Can Africans Govern Themselves In The Modern World?

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posted on Apr, 18 2010 @ 01:40 PM
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reply to post by Flighty
 

Totally agree , let them lead themselves , don't start the whole white colonial cycle again.

It's been my idea to stop giving aid and donations to the corrupt governments and set up distribution stations at U.N warehouses or unions to distribute the aid and donation directly to the people. There should also be An oversight committee half donators , half U.N that makes sure the goods go where their needed to the poor and destitute and people who truelly want to make their country better. It may not be the best solution and I invite others to offer a better solution other than apartheid.

I agree also the Globalists should not force the world to pay a tax cuz Africa is going through "growing pains" in an imperfect world. That's all these greedy Globalists sobs love to do force us to pay taxes for the least little , fixable problem.

Yes , responsibility for themselves. But when people do donate there should be accountability and consequences for pilfering and squandering aid and donations to the worst off.

Hey , if their happy living in huts with dirt floors then so be it. There are still tribes in south america and south east asia that do.

Personal responsibility and owning our actions are something that ALL people are expected to do. The same standards DO apply to EVERYONE else. Black leaders need to take responsibility for their actions as much as white/asian leaders for theirs.





[edit on 18-4-2010 by De La Valletta]




posted on Apr, 18 2010 @ 01:55 PM
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Running a country the way us Westerners think a country should be run requires certain types of education and training. This type of training is not available to most of us whites, which is why we couldnt govern ourselves if left to ourselves. Africa is currently even further away from the education and training needed for running a modern country.

But given the right information, anyone could govern themselves. I dont buy the idea of "blacks cant govern because they are of inferiour intelligence" as some of you are secretly thinking.

Give any uneducated white a country to run and the same things would happen.

[edit on 18-4-2010 by Skyfloating]



posted on Apr, 18 2010 @ 02:20 PM
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reply to post by Skyfloating
 


If Africa wasn't ready for independence then they shouldn't have pushed for it until they were.

And someone mentioned OBAMA in this thread. Maybe he could've made a huge difference by entering politics in Kenya and helping those people out with his education and upbringing like his father tried to do?

If the educated don't return and help their own, then what chance will Africa ever have?


[edit on 18-4-2010 by Flighty]



posted on Apr, 18 2010 @ 02:40 PM
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reply to post by Flighty
 




If Africa wasn't ready for independence then they shouldn't have pushed for it until they were.


Slavery , racism and oppression can be some mean motivators. I'm sure many here would have fought tooth and nail to , if it was them and theirs.

Maybe kenya doesn't give the perks that being president of the U.S does.



posted on Apr, 18 2010 @ 03:48 PM
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Originally posted by joey_hv
reply to post by hinky
 

I believe he makes his point quite clear. He believes, as do I, that blacks cannot govern themselves.
His words:

"Give a black man a leadership opportunity and instead of working his black ass off for his people all he thinks is about enriching his immediate family at the expense of the public. "



I am leery of any thread which begins by declaring it is not racist, because it inevitably is.

See the above posts.

I rest my case.

Good day.




[edit on 4/18/2010 by ladyinwaiting]



posted on Apr, 18 2010 @ 03:55 PM
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reply to post by ladyinwaiting
 

Ma'm, I was quoting from the article which is in the OP. Obviously you didn't read it. It was written by a black man.



posted on Apr, 18 2010 @ 03:58 PM
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Ahhhhhhh! This post anger's me so much, lol, all I can do is just laugh and walk away. Go build some walls around your home's and hide, then sit there and wait for the "Africans" and "Middle Easterners" to come and kill you.



posted on Apr, 18 2010 @ 04:23 PM
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Originally posted by LifeIsEnergy
Ahhhhhhh! This post anger's me so much, lol, all I can do is just laugh and walk away. Go build some walls around your home's and hide, then sit there and wait for the "Africans" and "Middle Easterners" to come and kill you.
So you have nothiing to add to the conversation concerning the inability of black people to govern themselves or anyone?



posted on Apr, 18 2010 @ 04:25 PM
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reply to post by joey_hv
 




Neither I nor anyone in my immediate family is racist. I am half Mexican half Caucasian and have many black friends and date blacks without any problems.


I am 25% Heinz 57 and proud of it. I have tried to date one of everything, including Mexicans, and loved it.

But I ask you this:

With the number of Mexican revolutions and revolts in the last 1.5 century, and now the chaos on the border with the southern U.S, can you not ask the same question about Mexicans? People die there every day in numbers and horror we (many of us) cannot imagine. Can that be called governing, since it seems to be an ongoing cycle of revolution & violence?

Since you claim Mexican ancestry, you might want to look a little closer to home.



posted on Apr, 18 2010 @ 04:31 PM
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reply to post by 1SawSomeThings
 

With regards to Mexican vs blacks governing.
Mexico earthquake 7.2, deaths 2
Haiti earthquake 7.0, deaths 200,000
www.abovetopsecret.com...

difference is building standards imposed by the government.

case rested...



posted on Apr, 18 2010 @ 04:45 PM
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reply to post by joey_hv
 




difference is building standards imposed by the government.

case rested...


You may be right, cardboard and plywood don't fall as heavily as concrete...

[edit on 18-4-2010 by 1SawSomeThings]



posted on Apr, 18 2010 @ 05:10 PM
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reply to post by joey_hv
 


www.abovetopsecret.com...

This is a related thread. I believe that the only hope Africa ever had could have been if MLK or Malcom could have went there. Their leadership MIGHT have made a difference and got these folks on track. These two were strong leaders AND honest (hence, why they are dead).

We'll never know.

Regretably, most of Africa is little more than primative. That is earning them exploitation from outside influence AND their own people working for the outside influence.

yeah. i also realize that they have "some parts" that may be quite "metropolitan". Your average african will NEVER be in a position to get into a middle class position to enjoy this though.



posted on Apr, 18 2010 @ 06:04 PM
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The Republic of Botswana has shown there is countries in Africa that can develop and show a strong democratic mind as well as a very mixed type of people. Offcourse one of the reasons they do greater than nabour countries is tha fact that the population is only 1,990,876. But then again around 70 % is covered by the kalhari desert, but still. And there are 53 countries! We talk about africa as if there only was a handful of countries but we know very little about this continent. I think Africa is the future because so much raw material is still untouched.



posted on Apr, 18 2010 @ 06:23 PM
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Originally posted by joey_hv
reply to post by hinky
 

I believe he makes his point quite clear. He believes, as do I, that blacks cannot govern themselves.
His words:

"Give a black man a leadership opportunity and instead of working his black ass off for his people all he thinks is about enriching his immediate family at the expense of the public. "


[edit on 18-4-2010 by joey_hv]


Now we have made that leap from the abstract to the outlandish. You and him have thrown Africa out of the mix by using Haiti in examples.

There are thousands of examples of city councilmen, mayors, Congressmen, Senators, Governors, and even a President that have done outstanding work in Governance. The US military has thousands of examples of leaders from generals to lowly privates.

What the author has done is something most black Africans can not do. He received a formal education in the US and then stayed in the US fulfilling his own words.

He should have went back to his native Nigeria and used his education there in the betterment of his people. He is nothing more than a hypocrite.

While Europe shed their colonies in the 1950's and 1960's which seem so long ago, it is within my lifetime. You have first generations of black Africans that have limited or no education in positions of power from various means. The people who were fortunate to receive an education be it in the USA or Europe, have used that education only to better themselves.

This isn't just a black thing, there are countless examples of all other racial groups doing this very same thing in the USA. You just don't see it published as a hate article and passed off as legitimate news.

Now this brings us to you and your agreement of his views. You're just racist but trying to defend an indefensible position. You don't see it this way and that's fine.

Any further response just proves the point, but I'm game.



posted on Apr, 18 2010 @ 07:12 PM
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Interesting thread. And not in a good way...

So, let me see if I understand what the OP is saying... Africa is being seen as unable to govern itself because they do not govern themselves as the US has been governed? The US is being used as the "gold standard" of governance? Is that what I'm reading? With corporations getting away with murder, the top 1% of the people owning 90% of the wealth, genetically modified food, The FDA approving dangerous, deadly drugs and making harmless ones illegal, the FED robbing us blind, crappy health care, dirty air, arsenic in the water, two wars against innocent people on a "Mission from God", a trashed economy.... THIS is what's being held as a government to which Africa should aspire?

And who got us here? White guys!


Originally posted by drwizardphd
I am beginning to think (flame shield: go!) that the entire purpose of this thread was to devolve into the argument that Obama is not fit to lead because he is "black".


I'm pretty sure that was the singular purpose of the thread. To relate Africa's failure to govern itself to the color of its people's skin, so that this "lack of ability to govern" could be translated across the ocean to our black president.
From the OP:


Originally posted by joey_hv
I recently read an article that made me start looking further into this subject and considering the way Obama is governing us into the third world I am starting to believe that the writer may be right.


Disclaimer or not, that's pretty transparent.


Originally posted by joey_hv
I agree, it is a difficult thing to face but, there is some races that cannot govern themselves. Blacks and Middle Easterners are two.


I assume that you do not include Israel as a country that can't govern itself. And since Israel is in the Middle East, I assume that instead of "Middle Easterners", you really mean Muslims. Or maybe you mean Arabs? If so, what about Iran, whose population is only 3% Arab? Do you approve of the way they govern? What race is "Middle Eastern"? Or did you mean Muslims, which is a RELIGION.

Or is this just a convenient way to suggest that Obama is a black secret Muslim and that is why our country is in such bad shape?

Yeah. Pretty clear.



posted on Apr, 18 2010 @ 07:18 PM
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reply to post by De La Valletta
 




if their happy living in huts with dirt floors then so be it.


And this, I think, is an important point.

With "modern civilization" comes traffic, pollution, debt, dangerous food additives, 40-hour workweeks, bankruptcy...so many unpleasant things that don't exist when you live in a mud hut and hunt. Maybe blacks aren't equipped to deal with "modern" society, or maybe they simply don't want to live in one.

It doesn't matter. For us to come in and impose our way of life on them is not doing them a favor.

Leave them be.



posted on Apr, 18 2010 @ 07:42 PM
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Originally posted by LordBucket
reply to post by joey_hv
 




disclaimer

Neither I nor anyone in my immediate family is racist. I am half Mexican half
Caucasian and have many black friends and date blacks without any problems.


Ok. Here's my disclaimer:

I'm a blatant racist, and I have no black or mexican friends because I don't like them.

There you go.



time to ask ourselves whether Africans can really
govern themselves in the modern world.


It's none of our business whether they can govern themselves in africa. And who are we to decide whether they're capable? Its their land, they live there not us, and it's up to them to decide for themselves how they want to live.



Give a black man a leadership opportunity and instead of working his black ass off for
his people all he thinks is about enriching his immediate family at the expense of the public.


That may be true. But it doesn't matter. It's basically reasonable for people of like mind to live together in the manner of their choosing. It is not your place to tell them how to live. It is not your place to "give them opportunities" they don't want or to decide what is proper for them based on your own standards.

It's perfectly fine for you to decide for yourself whether you want to live the way they do, but "taking pity" on someone who has no interest in your ideals and taking control, "civilizing them" against their wishes and compelling them to live by your criteria is not the answer.

Give them space. Let them do their own thing. They don't need us.

Judge what is proper and correct for yourself. Not what is proper and correct for others.

[edit on 17-4-2010 by LordBucket]


You know what?

Your absolutely correct! While I would like to see those people get their act together.....

IT IS THEIR ACT TO GET TOGETHER!

the western civilized nations just need to stop immigration from these backward areas. You have disease, lack of education, and a fairly large cultural jump to overcome just to have them assimilate.



posted on Apr, 18 2010 @ 08:29 PM
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reply to post by LordBucket
 


Not generalizing ALL blacks just saying the ones that want a hut , they can have one and if they want urban sprawl they can have that to. As black people have lived in walled cities also for thousands of years from black civilizations like Ancient Khemet (Kemetian name for egypt) , Nubia , Carthage , Ethiopia etc and are still living in , building brick or concrete houses today and living quite large in them e.i P.DIDDY , OPRAH , COBY BRYANT. Again black people are people too , they built stoned cities , palaces and ports too , long before the European and the Islamic Umma invasion of africa.

There's nothing to stop them from functioning well in a cement , brick or glass and steel modern city , but if they fancy a hut (which I doubt most black people do if they can AFFORD to) , hey what's wrong with a good ol eco friendly and affordable hut.
certainly beats a cardboard box.


[edit on 18-4-2010 by De La Valletta]



posted on Apr, 18 2010 @ 08:47 PM
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Originally posted by De La Valletta
reply to post by LordBucket
 

e.i P.DIDDY , OPRAH , COBY BRYANT.

an entertainer, a loudmouth and an athlete...yeah, great examples of black leaders that can govern...


back to the topic of this thread:
BLACKS CANNOT AND SHOULD NOT GOVERN THEMSELVES.

EVERY TIME THEY TRY IT FAILS.

THEY LOOK AT ENRICHING THEMSELVES AND NOT THE BETTERMENT OF THEIR COUNTRY.

NO RACISM INVOLVED HERE JUST FACTS.

of course you can pull the racist card and use it like other folks do thinking it will end the discussion but inside they know the truth is the truth and it cannot be denied.



posted on Apr, 18 2010 @ 10:07 PM
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reply to post by joey_hv
 

Do you even read the posts? I never said they were examples of leadership. In my reply to lord bucket I was merely illustrating that black people , like everyone else can live in modern stressful cities and thrive , have any of these people ran for government , no , at least not that I know of. It doesn't take any magic "white power" to live in a city or build one , anyone can , and black people have done it themselves for thousands of years , in cities built by their own civilizations (khemet , Nubia , Carthage , Ethiopia , Numidia etc).





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