Obama may not be allowed to go to Arizona if this immigration bill passes.

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posted on Apr, 21 2010 @ 10:38 AM
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I thought I would create this thread to actually address the issue at hand and not some tripe created to bash the TPM. I find it ironic that if someone in the enforcement arm of the Arizona police, has a reasonable suspicion that Obama is an illegal, they could force him to prove it!

From the legislation-



For any lawful contact made by a law enforcement official or agency of this state or a county, city, town or other political subdivision of this state where reasonable suspicion exists that the person is an alien who is unlawfully present in the United States, a reasonable attempt shall be made, when practicable, to determine the immigration status of the person. The person's immigration status shall be verified with the federal government pursuant to 8 United States code section 1373(c)


Here is the link to Arizona legislature's page on the immigration bill.

Arizona legislation 1070

Any Arizona Police Officers out there that are birthers?




posted on Apr, 21 2010 @ 10:46 AM
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I have one question for everyone who supports this move by Arizona...do all of you also support a national ID???

Because you know you are supporting the first step towards a national ID by supporting this....right?




It's been discussed on ATS many times how will America be turned into a police state...well apparently this is how...and with open arms by those who usually scream against it. But hey...as long as it is targeted towards those with brown skin....you are ok with it....right?



posted on Apr, 21 2010 @ 10:47 AM
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Originally posted by endisnighe
I thought I would create this thread to actually address the issue at hand and not some tripe created to bash the TPM. I find it ironic that if someone in the enforcement arm of the Arizona police, has a reasonable suspicion that Obama is an illegal, they could force him to prove it!

From the legislation-



For any lawful contact made by a law enforcement official or agency of this state or a county, city, town or other political subdivision of this state where reasonable suspicion exists that the person is an alien who is unlawfully present in the United States, a reasonable attempt shall be made, when practicable, to determine the immigration status of the person. The person's immigration status shall be verified with the federal government pursuant to 8 United States code section 1373(c)


Here is the link to Arizona legislature's page on the immigration bill.

Arizona legislation 1070

Any Arizona Police Officers out there that are birthers?


That is seriously one awesome bill o-o.. BUT I don't think Obama is an ILLEGAL immigrant.

Just because someone isn't a U.S. citizen doesn't mean they got here illegaly.

Just my thoughts.



posted on Apr, 21 2010 @ 10:50 AM
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reply to post by OutKast Searcher
 


Read the frelling bill and tell me it is not okay to ask someone for their status of being in the FRELLING country?

Or are you just going to go off topic and try and derail this thread to foment discontent.

THIS HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH REAL ID AND QUIT YOUR LYING.

When in contact with the government, in either a law enforcement or governmental assistance, an Arizona official HAS THE RIGHT to ask if the person in question is here legally.

Quit your obfuscations.



posted on Apr, 21 2010 @ 10:52 AM
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Originally posted by OutKast Searcher
I have one question for everyone who supports this move by Arizona...do all of you also support a national ID???

Because you know you are supporting the first step towards a national ID by supporting this....right?




It's been discussed on ATS many times how will America be turned into a police state...well apparently this is how...and with open arms by those who usually scream against it. But hey...as long as it is targeted towards those with brown skin....you are ok with it....right?


That's a new viewpoint, but can you look through their legislation and find a line that applies to it for us to see?

Just one more thing though, how do you get off saying that "as long as it is targeted towards those with brown skin....you are ok with it" that's a huge leap to make, it's a national problem not a racist issue,



posted on Apr, 21 2010 @ 10:52 AM
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Not sure but I think we beat this horse to death at this thread:

Arizona House OKs Birther Bill! here we go....
www.abovetopsecret.com...

If I am wrong, sorry.

[edit on 4/21/2010 by anon72]

[edit on 4/21/2010 by anon72]



posted on Apr, 21 2010 @ 10:57 AM
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reply to post by anon72
 


Well, I just brought in a twist to the immigration bill that Arizona is about to pass. It just states that the State has a right to check on the status of an individual in a lawful contact.

Of course we have the loons that want to bash any illegal immigration control that is attempted by anyone.

They have begun their lie campaign without one link to the bill.

Why bother linking to the bill when they are so much better at lying about what is in it.



posted on Apr, 21 2010 @ 10:58 AM
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reply to post by endisnighe
 


What document are you going to show as proof you are here legally if asked?

The only ones with good identification that they are here are non-citizens with a greencard/visa. What do I have that shows I'm a citizen? Drivers license...nope. Birth Certificate...nope...I could of been born here...renounced my citizenship and snuck back in ILLEGALLY. Social Security Card...nope...that doesn't work either. And if you do want to use any of these...they are easy to fake...right? In fact...you don't even have to fake the drivers license...illegal aliens could have a valid drivers license.

So what do I as a citizen have to show that I am actually a citizen of the United States???? Nothing...unless they begin a national ID.


So this law will become harrassement...and they will realize there is no way to enforce it WITHOUT a national ID.


Prove me wrong. What document would you show me that proves your CURRENT legal status.



posted on Apr, 21 2010 @ 11:01 AM
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reply to post by Scarcer
 


I know, I thought I would just throw a twist into the OP.

Thought it may attract more people to actually see what is in this bill.

Okay, since it is legislation I am going to post the entire bill.

From the original link-

Be it enacted by the Legislature of the State of Arizona:


Section 1. Intent

The legislature finds that there is a compelling interest in the cooperative enforcement of federal immigration laws throughout all of Arizona. The legislature declares that the intent of this act is to make attrition through enforcement the public policy of all state and local government agencies in Arizona. The provisions of this act are intended to work together to discourage and deter the unlawful entry and presence of aliens and economic activity by persons unlawfully present in the United States.

Sec. 2. Title 11, chapter 7, Arizona Revised Statutes, is amended by adding article 8, to read:

ARTICLE 8. ENFORCEMENT OF IMMIGRATION LAWS

START_STATUTE11-1051. Cooperation and assistance in enforcement of immigration laws; indemnification


Mod Edit: External Source Tags – Please Review This Link.

[edit on 21/4/2010 by Mirthful Me]



posted on Apr, 21 2010 @ 11:07 AM
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reply to post by OutKast Searcher
 


Prove a negative. Nice try.

Frelling pulling out all the stops on this bull# aye?

Marching orders for the Dems have come out in full regalia on this one.

Cannot have a State TRY to enforce FEDERAL law aye?

Why is their a Federal Law on immigration if it is NOT meant to be enforced?

Oh, I see, this could hurt the NWO plan to destroy the US so no need to enforce it aye?

Frelling come with an argument or go home crying.

Will be back later. I posted the entire bill so show me where the REAL ID is in it.

Otherwise quit YOUR LIES AND OBFUSCATIONS.

Sorry, determining if someone is here illegally is quite SIMPLE.



posted on Apr, 21 2010 @ 11:14 AM
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reply to post by endisnighe
 



Prove a negative. Nice try.


Why do people always try this when they are stumped by a question.

WHAT NEGATIVE????


I'm asking you to do exactly what the bill states....PROVE YOUR LEGAL STATUS. This is not proving a negative...and if it is...how do you expect ANYONE TO COMPLY WITH THIS LAW????

Go ahead...I'll wait.


Sorry, determining if someone is here illegally is quite SIMPLE.


Then go ahead...how do you determine that? Color of skin and if they speak English?



Even though you are using your standby dodge, exit the thread...come back later and ignore this question. I've seen you do it many many times...you will join back in when you can respond to people you agree with and dodge any question you can't answer. It is actually quite funny.

[edit on 21-4-2010 by OutKast Searcher]

[edit on 21-4-2010 by OutKast Searcher]



posted on Apr, 21 2010 @ 11:17 AM
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Originally posted by OutKast Searcher
reply to post by endisnighe
 



Prove a negative. Nice try.


Why do people always try this when they are stumped by a question.

WHAT NEGATIVE????


I'm asking you to do exactly what the bill states....PROVE YOUR LEGAL STATUS. This is not proving a negative...and if it is...how do you expect ANYONE TO COMPLY WITH THIS LAW????

Go ahead...I'll wait.



Even though you are using your standby dodge, exit the thread...come back later and ignore this question. I've seen you do it many many times...you will join back in when you can respond to people you agree with and dodge any question you can't answer. It is actually quite funny.


He went to the same person that Obama went to get his proof of citizenship made. You know it has to be authentic like Obama's,

and he gets it made, he can tell the state of Hawaii to lock it up for him.



posted on Apr, 21 2010 @ 11:27 AM
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reply to post by endisnighe
 


I'd like to think there's a 'gotcha' here, but all one really needs to do to prove themselves a citizen to a cop is produce a driver's license an proof of insurance if stopped in a car; social security card and a bank debit card or a checkbook if you aren't in a car.

I actually applaud this law. There is no "right to privacy" in the Constitution, and even if there were it would only apply to U.S. citizens.

You can think of the law this way - it allows police to verify that the person in question IS a U.S. citizen and afforded the rights of the Constitution.

I'd like to ask anyone how this law is any different from a policeman pulling over anyone on the road right now? Cops are allowed to do so at their discretion. It doesn't have to be for a traffic violation - it can be because they thought your car matched the description of one that was stolen, or you matched the appearance of someone they were looking for.



posted on Apr, 21 2010 @ 11:50 AM
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reply to post by OutKast Searcher
 


Nice try, first you tell me to prove that this does not have to do with the move to institute the REAL ID act.

Now you bring in having to prove that I am a Citizen or am legally here.

Really easy on my part, I can show my long form or short form Birth Certificate or my DL or my SS card or even my record of Grade school, middle school, high school, college transcripts. That would be easy enough, I haven't locked those up as others have. HMMMMM.


Just because SOME people have a problem with that, does not mean I would have a problem proving it.


Nice to see TPTB are bringing all their SOP to this argument.

Anything else you want to obfuscate about?



posted on Apr, 21 2010 @ 11:54 AM
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reply to post by sos37
 


Yes, if someone knows their rights, they could just ask if they are being detained for something.

A police officer actually has no right to accost anyone without probable cause. If you know your rights, that in and of itself can be proof you belong here.

Now, if you are pulled over or asked to provide proof when probable cause is given, no problems.

Kind of funny how we as Citizens are supposed to follow these guidelines, but the illegals are not?



posted on Apr, 21 2010 @ 12:08 PM
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Always enjoy your threads, endisnighe.

But, don't you think that this bill will pass? The Immigration Reform Act.
They WANT a North American Union.
They WANT no borders.

That's the point of the reform act. These people want illegals to be legal.
Therefore tearing down the borders and hence, no one will be illegal.

It's all a plan to create the new Union.


(opinions)



posted on Apr, 21 2010 @ 12:16 PM
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I'm glad to see that a state is actually going to adhere to an existing federal law. Why won't anyone else? While ID's are easy to fake, being in a police database, that links with an AZ citizen database, is not. If you get pulled over, it's simple enough to find out if you're legal or not REGARDLESS if you have an ID or not. If you know your rights under the law, and can spout your DL # and SS # on demand, then you're probably legal. This law will NOT have a 100% hit rate because they still will be acting within the constitution of the US.

Oh, and for the guys who give into the PC crap, then check this out:

Operation Wetback

Hmmm...wonder why it was just for mexicans....Oh, that's right, because they were the MAJORITY of illegal aliens in this country and they still are. It did work, and ag prices (lettuce, strawberries, corn, etc.) did not sky rocket. We have the problem we do now because 1. we didn't do anything when they came back and 2. we have passed, i think, 2 amnesty bills since.



posted on Apr, 21 2010 @ 12:19 PM
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reply to post by havok
 


Well, I am hoping when the Feds attempt to pass the amnesty crap again the people do exactly what they did last time, stop it.

If not, this country is going to tear itself apart, all thanks to the NWO agenda and the totalitarians.

Now, this bill by Arizona is only enforcing federal laws, and we have the statists out and about decrying the bill, without of course even posting a link to it.

NOT one blog or article yet even bothers to post a link. I had to do a search for it at the Arizona.org link.

As for the NAU, I know this is their agenda. My God, you can hear the ignorant masses out there spouting the borders should mean nothing rhetoric.

I am beginning to find these people very vile in there ignorance and collusion with the the Destruction of the Sovereign Country of the US.

They are trying to destroy the US. I find this to be treasonous. I think some AG's from some states should start arresting some feds for treason.

Something sooner or later is going to hit the fan.



posted on Apr, 21 2010 @ 12:43 PM
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reply to post by endisnighe
 


...


i could see that happening.



posted on Apr, 21 2010 @ 01:05 PM
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Is it just me, or is the entire premise of this thread a complete crock.

To my knowledge, even "birthers" have never questioned whether Obama is a current legal citizen; they've questioned whether he's a "natural born citizen" (what's constitutionally required to hold the office).

As there is no valid question regarding Obama merely being a citizen; he'd have no problems whatsoever entering AZ with nothing more than a valid drivers license/social security card.

[edit on 4/21/10 by redmage]





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