I'll respond to it.

EDIT: Had to fix my sometime's terrible terrible typing

[edit on 24-4-2010 by Awolscout]



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