Why do you support the ILLEGALS?

reply to post by SpectreDC


I would love to see which judge out there is going to side with ILLEGAL Aliens in this issue. Arizona has strict language in its laws and any judge that tries to overturn or go against such law will have to answer to WE THE PEOPLE who are THE CITIZENS of the USA.

Originally posted by Taupin Desciple
reply to post by prionace glauca

 

They focus on what's on paper and not on what is really going on in person and in real-time. In short, they can't see the forest through the trees. And the only way of REALLY rectifying that problem is to remove the trees.



Peace

Of course trees being the businesses and individuals hiring and givingemployment and services to illegals in your analogy.

reply to post by hotbakedtater


So go ahead fine the businesses, what happens when they are no more businesses hiring illegals? Do you think those illegals get packing and move back down to Mexico or where ever they came from?

Hell Nah, what they do is get busy in the sheets if they haven't done already and create those anchor babies.

reply to post by prionace glauca


Well, if you read my post before jumping to conclusions, you would see that I likened the direction of the US to the Third Reich not because some deep-seated xenophobia, but do to this push for State Capitalism. Kick the illegals out, we need an all America economy! End globalization, made in America rah rah rah! You are putting your faith and your money into a hierarchical state instead of humanity...

What will building a wall or increase border protection do? More government spending, more government jobs, more government agencies, government expansion, more taxation. More draconian measures similar to the PATRIOT Act.

Where we ultimately differ is our approach to the State - you claim to be anti-government this, anti-government that, but ultimately you're still a statist. I don't believe in the need for a state, so of course our views on immigration differ.

Here's some ideas that would work in the real world, since my ideals will most likely never come to fruition: American can legalize drugs. It would be a source of jobs, a commodity to tax and it would eliminate the need for the cartels, who would crumble without their cash crop. With the cartels out of the picture, Mexico's infrastructure would begin to turn around, and illegal immigration would slow.

We are hypocrites if America lashes out at people who cross the border while countless numbers of Americans are consuming drugs produced by those who are causing the immigrants to flee north. Likewise, we would also be hypocrites if we preached about freedom and liberty and yet continued this ridiculous prohibition.

Nations have immigration laws for a reason. They are to protect the citizens of the nation who work hard and pay taxes and support their country.

Nations have procedures for people to immigrate legally, the U.S. has a set of well defined procedures.

People who hire illegals are breaking the law and should be prosecuted.

People who cross our borders illegally should be captured and ejected from the country.

It is not a "gray area" issue. It is black and white, you either follow the procedures to immigrate or you are a criminal and should have no protection under our constitution.

Try illegally crossing the border into most countries in the world and you very possibly could get shot dead. I have absolutely zero sympathy for illegals entering our country. Were I in charge Sheriff Arpaio would look like goody goody two shoes.

Stopping the Illegals problem will also put a dent on the illegal drugs the said population brings with them across the borders. Illegals are used as human traffickers and as slaves. Why not help stop this problem which will in turn curb the amount of drugs brought across our borders.

This entire "lets stop the illegals" topic is little more than smoke&mirrors when compared to more important issues such as the ever-growing trend of corporations outsourcing jobs to asia and low tariffs on asian imports.

If fixing the american economy was their #1 priority they wouldn't be making a huge deal about this. Enough of the hypocrisy already!

Originally posted by prionace glauca
Stopping the Illegals problem will also put a dent on the illegal drugs the said population brings with them across the borders. Illegals are used as human traffickers and as slaves. Why not help stop this problem which will in turn curb the amount of drugs brought across our borders.

Drugs have nothing to do with illegal immigration.

Yes drugs come into our country "illegally" but your average mexican trying to raise a family by making more money is the last place I would be looking at.

Try the mafia and government instead.....

reply to post by prionace glauca


Unemployed people with advanced degrees do not want to scrub toilets for or pick strawberries for minimum wage. They want white collar jobs with 401(k)'s, PPO medical, and paid vacations. These people are not going to fill any void that would exist if illegal aliens were to somehow disappear.

Originally posted by hotpinkurinalmint
reply to post by prionace glauca

 

Unemployed people with advanced degrees do not want to scrub toilets for or pick strawberries for minimum wage. They want white collar jobs with 401(k)'s, PPO medical, and paid vacations. These people are not going to fill any void that would exist if illegal aliens were to somehow disappear.

How many Americans do you believe have advanced degrees? Again, this economy downturn has humbled many Americans who used to believe that this couldn't happen to them. Governments, politicians, banks pushed Americans to live outside of their means as this resulted in a fake economic growth. Americans know now that a good job is a job in which you are employed. Of course you will also have those lazy Americans who would rather live of off the teet of welfare than go and work, but a majority of Americans want to work no matter the type of job it is. I urge you to take a gander at Dirty Job Episodes.

You still believe in plantations as you continuously try to make a point that illegals are needed because they don't ask for benefits.

[edit on 24-4-2010 by prionace glauca]

reply to post by Taupin Desciple


Cheap labor serves its purpose in our economy. It makes everyone involved better off. The illegal aliens are better off being cheap labor in the USA than they would be if they stayed at home. The employers are obviously better off because cheap labor enables them to compete in the marketplace. Cheap labor makes us all better off because it enables us to afford goods and services like produce and childcare.

As to your second point, it is true illegal aliens break the law when they cross our border. However, all of us break laws every day. How many people drive over the speed limit on a daily basis? How many people get parking tickets? How many people did not wait until they were 21 years old to have their first drink? How many people take questionable deductions on their tax returns?

When I talk about a clean criminal record, I am talking about felonies like robbery, murder, rape, assault and battery, and child molestation. Are you telling me that living next door to an illegal alien is less desirable than living next door to a pedophile? In the grand scheme scheme of things breaking this country's immigration laws is by far not the worst crime one can commit.

reply to post by prionace glauca


There are plenty of Americans with advanced degrees. I have a Bachelors and two law degrees. I am not cheap labor. Most people on this board, including myself, could not afford to hire me at my going rate.

I also am not alone. You may not know a lot of people that went to college and graduate school, but there are plenty of people who have gone to college and graduate school. While it is true many of them may have wasted their time (I sometimes wonder whether I wasted my time), many of these people have valuable skills and can earn more than minimum wage for their talents. Many of these people, including myself, may be under employed or unemployed at the moment, but they will be fully employed in a year or two.

reply to post by hotpinkurinalmint


Cheap labor serves no one involved justice except for the employers of such labor. Illegals should not be allowed to hold positions or be allowed to work here as it promotes more people to come across.

Companies are being fined for their use of illegal labor, but these illegals aren't willfully leaving so they have to nudged out. Illegals are in this country for more reasons than just jobs alone, its to time take back our schools, neighborhoods, communities, and government. This bill allows for officers to do their job without having their hands tied with administrative B.S.

reply to post by hotpinkurinalmint


Could not afford you? Who decides what you get paid? You or the market, the market is full of well qualified people that are less snobbish. I see people like you rather wait in the lines of unemployment for a benefit check rather than do yourself and the country a service by working.

People who actually want to work instead of toiling around with the ideas that I am too good to work that job deserve to be unemployed. I know of medical doctors who came into this country legally working as cab drivers. One of my cousin is a nuclear physicist and he is working at a gas station. I know of other higher educational professionals who are currently volunteering their services as they are unemployed.

Sometimes the people who consider themselves to be the most educated need to back to the school of humility.



[edit on 24-4-2010 by prionace glauca]

The entire immigration discussion has striking similarities to the kind of things said before asians were essentially banned from immigration for the better part of 100 years.

Hateful idiocy that has little to no common sense.

I support and stand by illegal immigrants because our system is poorly constructed and is easier (and far cheaper) to bypass than to pass through.

When people ignore that American power is rooted in our ample supplies of cheap low to no skill workers, we get anti-capitalistic "solutions" that would end up creating major upheaval, cost loads of money, give large amounts of power to federal agents (not to mention create quite a lot more of them), and generally do little to no good.

This debate is tainted by a complete misunderstanding of history, economics, reality, and the ACTUAL causes of the problems.

I'm disgusted by my countrymen. Disgusted.

[edit on 24-4-2010 by KrazyJethro]

reply to post by prionace glauca

I see people like you rather wait in the lines of unemployment for a benefit check rather than do yourself and the country a service by working.

You mean to tell me that there are Americans that are abusing the system and costing taxpayers money.

Of course, it is a lot easier to blame all our problems on illegals.

Originally posted by jam321
reply to post by prionace glauca

 

I see people like you rather wait in the lines of unemployment for a benefit check rather than do yourself and the country a service by working.

You mean to tell me that there are Americans that are abusing the system and costing taxpayers money.

Of course, it is a lot easier to blame all our problems on illegals.

Hey if Americans want to remain on teet of welfare that is fine, they paid into it so it is their right to keep sucking as long as they can.

The illegals still contribute to the deteriorating of schools, neighborhoods congested with gangs, drugs trafficking, etc etc.

[edit on 24-4-2010 by prionace glauca]

reply to post by prionace glauca


You are right, the market does decide my rate. However, I have an overhead to worry about. I am not going to lose money by representing someone. I am better off rejecting some jobs than not taking them on.

Many people have asked me to handle legal matters for them on the cheap. For example, somebody wanted me to handle their bankruptcy for a $1000. I could not take the case because my malpractice insurance would not cover it. If this guy sued me for malpractice (which could be likely because the guy was in danger of losing many of his assets), I would lose the $1000 and then some.

Originally posted by prionace glauca
reply to post by hotpinkurinalmint

 

Cheap labor serves no one involved justice except for the employers of such labor. Illegals should not be allowed to hold positions or be allowed to work here as it promotes more people to come across.

I used to think the same way but you have to realise in oligarchy capitalism where small&medium size companies have to compete against the big multi-nationals, they absolutely need every break they can get otherwise we would all be mega-mart employees. Do you prefer working at walmart or having your own business?

Originally posted by prionace glauca
Companies are being fined for their use of illegal labor, but these illegals aren't willfully leaving so they have to nudged out. Illegals are in this country for more reasons than just jobs alone, its to time take back our schools, neighborhoods, communities, and government. This bill allows for officers to do their job without having their hands tied with administrative B.S.

Right, its always the minorities' fault. Your comments wreek of racism and I can certainly understand why you support this bill. Most hardline conservatives think the same way...

Keep burrying the real issues with pathetic red herrings!!!