Voted for McCain? We would be at war with Iran by now

Originally posted by tothetenthpower
You know..on second thought, I agree with you. I can see how McCain would have picked up the rhetoric far earlier than Obama would have, or has.

I don't think it would have mattered. The R's had no control over setting the agenda in congress. The L/R paradigm would have prevented any coming together between McCain and congress on the subject of war. They would have come together on every other tax and spend agenda but he would not have had his way on starting a war with Iran. I still think Obama has a higher chance of making that come true due to the follow your leader attitude in Washington. It is not a representative government as SaturnFX wants us to believe. It is a club. You get voted in and you do what your told or you get kicked out. That is why ideas like GOOOH are so important in order to reestablish true representation.

I think that even with McCain, we wouldn't go to war with Iran; at least not yet...our military is spread too thin and that would certainly put moral at an all time low. However, the rhetoric that would be coming from McCain would certainly leave us in a precarious position and may cause Iran to make the first strike...even if that first strike is on Israel, since US soil is out of their reach.

Either way, a vote for Obama (at least mine) was a vote for no more new wars and a ramping down of troops in Iraq and Afghanistan.

I'm disappointed in him over Afghanistan. I wish he would bring our troops home, as we have pressing domestic issues that are more important than "cave men".

Originally posted by tothetenthpower
reply to post by SaturnFX

 

You know..on second thought, I agree with you.

Welcome to the darkside

Originally posted by Aggie Man
I'm disappointed in him over Afghanistan. I wish he would bring our troops home, as we have pressing domestic issues that are more important than "cave men".

Obama ran on a campaign of fueling more troops into Afghanistan though...he was pretty clear on that from the get-go.
He said we lost focus of our mission and target by going to Iraq and he promised to put a end to Iraq within his term. He then said 18 months when he took the reins, but most said that was going to be impractical, and it was...we are coming up to that mark in 4 months and no doubt we will still have feet on the ground there...but they are now all but stuck in bunkers sitting there doing nothing.

The concept was to surge Afghanistan, train troops, and eventually get out...problem is, the cavemen are too corrupt and unruly for a western style democracy...and installing a dictator to rule the masses worked not so well when we put Saddam in charge of Iraq.

-add: To solve the problems in Afghanistan overnight...give every woman over there a gun. Let them rule.


[edit on 17-4-2010 by SaturnFX]

reply to post by SaturnFX


I couldn't agree more, John McCain is a train wreck waiting to happen. He reminds me of a duck flying in the fog, he goes wherever the wind blows him.

To be quite honest, IMO McCain has never been very good at anything he's ever done. I certainly wouldn't crawl into and airplane with him behind the stick, would you?

Originally posted by Flatfish
I certainly wouldn't crawl into and airplane with him behind the stick, would you?

I would in a second, but I am quite the avid skydiver, so its just another chance to go jumping.

I actually like McCain circa 2000. I think things would have been alot more calm with him as POTUS verses Junior, but meh...such is life.

Originally posted by SaturnFX
Obama ran on a campaign of fueling more troops into Afghanistan though...he was pretty clear on that from the get-go.

Yeah, I know...but I was hoping that would be a campaign promise he wouldn't keep.

-add: To solve the problems in Afghanistan overnight...give every woman over there a gun. Let them rule.

Agreed! However, I think the women over there are so brainwashed into obedience that they would immediately turn over the guns and control back to the men.

Originally posted by Aggie Man
Yeah, I know...but I was hoping that would be a campaign promise he wouldn't keep.

I wish he had because he is not exactly doing a bang-up job what with having the elected leader of the country threating to join with the Taliban according to the New York Times.

You're all aware we can't win in Afghanistan, right?

We're not facing a group. We're not facing an army. We're facing an ideology. An ideology heavily invested in religious convictions. They are by all means religious-warriors, regardless of whether you think they are or not. Shock and awe won't work. Propaganda won't work.

"You can't kill an idea." - V for Vendetta

Besides, any historically savvy individual knows it's the graveyard of empires. Lets look at exactly the game plan of all these empires thus far.

British:

1. Kill savages
2. ???
3. Drink Tea

Russians:

1. Kill mujahideen
2. ???
3. Drink Vodka

Americans:

1. Kill terrorists
2. ???
3. Drink Beer


If anyone hasn't noticed, IT CAN'T BE DONE.

reply to post by SaturnFX

Uh, yeah. I would rather go to war with Iran than deal with Hussein Obama for one more day. I would rather go into debt with actions towards an aggressor than pay for medical coverage for illegal aliens and unemployed any day. Locked and loaded here. I'm pretty sure the rest of the 60% of america who didn't want this overhaul feels the same way.

Originally posted by minigunner
reply to post by SaturnFX

 

Uh, yeah. I would rather go to war with Iran than deal with Hussein Obama for one more day. I would rather go into debt with actions towards an aggressor than pay for medical coverage for illegal aliens and unemployed any day. Locked and loaded here. I'm pretty sure the rest of the 60% of america who didn't want this overhaul feels the same way.

While I'm vehemently against Obama and much of what he has done, if you're okay with starting another stupid war that will kill tens of thousands of people, and waste billions and billions of dollars, you're sick in the head.

Originally posted by lpowell0627
What McCain said is that if we are not prepared to do anything, we have no business threatening that we are going to.

That to me, makes sense. Let's face it, if you can't back up threats with actions, you lose all credibility and the next time you threaten, nobody takes you seriously.

I can't believe you just trivialised the past 50 years of North Korean foreign policy like that.

Or Frances.

It's simply appalling. If you can't threaten action without backing it up NATO would become largely irrelevant. Many nations would lose their deterrent and the very fabric of world geopolitics would collapse.

McCain would have us in Iran eh? A commanding Democratic Congress would not of allowed it. Oh wait... This sounds like...

I am NOT, a Democrat nor a Republican. I am a Right Leaning Independent who did not support McCain nor Obama during the fo-lection. I think we are being led around by our noses by the men behind the curtain.

A primary reason I don't think Iran has been invaded is that the terrain is some of the toughest on Earth. Crap, wait a second, so was/is Afgahistan! I do not think it is due to be "stretched too thin. That is a myth. We have more then enough man power and equipment to attack. It is the sustaining and occupying that is a mystery yet to be truly unlocked. I'm sure some geeks in a smoke filled room are attempting to decrypt that problem right now though.

In relation and response to the topic though, I do not think we would be at war had McCain gotten in. Public opposition would not have dictated it. I know, it's hard to say that with a straight face since they are so in tune with public opinion in Sodom D.C.

Originally posted by SaturnFX


Some ask why Obama was elected...consider the alternative.

To have war with the former USSR countries which you guys are losing one by one as we speak, to fire up war and tensions in the Mediterranean. To destroy Greek economy. To let Turkey slip away in to Islam, to destroy their economy too (that's 80 millions of future Islamists right next to Europe). To let Israel out of its leash threatening global peace and nuclear proliferation treaties. To help German fundamentalism destroy the Euro and EU.To fire up Islamic fundamentalism worldwide and ultimately have a civil war in America and kill each other. Thus the problem will be solving itself.

NICE PRESIDENT MAN! WAY TO GO THERE!

He is probably on the works to help a new rise to Nazism in Europe, after recent screw up of the global economy, which is too your of own governments making, Nazism is not that far away. A black president, a liberal? Who would have thank it!? That's how the TPB works anyway, they first sell you cheap smoke and mirrors.

[edit on 17-4-2010 by spacebot]

reply to post by spacebot


I agree with you, with the minor exception that everything you stated is void of any factual base whatsoever and points to corporate stranglehold pushed forth by the bush administration.

But...I like how the text you wrote bumped the thread...so at least you did that to contribute to the thread. Rational, sane thinking people will know to take your satire for what it is.

Anyhow, keep it up...and thanks for the bump

What makes anyone think that one puppets foreign policy (Obama) is going to be different than the others (McCain) ??

Presidents have some leeway in certain domestic issues, however foreign policy regarding wars are planned decades in advance.

Most of congress dances to the whip of the "main stream media" because it can easily make or break their next election in normal years. Getting Congress to consent to war has been easy in the past.

Look at Zbigniew Brzezinski's book "The Grand Chessboard" written 10 years ago which mirrors what is happening today. The middle east is the pawn, Eurasia is the prize. Do you see why Russia/China are getting nervous ?

McCain lost on purpose because he knew the job detail would eventually become "Traitor in Chief" i.e. - destroying U.S. sovereignty. Plus Obama is a much better liar (actor) than McCain, so that probably won him favoritism by the globalists. Oligarchs (globalists) love elections it gives the illusion of free choice.

Coincidentally Zbigniew was an influential advisor to Obama's campaign.
Coincidentally Kissinger was an influential advisor to McLames campaign.


Coincidentally I VOTED FOR NEITHER.




[edit on 17-4-2010 by zzombie]

reply to post by minigunner


The thing is Iran isnt really an aggressor.. Iran isnt really a threat to the US or anyone at the present time, they have a nuclear program yes, so does Israel. who is more of a threat out of the two, Israel doesnt even reveal anything about their nuclear program to anyone. Israel is more likely to either bomb Iran or stage a false flag in order to start the war.

Originally posted by spacebot

Originally posted by SaturnFX


Some ask why Obama was elected...consider the alternative.

To let Turkey slip away in to Islam, to destroy their economy too (that's 80 millions of future Islamists right next to Europe).

Now hang on a second. what are you implying with this statement? that all those people are going to turn into radical islamists and go on to blow up cities all over europe..

Originally posted by zzombie
Look at Zbigniew Brzezinski's book "The Grand Chessboard" written 10 years ago which mirrors what is happening today. The middle east is the pawn, Eurasia is the prize.

Your right to look at the more broad plans, which is why I tried to bring attention to PNAC with my original post...hopeing some would educate themselves.

Things were going fantastically for the initial roadmap to conquering...step by step, everything was being uncovered.
The elections of 2006, which lost the neocon agenda started railroading the map, and 2008 completely eliminated any furthering of the steps that was otherwise going unchallenged.

They since have reworded things, but the core is still there...now trying to re-establish the goal, but knowing things are going disasterously since they are out of power.

I think some presidents are little more than puppets for the erm...illuminati (if you want to call them that), and once in awhile, the people win and get a few seasons of a true president that punches TPTB in the face...this is of course when they (TPTB) go into overdrive into a pseudo-patriotism populist movement starting from a "grassroots" perspective to get people back into fearful unthinking mindsets again.

A few moments looking at the state of the country and world is clearly showing this, if you spend a few minutes researching the pretty transparent links between movements and money that pushes the movement.

Woow...

There is no left or right... Just stop adding to the production and ignore them both.