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End of Times is Here

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posted on Apr, 15 2010 @ 08:42 PM
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reply to post by On the Edge
 


It's called editing. The story of Jesus could have been edited numerous times before it was written down and anyone discovered the documents. They could have easily added in the elements that match up with prophecy to help support their case that Jesus was the Messiah.

Considering that we have no unbiased historic documents to tell us how Jesus's life and ministry really played out as they were happening (we have second hand accounts) it is more likely the story has been embellished and altered to fit the prophecy and add supernatural elements.

Edit to Add: Because this is more or less off topic please do not respond to this post in this thread but write me directly via U2U.

[edit on 15-4-2010 by Titen-Sxull]




posted on Apr, 15 2010 @ 08:56 PM
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Originally posted by Titen-Sxull
. . .
Lot's of people believe this is the end times, from multiples faiths but the fact is that every generation has believed it would be the last. Every generation there are dates put forward for when the world will end, people make careers on making world ending predictions and they bring all sorts of new age nonsense and religious prophecy in to support their ideas.


Once again . . . none of those generations had all the pieces of the puzzle in play like we do.


The fact of the matter remains that no one knows when the world will end and no one knows how. You can claim otherwise, you can claim its all in the Bible but that doesn't make it true no more than any other prophecy is true.


Really? The Bible has a fantastic record with prophecy.


My problem with end times prophecy is that they are all vague or nonsensical. In Revelation you've got half-lion half-scorpion half-locusts torturing people (yes I know i put 3 halves) and giant horsemen riding around and a supposedly merciful God giving angels permission to torment and kill people.


You try to describe something that you saw 2000+ years into the future. Then we will see how people 2000 years into the future are confused by what you are trying to describe.


Then at the end of Revelation you have a supposedly merciful God throwing billions into a lake of fire to burn FOREVER with no chance of escape and it claims that Magicians and Cowards will be among those burned (so David Blaine and anyone who's ever run from a fight will go to Hell apparently)...


God, above all is just. Yes, he is merciful. But mercy can last only so long.


You see it makes no sense so there's no reason to put any faith in it. Besides it doesn't even offer a time frame for itself, we have no idea when any of that stuff is supposed to happen.


Yeah it does. Study more.


The final nail in the coffin is that those in power, TPTB can manipulate world events to make it APPEAR that prophecy is coming to pass and if they do that they can easily sway and manipulate believers.



You give TPTB way too much credit. And even if that were the case . . . a self fulfilling type prophecy is still a fulfilled prophecy. God works through good men and evil men, as the Bible often shows us.


So I see no real reason to believe that the end is near.


That is your choice. While I do not agree with your choice, I respect your wishes to have that belief as your choice, though I would urge you to study some more.



posted on Apr, 15 2010 @ 09:12 PM
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Well, I have been studying prophecy for a number of years now and I think I got the prophesies that puts a definitive date on the Apocalypse.

After a study of Leviticus 26 and the book of Hosea along with Malachi I think I have a specific date when it's all over with. Combine that with the generation prophesy of Matthew 24 it would seem that the spring of 2028 is the approximate date of the reign of the saints.

So to start with in Matthew 24 Jesus Christ says that some of the generation being born at the time of the first end time event will see it's end. And the rebirth of Israel in 1948 qualifies as a end time event per the prophesies of Ezekiel. That would mean according to Psalms 90 it should be all over with by 2028. 80 years at a maximum.

The next series of prophesies deal with what I call the curse of Malachi.
Here's the curse.

Malachi 4
5 Behold, I will send you Elijah the prophet before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the LORD:
6 And he shall turn the heart of the fathers to the children, and the heart of the children to their fathers, lest I come and smite the earth with a curse.

And Jesus Christ himself claimed that his John the Baptist was Elijah. Which means that when Herod killed John he triggered the curse. And it took a bit of searching but I was able to piece together the curse. To understand it you need to have a understanding of Leviticus 26 to start with.

Essentially Judaism is a legal contract. In exchange for your worship and fealty God agrees to grant a number of benefits. But break the rules and He imposes punishments. And according to the book of Hosea he threw the book at the Jews.

To start with.
Hosea chap 3.
4 For the children of Israel shall abide many days without a king, and without a prince, and without a sacrifice, and without an image, and without an ephod, and without teraphim:
5 Afterward shall the children of Israel return, and seek the LORD their God, and David their king; and shall fear the LORD and his goodness in the latter days.

And then it gets worse.
Hosea 5
13 When Ephraim saw his sickness, and Judah saw his wound, then went Ephraim to the Assyrian, and sent to king Jareb: yet could he not heal you, nor cure you of your wound.
14 For I will be unto Ephraim as a lion, and as a young lion to the house of Judah: I, even I, will tear and go away; I will take away, and none shall rescue him.
15 I will go and return to my place, till they acknowledge their offence, and seek my face: in their affliction they will seek me early.

Chap 13
7 Therefore I will be unto them as a lion: as a leopard by the way will I observe them:
8 I will meet them as a bear that is bereaved of her whelps, and will rend the caul of their heart, and there will I devour them like a lion: the wild beast shall tear them.

But there is the promise of a future redemption.
Chap 1
10 Yet the number of the children of Israel shall be as the sand of the sea, which cannot be measured nor numbered; and it shall come to pass, that in the place where it was said unto them, Ye are not my people, there it shall be said unto them, Ye are the sons of the living God.
11 Then shall the children of Judah and the children of Israel be gathered together, and appoint themselves one head, and they shall come up out of the land: for great shall be the day of Jezreel.

So what is the deal here? Well. The book of Hosea has the time frame of the curse.

Chap 6
1 Come, and let us return unto the LORD: for he hath torn, and he will heal us; he hath smitten, and he will bind us up.
2 After two days will he revive us: in the third day he will raise us up, and we shall live in his sight.
3 Then shall we know, if we follow on to know the LORD: his going forth is prepared as the morning; and he shall come unto us as the rain, as the latter and former rain unto the earth.

So what is the deal with the 3 days? Those days are in the presence of God. According to Psalms 90 those days are thousand year periods of time. The curse of Malachi is 2000 years long followed by a thousand year day of Jezreel.

And 2000 years from the death of John the Baptist is in the 2020's

And there is 2 prophesies on the dates of the Apocalypse.

[edit on 15-4-2010 by ntech]



posted on Apr, 15 2010 @ 09:14 PM
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some say the bible is the word of god. others that if man copied it down or was inspired to write it, it would be full of mistakes.

if its the word of god, has it been altered?
consider the following;- it is said in revelations? somewhere that if anyone alters the bible the plagues mentioned in it will be experienced by him or her.
if that is true, then perhaps it has happened. someone altered it, they died of some plague, and it remained altered. you'd never know.

that being said, i believe their is a lot of good stuff in the bible. and i am definitely not a christian, more of a "monist".

i've been around for several decades, and since the beginning have felt humanity splitting into 2 streams of consciousness. in the last decade or two those streams seem to be intensifying in some way.

i do believe we are in the last days or years. if you consider the state of society, the dozens of prophecies from various cultures around the world which in the main agree with each other, and your own gut, there is only 1 conclusion to reach. how long the last days take is another question.

the mayans seem to indicate its 2 1/2 years away. but that does not seem like enough time for all the prophecies to occurr. for example; getting the mark of the beast and so on. even if they are on the way to it. if it is december 2012, then perhaps the wheat will be separated from the chaff and those that remain will experience rough tough times. perhaps 2 will be working in the field, 1 will be taken and the other left. some sort of density of consciousness thing?

i'll just mention some writings from islam.

the following are the "minor signs" of the end times according to islam.
1. When it will be regarded as a shame to act on Quranic injunctions.
2. When untrustworthy people will be regarded as trustworthy and the trustworthy will be regarded as untrustworthy.
3. When it will be hot in winter (and vice versa).
4. When the length of days is stretched, i.e. a journey of a few days is covered in a matter of hours.
5. When orators and lecturers lie openly.
6. When people dispute over petty issues.
7. When women with children come displeased on account of them bearing offspring, and barren women remain happy on account of having no responsibility of offspring.
8. When oppression, jealousy, and greed become the order of the day.
9. When people blatantly follow their passions and whims.
10. When lies prevail over the truth.
11. When violence, bloodshed and anarchy become common.
12. When immorality overtakes shamelessness and is perpetrated publicly.
13. When legislation matters pertaining to Deen is handed over to the worst elements of the Ummat, and if people accept them and are satisfied with their findings, then such persons will not smell the fragrance of Jannat.
14. When the offspring become a cause of grief and anger (for their parents).

a portion of the major signs reveals;-

CHRISTIAN DOMINATION
Christians dominate the world up to Khaiber (near Madinah), and they will pursue Muslims with 80 flags, with 12,000 men under each flag.

to me it sounds like the united nations or nato or the coalition of the "swilling". just google major signs to read it all. its christians against moslems.

they also predict the return of "hadhrat eisa", their name for jesus. yes, moslems admitting to jesus! he will live 19 years after his marriage and be buried alongside muhommad.

as is mentioned by various catholic saints, islam agrees their will be 3 days of darkness at some stage. they add that after that the sun will rise in the west!

from all that i have read it would appear like the laws of physics as we know them will be stood on their heads. the years ahead will be unbelievable, and we'll all have ringside seats! just watching a new heavan and earth manifesting, and the old heavens being rolled up like a scroll, and the stars failing to keep their places.

its an interesting read www.islaam.org...

as for isaiah chapter 30, its interesting. perhaps later our host mother earth
will cry streams of water from the mountaintops at the behaviour of humans.



posted on Apr, 15 2010 @ 09:29 PM
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Originally posted by Titen-Sxull
reply to post by On the Edge
 


It's called editing. The story of Jesus could have been edited numerous times before it was written down and anyone discovered the documents. They could have easily added in the elements that match up with prophecy to help support their case that Jesus was the Messiah.

Considering that we have no unbiased historic documents to tell us how Jesus's life and ministry really played out as they were happening (we have second hand accounts) it is more likely the story has been embellished and altered to fit the prophecy and add supernatural elements.

Edit to Add: Because this is more or less off topic please do not respond to this post in this thread but write me directly via U2U.

[edit on 15-4-2010 by Titen-Sxull]


I have no problem responding to your post here,if you don't mind. I find your reply very much "on topic".

Your mindset has been written of in the Bible as well... 2 Peter 3:3,4,"First of all,you must understand that in the last days scoffers will come....They will say,"Where is this 'coming' he promised? Ever since our fathers died,everything goes on as it has since the beginning of creation."

As often as I have seen your various posts,I cannot recall any of them being reverent to God. Without seeming "too personal",should one assume that you don't want to believe?

Ephesians 4:18,"They are darkened in their understanding and seperated from the life of God because of the ignorance that is in them due to the hardening of their hearts."

1 Corinthians 2:14,"The man without the spirit does not accept the things that come from God,for they are foolishness to him,and he cannot understand them because they are spiritually discerned."

It would seem to me that your mind is made up and looking for reasons NOT to believe the word of God. If you are not willing to see things from God's point of view,He may just harden your heart and allow you to go on being deceived. I pray that will not be the case!

You have read these "end-times" threads before,and are still in denial? I cannot help you with that. In my opinion,a sincere humbling of yourself before God and asking Him to give you eyes to see and ears to hear would make all the difference. (I wouldn't be here now if I hadn't prayed for God to put me to use for Him!) He is patient,but that time ends,after taking the Mark of the Beast,based on some interpretations. Then come the worst plagues of all!....

An unbelieving heart will continue to deny the things of God and the words we impart will be meaningless to you. Have you ever read the testimonies of former Atheists who have changed their minds,after doing their own scholarly research and finding the Bible to be true? They are many! Or,you can listen to the Darwin's and the Dawkins of the world and continue in the path of denial,and accept whatever fate lies ahead.

This applies to all skeptics,I'm not "picking on you". If you want to talk more,you can U2U me and I would be happy to discuss this more.

For now,whatever we say will be interpreted by you as being manipulated and altered,embellished,etc...

Here's a quick little video called,"Are Christians Crazy?". You might get something from it!(It's not even 8 minutes long.)
www.liveleak.com...



posted on Apr, 15 2010 @ 09:37 PM
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reply to post by Lemon.Fresh
 


If you would care to do your own research, you will find that all 66 books
of the Bible were written over a long time by 40 different people.
The Old Testament covers a period of over 2,000 years. The new
Testament was written in just about a century of time, so there is a lot
less information about the time Christ was on earth and the short time
after his death.

The Bible is the word of God written by men. Through God the words
came.

The Bible contains more than 1200 prophesies. Up to now, over 800 of
them have happened just like it says in the Bible. The rest are yet to come.
And don't ask me to post all 800 of them on this thread. You show me
one, just one that hasn't come to fruition. And yes, these prophesies have
occurred over long periods of time. The rest are coming, I assure you.
One day they will be able to write that, yes, all 1200 of the prophesies of
the Bible came true just like it was written over the ages.

SHALOM and PEACE !!



posted on Apr, 15 2010 @ 09:46 PM
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reply to post by Lemon.Fresh
 



Once again . . . none of those generations had all the pieces of the puzzle in play like we do.


Really? I think it far more likely for something involving four horsemen and beasts rising out of the sea to take place along time ago, doesn't seem to correspond to anything going on to day.


The Bible has a fantastic record with prophecy.


I've never read a direct, specific Biblical prophecy that came to pass. Most, if not all, Biblical prophecies are vague, bizarre or intended to be figurative and therefore open to interpretation and misinterpretation. Also the Bible states that no one knows the hour or the day.

So you think that half-scorpion half-locust lion bugs will be given carte blanche to torment people by a supposedly loving God? It says that many will long for death but not find it meaning God is, for no reason, tormenting people with these bugs. Is Man-Bear-Pig real as well?




Also if God was giving this vision to John couldn't he have explained EXACTLY what John was seeing. The fact that John is describing something he might not be able to comprehend casts doubt on the prophecy and makes it easily misinterpretable.


God, above all is just. Yes, he is merciful. But mercy can last only so long.


The God of the Bible is not just. He regularly kills children or commands women and children to be killed or taken as slaves. He claims to punish children for the sins of their fathers. In other verses however it claims his mercies are new every morning and that they never run out. It says that God shall never leave us or forsake us but then also claims we will be thrown into a Lake of Fire for some of the simplest of sins (like lying). What we have are contradictory accounts of the same deity because these books were written by flawed men.

And I do not trust any human to be able to see the end of the world. Just look at how many end of the world predictions there have been. I suppose one of them has to be right sooner or later though


[edit on 15-4-2010 by Titen-Sxull]



posted on Apr, 15 2010 @ 09:47 PM
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reply to post by endtimer
 


lol

I do not know what you are on about. Prophecy is one of my forte's, along with history. I know the Bible quite well, thank you.

You are barking up the wrong tree, in other words.

It has been put forth in this thread, and any other end times thread, that the prophesied events could direct us to any point in history. I am trying to prove that this is is false because even though similar events have happened, no where in history have ALL of the events happened.

We are, at this juncture in time, in a position to witness all of the puzzle pieces being put together and utilized. At no other time in history could this be said.

All I am asking is for the skeptics to prove to me that any time in history could be considered the end of times . . . using common end times prophecy.

[edit on 4/15/2010 by Lemon.Fresh]



posted on Apr, 15 2010 @ 10:10 PM
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Something you should know about Islam is that it was created by the Catholic church! Sound far-fetched? It isn't! If you can search the Walter Veith video called,"The Islamic Connection",he lays it out perfectly. And why wouldn't they have? It's another branch used to persecute the Christians.

Sadly,the video has been removed from some of it's more ordinary places,but it's out there.

"All Roads Lead to Rome" is truer than you know!



posted on Apr, 15 2010 @ 10:14 PM
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Originally posted by Titen-Sxull

Really? I think it far more likely for something involving four horsemen and beasts rising out of the sea to take place along time ago, doesn't seem to correspond to anything going on to day.


And yet again, a skeptic is taking one part of prophecy and throwing the whole thing out of context . . .




I've never read a direct, specific Biblical prophecy that came to pass. Most, if not all, Biblical prophecies are vague, bizarre or intended to be figurative and therefore open to interpretation and misinterpretation.


--Jer 16:14-16 However, the days are coming," declares the LORD, "when men will no longer say, ‘As surely as the LORD lives, who brought the Israelites up out of Egypt,’ but they will say, ‘As surely as the LORD lives, who brought the Israelites up out of the land of the north and out of all the countries where he had banished them.’ For I will restore them to the land I gave their forefathers.

In all, 13 books of the Bible speak of the nation of Israel being restored in their land from the nations in which they were scattered. This prophecy became history in 1948 when the United Nations granted a homeland to the Jewish people and the nation of Israel was reborn! See also Jer 3:14, 31:8-9, Isa 60:8-9, Deut 30:3, Amos 9:15.




The desolate land of Israel would again blossom and be fruitful in the last days:

Zech 7:14 I scattered them with a whirlwind among all the nations, where they were strangers. The land was left so desolate behind them that no one could come or go. This is how they made the pleasant land desolate.
History records that while the Jewish people were exiled amongst many nations, the land of Israel was a barren desert. See also Lev 26:14, Ezek 15:8, Jer 9:12-13, 23:10, 44:22, Isa 32:13

Isa 27:6 In the days to come, Jacob will take root, Israel will bud and blossom and fill the world with fruit.

This is exactly the case today! Not only has God bought the Jewish people back into their land like He said He would in the last days, but He has also blessed the land so that they now export flowers and fruit around the world! Satellite photos show the green pastures of the nation of Israel, in sharp contrast with the surrounding desert lands of the Arab nations. See also Isa 35:1, Ezek 36:35.
--

Source


Also the Bible states that no one knows the hour or the day.



Yes, Jesus says this . . . BUT . . . he also says that we can know the season when he will come because just as you can tell by the fig tree that summer is near, so can you tell when the coming of the son of man will be near.



So you think that half-scorpion half-locust lion bugs will be given carte blanche to torment people by a supposedly loving God? It says that many will long for death but not find it meaning God is, for no reason, tormenting people with these bugs. Is Man-Bear-Pig real as well?





Once again, how do you explain something you do not understand?


Also if God was giving this vision to John couldn't he have explained EXACTLY what John was seeing. The fact that John is describing something he might not be able to comprehend casts doubt on the prophecy and makes it easily misinterpretable.


You describe Chinook helicopter to someone from 2000 years ago


The Bible also says that when the time is right, the keys to all prophecy will be unlocked. It may be vague now, but the answers will become clear at the appointed time.

There is some weird things that we can speculate about (such as the things you have mentioned), but all will be revealed in due time. Think of it this way. In just over 50 years we have invented a way for the mark of the beast to come about, and a way for all of earth to see Jesus return. Just 100 years ago, people were wondering how just those two items would be possible!



The God of the Bible is not just. He regularly kills children or commands women and children to be killed or taken as slaves. He claims to punish children for the sins of their fathers. In other verses however it claims his mercies are new every morning and that they never run out. It says that God shall never leave us or forsake us but then also claims we will be thrown into a Lake of Fire for some of the simplest of sins (like lying). What we have are contradictory accounts of the same deity because these books were written by flawed men.

And I do not trust any human to be able to see the end of the world. Just look at how many end of the world predictions there have been. I suppose one of them has to be right sooner or later though




And that is the issue. You do not believe in my God, so no proof given will satisfy you. You will continue to fight back even when the truth smacks you right in the face.

So I must ask, if you do not believe, why bother opening this thread in the first place?

[edit on 4/15/2010 by Lemon.Fresh]



posted on Apr, 15 2010 @ 10:20 PM
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reply to post by Lemon.Fresh
 




no proof given will satisfy you


Wrong actually. Solid evidence would satisfy me but I've scoured the internet and debated with countless people and no solid evidence has ever been provided. I know because most of the time I spent searching for that evidence was when I was still a Christian.

That verse if Jeremiah is a self-fulfilled prophecy. If at any point Israel had reformed as a nation it would be proven "true" and of course there were millions working to make it a reality (not just Jews but lot's of other people). A self-fulfilling prophecy may count as far as you're concerned but it doesn't impress me. Its no different from predicting I'm going to have spaghetti a week from now and then eating spaghetti in a week the difference is that "prophecy" is dealing with reforming a nation (or the planting/sprouting of fruit and flowers) and not eating dinner.

[edit on 15-4-2010 by Titen-Sxull]



posted on Apr, 15 2010 @ 10:21 PM
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reply to post by Titen-Sxull
 


Thank you for proving my point.


Have a good evening!



posted on Apr, 15 2010 @ 10:24 PM
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reply to post by ntech
 


I kinda agree but the Bible decodes itself and states a generation is 70 years putting the 1947 (when Isreal was signed in as a nation) or 1948 (when Isreal publicly became a nation) plus 70 years is 2017 or 2018 which means the tribulation starts or started this year 2010 or next year 2011. I lean toward 2010; ie: hence the earthquakes in divers places (Matt 24). Cool thing is anyway, shape, form or fashion you do the math that is provided in the Bible you come up with, well right about now. Another awsume find; is when I was studying the Lost Sea Scrolls it has some mathmatical clues too and guess what? The solution is parallel to the Biblical timeline. Melissa101

[edit on 15-4-2010 by Melissa101]



posted on Apr, 15 2010 @ 10:24 PM
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reply to post by Lemon.Fresh
 


How does a self-fulfilling prophecy count as proof? Would they use such a thing in a court of law? Would they use such a thing in the scientific process? If not then it does not count as proof.

If there is no evidence then believing must take place with blind faith and if there is a God I don't think he would force us to believe based on blind faith.



posted on Apr, 15 2010 @ 10:30 PM
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reply to post by Titen-Sxull
 


Even in a court of law a mound of circumstancail evidence equals tangible evidence and is submisable.

Question? Can you prove without a shadow of a doubt that there is no God? Can you prove Jesus never exsisted? Can you prove the Bible is a fairy tale? Where is your hard evidence?

Oh and PS there is evidence of God and it is absolutly everywhere but just like stated in the Bible the wicked will never see it nor comprehend only the wise and those that believe and fear God have the knowlegde and abilty to see it. It is in your face slap knee funny when you wake up and see it.

[edit on 15-4-2010 by Melissa101]

[edit on 15-4-2010 by Melissa101]



posted on Apr, 15 2010 @ 10:36 PM
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reply to post by Melissa101
 


No I cannot prove that there is no God and I have no reason to do so. In a court of law the burden of proof is on those making the claim (in most cases it is a claim about a crime).

I believe Jesus did exist, there are a handful of historical references to suggest that the Gospels are based, at least in part, on a real individual. However I think the supernatural elements were added later on, embellishments added to make him seem even more like the Messiah. The unsubstantiated supernatural elements distract people from the profound messages in Jesus's teachings and put the focus on his supposedly supernatural death and return to life instead of on how he lived and thought we all should live.

Common sense and simple logic, as well as lack of archeological evidence for supernatural happenings, tell me that the Bible is only partially based in reality. It is an embellished version of real happenings, like many myths and legends are. Kinda like a based on a true story movie.

I don't know whether or not there is a God. I do however think that if there is one he/she/it would not require us to believe on blind faith or else face eternal torment mainly because that idea does not make sense. Just like the idea of Christians predicting the end of the world doesn't really make sense when the Bible itself says "no one knows the hour or the day".

[edit on 15-4-2010 by Titen-Sxull]



posted on Apr, 15 2010 @ 10:39 PM
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reply to post by ReVoLuTiOn76
 


Not only did you lose your cherry, you lost your bu-hymen too. Couldn't have chosen anything else huh? Greenhorn. Boy are you gonna get ripped a new one over and over for this. You know christian boy.... I really hope god exists cuz when i die i got a @#$load of stuff to grill him about. The bible is just a pre "official story" for what man has got up his sleeve. And its this dangerous born again "n.ot o.f t.his w.orld" mentality that is fueling this madness by the hundreds of millions worldwide. God help us... OOOOPSS!!!



posted on Apr, 15 2010 @ 10:40 PM
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Originally posted by Titen-Sxull


How does a self-fulfilling prophecy count as proof? Would they use such a thing in a court of law? Would they use such a thing in the scientific process? If not then it does not count as proof.


All things are done through God for his purpose. Even if you believe that it is self-fulfilling, it is still part of God's plan.

But that is another rabbit trail.

Israel returning can't be a self fulfilling prophecy for a few reasons (I stole these from AshleyD, FYI):

Israel's rebirth took place to the day it was prophesied to be fulfilled. Many accusations then come flying forth that it was done on purpose but they forget two things:

1) The math was not realized until about a decade ago- not prior to 1948.

2). There were about a dozen prophecies that mentioned the specific circumstances that would surround Israel's rebirth. It was not a vague prophecy that Israel would simply exist at the end times. It was multiple things that had to occur.

Here are a few:

A). Be reborn in one day (this happened).
B). The Jew would slowly trickle in (this happened).
C). They would immediately be surrounded by enemies (this happened).
D). The precise names of the countries who would be their enemies were given by name (this coalition now exists).
E). They would regain Jerusalem (this happened).
F). There would be no king (this happened- and a prophecy stating a country without a king was preposterous in the age of monarchies when this prophecy was given).
G). The land would blossom (since its occupation the desert has become a type of oasis in the ME).
H). There would be attempts to divide the land (this is happening with the Palestine issue).




If there is no evidence then believing must take place with blind faith and if there is a God I don't think he would force us to believe based on blind faith.


I have given you evidence, and you have declined to accept it.



posted on Apr, 15 2010 @ 10:47 PM
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I'm going to direct you to a web page which contains a PDF book that I had the pleasure of reading all the way through today. I think it will shake your foundations as far as Christianity goes, and make you and people of every religion realize that all religions started from one point. This is an excellent book, and I haven't found such a treasure trove of data all in one place in a long time.

thecrowhouse.com...


As far as your theory, yes, we are in the "end times" so to speak. But it isn't at the hands of a vengeful God, or an anti-Christ or any of that nonsense. A naturally occurring event in our universe's history is slowly unfolding again, and we just happen to be in the age in which it will happen again.

Nice try for a first post on ATS, but boo on you for asking for lenience...as I'm sure you will find none on this subject.


Peace be with you.

-truthseeker



posted on Apr, 15 2010 @ 10:51 PM
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Originally posted by Titen-Sxull
reply to post by Lemon.Fresh
 


How does a self-fulfilling prophecy count as proof? Would they use such a thing in a court of law? Would they use such a thing in the scientific process? If not then it does not count as proof.

If there is no evidence then believing must take place with blind faith and if there is a God I don't think he would force us to believe based on blind faith.


"For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God,not by works,so that no man should boast." (Ephesians 2:8-9)

Oh,I think God has alot to say about the importance of Faith!

There is overwhelming evidence. You just choose not to see it. You have one excuse after another not to believe.

Not only is the state of Israel (1948) a clue,Revelations speaks of World Government,a One-World Religion,the Mark of the Beast on the hand or forehead,knowledge increasing (Internet!),the Catholic church ("harlot") coming into global-political power again,...the list goes on and on! (Russia and Iran,in Ezekiel 38 and 39;Global Economic collapse,The Euphates River drying up-even the New York Times admitted the prophetic implications of that! Sky-rocketing commodities prices,like oil and gold,an increase in apostasy (falling away from the faith),a rise in the occult,Satan coming with "lying signs and wonders",extreme lack of morality,worshipping the things of the earth and the "earth" itself instead of God,...

These things have not "always" been happening or even possible.

Just this short excerpt says alot!
www.aim.org...


The New York Times got it right this time, noting the Pope's call for a world political authority amounted to endorsement of a New World Economic Order, a long-time goal of the old Soviet-sponsored international communist movement. Bloomberg.com highlighted the Pope's call for a new world order with "teeth."

The Pope's shocking endorsement of a "World Political Authority," which has prophetic implications for some Christians who fear that a global dictatorship will take power in the "last days" of man's reign on earth, comes shortly after the United Nations Conference on the World Financial and Economic Crisis issued a call for global taxes and more powerful global institutions. U.N. General Assembly President, Miguel D'Escoto, a Communist Catholic Priest, gave a speech at the event calling on the nations of the world to revere "Mother Earth" but concluded with words from the Pope blessing the conference participants.


From
www.remnantofgod.org...


Vatican wound healing unquestionably (updated)
December 2, 2009 — Nicholas
It seems the prophecied beast of Daniel and Revelation has just taken a giant step closer to her prophecied healing by enacting Sunday Laws in Germany.

High court reaffirms ban on Sunday shopping
Sunday will no longer be an option for Christmas shoppers. Ruling in favor of the Catholic and Lutheran churches, Germany’s highest court has found that the city of Berlin’s ten shopping Sundays a year go against the constitutional protection of Sundays as a day of rest.

Germany’s Constitutional Court ruled on Tuesday that shops must close on Sundays, and that legislation in Berlin allowing for ten shopping Sundays was unconstitutional. Germany’s Basic Law protects Sunday and public holidays as “days of rest from work and of spiritual improvement.” -Editor: DW-World.de December 2, 2009


Germany had Sunday laws since 1919, however in 2006 they allowed for 10 Sundays a year for shops to be open. But 24 hours after the Lisbon Treaty, (EU Constitution) was ratified, Rome reaffirmed Sunday laws as an obvious show of both political as well as prophecied strength. The opening of shops on Sundays suddenly became “unconstitutional” thanks to Rome’s influence in writing that constitution! Now that they did this in Germany using their new Constitution as a foundation, soon all EU nations will follow suit. After all, they all have the same Constitution as of December 1, 2009. As I have been saving for years, the EU is a testing grounds for Rome. Using the Lutheran church along with the Vatican is a bold move by Satan to try and suppress the work of Martin Luther who had the spiritual insight to target the Vatican as the house of Antichrist when he posted his 95 Thesis on October 31, 1517, which later allowed so many to see this prophecied truth as Scriptural fact. Eventually the mortal wound was administered by Napoleon in 1798ad, in the exact year that Daniel 7:25, Revelation 12:6, & 13:5 predicted it would happen. That being said, I wonder if scoffers will still proclaim Sunday Laws to be a bogus prophecy of Sabbath keeping Christians. If it’s so bogus, why is the Vatican doing exactly as prophecy said they would? Will this Sunday law spread globally? The American Constitution is already being whittled away, and as I reported in the September 2009 Newsletter, Obama supporters have already started a Sunday Law campaign here in America.

“Of course the Catholic Church claims that the change (Saturday Sabbath to Sunday) was her act... And the act is a MARK of her ecclesiastical authority in religious things.” H.F. Thomas, Chancellor of Cardinal Gibbons. Nov. 11, 1895

“Sunday is our MARK or authority. . .the church is above the Bible, and this transference of Sabbath observance is proof of that fact” Catholic Record of London, Ontario Sept 1,1923.



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