Originally posted by Tiger5
reply to post by harryhaller
Well The ANC was never a communist organisation. If any one had read the works of Marx and / or Lenin they could never assume the ANC was communist.
The Soviet Union was communist for about three years about the time of John Read in the early 20s.
[edit on 11-4-2010 by Tiger5]
Curious statement. First up, i have no idea of the relevance of "John Reid"? Or the timeframe of the 20's with regards South Africa?
While technically correct, that the ANC and SACP (south african communist part) were ideologically seperated, i think you're nowhere near the truth.
The alliance between The ANC, SACP and COSATU (Congress of South African Trade Unions) has always been very tight. And only recently has the ANC run
roughshod over the wishes of the "partners".
Through the 60's, 70's and 80's, while the ANC was a terrorist organisation, they had tremenous help from the USSR, who was using the African
conflicts as a proxy against Washington, who supported the apartheid govt fully. Many of the struggle heroes, too many to name, were taken to Russia
for training. Russia supplied arms, training, money and other support for the then exiled "freedom fighters".
I would love an inside view to what was actually taught, but it was the hardest indoctrination and best covert military training available at the
What is almost impossibe to define, is what effect this hard-core cold-war era training and ideas did to the "common mindset" of the ANC and
partners. Rest assured that it had significant effect ... just what we're not sure.
I had a chat to a guy at work the other. Black guy late twenties, well educated and so far successful, he is a practicing ANC member. When talking,
just generally about the current affairs, i couldn't help feeling a very pronounced ideological slant to the entire conversation. This is totaly
subjective, but i felt a mental block on some issues that was not rational. Also a perspective that was ... not in touch with reality (?) very almost
An example: He made a statement that SA is NOT capitalist, as according to him the majority of people are economically inactive (it is mostly fact),
ergo SA is not a capitalist system (which is faulty logic). He was not able to say what it was, and shrugged off the fact that he drives a very nice
car, paid for with cash, which he earned.
Another thing i noticed when talking about matrics (final year secondary school, where more than half the students nationwide are failing annually)
that all the figures he quoted were for BLACK STUDENTS only (he was specific about that). When i asked him why he did that, it was because the black
students were the only "real" index ... or reflection on reality.
All i can say is there are certain "basic assumptions" which we do not share. We being "whites" and "blacks" ... in very general terms.
One of these assumptions that i've noticed is this. The only true politics of Africans today is TRIBALISM. It is represented by the SACP, but
practiced by just about every single black person i know. It is neither Marxism, nor Communism nor indeed anything western, except perhaps
The Basic precepts for tribalism are as follows:
There is one leader, who shall never be challenged.
All things belong to this leader. (thats where communism appears)
He rules by force. (In Africa, unless you use force, it will be used on you.)
There is a lot more to my theory than just this, but it's been agreed to by many people here i've spoken with. I'm just annoyed that they've all
read Marx and none have read Plato.