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Who told the truth in the garden?

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posted on Apr, 18 2010 @ 02:56 AM
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Originally posted by faceoff85

.. true the didn't stop living that day but the did start the dying process on that very day... they lost their perfect minds and bodies and started what we know today to be "aging" so in a way gods warning was true... altough death did not set in right away the most definetely had the prospect of dying after eating

This could be a possibility.


Originally posted by faceoff85
I should apologize for setting a bad tone... its just my kids woke me up pretty early and now I feel kinda rebellious
so no offence

No problem. I have four kids and know how that is.




posted on Apr, 18 2010 @ 02:59 AM
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Originally posted by Hydroman

Originally posted by faceoff85

yeah and thanks to that science man has almost finished destroying mother earth.... not to mention our brethren or animals. long live the rule of man...

[edit on 18-4-2010 by faceoff85]

Wtf? That wasn't my post.

But also thanks to science, cures to diseases have been found. Life has been made easier, etc. It does come at a cost. Maybe one day science will find a way to go about things without hurting the environment. I guarantee you it won't be a god that fixes it.


Yeah true up to a certain point but I have a pretty depressing point of view on life in general. for one I definetely believe god is the one to fix this earth up.
And its true our current technological standard has its benefits but at the same time it has as many if not more downsides... what about the thread where they point out the poliovaccin inducing cancer for generations... or the todllers being injected with some pork-dna... those thing just make my hair stand up straight... I realize not everyone is out to kill our felow humans but for obvious reasons Im looking very long and hard at TPTB



posted on Apr, 18 2010 @ 03:03 AM
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Does anyone know how the Jews interpret the verses I presented from the hebrew writings, as far was what the death meant, and what god meant by when and how it would take place?

[edit on 18-4-2010 by Hydroman]



posted on Apr, 18 2010 @ 03:11 AM
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How can you be sure the author of Genesis got his facts straight?
After all, according to the author, he says that Man gave birth to woman. We all know it's the other way around.

Seems there are a lot of things told in reverse. I wonder why?



posted on Apr, 18 2010 @ 03:12 AM
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Originally posted by Alethea
How can you be sure the author of Genesis got his facts straight?
After all, according to the author, he says that Man gave birth to woman. We all know it's the other way around.

Seems there are a lot of things told in reverse. I wonder why?

What's more is that the author wasn't there, so how does he know how all those conversations went? Matter of fact, all through out the bible where the author wasn't actually present, how do they know how those conversations took place and what was said? Like the story of Job. How did the author know what was spoken between Satan and God wherever they were?

[edit on 18-4-2010 by Hydroman]



posted on Apr, 18 2010 @ 03:14 AM
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reply to post by Hydroman
 


uhmm... my urge to participate in this thread is to strong, I dont know the jewish p.o.v. on that specific point... I do know what the major difference between jews and christians is.... where christians believe in jesus as our saviour and the one who, through his death, made it possible for us to ask for forgiveness.... the jews dont see jesus this way... and where the jews think of christ as a physical warrior destined to lead them to victory in a coming holy war the christians dont believe jesus will return, instead christians are meant to go see jesus in heaven. the christians and jews are bound to differ in opinions on more occasions but these are the most drastic of them....



posted on Apr, 18 2010 @ 03:18 AM
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reply to post by Alethea
 


well not quite... the bible never speaks of adam giving birth to eve... instead it says god made adam from dust in their (heavenly creatures) own likening.... hence all the humanoid alien sightings allover the world (the plot thickens) then the bible continues and says adam was lonely so god ripped out a rib and formed eve out of that rib... hence the reason man misses 1 rib compared to women (I'm not sure about this being fact and im to lasy right now to check, please correct me if im wrong caus that would be an eye-opener for me)

[edit on 18-4-2010 by faceoff85]



posted on Apr, 18 2010 @ 03:18 AM
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Originally posted by faceoff85

the jews dont see jesus this way... and where the jews think of christ as a physical warrior destined to lead them to victory in a coming holy war ...

Have you ever studied to see why the Jews don't believe Jesus was the messiah? It's pretty interesting.



posted on Apr, 18 2010 @ 03:20 AM
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reply to post by Hydroman
 

I havent gone indept... guess I should study up since its interesting to me.... know any good sources to start of? my bookshelve isn't really up to date in jewish literature



posted on Apr, 18 2010 @ 03:21 AM
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Originally posted by faceoff85
... hence the reason man misses 1 rib compared to women (I'm not sure about this being fact and im to lasy right now to check, please correct me if im wrong caus that would be an eye-opener for me)

[edit on 18-4-2010 by faceoff85]

This is from a christian site saying that men do not have fewer ribs than women.

www.creationtips.com...



posted on Apr, 18 2010 @ 03:23 AM
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Originally posted by faceoff85
reply to post by Hydroman
 

I havent gone indept... guess I should study up since its interesting to me.... know any good sources to start of? my bookshelve isn't really up to date in jewish literature


www.aish.com...



posted on Apr, 18 2010 @ 03:25 AM
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Originally posted by Hydroman

Originally posted by faceoff85
... hence the reason man misses 1 rib compared to women (I'm not sure about this being fact and im to lasy right now to check, please correct me if im wrong caus that would be an eye-opener for me)

[edit on 18-4-2010 by faceoff85]

This is from a christian site saying that men do not have fewer ribs than women.

www.creationtips.com...


hahaha thanx alot for ruining my faith
always good to get the facts
straight... thanx
will look into that other site you gave me.. so what is yor take on faith... you mentioned you used to believe... care to elaborate on that?

[edit on 18-4-2010 by faceoff85]



posted on Apr, 18 2010 @ 03:27 AM
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Originally posted by faceoff85


hahaha thanx alot for ruining my faith
always good to get the facts straight... thanx

Why would that ruin your faith? There's better things out there that can do that for you, lol.



posted on Apr, 18 2010 @ 03:33 AM
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Originally posted by Hydroman
Wtf? That wasn't my post.

But also thanks to science, cures to diseases have been found. Life has been made easier, etc. It does come at a cost. Maybe one day science will find a way to go about things without hurting the environment. I guarantee you it won't be a god that fixes it.


That was actually my post the poster was quoting.

I agree that science has made life easier for Man, but like many other things, science can also be abused and can also be used to harm man.

Sure, science has given us medicines that can cure diseases, but it's also given us medicines that have intentionally created even more dangerous diseases.
If you can think of science as Evil, under the guise of Good, then you can understand why it indeed the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil.
We are talking about how Man has been conned and continues to be mislead.
The serpent knew exactly what he was doing, just like the big pharma folks know exactly what they are doing.

Ever wonder why the medical symbol includes snakes?


btw, why are you expecting God to fix the environment he created for, yet has been destroyed by, Man?



posted on Apr, 18 2010 @ 03:35 AM
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Originally posted by Hydroman

Originally posted by faceoff85


hahaha thanx alot for ruining my faith
always good to get the facts straight... thanx

Why would that ruin your faith? There's better things out there that can do that for you, lol.


I've always felt there are tons of ways to get to the point where you find it unrealistic to believe in a "creator scenario" but yeah since the bible warns of exactly that I've taken the stance of hypocritcally holding onto my faith while reading things that would normally confuse me... after all the bible is just another book... but the prospect of what the bible promises kinda convinced me to put my money on the bible... in my point of view the bible offers a win-win situation... if its true then following its advice can grant you me and anyone else trying their best a morally clean life and the prospect of eternal life in paradise with all the bliss you can imagine... if it is false you'd still be left with a morally clean life wich I find to be a virtue...



posted on Apr, 18 2010 @ 03:35 AM
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Originally posted by Alxandro


Ever wonder why the medical symbol includes snakes?


btw, why are you expecting God to fix the environment he created for, yet has been destroyed by, Man?


I always thought the intertwining snakes was a symbol for a strand of dna. Moses even used the snake symbol to bring healing. Remember that?

Why did god send a flood to fix things when man had messed things up?



posted on Apr, 18 2010 @ 03:51 AM
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reply to post by Alxandro
 


I can see where you're coming from and your point of view makes sence... props..
the reason I believe god will come to our aid is based on what the bible says... I realize 90% of the folks will fall back now but that book is kind-off my survival-guide... the teaching I take out of the bible (note the choice of words
) should be summarized due to space restriction and boils down to this... it has told us way in advance of the circumstances of the end times... I find that we live in those times.. but the bible isn't all doom and gloom, it promises a salvation but not in the way the mainstream has heard of... it tells us god will stop the rule of man and appoint jesus as our king for about 1000 years... its good to note the bible calls the last phase before the end of the rule of man "the time of great tribulation". this would be the times in wich TPTB will try to ban all existing religions. the bible then says that at the moment when gods "true" followers will be targeted it will be done... thats when man will fall and the kingdom of the heavens will rise... this will be followed by a 1000 year period wich will mark the time of recuperation of mother earth and man's growth back to their former perfect self as god had planned with adam and eve... people who died will be resurected. after this 1000 year period of peace the serpent would be given another chance to spread havoc... after this the serpent would permanently be shut up and eternal peace will begin....
The overall theme of this should be called "the separating of the sheep (gods righteous followers) and the ram? (the people who didn't heed the warning).
This summarizes my faith and actually contains bits of jewish faith and christian faith.

Now I find this all to be quite a reach out there... but... my alternative is to just live out my life and die... I guess I wont lose much if it all turns out to be false....



posted on Apr, 18 2010 @ 04:01 AM
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Originally posted by Hydroman

Originally posted by Alxandro


Ever wonder why the medical symbol includes snakes?


btw, why are you expecting God to fix the environment he created for, yet has been destroyed by, Man?


I always thought the intertwining snakes was a symbol for a strand of dna. Moses even used the snake symbol to bring healing. Remember that?

Why did god send a flood to fix things when man had messed things up?


Im curious to the explanation of that symbol although I believe I've heard it before..

but about the flood... it wasn't just man who screwed things up... the fallen angels in that time had taken women and bore kids... the herculesses or nephilims... they were men of renown anyway... but the bible describes those times as being quite bad... murder and rape were quite common... there was alot of godlesness. And if we were to take the book of enoch to be true man actually learned alot of forbidden techniques back then from those fallen angels... astrology, the cutting of herbs (drugs?), spells, the forging of weapons, making war and enoch even mentions make-up and similar atributes to be things god found detestable... quite an interesting book although i have doubts about its authenticity... you should also remember god gave those people a chance and 40 years time (wich probably had the oposite effect as us humans tend to think quite short-term) to escape the flood.

I have my opinion established quite well but I trust being here on ATS will keep me with 2 feet on the ground... in that sence I am relying on my fellowposters...


[edit on 18-4-2010 by faceoff85]



posted on Apr, 18 2010 @ 04:15 AM
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reply to post by Jean Paul Zodeaux
 



What Satan, apparently, failed to inform both Adam and Eve of, was that neither one of them were likely equipped to handle the knowledge of good and evil. Possessing knowledge does not make one equipped to deal with such knowledge


Although they aren't an official book of the Bible, The Books of Adam and Eve showed very clearly their total incompetence in looking after themselves and surviving outside of the Garden of Eden.
It's very interesting reading on what happened after they were expelled.

The lack of knowledge of good and evil was taken advantage of by Satan as they were now far from Gods sight and far from his councel.

Your post just reminded me to get the books out and read them again.

Back on topic, it's always been clear to me that Satan was the liar.





[edit on 18-4-2010 by Flighty]



posted on Apr, 18 2010 @ 04:58 AM
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reply to post by Flighty
 



I have long felt that the "fall from grace" or "expulsion from the Garden" was misinterpreted and told as a cautionary tale of disobeying God's word. Indeed, I recently started my own thread making such an argument:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

That both Adam and Eve were ill equipped to handle the knowledge of good and evil seems rather evident. That they chose to do so anyway is another issue entirely.



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