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If The U.S. Economy Goes Into The Toilet Will It Result In A Complete And Total Collapse Of Society?

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posted on Apr, 22 2010 @ 12:59 PM
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If the United States experiences a horrifying economic collapse (and it most definitely will), will that cause a complete and total collapse of society? Will we experience crime, violence, riots and social unrest on a scale that is unprecedented in U.S. history?

Before you dismiss such notions as utter foolishness dreamed up by a few bloggers with too much time on their hands, perhaps you should consider what one of the biggest credit rating organizations in the world is saying. According to a report on sovereign debt by Moody's, the world's five biggest AAA-rated countries (including the United States) are all at risk of soaring debt costs and will have to implement austerity plans that threaten "social cohesion". In case you are wondering what happens when "social cohesion" starts to break down due to economic factors, just check out the recent examples in Iceland and Greece.

Iceland:

Greece:


At the time of the Great Depression, the American people were tough, self-sufficient people who knew how to live off the land. Today, most Americans are weak, spoiled little children who will throw a temper tantrum whenever anyone tries to take their toys away. The character of the American people has been decaying for decades, and there is no way that the current crop of Americans has any chance of weathering a horrible economic depression the way Americans back in the 1930s did.

Source: theeconomiccollapseblog.com...

I thought this was a very interesting analogy of what is coming to the US and other countries-soon. Iceland was kept very hush-hush, they were the first to go down. Now Greece. The MSM trying to keep it hushed also. We, as a nation, really need to come to grips with what is going on outside our borders-that can effect all of us.

And, as to how the country would handle another Great Depression is anyone guess but I have to lean towards the aricles writer view: we would be toast-couldn't stomach the hardships etc.




posted on Apr, 22 2010 @ 01:13 PM
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Yes, absolutely....

Well no, but only for some will it be a catastrophe of epic proportions. The extreme rich that rely one the labor of other to get by and the extreme poor that rely on the labor of others to get by will be devastated when money has no value and everyone is left to their own devices to survive.


The lone survivalist may get lucky with his skills and avoidance of roving gangs. But the small-town communities that typically pull together in hard times will weather the collapse rather well, provided their luck in thwarting roving gangs.

Bottom line is people will die, people will die needlessly. Sufficient numbers will survive and just maybe be smart enough to prevent such a man made catastrophe from happening again. But given the history of the world, perhaps not.



posted on Apr, 22 2010 @ 01:15 PM
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I think you're right. People are dependent on technology now more than ever. Even people who are into camping wouldn't consider taking their hummers off-road without a shopping spree at Cabela's first.

Now, when I was seventeen, I boosted a car and drove over five states in order to be with my girlfriend who had been forcibly moved to live with her grandparents, because her parents hated me that much. (Not gonna get into the details...) I slept in the car, since it was summertime, ate out of dumpsters and went for six weeks without bathing, and that is as close to being a rugged self-sufficient person off the grid as I will ever get.

Nowadays, when I hear about the collapse of society I start thinking about how I could get in good with a group of people who already have such skills and make myself useful to them in exchange for sustenance.

Most people will riot, loot and steal until their are no more easy resources, then a few of them will resort to cannibalism, then most will die. However, there are plenty of people already living out in the woods to carry on the species.



posted on Apr, 22 2010 @ 01:18 PM
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If society comes unglued the body count in large cities will be astronomical as people realize the corner shops won't be feeding them anymore. I would give it a max of 48 hours to evacuate a major city before the roads will become too congested to escape by vehicle, and moving on foot will inherently be dangerous. Ideally if you are concerned about this kind of stuff it would be wise to get out of the city now while the getting is good,.



posted on Apr, 22 2010 @ 01:19 PM
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Originally posted by anon72
I thought this was a very interesting analogy of what is coming to the US and other countries-soon. Iceland was kept very hush-hush, they were the first to go down. Now Greece. The MSM trying to keep it hushed also. We, as a nation, really need to come to grips with what is going on outside our borders-that can effect all of us.


Greece has gone down?

My Sister flew back from Athens yesterday.. Business as usual.. Big recession alright, high unemployment and big cuts on social spending but gone down? Gone down how? She said it was beautiful.. People were really nice.. A bit peeved at the recession but still in good form everywhere she went.. She had a great holiday actually..

You have to remember that in European countries, when politicians mess up, its citizen policy to protest and make demands.. People in the US do this stuff before the elections - We work it in reverse.. So mass protests and the odd riot mean very little tbh.. Its regular news during harsh times..

People on this site were saying last year about how Ireland had collapsed and was 'Gone Down'.. I was in Ireland for most of it.. Didn't see one protest.. Doom and Gloom was on the news alright but nothing overly bad.. I am now writing this on my Macbook while eating a sandwich in front of my 50" Bravia with the Simpsons on in the background, getting ready to fly to Berlin.. So I can guarantee you Ireland didn't "Collapse".. And neither will Greece

Iceland? Similar situation.. Whats a protest when your government messed up?

I have found that people on this site are exactly the same as the MSM.. they try to use fear to sell their threads.. **no offense to you obviously, its just an observation**

I am being realistic here.. Do you know why our countries haven't and won't descend into chaos?

People aren't animals, the future is never set in stone and austerity measures are never as bad as they are made out to be initially by the MSM who is only looking to sell a few papers..



posted on Apr, 22 2010 @ 01:27 PM
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reply to post by Dermo
 


I think things will be very different here in the USA. Have you ever been around a welfare distribution center when it ran out of items during a crisis? Seen the aftermath of Katrina in LA? Los Angles after the riots started? And the times were considered good then.

No, I think here in the US, if all out failure occurs, you will see death and destruction like you never imagined. Mostly in the cities and the surrounding areas. They won't make it into the mountainous regions-not quickly anyway.

But the up side of anything like that is eventual peace again. Change usually takes some type of violent action(s).



posted on Apr, 22 2010 @ 01:34 PM
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If the US economy tanks to the point of 'starvation and desperation' among the common masses, then the areas of Brooklyn, Manhattan and North Jersey will be levelled to a fine powder and the death toll will make Palestine look like a Paradise.

Ditto for many many other major cities especially the (ahem) so-called affluent areas of Chicago, Los Angeles, San Francisco, Miami Beach, Boston, Atlanta, Philadelphia, Detroit, Cleveland, San Diego, St Louis, Phoenix, Denver, Salt Lake City and others llike them.

Can anyone say 'POGROM'? The masses have a way of linking any meltdown in the economy to the New York Crowd e.g. Wall Street and the Banksters. And it has happened many times before in Europe.

Could it happen here in the once-great US of A ? VERY possibly. Canada is likely to be taking a lot of cash-rich refugees if it does.



posted on Apr, 22 2010 @ 01:41 PM
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Originally posted by anon72
I think things will be very different here in the USA. Have you ever been around a welfare distribution center when it ran out of items during a crisis? Seen the aftermath of Katrina in LA? Los Angles after the riots started? And the times were considered good then.


I get what you are saying but to be fair.. There is not much difference between crime and violent people in the US and crime and violent people in the EU..

I hope for your sake that this doesn't happen, I hope for humanity's sake that people aren't that animalistic and I hope for the US's sake that people haven't let themselves slip so much that they would resort to this type of behavior so easily.

I still find it extremely hard to see this happening though.. So much has to happen for it to get to the point of anything remotely like the loss of large amounts Amenities

[edit on 22/4/10 by Dermo]



posted on Apr, 22 2010 @ 02:35 PM
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reply to post by anon72
 



The society we have today needs to collapse. When society dictates that if you even look at your child cross eyed, you can have them taken from you. Nice of them, huh? Society today is so self absorbed with tech., that it forgets the spiritual side of humanity, and that is why it is in the shape that it`s in right now. When you add being self absorbed and the PC bit, it makes for one very illogical group of people hell bent on having everything their way. It`s time to shut them down for good.



posted on Apr, 22 2010 @ 02:42 PM
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reply to post by warpcrafter
 


Warpcrafter, you should write a thread about your experience.BTW, what happened to the girl friend?
Unfortunately, the rich have already stockpiled their foods and other supplies.
During several of my excursions into the Rockies and Sierras, I came across large buildings with nearby dirt landing strips, that had no reason to be out there.



posted on Apr, 22 2010 @ 02:50 PM
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I think you all should be flagging this thread (stars wouldn't hurt).

You have written some good and interesting things on here. Draw attention to it.. S&F.

my 2 cents.



posted on Apr, 22 2010 @ 04:09 PM
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From my own observation,why not can it happen again,in the 1930s depression there was mass civil disobedience,my bet is that it can happen again

Also if TSHTF,it may be too late to leave the city

[edit on 22-4-2010 by Mr_Alex]



posted on Apr, 22 2010 @ 04:30 PM
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No it will not. There will be pockets of extreme crime and poverty etc. But there is way too much control over society now by government. If anything society will increasingly become like that movie V for Vendetta where freedom loving citizens will be living on the fringes of "society" and terrorism will become a normal part of daily life here in the USA. US society will never collapse to the point where we will have to go bug out to tent cities or live out in the woods. The middle class is being systematically destroyed but for society to completely collapse that means the rich would have to lose most of their wealth and power......and not only will that not happen they will acquire more of both. The world is unfolding exactly how the rich and powerful want it to. Look at the other ATS thread...............400 families in the USA control more than 50% of the wealth!!!!!!!!!!! THAT IS NOT EFFING CAPITALISM THAT IS KLEPTOCRACY!!!!!!!!!!!!! WAKE UP PEOPLE! There will always be rich and poor in the world.......it's the middle class that is going away....and it's all planned.



posted on Apr, 22 2010 @ 04:32 PM
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My take on this is significantly different.

I don't think that any economic collapse will happen overnight. I think that there will be time to prep.

The rich will be prepared, perhaps move out to the country to that nice little vacation farm they bought.

The middle class already has a group called "preppers" They are getting prepared.

The people that will have trouble are those that depend on things being available all the time. Mostly, that will be poor people. They go to the store to buy their daily groceries and find the store closed. They try driving uptown and can't seem to find anything open.

They go back to their home and turn on the TV. For once, they turn on the news and here about an economic crisis. They get bored, walk down to the liquor store and buy a 12 pack. The next day, the stores are not open. They can't get gas for their cars. Things have ground to a halt.

A few days later they are on the news asking why the government hasn't come to help them. The answer is that the government isn't coming. There will be localized rioting when the underclasses realize the police have gone home to take care of their own families.

The rioters try to move into the middle class and upper class areas but they get shot. People from those areas create barricades and don't allow you in if you don't live there.

The funny thing about starvation is that after a week or so, you don't have enough energy to do much of anything.

The rich have a pleasant little vacation in the country. The middle class, pulls together and manages to survive. The lower classes will suffer the highest number of causalities mostly from their own ranks trying to steal from each other and getting hurt in the process.

I'll be running my little fruit and veggie stand where you can purchase my food if you have silver or gold.



posted on Apr, 22 2010 @ 04:36 PM
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There are protocols for this already in place. We won't disintegrate unless states decide to seceed and bundle together, then there will be civil war.

6900 Series of Protocols for Economic Collapse

[edit on 22-4-2010 by unityemissions]



posted on Apr, 22 2010 @ 04:49 PM
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Its already in the toilet* they just forgot to flush



posted on Apr, 22 2010 @ 06:01 PM
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reply to post by Wildbob77
 


I think you hit it right on the head man, as soon as vital services stop serving things are going to go ape in a big way. If people can't get food at the corner store, water from their tap or a dial tone when they need to call someone they will start to panic, and those kinds of people are downright dangerous in any number larger than 0.

As for the disparities between the social groups the only point of contention I would have with your layout would be the fact that many of the well to do folks who might prep do so with the misguided notion that their money will take care of everything. They tend to forget to recruit good talent for their group and expect to sit on their hind quarters in a SHTF situation rather than getting their hands dirty sharing in the work load; this tend to make them a short-lived ruler of their mini-kingdoms.



posted on Apr, 22 2010 @ 07:22 PM
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One thing for sure, once the riots and social decay starts-it will be a long time before it ends.

You now, maybe that is what is needed to happen. A flushing of society-with the end result being a more defined socitey. Instead of the crzay stuff going on all over the US.

People that survide would be far more appreciative of what they have and what they can do. Scary? Sure. Needed? Probably.

I am pretty sure by the time everything is back under control, a lot less people who take our society for granted, wouldn't anymore. They would be model citicens.



posted on Apr, 28 2010 @ 07:01 PM
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Here is what I found that might be interesting. The comparison between collapse of the Soviet Union and the future collapse of the USA. Follow the link and you can see that presentation.

www.energybulletin.net...



posted on Apr, 28 2010 @ 07:41 PM
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reply to post by anon72
 



I think it will depend on to what extent the interruption of what people have grown accustomed to.
I tell you this, 7 days of no food and power nationwide will result in a national security situation.
It will spiral out of control.
JIT merchandise management is one of multiple Achilles heels of this whole affair.

Crime will explode, Police will be forced to use extreme measures to keep the peace..if they can.
It is a sad fact that you must be prepared for emergencies, to its credit F.E.M.A has been telling people to get prepared, many have followed that advice and 10000 times more have not.

Its those who are in lala land that will turn into what Jim Rawles calls the "Golden Horde".

In spite of all of this people need to remain calm and follow the law, be vigilant as crime is on the rise.

Have a little faith, things are starting to look better.
Don't let the Neoconned Tea Party get you down, things are really going to get better if we work together.

A nation divided can not stand, look at the ideas being thrown around and see who offers hope, who offers lies and deceit.



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