are visa/non english born nurses to blame for nhs failures?

reply to post by jumpingbeanz


Yeah... I was reading in the Daily Mail (which resulted in the usual blood pressure raise) that the 1.5 million new jobs created by labour have been taken by foreigners...
Clearly we need to go down south and drag those self serving weasels from parliament and drown the lot of them in the Thames..... Or drag them up here and throw them in the cut (thats the canal for you none YamYams)...

reply to post by Wotan


Hi Wotan, I've worked in the NHS (short term) and have a number of family and friends still in the NHS..

The part I find strange is that we (the UK) are trawling the same shores for nurses etc, as we do not have enough trained persons.. Yet those I know (family/friends) who are trying to further their careers are finding that over the last few years the number of training places for nurses etc is dropping year on year.

It appears to me (inc my family and friends) that a large part of the skills shortage has been self inflicted.

reply to post by Yissachar1


Hey, your not the only ones who have issues with the Palace of Westminster..

Not all the South is rich or see any Gov investment, whatever colour tie they wear.

Fortunately I haven't had much reason to go to the Doctors or hospital much for myself, (touches wood, ), but close family members have had quite a lot of treatment and my step-daughter is a theatre nurse.

My local doctors surgery has doctors from all over the globe and I can honestly say that I have never had, or heard, of any problems whatsoever.

In local area there are 4 large hospitals; 1 is very good, 1 is very poor and 2 are ok.

Standards vary and there does seem to be a bit of a problem with a large number of foreign nurses who have little or no understanding of the English language.
How that is possible is absolutely beyond me.
Surely it is a basic requirement for a nurse to be able to communicate with his / her patients!

Many wards are now staffed with bank nurses and as a result there seems to be a lack of familiarity beween staff and patients.

And as for those colonial cousins who will use this as a justification for their opposition to Obama's health care plans I would just like to point out that the faults with our NHS are down to serial mismangement, lack of funding from succesive governments and being a reflection of the very society that it is a part of.
Yet I will take it any day rather than accept any of the alternatives.

reply to post by thoughtsfull


I do know what you mean. There never seems to be an organised response to recruitment for nurses in the UK. One minute you can have a 'glut' of nurses qualifying, then the Unis react and drop their Uni places for following years, then when it looks like there is not enough nurses qualifying, put out more places in Uni.

They would be better off just rounding the figures out and keeping them at a fixed number somewhere in-between.

As to further training opportunities, it does depend a lot on which area of nursing you are in and where you work. Generally speaking 'General Nursing' or 'Adult Branch Nurses' makes up the bulk of all nurses, therefore opportunities are hotly contested, whereas Mental Health Branch etc is a small group, so opportunities are more frequent and easier to gain.

reply to post by thoughtsfull


I know.... Its bad when you need to speak 5 languages to get a job in your own country... I feel for you mate.... Count yourself lucky though you have all that glorious countryside and seaside to look at..... I have a few old factories and a canal lol..... Guess you can throw some off the cliffs.... However I wanted to deprive them of getting one last look at beauty before we drown the bastards lol.... They dont deserve it.... A west mids canal would be more appropriate... Or am I just a bit too evil? lol

Originally posted by Freeborn


And as for those colonial cousins who will use this as a justification for their opposition to Obama's health care plans I would just like to point out that the faults with our NHS are down to serial mismangement, lack of funding from succesive governments and being a reflection of the very society that it is a part of.
Yet I will take it any day rather than accept any of the alternatives.

This is it, you never here the good stories about the NHS, I was diagnosed with a brain tumour in 2002 recurred in 2007, so I have been in and out of hospitals for the last 10 years and i have to say I think the NHS has been amazing. I've had surgery from one of the best surgeons in the world and been treated by the most reasurring and capable oncologists. I have two MRI scans a year had numerous chemotherapies, six weeks of radiotherapy, counselling, support groups and consistently supportive care from local GP's. Not to say its all wonderfull, you still have to make your voice heard to hurry things up and get things moving, receptionists can be rude and some nurses can be damn right uncarring idiots. But on the whole I can only find little fault with the NHS, i wouldnt be here without it, so i try to defend it when i see it being attacked. It aint perfect, but i dread to think what my out come would have been without a national health service.



[edit on 8-4-2010 by woodwardjnr]

reply to post by Yissachar1


It's the kids I feel for, myself I have EMEA wide roles (Europe, Middle East and Asia) under my belt.. And know asking for extra lanquages is a con since I speak very little of any other laquage and have run projects across 8 nations at the same time.. I try to learn, but everyone seems insistent on learning English.. So I end up the teacher rather than the pupil.. (frustrating)

On the other issue, I do agree that those canals seem like a better choice (my personal wish is they would invest a bit of cash in regenerating them) maybe that is why they used to hang draw and quarter people so that no part of the UK felt left out

But on topic, I'd still like to see more opportunities for those who live in this country to get roles in the NHS.. the front line services and infrastructure of this country is suffering greatly due to major under investment.. All I see in my home town is PCSOs and no real police presence.. I will say that ALL the PCSO's are women.. perhaps they have done away with the need for male officers

reply to post by Wotan


My family and friends have quite varied roles, radiographry, Aids & mental health specialist, podiatrists.. and I myself worked in histopathology and then as a pathologists assistant for a while.. (those where interesting times)

From a local perspectives of the above areas, the number of training places and further opporunties for all those area have dropped year on year for quite a few years (but that could be the local trusts)

Then there are the new middle ground posts, my brother was training to be radiographer, and end up only getting put forward for the newly devised technician post.. that has half the training/pay but all the same burdens..

If they keep skimming off highly trained roles to save some cash it will bite them in the rear at some point.... Imho they do need to get some balance back into the NHS structure, it is such a wonderful institution and seeing it so under funded gets me frustrated.

reply to post by woodwardjnr


Exactly.
Several family members have had extensive treatment which they would never been able to afford if having to pay privately and my younger brother would definately not been here if it had not been for a NHS specialist, (who also had a private Harley Street practice but felf honour bound to continue working for the NHS that had trained him).

Yes, it could, in fact most definately, should be much better than it is, but for all it's faults it still provides a great service and is taken for granted by many.

reply to post by thoughtsfull


Not only has the NHS been serially under funded by successive governments but it, like most governement organisations, suffers from appaling mis-management.
The vast majority of NHS managers have been promoted from within and the public sector and all it's failings are all they know.
The NHS refuses to appoint experienced managers from the private sector into any level and as a result is not subject to the standards the private sector would demand.

reply to post by Freeborn


My role is process improvement in major coporates, had a look at one biggie just before it all went pop (they got huge bailouts) and the coporates like that have the exact same levels of miss management as the NHS..

It isn't that they need the private sector, just an outside pair of eyes looking in.. How do they start if they do not know what they do not know is wrong with the system..

The Gov (of all flavours) have miss managed the NHS at some point it will bite them in the bottom.. It is such a wonderfull institution, it is a gutting to see it so miss managed.. the blind lead the blind on how to fix the NHS.

reply to post by poedxsoldiervet


I don't know what kind of health care you'll get after the bill passes but I would hope it is good enough.

Couple years ago in Newquay, I was accosted at a cash point by I think 4 people. My arm was laid across a curbstone and stamped on. Completely broken. I walked back to the pub, had a whiskey and then got a taxi to the hospital.

I had to wait for 30 mins while drunks were seen to. My arm was x'd and reset and stitched without painkillers because of booze I'd had. It was all jolly character building stuff and hurt something rotten. A decent cuppa tea
to boot.

However, the nurses and doctors of the NHS were bloody marvelous.

They were last month when they took a tumor out of my aunt's brain. They
were fantastic when they put my brother in law back together after a 70mph
head on car crash.

They were out of this world when they helped my mum through the difficult
birthing of my sister.

Election time. Let's not drag our medical people through %hite. The NHS does a damn site more good everyday than what the red tops would have you believe. But yeah, let's blame johnny foreigner.

PS. Don't Walt.

reply to post by thoughtsfull


Process Improvement,

Done quite a bit of that over the years, Six Sigma Black Belt, blah, blah, blah.

Seriously thinking about getting back into it.