Arizona Gov. Jan Brewer for President 2012!!!

Originally posted by Janky Red

Originally posted by Lemon.Fresh
reply to post by Janky Red

 

And when those are circumvented? Then what?

Are you a mentalist?

We haven't even tried

It has been a half assed attempt thus far, technology is 1980's and the man power is underfunded.

Mentalist? I am merely looking ahead.

It is like DVD piracy. No matter how many measures are in place, there will always be a workaround.

And then what?

You have to be proactive. You can't just let a piece of hardware do the work for you because there is always a way around hardware.

[edit on 4/23/2010 by Lemon.Fresh]

Originally posted by dgtempe
reply to post by SpectreDC

 

Oh my God, and would that be saying "Oye, Papi, ven aca" pssssst....

or carrying a large bag for the stolen goods?

A dead giveaway is walking around Phoenix eating a loaf of French bread. ha ha ha!

A clunky car will always give them away ( arent they the only ones with crappy cars?)

Carrying avocados out of the Safeway is a sure giveaway.

Wow, are the cops going to have their hands full!!!!!

LAWNMOWERS
Golden teeth (without diamonds)
Citrus fruit in the general proximity
Cowboy boots and no White person in them

Originally posted by Janky Red

JESUS man

SAME THING I HEARD, HERE (when certain folks who like this bill) during the build up for the patriot act, fisa, etc...

How did that work, liking the government much?

Changing probably cause to include PHYSICAL APPEARANCE is not a big thing?

Really guys, you are thinking like serfs

Think long term, governmental process and warping...

Ah, a terrorist attack

Right wing Extremist did it!

"OH GOOD, AZ. gives us a legal foothold to stop people based upon appearance to fight TERRORISM!!!"


My god folks-

Tomorrow is not the problem

BTW we CAN build a barrier, a real one, have we really tried, emphasis on tried?

BTW BTW they have ground penetrating radar and a whole host of other things that you cannot imagine.

Nobody is getting arrested based on physical appearance, I don't know why this keeps coming up.

It's like people can't understand that most illegal immigrants are freaking Spanish. Why can't people understand that? I didn't make all these Spanish people immigrate here illegally, it isn't my fault.

I can and do understand the long term consequences of this bill, the problem issue is that the constitution give the authority to the government to protect us from illegal immigration. As well as it should, that comes with some trade offs.

I don't know what to tell ya, it's either really start to fix the problem by actively seeking to solve it or let it keeping going how it is going. I'll repeat, it is absolutely pointless to build a fence and say lets hope this works. Because when it doesn't, as it hasn't worked, what do you propose then?

Look the problem has to stop.

reply to post by Light of Night


Join the mentalist club

Eeeesh

Originally posted by Lemon.Fresh

Originally posted by Janky Red

Originally posted by Lemon.Fresh
reply to post by Janky Red

 

And when those are circumvented? Then what?

Are you a mentalist?

We haven't even tried

It has been a half assed attempt thus far, technology is 1980's and the man power is underfunded.

I am merely looking ahead.

On one front

Sure don't seem to being thinking much like a DC lawyer or this government...

The precedent of probably cause being reduced to appearance does not bother you.

I have to take you as simple not to see this (not saying your are)

This CAN be WARPED in mind boggling ways legally speaking, one day this seemingly innocent thought could be applied to other appearances, for other "reasons"...

I fear many of you don't really comprehend what I am saying -

Anyhow you can do this for eternity

I can do it too


Watch

How do we know the illegals won't just move to another state?

How do we know the illegals and legal Mexicans won't organize to undermine
the current ID system by sharing legal identities, thusly ushering in MICRO CHIPS

We can do it, the technology is there, the manpower, the funding and will is not.

reply to post by Lemon.Fresh

*People loaded into a pick up truck

*A group loitering at Home Depot, the Workforce C omission/Unemployment Office

*Vehicles with a Mexican flag or their names on the back window in Olde English

*People working in a field or day labour.

All of the above provide reasonable suspicion, which is all that is needed, without the dreaded racial profiling.

*ahem*.....THOSE ARE ALL RACIAL PROFILING. Some people just don't get it...no...they CAN'T GET IT. I am now sure it is impossible for some people to see

Are you going to get some people who are not illegal? Sure. You will also get a bunch off innocents being brought in for questioning in robberies, homicides, etc.

And this is completely different then what this bill is about.

Your comparison would make sense if there was someone sitting on the border and saw a mexican male wearing a blue shirt cross the border...then they put an APB out for all mexican males with blue shirts in the area....find that ONE and let everyone else go. Otherwise your comparison is dumb.

reply to post by Janky Red


We will have to be on our toes and vigilant, then won't we.

Originally posted by Light of Night

Originally posted by Janky Red

JESUS man

SAME THING I HEARD, HERE (when certain folks who like this bill) during the build up for the patriot act, fisa, etc...

How did that work, liking the government much?

Changing probably cause to include PHYSICAL APPEARANCE is not a big thing?

Really guys, you are thinking like serfs

Think long term, governmental process and warping...

Ah, a terrorist attack

Right wing Extremist did it!

"OH GOOD, AZ. gives us a legal foothold to stop people based upon appearance to fight TERRORISM!!!"


My god folks-

Tomorrow is not the problem

BTW we CAN build a barrier, a real one, have we really tried, emphasis on tried?

BTW BTW they have ground penetrating radar and a whole host of other things that you cannot imagine.

Nobody is getting arrested based on physical appearance, I don't know why this keeps coming up.

I can and do understand the long term consequences of this bill, the problem issue is that the constitution give the authority to the government to protect us from illegal immigration. As well as it should, that comes with some trade offs.

I don't know what to tell ya, it's either really start to fix the problem by actively seeking to solve it or let it keeping going how it is going. I'll repeat, it is absolutely pointless to build a fence and say lets hope this works. Because when it doesn't, as it hasn't worked, what do you propose then?

Look the problem has to stop.

So you are trying to tell me with a straight "face" that officers will be tipped off by
HEARING these people speak?

Cause last I checked I see most cops in their cars not in earshot of more than 50 feet of squat, so my hearing must be bad...

But really obviously you don't GET the implications of this law my friend, you expect this avenue and expansion of enforcement to remain as this. Have you not observed the government in the last decade? Does it really go over your head? Lemon Face included...

to address your 2nd last line

the BERLIN WALL, worked VERY well sir and it did not not benefit from modern technology, built OVER 50 years ago. You could count the breaches on a page,
not millions...

I am not sure if you guys are just being argumentative or dull

My main point is, you don't screw with the entire ENFORCEMENT basis of our legal system for instant gratification.

PATRIOT ACT
FISA
SUSPENSION OF HABIUS CORPUS
ETC...

You have any sense, you wake up and think past tomorrow

Originally posted by Lemon.Fresh
reply to post by Janky Red

 

We will have to be on our toes and vigilant, then won't we.

Yup

sounds good

SCOTUS

[edit on 23-4-2010 by Janky Red]

Originally posted by OutKast Searcher
reply to post by Lemon.Fresh

 

*People loaded into a pick up truck

*A group loitering at Home Depot, the Workforce C omission/Unemployment Office

*Vehicles with a Mexican flag or their names on the back window in Olde English

*People working in a field or day labour.

All of the above provide reasonable suspicion, which is all that is needed, without the dreaded racial profiling.

*ahem*.....THOSE ARE ALL RACIAL PROFILING. Some people just don't get it...no...they CAN'T GET IT. I am now sure it is impossible for some people to see

Really?

Show me where I mentioned race.

I did mention a Mexican flag . . . but who, other than a Mexican would have a Mexican flag on the back of their car.

Are you going to get some people who are not illegal? Sure. You will also get a bunch off innocents being brought in for questioning in robberies, homicides, etc.

And this is completely different then what this bill is about.

Wrong. Any black female in a blue pick up truck is going to be pulled over. Reasonable suspicion.

Your comparison would make sense if there was someone sitting on the border and saw a mexican male wearing a blue shirt cross the border...then they put an APB out for all mexican males with blue shirts in the area....find that ONE and let everyone else go. Otherwise your comparison is dumb.

Once again, you missed the point. Right over your head. 80% (ballpark) of illegals are Mexican. Hence, they are brown. So we should never look at brown people because it is profiling. That is the point I am making. Instead of pulling over the black women in blue trucks, we pull over everyone in a blue truck because we do not want to profile? Hell no. Every black woman in a blue truck gets pulled over. So why can't take a look at the people who fit the typical descriptors? It is the same damn thing.

You got one thing right in that whole slew of hot air.

Some people just don't get it.

Dude, I live on the border. Mexico is 10 miles from my house. I see this every day.

I can point out an illegal "brown person" from a legal "brown person." I can assure you that 90% (ballpark) of people that live on the border can do this. All day.

I gave some examples of reasonable suspicion that did not involve race.

I gave an example of how non-profiling is ridiculous.

And it went zooming over your PC head.

reply to post by Janky Red

the BERLIN WALL, worked VERY well sir and it did not not benefit from modern technology, built OVER 50 years ago. You could count the breaches on a page,
not millions...

I don't even know what to say to this statement.....

Yea the Berlin Wall worked very well when you know that there were armed guards that would shoot and kill people who tried to go over the wall if they couldn't catch and arrest them and throw them in the Gulag.

And you want to talk about long term consequences of this bill, when you suggest a Berlin-esque Wall?

Look the fact remains that Most of the illegal immigrants are of Spanish decent. It's a fact, it can't be changed, this is the situation we are dealing with. You can blame the government for having to resort to these policies for not enforcing the law to begin with.

reply to post by Light of Night


Agree.

The race card is a straw man.

reply to post by Lemon.Fresh


It is. It's like some people just can't see past their nose to realize that most of the illegal immigrants are of Spanish decent. It's a huge problem that needs to be dealt with. The businesses that hire them need to be cracked down on also, but it makes absolutely no sense to start going after littler old white ladies and start carding them for their immigration status.

Besides all you have to do is carry your green card or BC on you at all times and if you are legal no worries. Just co-operate with the police and you are golden.

I guess also some people don't understand that in order to live in a free society that affords us luxuries beyond other countries there are some trade offs. I will admit that the trade off should be limited, but there are trade off's non the less.

Originally posted by Light of Night
reply to post by Janky Red

 

the BERLIN WALL, worked VERY well sir and it did not not benefit from modern technology, built OVER 50 years ago. You could count the breaches on a page,
not millions...

I don't even know what to say to this statement.....

Yea the Berlin Wall worked very well when you know that there were armed guards that would shoot and kill people who tried to go over the wall if they couldn't catch and arrest them and throw them in the Gulag.

And you want to talk about long term consequences of this bill, when you suggest a Berlin-esque Wall?

Look the fact remains that Most of the illegal immigrants are of Spanish decent. It's a fact, it can't be changed, this is the situation we are dealing with. You can blame the government for having to resort to these policies for not enforcing the law to begin with.

BRAVO

I was using an example of a physical boundary that DID in fact keep two territories
from co-mingling. I said this because on fourish occassions you and another questioned
"what about when it is circumvented?"

I tried to charecterize that with non discript examples on several ocassions

Funny, I finally get to use BEN

"Those Who Sacrifice Liberty For Security Deserve Neither"

look, you guys appear to have tunnel vision

This solution is based on a slippery slope, I can't make it plainer

I only hope the SCOTUS has some long term sense

"All solutions are not good solutions, eventually a pile of bad solutions will usher in the final solution..." C.R Hadly

Originally posted by Light of Night
reply to post by Lemon.Fresh

 

It is. It's like some people just can't see past their nose to realize that most of the illegal immigrants are of Spanish decent. It's a huge problem that needs to be dealt with. The businesses that hire them need to be cracked down on also, but it makes absolutely no sense to start going after littler old white ladies and start carding them for their immigration status.

Besides all you have to do is carry your green card or BC on you at all times and if you are legal no worries. Just co-operate with the police and you are golden.

I guess also some people don't understand that in order to live in a free society that affords us luxuries beyond other countries there are some trade offs. I will admit that the trade off should be limited, but there are trade off's non the less.

Well man

I hope if you trade your face, you will recognize it, its not looking good...

We agree that this needs to be solved

There are SO many other ways that do that

FISA

PATRIOT ACT

RAH RAH RAH

I am out

I hope you guys think about this, a little deeper a little harder

Good Luck

reply to post by TrueAmerican


Me too! I was very proud of her today when she signed that document, in pure defiance of the White House, which somehow can deny there is a problem at all. Mexico and drug cartels are at war here, and it's spilling over onto our American soil. I may be called names for this, but I say drive all illegals out, at gunpoint if necessary. Stand by to repel boarders!
Run out the cannon! Hoist the colors! We whipped them once, we can do it again. Also a real good excuse for her to recall Arizona's National guard from the fake war zone where they process the heroin, and bring them home to defend the State. It is past time for the States to stand tall and tell the FED the way it is going to be. they are messing up everything, and we cannot let them do this.

Here is the LAW.

Article IV, Section 4 of the U.S. Constitution

"The United States shall guarantee to every State in this Union a Republican Form of Government, and shall protect each of them against invasion; and on Application of the Legislature, or of the Executive (when the Legislature cannot be convened) against domestic Violence."

reply to post by Janky Red


Man you are making absolutely no sense. The Berlin Wall kept a country divided. America pushed the Nazi's back into Germany and the Russians pushed the Nazi's out of the Eastern block countries and the Russians kept the land for themselves. The Russians pushed all the way to Berlin and in turn built the Berlin wall to keep people on the communist side of things.

Why are you bringing Ben Franklin up? Tell me what freedom are you losing with this bill? None you are not losing any liberty nada, zero, zilch. If you are illegal you are loosing the liberty to sponge off the American taxpayer. Other than that if you are a legal citizen you aren't loosing ANYTHING.

reply to post by Janky Red


Okay so what are the other ways?

Make a list. One you have mentioned is building a wall. Okay been there still doing it.

So what are these "so" many other ways? That's all I'm asking if you have a better idea I'm all ears, the problem is there is no other solution.

SCOTUS won't shoot this down either, the only provision that could be unconstitutional is the mandate to carry your green card or visa. Other than that it is all completely legal.

reply to post by Light of Night


You guys keep saying the same thing over and over and don't realize it is RACIAL PROFILING.

Because you are going to get a legal American citizen by doing it the way you guys propose...BECAUSE YOU ARE PROFILING and not going based off facts.


You guys will never get it...just keep saying the same thing over and over without realizing what you are saying.


But oh well...Arizaon is going to get the crap sued out of them...so they will get what they deserve by being moronic about this issue.

reply to post by Janky Red


Really now?

What right are you losing?

What right is anyone losing?