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Reptilian DNA

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posted on Jun, 13 2004 @ 01:44 PM
Also in propechies it says that the return of the Antichrist ( Nephilim) who will come and say they are brothers or creators. So why was God so pissed at us. Why were we created in their image? So why did they change their image the Nephilim are they the aliens ? this is a bit too much

posted on Jun, 13 2004 @ 05:52 PM
This is what I came up with after 4 hours of research into Nephilim

The Biblical Apocrypha tells a story much like these, although on a grander scale. Two hundred angels, known as the 'îrin,' which translates to "those who watch" or simply "Watchers," look down upon earth and see the beautiful women there. They descend to earth and take the women as wives, but as they begin to procreate, the women give birth to a race of giants who bring about the near-total destruction of the planet. The angels in heaven plea with God to stop the madness, and God banishes the descendent angels to a prison, from which they will not released until the armageddon. The angels are called the Watchers, and their children -- the giants -- are called the Nephilim

so we are not made in there image.

Nephilim: The Apocryphal race of giants spawned by the union of the Watchers and human women. "Nephilim" is a Hebrew word meaning "those who have fallen."

That the sons of God saw the daughters of men that they were fair; and they took them wives of all which they chose." (Ge 6:2) Jude also makes reference to these fallen angels -- "6 And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day."

Then this gets interesting here about Noah

1 Then said the Most High, the Holy and Great One spake, and sent Uriel to the son of Lamech,
2 and said to him: Go to Noah and tell him in my name "Hide thyself!" and reveal to him the end that is approaching: that the whole earth will be destroyed, and a deluge is about to come
3 upon the whole earth, and will destroy all that is on it."

hmm giants im 6'6 maybe im a nephilim hehe ya right

posted on Jun, 13 2004 @ 05:54 PM
The nephillim were not humans, they were human hybrids. Humans were created by Jehovah Elohiym and later, some of those humans were abducted so to speak, by Annunaki/Fallen Angels and wallah, human hybrids known as nephillim. 2 different creations.

[edit on 13-6-2004 by Undomiel]

posted on Jun, 13 2004 @ 05:57 PM
If you had read the thread, you would probably notice I've been saying the same thing as you just said for the last 4 pages.

posted on Jun, 14 2004 @ 02:07 PM
of all the discussion that has been going on in here, i agree with it. i too have thought that when humanity had fallen from the garden of eden, we became flesh creatures. the entity known as ea, is also known as satan, which i read off a satanic website, which claims he created mankind. i see it he led us into the flesh, whereas yhvh will lead us back to our souls. now the question that comes into mind is what part the reptilians have in this. with an interview i have read, the draconians claimed to have created the dinosaurs, which in turn evolved into the saurians/reptilians/lizards/reptoids, etc., and to have also created the greys. the greys are deemed the ones who got away. from a bible code i read, it says that satan is a draconian. the order of command goes from draconian, reptilian, greys, and then humans. i have no clue as to where the supposed hybrids fit into this picture. maybe the reptilians are jealous of humanity, and just as it seems, they are in with the rest of the fallen angel camp, seeking to destroy our dna. these creatures are not stupid, for they've been able to intermingle with our bloodlines for centuries, going unnoticed by becoming to be known as our gods. what better way to go about their business while being called a god? it is the folly of mankind for completely forgetting our roots, and not putting our origins under scrutiny as we supersize ourselves and watch reality television. they have now become our gods, as man becomes complacent.

[edit on 6/14/2004 by cloud]

posted on Jun, 15 2004 @ 09:47 PM
I agree with most of what has been said about the Nephilim thus far, particularly in the posts by Undomiel.

Earlier, Nutzo mentioned that Annunaki (Sumerian for “those who came from heaven to earth”) might also mean “long neck”. This is possible, for one of the translations given for “Anak” given in the Strong’s Exhaustive Concordance is “neck”.

6061, 6062 ‘anoq. ’anoqim - Anak, Anakim - “neck“, necklace

Numbers 13:22 And they ascended by the south, and came unto Hebron; where Ahiman, Sheshai, and Talmai, the children of Anak, were. (now Hebron was built seven years before Zoan in Egypt.)

Numbers 13:28-33
28 Nevertheless the people be strong that dwell in the land, and the cities are walled, and very great: and moreover we saw the children of Anak there.
29 The Amalekites dwell in the land of the south: and the Hittites, and the Jebusites, and the Amorites, dwell in the mountains: and the Canaanites dwell by the sea, and by the coast of Jordan.
30 And Caleb stilled the people before Moses, and said, Let us go up at once, and possess it; for we are well able to overcome it.
31 But the men that went up with him said, We be not able to go up against the people; for they are stronger than we.
32 And they brought up an evil report of the land which they had searched unto the children of Israel, saying, The land, through which we have gone to search it, is a land that eateth up the inhabitants thereof; and all the people that we saw in it are men (‘ish) of a great stature.
33. And there we saw the giants (Nephilim), the sons of Anak, which come of the giants (Nephilim): and we were in our own sight as grasshoppers, and so we were in their sight.

Joshua 11:21-22
21 And at that time came Joshua, and cut off the Anakims from the mountains, from Hebron, from Debir, from Anab, and from all the mountains of Judah, and from all the mountains of Israel: Joshua destroyed them utterly with their cities.
22 There was none of the Anakims left in the land of the children of Israel: only in Gaza, in Gath, and in Ashdod, there remained.

Here are a few of other interesting things related to reptilian DNA and/or the ancient origins of mankind. The Hebrew word translated "whales" in KJV Genesis 1:21 (sea creatures or sea monsters in other translations) is "tanninim", plural of "tannin" (Stron'gs reference #8577) which is usually translated as "dragon(s)", while it is translated a couple of times as serpent(s). "Tanninim" may indeed mean "whales" in this case, but I wonder if it might also be attributed to dinosaurs, reptillians, or both?
Isaiah 34:14 is the only verse in the Bible in which the word (or name) Lilit/Lilith is mentioned, translated as screech owl in the KJV.

KJV Isaiah 34:11-15
11 But the cormorant (qa'at) and the bittern (qippod) shall possess it; the owl (yanshup) also and the raven ('oreb) shall dwell in it: and he shall stretch out upon it the line of confusion, and the stones of emptiness.
12 They shall call the nobles thereof to the kingdom, but none shall be there, and all her princes shall be nothing.
13 And thorns shall come up in her palaces, nettles and brambles in the fortresses thereof: and it shall be an habitation of dragons (tannin), and a court for owls (baht-yaana - daugher of the owl).
14 The wild beasts of the desert (tzi) shall also meet with the wild beasts of the island ('i), and the satyr shall cry to his fellow; the screech owl (Lilith) also shall rest there, and find for herself a place of rest.
15 There shall the great owl (qippoz) make her nest, and lay, and hatch, and gather under her shadow: there shall the vultures also be gathered, every one with her mate.

Strong's concordance ref. # 3917 lilit - night creature; Lilith, a female demon of the night.

I also find it intriguing that the Hebrew "nachash" which is the word translated "serpent" in Genesis chapter 3 (and many other places throughout the OT) may also be translated as "enchanter, magician, or sorcerer". Compare Strong's ref. #''s 5172, 5173, and 5175. I'm not saying that the "nachash" wasn't a serpent/reptilian, but I believe this definitely provides some evidence that the "serpent" was more than just a talking snake.

There may be something to Undomiel’s idea relating “the tree of the knowledge of good and evil” to DNA and the invitation extended to Adam and Eve by Satan to house their souls in biological forms. However, we should also take into consideration that individuals and nations are often symbolized by trees throughout the Bible. (Please see Ezekiel ch. 31 for just one instance of this.) The conclusion that I (and others) draw from this is that the LORD God (Yahweh Elohim) himself is “tree of life” while Satan is “the tree of the knowledge of good and evil”. Notice that the tree is not called “the tree of the knowledge of discerning (telling the difference between) good and evil”.

Undomiel, I have a question for you. I’m curious as to why you believe that Satan has already been cast into the bottomless pit/abyss in the past? According to my understanding of Revelation ch. 20, this would mean that the trumpet and vial judgments have already been delivered upon mankind, Yahshua HaMashiach has already returned to reign on the earth, and that the righteous dead have already been raised to eternal life.

The last point I’d like to make for now concerns the name of God. The proper, personal name which the Most High God has chosen to be called by His children on this earth is Yahweh. For a more detailed discussion and evidence for this, please see the following thread:

Nutzo, thanks for starting this thread. I appreciate the opportunity to discuss these very interesting and important topics.

[edit on 15-6-2004 by Ischyros]

posted on Jun, 15 2004 @ 10:31 PM

Originally posted by cloud
now the question that comes into mind is what part the reptilians have in this. with an interview i have read, the draconians claimed to have created the dinosaurs, which in turn evolved into the saurians/reptilians/lizards/reptoids, etc., and to have also created the greys. the greys are deemed the ones who got away. from a bible code i read, it says that satan is a draconian. the order of command goes from draconian, reptilian, greys, and then humans. i have no clue as to where the supposed hybrids fit into this picture.

The Draconians, such as Satan (the Red Dragon) are former Cherubim. (See Ezekiel 28:14 for confirmation of this.) The Mothmen, the Reptilians, etc. are fallen angels of different races/orders. The Greys are either another race of fallen angels or a genetically engineered slave race.

The Nordics are also known as the Watchers (see the Book of Enoch and Daniel 4:13, 17, 23).

The Draconians, Reptilians and other fallen angels/alien races were part of the first rebellion instigated by Helel/Lucifer's pride, Some of the Watchers are part of the second major fall/rebellion which is recorded in Genesis 6 and the Book of Enoch. The Watchers are the Annunaki/Nephilim whose children became the Rephaim/giants and other hybrid peoples. (Anakim, Emim, Horim, Zamzummim, Zuzim, Avim, etc.)

But the Watchers weren't the first angels (sons of God) to have offspring with human women.

Cain (more properly transliterated as Qayin) was half-angel himself being the literal son of Samael/Satan. (Satan was the "tree of the knowledge of good and evil" - individuals and nations are often symbolized by trees in the Bible", and the forbidden fruit was sexual intercourse. Yahshua refers to certain people as the literal "children of the devil" in John 8:44.)

Hopefully I'll be able to post in more detail on the subject of Cain's origin soon.

posted on Jun, 16 2004 @ 10:40 AM
Before I comment on your post, I need to know first of all, if you are a white supremacist? Perhaps a member of Christian Identity? This is necessary information as I do not want to offend your religious ideology, as some of it I am in agreement with (and some I am not - it's the parts we don't agree on that should be isolated and discussed). Rather than wade into and argue over information that we may already agree on, I need to have an idea where you're coming from so I can pinpoint our differences of opinion on this topic. To be sure, a difference of opinion in such matters may be a slight variation on interpretation and conjecture, that, when alls told, ends up being a major difference of opinion. Things have a tendency to snowball on themselves and grow out of control over an incorrect interpretation of one word, for example.

posted on Jun, 16 2004 @ 02:21 PM
In the Bible their is a peice which says ' THEY mated with the daughters of men'

That says to me another race mated with the race of men, whatever it may be. I am also of the mind Eve didn't actually eat an apple but actually choose a path. And that Angels don't fly around gods throne with swords etc, there is much more then we are told.

I have read stichins book 'Gods of Eden'. I recommend anyone interested in anything wrote here should read it. Also anyone with a Playstation should purchase the game Xenogears. You might laugh but the game was nearly banned in the US due its ideas about gods and angels.

posted on Jun, 16 2004 @ 02:43 PM
Undomiel, I'm not a white supremacist, nor am I a member of Christian Identity. While I myself am a Causcasian (with at least one Choctaw ancestor), most of my friends are either Asian, half-Asian, or part Native American. I realize that some of the information I presented is taught by the Christian Identity Movement and other related groups, but I've done a lot of my own personal research on the subject (last year I went as far as examining every single Hebrew word used in Genesis chs. 1-2*). Although there may be some room for doubt, I believe there is enough evidence for the Two Seedline theory for it to be more than just a tool used by racist groups. I even wonder if perhaps the idea hasn't been taken over by these groups for the sole purpose of discrediting it? After all, intolerance and racism are two of the few things widely held to be evil by the majority of the populace of western nations.

*Reason for editing: Sorry, I just double-checked, and I had only translated Genesis ch. 1-2, not 1-3 as I had posted earlier. But I have looked at some of the Hebrew from ch. 3 in certain verses which directly relate to this subject.

[edit on 16-6-2004 by Ischyros]

posted on Jun, 16 2004 @ 03:08 PM

Originally posted by Ischyros
Nutzo, thanks for starting this thread. I appreciate the opportunity to discuss these very interesting and important topics.
[edit on 15-6-2004 by Ischyros]

Not at all. Thank you for contributing your thoughts and ideas.

I think this thread is indeed a fine example of why forums like this are an important aspect of todays society. We have a mighty voice now. We are obligated to share ideas in the search for truth.


posted on Jun, 16 2004 @ 05:04 PM
Nutzo, I agree, it is the obligation of those who have granted knowledge of the truth to share it with others.

7th Chakra, I’ve read the entirety of Zecharia Sitchin’s Earth Chronichles, and the chapter on Mars in his “Divine Encounters”. His writings first introduced me to the Book of Enoch, and were part of what led me to start researching the Illuminati back in 2001*. While many of his ideas are interesting, I believe he is something of a false prophet. The main thrust of his books seems to be nothing more than to convince humans beings that we are all descended from the Annunaki’s genetic experiments, and that Enki is a trustworthy individual who often had the best interests of mankind at heart. Sitchin’s books are basically just a clever way of presenting Gnostic and Luciferian ideas. Nibiru may indeed be on its way, but it will only be bringing to earth a horde of fallen angels to help Satan bring in the reign of the Antichrist through means of a false Second Coming and/or alien invasion/contact.

I’ve played almost half of the Xenogears game, read the entire script online, and I’ve also played Xenosaga for Playstation 2. These games are in much the same vein as Sitchin’s work, designed to present certain ideas and concepts to the general public in such as way as to confuse or twist their true meaning and significance. “…He [the devil, Satan], was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it”. (KJV John 8:44). Satan is a liar and deception is his main tactic. He often intermingles his lies with just enough truth to catch those who do not yet have the proper knowledge or discernment to withstand him. Beware, for Satanists do not often go a around revealing their true intentions and announcing their actual identity.

KJV Matthew 7:15 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.

KJV 2 Corinthians 11:13-15
13 For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ.
14 And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.
15 Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.

I hope to post something more about the evidence for Satan being the physical father of Cain soon

*Reason for edit: I was mistaken when I wrote that I started studying the Illuminati in 2000. It was actually 2001.

[edit on 18-6-2004 by Ischyros]

posted on Jun, 16 2004 @ 05:51 PM
Earlier I claimed that men and nations are symbolized by trees throughout the Bible. Here is some evidence of that claim.

Ezekiel 31:3-5, 8-9, 14-18
3 Behold, the Assyrian was a cedar in Lebanon with fair branches, and with a shadowing shroud, and of an high stature; and his top was among the thick boughs.
4 The waters made him great, the deep set him up on high with her rivers running round about his plants, and sent out her little rivers unto all the trees of the field.
5 Therefore his height was exalted above all the trees of the field, and his boughs were multiplied, and his branches became long because of the multitude of waters, when he shot forth.
8 The cedars in the garden of God could not hide him: the fir trees were not like his boughs, and the chesnut trees were not like his branches; nor any tree in the garden of God was like unto him in his beauty.
9 I have made him fair by the multitude of his branches: so that all the trees of Edenp, that were in the garden of God, envied him.
14 To the end that none of all the trees by the waters exalt themselves for their height, neither shoot up their top among the thick boughs, neither their trees stand up in their height, all that drink water: for they are all delivered unto death, to the nether parts of the earth, in the midst of the children of men, with them that go down to the pit
15 Thus saith the Lord God; In the day when he went down to the grave I caused a mourning: I covered the deep for him, and I restrained the floods thereof, and the great waters were stayed: and I caused Lebanon to mourn for him, and all the trees of the field fainted for him.
16 I made the nations to shake at the sound of his fall, when I cast him down to hell with them that descend into the pit: and all the trees of Eden, the choice and best of Lebanon, all that drink water, shall be comforted in the nether parts of the earth.
17 They also went down into hell with him unto them that be slain with the sword; and they that were his arm, that dwelt under his shadow in the midst of the heathen.
18 To whom art thou thus like in glory and in greatness among the trees of Eden? yet shalt thou be brought down with the trees of Eden unto the nether parts of the earth: thou shalt lie in the midst of the uncircumcised with them that be slain by the sword. This is Pharaoh and all his multitude, saith the Lord God.

Isaiah 10:18-19
18 And shall consume the glory of his forest, and of his fruitful field, both soul and body: and they shall be as when a standardbearer fainteth.
19 And the rest of the trees of his forest shall be few, that a child may write them.

Isaiah 61:3 To appoint unto them that mourn in Zion, to give unto them beauty for ashes, the oil of joy for mourning, the garment of praise for the spirit of heaviness; that they might be called trees of righteousness, the planting of the Lord, that he might be glorified.

Jeremiah 11:16 The Lord called thy name, A green olive tree, fair, and of goodly fruit: with the noise of a great tumult he hath kindled fire upon it, and the branches of it are broken.

Matthew 3:10 And now also the axe is laid unto the root of the trees: therefore every tree which bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.

Genesis 2:17 But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.

Of further interest is that the words “know or knew” are sometimes used to mean “to have sex with” in the Old Testament. *

KJV Genesis 4:17 And Cain knew his wife; and she conceived, and bare Enoch: and he builded a city, and called the name of the city, after the name of his son, Enoch.

KJV Genesis 19:5 And they called unto Lot, and said unto him, Where are the men which came in to thee this night? bring them out unto us, that we may know them.

And fruit is often employed as a metaphor for deeds, whether good or evil.

Matthew 7:16-20
16 Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?
17 Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.
18 A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.
19 Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.
20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.

Fruit is even used metaphorically in relation to sex and/or in the Song of Solomon:

Song of Solomon 2:1-4
1 I am the rose of Sharon, and the lily of the valleys.
2 As the lily among thorns, so is my love among the daughters.
3 As the apple tree among the trees of the wood, so is my beloved among the sons. I sat down under his shadow with great delight, and his fruit was sweet to my taste.
4 He brought me to the banqueting house, and his banner over me was love.

Genesis 3:6 And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat.

So, it is not illogical to interpret the Eve’s eating of the fruit of the tree as sexual intercourse with Satan. As Satan has the ability to shape-change, it is possible that he assumed the form of a woman in order for Adam to eat the fruit. Or it may just be that Adam had intercourse with his wife who had previously been ‘known’ by Satan.

The first reaction of Adam and Eve after they become ‘enlightened’ by “the tree of the knowledge of good and evil” is very interesting.

Genesis 3:7 And the eyes of them both were opened, and they knew that they were naked; and they sewed fig leaves together, and made themselves aprons.


Genesis 2:25 And they were both naked, the man ('adam) and his wife, and were not ashamed.

* Reason for editing: Added verses Genesis 4:17 and 19:5, and I changed the wording in the sentence just above those verses.

[edit on 16-6-2004 by Ischyros]

posted on Jun, 16 2004 @ 06:48 PM
Hopefully this next post will answer any questions and solve any problems you might have with the interpretation of Genesis 3 which points at Satan as the physical father of Cain. It's a document I worked on last year, with some recent additions.

KJV Genesis 3:1 Now the serpent (nachash) was more subtil than any beast (khay) of the field (sadeh) which the LORD (Yahweh) God had made. And he said unto the woman, Yea, hath God said, Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden?

nachash 5172* - practice divination, interpret omens and signs:-divine, use enchantments, diligenlty observe, enchanter, enchantments. 5173 - sorcery, magic, curse, spell:-enchantments, enchantment. 5174 - bronze material. 5175 - snake, serpent; by extension: a mythological creature of chaos opposed to God. 5176 - viper or copper
2416 chay, n.m. life, state of living (in contrast to death), lifetime; “as I live” is a formula for an oath, implying death should follow if what is sworn is not true; family, kin; band, army; animal, beast, livestock, living creature; living, alive, with an implication that life has movement and vigor; “living meat” is “raw meat”; “living water” is “fresh, running water”
7704 sadeh or saday - area of land, usually cultivated: field, open country, countryside:-land, wild, ground, soil

*Numbers included in the text are Strong's Exhaustive Concordance reference numbers for its Hebrew dictionary .

A “beast of the field“, chay ha-sadeh, can imply any intelligent, sentient being of any race. Adam himself is a chay nepesh

KJV Genesis 2:7 And the LORD (Yahweh) God formed (yatzar) man ('adam) of the dust of the ground ('adamah), and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life (khay); and man ('adam) became a living (chay) soul (nepesh).

The same Hebrew phrase is used elsewhere in Genesis, but it is translated differently in the King James Version.

KJV Genesis 1:20-21
20 And God said, Let the waters bring forth abundantly the moving creature (nepesh) that hath life (chay), and fowl that may fly above the earth in the open firmament of heaven.
21 And God created great whales, and every living (chay) creature (nepesh) that moveth, which the waters brought forth abundantly, after their kind, and every winged fowl after his kind: and God saw that it was good.

KJV Genesis 1:24-25
24 And God said, Let the earth ('eretz) bring forth the living (chay) creature (nepesh) after his kind, cattle (behema), and creeping thing (remes), and beast (chay) of the earth ('eretz) after his kind: and it was so.
25 And God made the beast (chay) of the earth after his kind, and cattle (behema) after their kind, and every thing that creepeth (remes) upon the earth ('adamah) after his kind: and God saw that it was good.

KJV Genesis 1:30 And to every beast (chay) of the earth ('eretz), and to every fowl ('op) of the air (shamayim), and to every thing that creepeth (ramas) upon the earth ('eretz), wherein there is life (chay nepesh), I have given every green herb for meat: and it was so.

5315 nepesh, n.f. breath; by extension: life, life force, soul, an immaterial part of a person, the seat of emotion and desire; a creature or person as a whole: self, body, even corpse. This is the only word translated as “soul” in the KJV. The word usually translated as “spirit” is ruach (ref. # 7307).

There is another Hebrew word, behema, which more certainly implies a brute beast.
929 xax; behema - beast, animal, livestock, herd, cattle. The phrase behema ha-sadeh, occurs in the Old Testament as well. (From the context of some of those passages, even behema can be sometimes used to symbolize men, or sentient beings, just as the people of Yahweh are often symbolized as sheep.)
Therefore, we can surmise that the 'serpent', was actually an reptilian sorcerer/enchanter who was either an agent of Satan, or Satan himself.

Genesis 3:13-15
13 And the LORD (Yahweh) God said unto the woman, What is this that thou hast done? And the woman said, The serpent (nachash) beguiled me, and I did eat.
14 And the LORD (Yahweh) God said unto the serpent (nachash), Because thou hast done this, thou art cursed above all cattle (behema), and above every beast (chay) of the field (sadeh); upon thy belly (gachon) shalt thou go (halakh), and dust ('apar) shalt thou eat all the days of thy life:
15 And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed (zera') and her seed (zera'); it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel.

1980 halakh - walk, go, travel
1512 gachon - belly (of a reptile) The word gakhon is only translated as belly one other time in the Bible (in fact the only other time the word appears in Scripture) in Lev 11:42.

KJV Leviticus 11:42
42 Whatsoever goeth upon the belly (gakhon), and whatsoever goeth upon all four, or whatsoever hath more feet among all creeping things that creep upon the earth, them ye shall not eat ('akal); for they are an abomination.

It's possible that the word has another connotation for gakhon which is now lost to us. There may also be another, deeper meaning to “and the dust shalt thou eat”

398 'akal - eat, to be eaten, be consumed, be destroyed, devour, consume
6083 'apar - dust, earth, soil in any form; used as a figure of something that cannot be counted.

Genesis 2:7 And the LORD (Yahweh) God formed man of the dust ('apar) of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.

Genesis 3:19 In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust ('apar) thou art, and unto dust ('apar) shalt thou return.

Genesis 13:16 And I will make thy seed (zera') as the dust ('apar) of the earth: so that if a man can number the dust ('apar) of the earth, then shall thy seed (zera') also be numbered.

Genesis 18:27 And Abraham answered and said, Behold now, I have taken upon me to speak unto the Lord, which am but dust ('apar) and ashes:

Genesis 28:13-14
13 And, behold, the Lord stood above it, and said, I am the LORD (Yahweh) God of Abraham thy father, and the God of Isaac: the land whereon thou liest, to thee will I give it, and to thy seed (zera');
14 And thy seed (zera') shall be as the dust ('apar) of the earth, and thou shalt spread abroad to the west, and to the east, and to the north, and to the south: and in thee and in thy seed (zera') shall all the families of the earth be blessed.

By stating that the nachash would eat the dust all the days of his life, Yahweh may have been implying that Satan would devour men.

1 Peter 5:8-9
8 Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil, as a roaring lion, walketh about, seeking whom he may devour:
9 Whom resist stedfast in the faith, knowing that the same afflictions are accomplished in your brethren that are in the world.

Genesis 3:15 And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed (zera') and her seed (zera'); it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel.

2233 zera' - seed, semen, that which propagates a species; by extension: that which is propagated, child, offspring, descendant, line, race. The use of this use of this word reasonably implies that the nachash (Satan) would have physical offspring.

Psalm 74:13 "Thou didst divide the sea by thy strength: thou brakest the heads of the dragons (tannin) in the waters."

Psalm 91:13 "Thou shalt tread upon the lion and adder: the young lion and the dragon (tannin) shalt thou trample under feet."

Romans 16:20 And the God of peace shall bruise Satan under your feet shortly. The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you. Amen.

Genesis 4:1-26
1 And Adam knew Eve his wife; and she conceived, and bare Cain, and said, I have gotten a man from the LORD (Yahweh).

Yahweh was often given credit for everything supernatural in the Old Testament writings. The following verses are clear evidence that Satan could have actually been involved in an event that only mentioned Yahweh. It is the same event, that of David's census of Israel to which they refer. In fact, 1 Chr 21:1 is the first place Satan's name/title is mentioned in the KJV Old Testament..
2 Samuel 24:1 And again the anger of the LORD (Yahweh) was kindled against Israel, and he moved David against them to say, Go, number Israel and Judah.

1 Chronicles 21:1 And Satan stood up against Israel, and provoked David to number Israel.

Isaiah provides further evidence for this viewpoint.

KJV Isaiah 45:7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil (ra'): I the LORD (Yahweh) do all these things.

7451 ra' - bad, disagreeable, inferior in quality; by extension: evil, wicked in ethical quality, what is disagreeable to God is ethically evil:-evil, wickedness, wicked, etc.
Being the original source of all creation and existence, Yahweh takes ultimate responsibility for everything. Having slept with his wife before Cain is born, Adam is perhaps unaware that Cain is Satan's child.

Reason for editing: Had to fix the bold commands.

[edit on 16-6-2004 by Ischyros]

posted on Jun, 16 2004 @ 07:58 PM
It just occured to me that not everyone may be aware of or remember this verse:

KJV Revelation 12:9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.

So, Satan is actually called "that old serpent" in the New Testament.

By the way, there's a thread in the Conspiracies in Religion section which discusses the Nephilim and lists most of the verses related to them (proving that the sons of God are identified as angels elsewhere in the Old Testament).

Alright, I'll wait for Nutzo and Undomiel to respond before I post anymore here.

[edit on 16-6-2004 by Ischyros]

posted on Jun, 16 2004 @ 09:39 PM
One of the problems with this topic is how broad and encompassing it is. We're talking about thousands of years of human/nephillim civilizations, countless myths, religions, and all the related writings. What a task. So rather than wander around blindly in the massive data, we should attempt to cover one point at a time.

I'll start with your interpretation that "Adam" meant "rudy" skin and therefore indicates that he was caucasian. This is an incorrect interpretation in my opinion, as I feel the only reason adam meant red in color was in reference to the material he was fashioned from - et. al, CLAY. To further hone it down, a little common sense would tell you that God would not create a race of people who could not withstand the climate of a nearly equatorial location such as ancient Sumeria or Africa. It isn't logical to assume caucasians just suddenly packed their bags and moved to Europe and colder climes - as their fair skin, eyes and biology were specifically geared for the colder climes with less sunlight. And the concept that perhaps the poles flipped and what was below the equator was now above it, wouldn't work either, as Sumeria would still be in pretty much the same location -- near the equator . Even the smallest child with a bit of scientific knowledge could lay waste to such a theory, which I don't mind telling you, is how we end up having problems witnessing to people about the Lord. If even a small child can see the glaring errors in such a theory, we have to ask ourselves if we are simply believing it because it fits into our world view, rather than whether or not it's the truth.

Furthermore, the depictions of them in sumerian artifacts, are not caucasian features. As I've illustrated elsewhere in this thread, the sumerians were the people of the bible - the antediluvian kings of Sumeria, these are the people of Genesis. So if the ancient sumerians were the people of the bible, then the concept they were caucasians seems to be incorrect.

I'm of the opposite belief. I think caucasians were part of the nephilim influx originally, as they perfectly fit the definition of angels with fair skin and hair!

posted on Jun, 17 2004 @ 02:54 AM
With reference to the quote that says Satan was cast down with his angels. There is another part about how he was forced to crawl on his belly in the dirt. I wonder what symbolisam that holds?

I have seen another british medical logo in which a lady is sat on a chair with her hand out, a snake is coiled up a tree and seems to be feeding from the womans hand. I"ll try and track it down.

posted on Jun, 17 2004 @ 07:26 AM
Hi, Undomiel. I want you to know that I am open to different views and opinions on this subject. There are still many things which remain mysterious to me. The actual race of Adam is difficult to determine. However, I don’t believe it is merely my interpretation that the literal meaning of ‘adam/Adam is red or ruddy. I’m a 26 year-old southern California native, I wasn’t raised in a racist household, and I didn’t start learning about the Lost Tribes of Israel until August of 2002. I had never even heard of the two seedline theory until December of that same year. It’s not my intention to declare that one race of men is superior or inferior to another, but I believe it is readily apparent that there are differences between them. Anyway, below are some definitions straight from the Hebrew dictionary of the Strong’s Exhaustive Concordance.

119 ‘adem, v. be ruddy; be dyed red
120 'adam, n.m. man, human being; humankind, people, often in contrast to animals
121 ‘adam, & loc. Adam, “[red] earth, [ruddy] skin color”
122 ‘adom, a. red; ruddy (skin)
125 ‘adamdam, a. reddish, reddish-white
126 ‘adamah, Admah, “[red] earth”
127 'adamah, n.f. earth, the entire surface of the place where humans dwell, as well as smaller regions: land; with a focus on the elements of the earth: ground, soil, dust
128 ‘adamah, Adamah, “[red] earth”

I suppose the really significant thing that I’d like to determine out of all this is: are the different races or varieties of man currently inhabiting this planet all descended from Adam and Eve or not? I don’t believe that the Cainites/Qayini are Adam‘s true offspring, although many of them have mixed with the seed of men ('adam), as was/is the case with the Canaanites and the Edomites (who also intermarried with Nephilim/Rephaim making them even more contaminated). But the question remains, are Africans, Asians, Caucasians all descended from Adam and Eve? I accept the possibility of horizontal evolution/adaptation to a certain extent (simply that Yahweh built in to us the ability to adapt to our environment somewhat). However, did he really design our bodies with the ability to change their outward appearances so dramatically? Not just different colored skin, but different shaped skulls, eyes, noses, and body structure as well. That seems like a really dramatic change to me, and the Bible never mentions anything about the children of Shem, Ham or Japheth mutating. Contrary to popular belief, the tower of Babel story in Genesis chapter 11 says absolutely nothing about different races being created.. The only verse I’ve found so far which may possibly address the issue of human mutation is Jeremiah 13:23.

KJV Jeremiah 13:22-24
13:22 And if thou say in thine heart, Wherefore come these things upon me? For the greatness of thine iniquity are thy skirts discovered, and thy heels made bare.
13:23 Can the Ethiopian change his skin, or the leopard his spots? then may ye also do good, that are accustomed to do evil.
13:24 Therefore will I scatter them as the stubble that passeth away by the wind of the wilderness.

This seems to imply that Ethiopians/Africans cannot change their color (except through intermarriage with other races of course). Now, regardless of what race Adam was created as, Genesis allow for the possibility that different races were created at different times.

KJV Genesis 1:26-28
26 And God said, Let us make man ('adam) in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl ('op) of the air (shamayim), and over the cattle, and over all the earth ('eretz), and over every creeping thing (remes) that creepeth upon the earth ('eretz).
27 So God created (bara') man (ha*-'adam) in his own image, in the image of God created (bara') he him; male (zakar) and female (neqebah) created (bara') he them.
28 And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth ('eretz), and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl ('op) of the air (shamayim), and over every living thing (khay) that moveth upon the earth ('eretz).

* “ha” is the Hebrew definite article (“the” in English).

KJV Genesis 2:5-8
5 And every plant of the field before it was in the earth ('eretz), and every herb of the field before it grew: for the LORD God had not caused it to rain (matar) upon the earth ('eretz), and there was not a man ('adam) to till (‘abad) the ground ('adamah).
6 But there went up a mist from the earth ('eretz), and watered the whole face (paneh) of the ground ('adamah).
7 And the LORD God formed (yatzar) man (ha-'adam) of the dust of the ground ('adamah), and breathed (napakh) into his nostrils ('ap) the breath (neshemah) of life (khay); and man (ha-'adam) became a living (khay) soul (nepesh).
8 And the LORD God planted a garden eastward in Eden; and there he put the man (ha-'adam) whom he had formed (yatzar).

First let me make clear that the Hebrew words ‘eretz (Strong’s ref. # 776) and ‘adamah (#127) can both be, and often are, translated as “land” or “ground“ . Neither word specifically means the entire world. ‘Eretz is actually translated as “land” twice as often as it is “earth”. It is even translated as “country” and “countries” several times. Same the English word “earth” can mean equally mean a part of the earth, a piece of the ground, or the world in its entirety. The meaning which is to be applied changes according to context and usage.

Now, when comparing the two creations of man, we notice some obvious differences. Instead of creating ha-’adam out of nothing as in the first chapter, Yahweh Elohim “formed man out of the dust of the ground” in Genesis 2:7. Also, vegetation is already growing on the earth during the third day recorded in chapter one, well before ha-’adam was created on the sixth day. But, in 2:5, there was a certain earth or land (‘eretz) where no plant or herb had yet grown.

So, the two possibilities are that Genesis chapter 2 is rewinding to a special creation event of ha-adam before the third day, or it is recording a different creation event after the seventh day, focusing on a particular land where for some reason it had not yet rained and no plant life was growing. My vote is for the second option. I believe Adam and Eve were special ‘eighth day’ creations. Notice also that Genesis 2:5 does not merely read “there was not a man”, it reads in particular, “and there was not a man to till the ground.

This can reasonably imply that Adam was the first human granted the knowledge of agriculture, and all ha-’adam who came before were gatherers. Whether or not any them were also hunters is unclear, but in Genesis 1:29 God only gave men “every herb bearing seed” and “every tree, in the which is the fruit of a tree yielding seed” to eat. But that doesn’t necessarily mean that humans didn’t disobey His commands and begin to eat animal flesh without permission.

Also of significance, Adam has a particular mission in the garden.

KJV Genesis 2:15 And the LORD God (Yahweh Elohim) took the man (ha-'adam), and put him into the garden of Eden to dress (‘abad) it and to keep (shamar) it.

5647 'abad, v. to work, serve, labor, do; to worship, minister, work in ministry; to be plowed, be cultivated; to be worked; reduce to servitude, enslave, cause to serve; to be caused to serve, worship (a god) [Translated as “to till” in Genesis 2:5 and “to dress” in 2:15. But ‘abad is translated as “to serve” far more often. The Hebrew for “servant’ and “service” are derived from the same root.]

8104 shamar, v. to keep, watch, observe, guard; to be set aside, be secured; to be careful, beware; to cling to; to keep oneself; to observe for oneself. [Hebrew words for ”guard” and ”watchman” are derived from this root, although there are also other words translated as such in the KJV.]

Based on the language used, I believe that Yahweh specially created Adam to be a warrior-priest who would destroy Satan. However, because Adam failed, Yahweh is going to do it himself in the form of His Son Yahshua.

There’s another interesting aspect to Genesis ch. 2 I’d like to address.

KJV Genesis 2:15-17
2:15 And the LORD God took the man, and put him into the garden of Eden to dress it and to keep it.
2:16 And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat:
2:17 But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.

Now, if those trees are people/nations, none of them seem to have been of Adam's specific type (same spiritual and intellectual capacity?).

2:18 And the LORD God said, It is not good that the man should be alone; I will make him an help meet for him.
2:19 And out of the ground the LORD God formed every beast of the field, and every fowl of the air; and brought them unto Adam to see what he would call them: and whatsoever Adam called every living creature, that was the name thereof.
2:20 And Adam gave names to all cattle, and to the fowl of the air, and to every beast of the field; but for Adam there was not found an help meet for him.
2:21 And the LORD God caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam, and he slept: and he took one of his ribs, and closed up the flesh instead thereof;
2:22 And the rib, which the LORD God had taken from man, made he a woman, and brought her unto the man.

If there were any living souls (chay nepesh) of the exact same type (spiritual and intellectual capacity?) as Adam yet existing, then Yahweh would not have needed to form Eve.

posted on Jun, 17 2004 @ 07:56 AM
Okay, so , now that we’ve covered those particular point, here are some more references to skin color in the Bible:

KJV Song of Solomon 5:10-11 My beloved is white (tzach) and ruddy (’adom), the chiefest among ten thousand. His head is as the most fine gold, his locks are bushy, and black as a raven.

5:14-15 His hands are as gold rings set with beryl: his belly is as bright as ivory (shen) overlaid with sapphires. His legs are as pillars of marble, set upon sockets of fine gold: his countenance is as Lebanon, excellent as the cedars.

7:3-4 Thy breasts are as two young roes that are twins. Thy neck is as a tower of ivory (shen); thine eyes like fish pools in Heshbon, by the gate of Bath-rabbim: thy nose is as the tower of Lebanon which looketh toward Damascus.

white 6703 sah/tzach, a. radiant, shimmering, scorching, clear.

White may not be listed in the definition, but the root verb 6705 sahah/tzachach means only “to be white”.

ivory 8127 shen, n.f. & m. tooth (human or animal); by extension: anything tooth shaped; rocky crag

The word in Hebrew that means “ivory” specifcally is 8143 shen-habbim. However, “shen” is translated as ivory many other times, including the verses describing Solomon's throne of ivory, and Ahab's palace of the same substance. Only in 1 Ki 10:22 and 2 Ch 9:21, both of which describe the shipments of ivory and other precious objects brought from Tarshish every three years during King Solomon's reign, is the word 'shenhabbim' used. So then, 'shen' is properly translated ivory in certain contexts.

ruddy 122 ‘adom, a. red; ruddy (skin)

Also interesting is the name Lebanon 3844 Lebanon, Lebanon, "white, snow" . This of course is from 3835-37 laban which means “to make white” as a verb and “white” as a noun. The father of Rachel and Leah, Jacob/Israel's two chief wives, was Laban or “White“.

The following verses are also interesting.

KJV Song of Solomon 1:5-6
1:5 I am black, but comely, O ye daughters of Jerusalem, as the tents of Kedar, as the curtains of Solomon.
1:6 Look not upon me, because I am black, because the sun hath looked upon me: my mother's children were angry with me; they made me the keeper of the vineyards; but mine own vineyard have I not kept.

The Hebrew word translated black in verse 5 is 7838 shachor, a. black, dark, while the one translated as such in verse 6 is 7840 s'harhor/shecharchor, a. dark, swarthy (complexion).

Some might believe this points to a wife of Solomon being African, but that’s not necessarily the case. (Although it is possible, as Solomon had an overabundance of wives and concubines, many of them identified as being foreign, pagan women. See 1 Kings 11.) Anyway, it's quite possible that the woman singing to Solomon actually just has a very deep sun-tan after being made to work outside in the vineyards by her family. Some Caucasians are capable of developing very dark complexions after spending their entire lives in the sun.


KJV 1 Samuel 16:12 And he (Jesse) sent and brought him (David) in. Now he was ruddy (’admoni), and withal of beautiful countenance, and goodly to look to. And the LORD (YHWH) said, Arise , and anoint him: for this is he.

KJV 1 Samuel 17:42 And when the Philistine looked about, and saw David, he disdained him: for he was but a youth, and ruddy (’admoni), and of a fair countenance.

ruddy 132 'admoni, a. red; ruddy (skin)

It may very well be that the “sons of God” of were fair-haired and fair-skinned, perhaps even blonde-haired and blue-eyed. Certainly they must have been taller than the children of Adam. But I wonder if one of the reasons they were attracted to the females of Seth’s line was because they were of similar appearance?

KJV Genesis 6:1-7
1. And it came to pass, when men (ha-'adam) began to multiply on the face of the earth ('adamah), and daughters (baht) were born unto them,
2. That the sons of God (bnei ha-'Elohim) saw the daughters of men (banot-ha-'adam) that they were fair (tobah); and they took them wives of all which they chose.

2896 tob, a. & n.m. good, pleasing, desirable; goodness; this can refer to quality as well as moral goodness.

Note that the word “fair” in Genesis ch. 2 is not a reference to complexion, but to the quality and desirability of the women.

Of course it might not be the case that the daughters of ha-’adam resembled the “sons of God” in their appearance. The possibility just occurred to me, so I thought I’d mention it. Anyway, not all Caucasians are tall and fair-haired. I myself have reddish-brown hair, brown eyes (though they were hazel when I was younger) and am just under 5 feet 8 inches tall.

Well, I understand that the information contained in the last two posts is probably very offensive to some people, but all I’m doing is examining the Scriptural evidence I have before me. If anyone believes I've errored in any of the above statements and interpretations, please feel free to point it out. But please be assured that I don't believe Caucasians are any better or more righteous than any other people on this planet. I'm well aware that many Caucasians are extermely ignorant and deplorably wicked. Morevover, I do most definitely believe that the salvation of Yahweh through His Son Yahshua is open to all races of mankind, whether black, white, red, or yellow. Although Yahshua does seem to preclude the serpent seed reptilians.

Matthew 23:33 Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers, how can ye escape the damnation of hell?

The word translated as "generation" is the Greek, genema. Genema actually means "fruit, product, yield, harvest; offspring, or brood". "Vipers" is the Greek word, echidna, which may mean snake or viper. According to the Webster's College Dictionary, the Echidna is also a mythical creature that gave birth to the hydra (six-headed serpent in Greek mythology) and other monsters.

Again he condemns the children of the devil in the Gospel of John chapter 8:

41 Ye do the deeds of your father. Then said they to him, We be not born of fornication; we have one Father, even God.
42 Jesus said unto them, If God were your Father, ye would love me: for I proceeded forth and came from God; neither came I of myself, but he sent me.
43 Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word.
44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.
45 And because I tell you the truth, ye believe me not.
46 Which of you convinceth me of sin? And if I say the truth, why do ye not believe me?
47 He that is of God heareth God's words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God.

So, while it is not a very popular idea these days, Yahshua does seem to identify certain people who are incapable of being saved.

KJV Romans 9:18-24
18 Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will have mercy, and whom he will he hardeneth.
19 Thou wilt say then unto me, Why doth he yet find fault? For who hath resisted his will?
20 Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus?
21 Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour?
22 What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction:
23 And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory,
24 Even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles?

Undomiel, if you believe my conclusions about the racial make-up of the ancient Israelites are unreasonable and hold no merit whatsoever, please help me to see the error of my ways. I really just want to find out what the truth is. I can't say I wouldn't be disappointed if what I've learned about the Lost Tribes of Israel is not true, but I could deal with it. Also, I'm curious to know what you think of the belief some hold that many of the modern Jews are not actually Israelites at all. Here's a link to a thread I started on this subject earlier:

I'll look forward to getting your opinion on this and other matters.

[edit on 17-6-2004 by Ischyros]

posted on Jun, 17 2004 @ 08:13 AM
I forgot that I wanted to suggest a couple of very interesting websites to all of you, so I'll go ahead and do that now.

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