Nibiru This, Nibiru That: STOP, You've been punked!, page 16

reply to post by ElectricUniverse

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the failure is on your part as a "greater constraint" is NOT more important unless you have several models showing this, and you don't...

Your failure has been to purposely misquote me, and to have no idea what a constraint means, and to not understand the difference between a model and a technology.

When you start by learning the scientific method to how models work, and how they are corroborated only then can we start to have a concise argument again, but you keep trying to claim that one constraint alone is enough to dismiss what other models say AND THIS IS NOT HOW IT WORKS...

When you learn that different technologies offer different results you can begin to understand how things work.

reply to post by serbsta

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Wow.... just when all hope was lost; an excellent thread, extremely well presented and referenced.

Thank you OP, Carry on the great work denying ignorance.

S+F!!!!, thanks!

reply to post by stereologist

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And then again with the new claim... stereologist.. to prove ANYTHING using ANY TECHNOLOGY it has to be done either using MANY different models, or corroborating with MANY other laboratories... Astronomical discoveries are not done just by lonewolves, and data provided by them is verified, and verified again, and verified again.... One constraint, just because it is larger, doesn't dismiss the several other constraints several models have shown....

Originally posted by ElectricUniverse
reply to post by stereologist

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And then again with the new claim... stereologist.. to prove ANYTHING using ANY TECHNOLOGY it has to be done either using MANY different models, or corroborating with MANY other laboratories... Astronomical discoveries are not done just by lonewolves, and data provided by them is verified, and verified again, and verified again.... One constraint, just because it is larger, doesn't dismiss the several other constraints several models have shown....

Whether amateur or expert astronomer, no one as of yet has provided any data or evidence, the only theory we have currently is that

a) brown dwarf stars exist in abundance in our solar system and beyond

and

b) We are unable to detect many of them due to the photographic processes involved when gazing space. They do not produce the required light radiation for the device to capture them, especially when there are other exposure sources.

Now where's your logic? It's entirely possible, but not probable. Where's the theory, wheres the hypothesis, wheres the telescope evidence showing its orbit, its size, its relation to other known stars? WE DONT HAVE IT....YET but that doesn't mean we definetly will.

reply to post by stereologist

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Hi Stereologist,

How can you spend countless hours posting on nothing but Nibiru, Planet-X, Nemesis, Brown Dwarf, Wormwood, 2012 and Coming Earth Changes threads?

You post non-stop around the clock and to top it off you don't even believe in any of this stuff.

What makes you spend hours upon hours everyday doing nothing but trying to disprove/debunk these type of threads on something that you don't even agree with or believe in?

Seriously, it makes no sense to me and that brings further question of who your employer really is because obviously you are spending most of your hours and days on this site doing nothing but trying to disprove/debunk Nibiru, Planet-X, Nemesis, Brown Dwarf, Wormwood and Coming Earth Changes threads?

Best Wishes!

Originally posted by serbsta
Nibiru is NOT a planet beyond Pluto.

Nibiru has NOTHING to do with 2012.

Nibiru therefore has NOTHING to do with any 'Annunaki Gods'.

BTW Serbsta, to show how ignorant you are about this subject you claim that Nibiru has nothing to do with any Anunnaki (that's the correct spelling btw)...

B. The Anunnaki, Igigi, and the Younger Gods
Ellil (Enlil) - Sumerian for "wind/storm-god".
Initially the leader of the pantheon, he has since relinquished his spot to Anu. Possible slayer of Enmesharra and avenger of his father Anu. His role in this was upplanted by Marduk by the Babylonians. He is a short-tempered god who was responsible for the great flood. He is the creator of mankind. He is thought to favor and help those in need. He guards the "tablets of destiny", which allow him to determines the fate of all things animate or inanimate. They was once stolen from him by a Zu, a storm- bird (a bird with some human qualities). They were recovered and Zu faced judgment by Ellil. His consort is Ninlil, his chief-minister is Nusku. He was also god of the lands and of the earth. He is a "King of the Anunnaki". He was their counselor warrior. He and his people receive the earth in 'Atrahasis'. His temple is Duranki.
.....
He divided the Anunnaki and placed 300 to guard the sky, and six hundred to dwell in heaven and earth. He had them create Babylon building the Esagalia temple and a high ziggurat. Anshar gave him many new names: 1. Asarluhi, 2. Marduk, 3. The Son, The Majesty of the Gods, 4. Marukka, 5. Mershakushu, 6. Lugal-dimmer-ankia (King of heaven and earth), 7. Bel, 8. Nari-lugal-dimmer-ankia, 9. Asarluhi, 10. Namtila, 11. Namru, 12. 'Asare, 13. Asar-alim, 14. Asar-alim-nuna, 15. Tutu, 16. Zi-ukkina, 17. Ziku, 18. Agaku, 19. Shazu, 20. Zisi, 21. Suhrim, 22. Suhgurim, 23. Zahrim, 24. Zahgurim, 25. Enbilulu, 26. Epadun, 27. Gugal, 28. Hegal, 29. Sirsir, 30. Malah, 31. Gil, 32. Gilima, 33. Agilima, 34. Zulum, 35. Mummu, 36. Zulum-ummu, 37. Gizh- numun-ab, 38. Lugal-ab-dubur, 39. Pagal-guena, 40. Lugal-Durmah, 41. Aranuna, 42. Dumu-duku, 43. Lugal-duku, 44. Lugal-shuanna, 45. Iruga, 46. Irqingu, 47. Kinma, 48. Kinma, 49. E-sizkur, 50. Addu, 51. Asharu, 52. Neberu, 53. Enkukur. He becomes a firm lawgiver and judge who, when angered is not stoppable.
...

home.comcast.net...

Now...to refresh sebrsta memory...

Nibiru (also transliterated Neberu, Nebiru) is a term in the Akkadian language, translating to "crossing" or "point of transition", especially of rivers[1], i.e. river crossings or ferry-boats. In Babylonian astronomy, nibiru (in cuneiform spelled dné-bé-ru or MULni-bi-rum) is a term of the highest point of the ecliptic, i.e. the point of summer solstice, and its associated constellation. The establishment of the nibiru point is described in tablet 5 of the creation epic Enûma Eliš"

"When Marduk fixed the locations (manzazu) of Nibiru, Enlil and Ea in the sky".(2)
As the highest point in the paths of the planets, nibiru was considered the seat of the summus deus who pastures the stars like sheep, in Babylon identified with Marduk. This interpretation of Marduk as the ruler of the cosmos suggesting an early monotheist tendency in Babylonian religion by various authors.[3][4]

The corresponding constellation was in the area of Libra. The Nibiru constellation rose in the month of Tišritum, around autumnal equinox, and Nibiru was also a name for the planet Jupiter when observed in the month of Tišritum.

In the enumerations, Nibiru is mentioned at different astronomical locations in conjunction with the positions of stars and planets,(2) mostly as the "star of Marduk", as in the Enuma Elish: "Nibiru is (Marduks) star, which he made appear in the heavens . . . [130-131] The stars of heaven, let him (Nibiru) set their course; let him shepherd all the gods like sheep."[5]

The various stars or planets were not subject to any fixed interpretation. The "star of Ea", for example, was described at various "revelation spots" including Vela, Fomalhaut, and Venus. Similar interpretations were made for the other "stars of the gods", so certain celestial coordinates where the "stars of the gods" appeared must be considered.[2]

Nibiru is described more closely on a complete cuneiform tablet:[6]

Nibiru, which is said to have occupied the passageways of heaven and earth, because everyone above and below asks Nibiru if they cannot find the passage. Nibiru is Marduks star which the gods in heaven caused to be visible. Nibiru stands as a post at the turning point. The others say of Nibiru the post: "The one who crosses the middle of the sea (Tiamat) without calm, may his name be Nibiru, for he takes up the center of it". The path of the stars of the sky should be kept unchanged.
Böhl calls the text "objectively the most difficult passage, although it has been handed down in its entirety. The Nibiru tablet does not provide any essential help for the clarification."[7]

In the MUL.APIN, Nibiru is identified as Jupiter:

"When the stars of Enlil have been finished, one big star – although its light is dim – divides the sky in half and stands there: that is, the star of Marduk (MUL dAMAR.UD), Nibiru (né-bé-ru), Jupiter (MULSAG.ME.GAR); it keeps changing its position and crosses the sky."
Conversely, Tablets K.6174:9’ and K.12769:6’ refer to it as Mercury: "If Mercury (MULUDU.IDIM.GU4) divides the sky and stands there, [its name] is Nibiru.

en.wikipedia.org...(Babylonian_astronomy)

reply to post by ElectricUniverse

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I never said any constraints were dismissed. I said that gravitational methods produced known weaker constraints. The constraints are in agreement with each other. Some constraints are just stronger than others.

reply to post by ElectricUniverse

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kk nice theory, you gonna give me the bible for proof of god now?

Originally posted by ET_MAN
reply to post by stereologist

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Hi Stereologist,

How can you spend countless hours posting on nothing but Nibiru, Planet-X, Nemesis, Brown Dwarf, Wormwood, 2012 and Coming Earth Changes threads?

You post non-stop around the clock and to top it off you don't even believe in any of this stuff.

What makes you spend hours upon hours everyday doing nothing but trying to disprove/debunk these type of threads on something that you don't even agree with or believe in?

Seriously, it makes no sense to me and that brings further question of who your employer really is because obviously you are spending most of your hours and days on this site doing nothing but trying to disprove/debunk Nibiru, Planet-X, Nemesis, Brown Dwarf, Wormwood and Coming Earth Changes threads?

Best Wishes!

He is showing his side of the debate and unfortunately no one yet has given a cohesive reciprical argument against HIS case,

he's trying to deny the ignorance surrounding this subject and all of the fear-mongers and preachers we have infesting this site and youtube.

They know they have no proof and are quite frankly unwilling to provide anything, or any methodical study or hypothesis for the subject.

Again, to me, it's like handing someone the bible and saying "here, here is proof of god" - its not scientific, its not progressive, its just meaningless vocabulary of avoidances, using things such as well "you can't prove it DOESN'T exist" - Yes because the burden of proof is not on me..... as in any scientific preposition, the proof will be provided to support the claim.

Sorry their claims are not adequate enough and are not backed by anything of substance.

Peace.


[edit on 24/5/10 by awake_and_aware]

Originally posted by awake_and_aware

kk nice theory, you gonna give me the bible for proof of god now?

I wasn't using the bible in that fashion... btw you do know what biblia means right? BOOKS... the bible is a collection of books with stories, and many of those stories told about what people knew about in the past.... Wormwood is one of those things it speaks about.

The Hopi also have a prophecy which speaks about a red Star which will appear after the blue Katchina makes it's appearance in the skies and sheds it's mask. the Blue Katchina was comet HOlmes, which in October 2007 became the largest object in the Solar System being even larger than the Sun. It shone blue and it's brightness increased half a million times more than it was before this happened. BTW Comet Holmes survived this and only part of it was lost when for whatever reason it expanded.

The following image shows the comparison between the Sun and the expanded comet Holmes in 2007.

The Hopi elders have long passed down their myths and prophecies from generation to generation via oral tradition. Additional details are extrapolated from their many ancient rock pictographs and tablets.

One such prophecy reveals: "When the Blue Star Kachina makes its appearance in the heavens, the Fifth World will emerge".

The Blue Star is seen as the starting herald of a Great Purification period beginning prior to 2012. This would last for 7 years in total. Interestingly comet Holmes 17P travels an orbit around the sun 7 years long. That fact makes for a rather ominous coincidence if you ask this researcher. That should mean the great purification runs through 24-10-2007 to 24-10-2014.

It is said that it will begin when the Saquasohuh (Blue Star) Kachina dances in the plaza and removes his mask. Which partly relates to a certain ceremonial dance involving a specific religious mask from what I understand. It is however also explained as an actual solar object. First it would be represented in dances and later seen in the sky by all peoples of the Earth.
....

2012rising.com...

[edit on 24-5-2010 by ElectricUniverse]

reply to post by awake_and_aware

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Hi awake_and_asleep,

He is showing his side of the debate and unfortunately no one yet has given a cohesive reciprical argument against HIS case,

You have to be joking, many have provided stereologist with plenty of FACTS & EVIDENCE that stereologist has simply ignored and has never disproven.

Are you trying to tell me that he has dedicated his entire life now to doing nothing but disproving/debunking Nibiru, Planet-X, Nemesis, Brown Dwarf, Wormwood and Coming Earth Changes threads?

Full time job am I right?

Yes Full Time and I love how you, stereologist and some others work really tight as a team.

Do you answer all of his posts by the way?

Secretary or business partner?

FACTS & EVIDENCE!
Links you need to check out!
www.the-rabbits-hole.com...
comingearthchanges.phpbb3now.com...
www.poleshift2011.com...
yowusa.com...

Best Wishes!

[edit on 24-5-2010 by ET_MAN]

reply to post by ET_MAN

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It's not that we want to disprove you, its that we demand proof, evidence or otherwise at least a cohesive, scientific approach to the reality of such a proposed planet and it's surrounding myth.

Yes, it's entirely possible. But the world ending tommorow is possible, or even in 2012 but i don't go around preaching because all scientific evidence and research shows otherwise.

Thanks for the smarmy comment too "awake_and_asleep" - Nice one.

Why i attack and debunk such subjects as these? To save people some time and effort; in putting their beliefs in something unfalsifiable. They are being lead up the garden path.

What's worse is people who carry on as if they definetively know and understand it so well that they have put all their beliefs in this proposed planet. It's just wrong. Its stupidfying.

That's not to say don't research the subject, but our telescopes arn't picking anything up, no scientists have confirmed or proposed such evidence or even theories and nothing can be seen with the visible eye, so why claim the truth, when you don't know the truth.

reply to post by awake_and_aware

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Nice to see you make such claims, when you yourself obviously haven't read the information which has been given. BTW, I am not saying the information from the op is true, however there is evidence which does states there are other planets in our Solar System as well as a red or brown dwarf, and we know as a matter of fact that for example Neptune and Uranus were hit at least once long ago by some large object at least 4-5 times the size of Earth. Then there is the asteroid belt which is between the orbits of Mars and Jupiter and it is thought that a planet was once where the asteroid belt is.

Appart from this we have what astronomers are telling us that for example the orbit of Sedna is impossible unless there is a very large object, maybe even an stellar size object which could be the cause for it's trajectory. Then there is the irregular orbit of Pluto also, which at one point in it's orbit it gets closer to the Sun than Neptune, when Neptune's orbit is closer to the Sun.

Sorry, but all you have shown is that you rather side with those that want to dismiss anything that shows the real possibility of our Solar System being a binary System, and having several other planets which haven't been discovered yet...

Serbsta has shown nothing but ignorance, but he is not the only one unfortunately.

reply to post by ElectricUniverse

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the Blue Katchina was comet HOlmes, which in October 2007 became the largest object in the Solar System being even larger than the Sun. It shone blue and it's brightness increased half a million times more than it was before this happened. BTW Comet Holmes survived this and only part of it was lost when for whatever reason it expanded.

Do you have any evidence that Holmes appeared blue? I have seen telescopic images of Holmes being blue, but no naked eye sightings of Holmes as blue.

reply to post by ET_MAN

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You have to be joking, many have provided stereologist with plenty of FACTS & EVIDENCE that stereologist has simply ignored and has never disproven.

Like what? When that liar Lucus fails to disclose that the objects seen by IRAS were galaxies and a cosmic "cirrus cloud." Do you mean when you post material about Velikovsky that was debunked 50 years ago? Do you mean like posting claims about pole shifts that are false? Is that your crummy so-called evidence?

reply to post by ElectricUniverse

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Ok,

Did i say there isn't a possibility of a brown dwarf star in our solar system, did i say there is no possibility of our system resembling a binary system with the failed star being your proposed Nibiru? no? no i didn't

Possibility, not fact, not even probability, no evidence, only a theory of 3600 year orbit and the people who made us inhabit or inhabited it.

And when our science even now can't even rationalise with this theory of 3600 years orbit, aliens inhabiting it (our creators). Then you are just as bad as the bible in what you are preaching. Thanks i am done here....

i'll be back to apologise when i see it with my eyes or an intelligent/respectible scientist presents irefutable evidence.

EDIT: Infact i won't apologise, because why should i apologise for not believing in something that cannot even be proved or observed.

Thanks for being really smarmy though, really nice way to go on.

Peace out to those who can think for themselves.





[edit on 24/5/10 by awake_and_aware]

reply to post by ElectricUniverse

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there is evidence which does states there are other planets in our Solar System as well as a red or brown dwarf

This is a typical misrepresentation of the evidence.

No one is saying that there must be these objects. What is interesting is how far out and difficult these objects must be IF they exist. The evidence is not that they do exist, but that there are no planet sized objectsd even close to the orbits of the known planets.

Then there is the asteroid belt which is between the orbits of Mars and Jupiter and it is thought that a planet was once where the asteroid belt is.

The mass of the asteroids in the asteroid belt is small. It is too small to form into a planet. Put it all together and it is 4% of the moon. So the asteroid belt has a mass a little bigger than Sedna.

[Appart from this we have what astronomers are telling us that for example the orbit of Sedna is impossible unless there is a very large object

Give us a link showing that there must be a body that exists today and not some past gravitational interaction.

All you've done is poor misrepresentations of the evidence which are so easy for anyone to figure out as being misrepresentations.

reply to post by stereologist

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Couldn't agree more.

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