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Kenyan official: Obama born in KENYA

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posted on Apr, 12 2010 @ 10:16 AM
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reply to post by whatukno
 


Here allow me to provide you with some reading material wuk. Maybe TRY to not use one of these in every one of your posts and I will decide to give you the light of day.

Fallacies


reply to post by Southern Guardian
 


I haven't acted out regardless because, as I said, I stay out of these topics. This is maybe my second at most that I've even decided to comment on and it was because of the ignorance being displayed within. I've I would have cared before now, maybe I would have acted like this for other statements, but forgive me for not being everywhere at once.










*Sigh*

I read on in this topic and see more of the same. The same issues being brought up, the same ignorance on both sides. APPARENTLY, I'm the only person on ATS that realizes that there isn't enough evidence in this situation to prove either side, yet there are those that will continue to go on and on and on about how one side "lost" and keep dragging it out.

One argument I see for the anti-birthers is the all to common - "Why don't you focus on something more important than these trivial issues?" which has been posted a couple of times in this topic.

Allow me to ask those who question such - is the Constitution a "trivial" issue? If in fact the Constitution was violated in any way during Barack Obama's presidential election and/or reign - is that somehow a "trivial" issue? The entire argument bases around the insane belief that apparently, if you are a birther, you are only worried about the birther movement, you only talk about the birther movement, and your ignore any other relevant information. It is funny because most of the "birthers" I see here on ATS I see around many other places spanning a number of issues, while most of the people making such comments I have never seen outside of a birther thread. Interesting assessment I might say and I would say that it should lead one to question - who are the ones that are REALLY wasting their time?



Now the second thing I realize is the blatant ignorance by both sides, as I stated before, but in the particular topic it comes mostly from the anti-birther side.

You see, the anti-birthers will ask birthers exactly what they want to see and what would prove Obama's eligibility. Most times they provide a list of records that would be commonly available to a person in today's age, and then the opposition usually replies with the generalized statement - each and every time:

"It doesn't matter what Obama would release, birthers would still find something else to complain about."

This an unfounded and irrational argument for a number of reasons. First of all, the argument makes it sound as if Obama and his administration has gone through lengths to provide sufficient documentation to prove his eligibility when in fact, it is painfully obvious that they have done the opposite. Thus the argument is trying to base birther reactions on a situation that never happened based on assumptions and bias.

Secondly, as far as I am aware, the birther issue has focused on one thing the entire time - the revealing of the birth certificate of Barack Obama with the name and signature of the doctor in Hawaii who delivered him. That is it. The request for OTHER documents came only after excuses and misleading statements were made about the location and release of the mentioned document and while they may not be able to provide 100% proof for the matter, they would at least allow us some insight into the history of the man we are expected to follow behind.

Then, as if on cue, there are those that when prompted with the reality that there is very little evidence on either side, they will begin making the same ludicrous remarks:

"So what if he isn't eligible. Do you think this is going to change anything even if it is true? Why even bother?"

To which I say that these people display one of two things: the want for opposition no matter what, or the complete and utter ignorance towards the TRUTH just because it does not benefit them.



The reason I PERSONALLY am interested in this topic is because the issue is still lingering and there are still topic points ever 2 years down the road. You still have very little evidence supporting either claim, and yet at the same time you have down right REFUSAL to investigate further, provide any addition documents or information, or appease the people from their apparent "dead horse" beliefs once and for all.

Seriously, people on both sides, wake up and smell the coffee. I may lean more towards the birther side of things but the fact of the matter is that, more than anything, I want the truth. And when it comes to knowing the TRUTH, I don't need an excuse or an ulterior motive in order to question something that is so easily questions, so easily refutable, yet so easily ignored and denied.

Ignorance will get us nowhere. To all the people against the birthers why don't you suck up your pride for a minute, put away your biases and your speculation, and for once seek the TRUTH instead of seeking recognition of being RIGHT. Look at all the incidents in the past that ignorance has revealed to us only decades following them. Let this not be one and even if the birthers ARE WRONG, at least know that you did everything in your power to find the truth, regardless of if it is pretty or not.




posted on Apr, 12 2010 @ 10:18 AM
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Originally posted by kozmo
When you apply for a job, get a driver's license, get a marriage license it is up to YOU to provide proof that you are who you say you are and that you are eligible to receive such benefit. If you logic was correct, then I could tell the DMV to PROVE that I am NOT permitted to have a driver's license. OR tell my employer to PROVE that I am not who I say I am amd that the SS number i provided was incorrect. That burden of proof lies solely on ME!

When I apply for a job, I prove who I am to the boss or personnel officer.
I am under no obligation to prove my identity to every Tom, Dick and Sally who murmer I might be a three-headed Marxist, fascist, Islamicist, Muslim, Arab, antisemitic, child-eating, satanic antichrist.

When I get a driver's license, I'm under no obligation to show my birth certificate to every passing motorist.

When I get married, I don't have to prove my identity to all the wedding guests.

There was a committee to assess Obama's eligibility. That was their job, it is not yours or mine. You are assuming, with no proof of your own, that they had insufficient reason to believe Obama was a natural born American.

An accusation like that, made with no evidence, is just more hot air.



posted on Apr, 12 2010 @ 10:20 AM
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reply to post by Kailassa
 





He doesn't present any proof, and doesn't say why he believes this to be true, but you'll take his word over that of all the members of Congress and members of the Senate in America . .


Good point, however why would he lie and why didn't anyone check him on his mistake,




you'll take his word over that of all the members of Congress and members of the Senate in America


LOL, yes, I don't trust them any further then I can throw them.



posted on Apr, 12 2010 @ 10:31 AM
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Originally posted by EzraBuckley



Yup it is documented, he said it,

en.wikipedia.org...



I'd love to see this documentation. All I see is a Wikipedia entry confirming James Orengo is a real person. For the record, a passing reference in Wikipedia alluding to the allegation wouldn't prove anything, but it would be a start.

Assuming Orengo really made this comment, I don't see any reason to believe he'd be privy to this kind of information. My knowledge of Orengo begins and ends with the Wikipedia entry (and an entry to the scandal that brought him to office, and entries on his political associates) and nowhere in this body of information do I see any reason to believe he'd have access to state secrets like this. Why, other than your desperate need to discredit Obama (for whom I also have no love) do you believe an off-handed comment by a man I guarantee you'd never heard of before today.

Here is how I like to test the veracity of a source. Imagine that same source saying something that, on a visceral, emotional level, you disagreed with instead of confirming a belief for which you desperately want to find evidence. Would you still be taking him seriously? Would you still be citing him? Would he even pass the bloody laugh test? If James Jimmy-Jimmy Owadgi Adhiambo Orengo made an off-handed comment you disagreed with would you take him at his word? Who was that televised blowhard who used to shriek "NO SPIN" like a large, demented owl from time to time? Don't you think taking the word of a minor politician you'd never heard of as evidence for a conspiracy you desperately want to believe in puts you well within the "Oh man I so totally got spun" Zone?


I can't speak for everyone, but God, I hope there's no evidence that he was born in another country... I hope there's no evidence that he's claimed alternate or dual citizenship.

It would completely undermine an entire election.

THE PROBLEM is that we don't have any credible evidence to the contrary. The COLB does NOT answer the question. You who are claiming that it does are the ones who are denying....

This is one of the biggest issues in our nation's history and it's important to put it to rest as quickly and simply as possible.

Do you understand what happens if evidence is found that shows he WASNT eligible four or five years down the road??? Have you thought about that???

For those stating that if evidence was produced he wouldn't be removed???? Are you smoking crack? If he proves to have been ineligible, it's do not pass go, election null and void and the chaos that would insue would be insane.

I don't want that; however, I want an illegal POTUS even less. You see, I think that the COTUS is the greatest political document ever written, I swore an oath to defend it on two separate occasions. If we don't start following it again, we are in deep trouble as a nation and there are many who will do whatever is in their power to prevent that from occurring.

Jaden



posted on Apr, 12 2010 @ 10:34 AM
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Originally posted by ReelView
It appears that they are trying to condition people to the idea that it doesn't matter.


EXACTLY disinform enough and it will stick, just like Bush on WMD's disifo repeat something enough till it sticks



posted on Apr, 12 2010 @ 10:34 AM
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Originally posted by jimmyx
reply to post by HappilyEverAfter
 


you would not believe a birth certificate that has been public for years, and you do not believe any government entity, local, state, or federal that says Obama is an american citizen...so if you have proof that he isn't...get together with your birther friends and buy a page of the new york times and present your proof.


SEE !
You sir are proof of my argument,
I am saying that it has not been proven or disproven.
There are varying opinions based on the failure to completely address this.
Lawyers and bloggers and you and I have opinions due to an equal amount of crap available to view.
Until a proper hearing and judgement is made it is still unsettled.
Obama, has become a protected religious entity masked and defended by and with a very bizzare close minded cult, that would rather not ask questions and follow along lock step like lemmings.
The race card, political affiliation card, etc etc has all been used to boredom.
The difference?
You and other "believers" have passed judgement already, on what little, and it is little, proof is spewed.
I am still asking that a proper investigation be done and our high court pass judgement.
So go ahead and stomp your passionate feet and call names and assume,
because that's all that's been done to date, assumptions.



posted on Apr, 12 2010 @ 10:36 AM
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Originally posted by seagull
reply to post by TheOneElectric
 


Or, maybe...just maybe, vote for someone else? Presidential elections are only two years away.


Sorry but the way things are going i dont think we have 2 years left, will be lucky to make it past April 19th when the 2nd amendment armed march takes place in Washington, it might be the icebreaker for #2



posted on Apr, 12 2010 @ 10:39 AM
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Originally posted by Stormdancer777
reply to post by Kailassa
 


Unless I'm mistaken, the woman you are referring to was not a blood relative of Obama II, and was talking about witnessing the birth in Mombassa of Obama I.

I think she is a blood relative.

Obama's Kenyan Grandmother to Attend Inauguration

www.foxnews.com...


President-elect Barack Obama's Kenyan grandmother will be among the millions of people in Washington for the Inauguration.

Sarah Obama, the mother
of Obama's Kenyan-born father, will join representatives from the Kenyan government, African Union and African diplomats for an unofficial inaugural ball on Jan. 20. Organizers say Kenya's foreign minister and the Boys Choir of Kenya also plan to travel to the United States for the invitation-only event at a Washington-area hotel.


Fox new gets it wrong again! What a surprise ...

The actual mother of Barrack Obama senior was Akumu Nyanjoga. She died while he was quite young and he was brought up by his father's third wife, Sarah. Sarah, by the way, had been there at the birth of Obama senior, which is why she claimed later to have witnessed his birth. She would have been unlikely to say she had seen that birth if she had been the one giving birth.


en.wikipedia.org...



posted on Apr, 12 2010 @ 10:46 AM
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Originally posted by GorehoundLarry

Originally posted by spinalremain










Once again, felt the need to post this.

For those who are questioning it because it lacks the damage it would've taken over the past few...ok, many (lol) years...is it not possible it was indeed taken care of? Is it possible that they have gotten a COPY just to show you birthers (ugh) that your president was indeed born in the United States?

Yes both are possible but you refuse to accept it.

Really guys? There is nothing else about the president you can make up? Nothing? Why not say he's an alien who was born in the mountains of China but escaped and now he's president so the government can pull the strings of a different species while it runs the country?

Could be more interesting and more amusing than this rumor.



posted on Apr, 12 2010 @ 10:54 AM
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reply to post by Kailassa
 






Habiba Akumu Obama
Also known as Akumu Nyanjoga (c. 1918–?).[62][63] Barack Obama's paternal grandmother, and the second wife of Hussein Onyango Obama. She gave Onyango three children: daughters Sarah and Auma, and son Barack (Barack Obama's father).[64] Her father was named Njango and she was born and raised in the Western Kenyan village of Karabondi.[63][65] In his memoir Dreams from My Father, her grandson wrote that she was miserable in her marriage and abandoned her husband and children and subsequently married again and moved to presend-day Tanzania. Luos are given name related the circumstances of their birth and Akumu means mysterious birth, a conception after a birth, but before resumption of menses.[61] She took the name Habiba upon her conversion to Islam. A photograph of her holding her son, Barack Sr, on her lap is on the cover of her grandson's memoir. (See image at right margin.)[66]


Well ain't that something, thanks for another piece of the puzzle.

She gave Onyango three children: daughters Sarah and Auma, and son Barack (Barack Obama's father).

So she is prolly not living?




en.wikipedia.org...



[edit on 103030p://bMonday2010 by Stormdancer777]



posted on Apr, 12 2010 @ 10:56 AM
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Originally posted by Southern Guardian

Originally posted by Masterjaden
The statement made by the hawaiian official gave NOTHING other than opinion...


Please read this statement and tell me what part of it was opinion:


I, Dr. Chiyome Fukino, Director of the Hawaii State Department of Health, have seen the original vital records maintained on file by the Hawaii State Department of Health verifying Barrack Hussein Obama was born in Hawaii and is a natural-born American citizen.

I have nothing further to add to this statement or my original statement issued in October 2008 over eight months ago,” Fukino said, in hopes of ending the controversy surrounding Obama’s citizenship.

hawaii.gov...


Done on this topic...


Gets some rest and bring some more BS tomorrow. I'll be happy to address more then.


If you can't see that this is a statement of opinion I feel sorry for you...

She states that she has seen his documents and can attest that he is a natural born citizen. 1) what gives her the ability to declare him a natural born citizen and 2) What does she base her declaration on.

Without qualifying data, it is just a statement of opinion...

Your ridiculous notion that I need to think up more b.s. when I have never even stated that I believe that he was not born in the US.

As I have stated, I believe that anyone NOT born to TWO us citzen parents should not even be a citizen (although that's not the law) they definitely still should not be considered natural born if they are not.

Be that as it may, we still need to put this to rest. It can easily be put to rest with the release of his documents...

WHY are you so adamant that this is put to rest without the release of documents that can ACTUALLY put it to rest.

Jaden.

I'm done with this thread the idiocy is mind boggling.

Look, anyone who declares that they know where obama was born based on the PUBLIC information available to date is incapable of logical evaluation. I don't know and I don't care as much as I care about the lacksadaisical attitude and head in the sand attempts at obfuscation of the merits of the question



posted on Apr, 12 2010 @ 11:01 AM
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reply to post by Masterjaden
 


Dr. Chiyome Fukino, is the Director of the Hawaii State Department of Health, which means she overseas all the vital records. She is the one that you go for for a birth certificate.

So, when she says that Obama was born in Hawai'i, well guess what? Obama was born in Hawai'i.



posted on Apr, 12 2010 @ 11:03 AM
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reply to post by OpTiMuS_PrImE
 


Here is the article quoted directly. www.audacityofhypocrisy.com...

Just because some guy refers to him as Kenyan born everyone flips out. In a radio interview the fact that he referred to Obama as Kenyan was explained. He meant of Kenyan heritage. The exclusion he referred to was the race barrier being breached in the highest office in the land. A son of Kenya becomes president of predominantly white America. He even said in another interview, "Although President Elect Obama was born in Hawaii he is and always shall be a son of Kenya."

Look, Obama may be a lot of things, but he wasn't born in Kenya. People that keep up these Kenyan born shannanigans, WMD included have an alterior motive. And it isn't good. Judge the man on his deeds, the fact he's running our country into the ground more quickly than Jimmy Carter could ever imagine, but don't jusdge him on crap that isn't true.

He was determined to be a natural born American, as was McCain, in a court case. It's over. Not one person who accused him of being Kenyan born has any evidence of it whatsoever. Hey, I'm going to do the same thing Orengo did, quote me here too.

Look at what America has done with President Obama. They have broken down all of their prejudicial barriers and elected the 1st Martian to the highest office in the land. How is this so? They dropped all of their exclusionary laws...

That's just as true as what Orengo said...

Orengo also said...

“If America was living in a situation where they feared ethnicity and did not see itself as a multiparty state or nation,” without regard to “ethnic consideration and objectives.”

It's hilarious that from the time of Ann Dunham's marrige to Big Barrack Sr, they were married while she was pregnant btw, they didn't leave America until he was 6 years old. His Dad only say him 1 other time before he died.

There is a reason that nobody of consequence is pursuin the birther issue. Because it's ridiculous. Deny ignorance. Oh yeah, I voted for Ron Paul, so don't pigeonhole me as one of the socialist left wing nuts wither.



posted on Apr, 12 2010 @ 11:03 AM
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reply to post by GorehoundLarry
 


So answer the really important question: how is it that Barack Obama's Indonesian-born sister has a Hawaii birth certificate?

And given that fact, isn't it also possible that Obama could have, in fact, been born someplace other than Hawaii?



posted on Apr, 12 2010 @ 11:03 AM
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Originally posted by DaRAGE

That makes him an illigitimate president - and should be done for Treason... Nuff said


Don't you have to be a citizen of the country to be done for treason?



posted on Apr, 12 2010 @ 11:14 AM
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Originally posted by Stormdancer777
reply to post by Kailassa
 


He doesn't present any proof, and doesn't say why he believes this to be true, but you'll take his word over that of all the members of Congress and members of the Senate in America . .

Good point, however why would he lie and why didn't anyone check him on his mistake,


We don't know he intentionally lied. There has been enormous time and money spent pushing the idea that Obama was born in Kenya, with streams of people endlessly repeating the untruth that Sarah Obama stated she witnessed the birth of ObamaII in Kenya.

(I have an acquaintance working as an accountant in an advertising agency. Their fastest growing area of business is labelled "Interactive Advertising," and includes payments to a stable of posters for whom the agency acts as a go-between, who post views on topics the client wants publicised.)

I'd suggest that, rather than lying, the Kenyan politician fell for this wave of propaganda and assumed their was truth in it.

Perhaps the others, if they knew better, thought it would be impolite, or unappreciated, if they corrected Mr Orengo publicly.




you'll take his word over that of all the members of Congress and members of the Senate in America?

LOL, yes, I don't trust them any further then I can throw them.

Corruption is everywhere.

You are just as likely to find an uncorrupt politician in America as in any other country.
And sadly, you are no more likely to find an uncorrupt politician in Kenya than you are in America.



posted on Apr, 12 2010 @ 11:17 AM
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This just in:

Damning evidence surfaces. JFK Not Native American.

www.youtube.com...



posted on Apr, 12 2010 @ 11:18 AM
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Originally posted by sos37
reply to post by GorehoundLarry
 


So answer the really important question: how is it that Barack Obama's Indonesian-born sister has a Hawaii birth certificate?

And given that fact, isn't it also possible that Obama could have, in fact, been born someplace other than Hawaii?


Do you have proof that Maya has a Hawaiian birth certificate which states she was born in Hawaii, or is this claim just another internet rumour?



posted on Apr, 12 2010 @ 11:21 AM
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Just one other thing. I've heard people griping about his SSn. His 1st 5 are 042-68. Which means it was issued in CT in 76-77. So he got it when he was 16 or 17. Before you say omg this proves the conspiracy, hold up. Many kids didn't get their SSN when they were born in the 60s and 70s. He got his, guess when, when he started applying to colleges. Applying from Indonesia btw. So his ssn was processed in CT, no big deal. He got it while applying to colleges in Indonesia. No conspiracy. CT was one of the main SSA hubs in the 70s and had one of the shortest turnaround times. And if he was applying for college being a smart boy he requested his number form where he could get it the fastest, and the closest hub to where he wanted to go to college. That way when he went for his campus visit he could handle his SSN paperwork.

But what do I know, I'm a government agent.



posted on Apr, 12 2010 @ 11:33 AM
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Originally posted by Masterjaden
reply to post by Kailassa
 


Show me where the COLB states that Obama was born in Hawaii????

It doesn't. It states that he was born....and that the document was produced in Hawaii. That's why people are asking for the long form because that atleast gives verifiable evidence that he was born in Hawaii.

Jaden


Take an actual look at the document instead of falling for the bull-crap.

The COLB clearly states Obama's place of birth as Hawaii.




www.8thwood.com...

[edit on 12/4/10 by Kailassa]



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