The United States Takes the Matter of Three-headed Babies Very Seriously

You know, I always say that the Iraq war was something that had to be done sooner or later. Saddam had to go, well, being a raging lunatic massmurderer as he was. But the US botched the job they took on themselves, no thanks to conquerous loonies like Paul Bremer, and mercenary armies like Blackwater.

As far as DU goes...well, it may or may not have been the source of these deformities. My guts tell me it was. Regardless, however, the # is bad for you. It shouldn't be used. In the first place, it's only used to make up the balance for its lack of stopping power after getting rid of the old 7,62 mm rounds.

Why not dump the 5,56 if it can't even kill somebody without attaching a friggin' Hiroshima pill to it? Try using something more humane in terms of collateral damage, and yet something inhumanely destructive towards its intended target. Something that leaves him maimed, mutilated, dead as a door knob, a bloody pile of gore on the floor if you will.

It's war. It's not meant to be pretty. But it was never intended to be fought against the very people the US claimed to liberate, either, albeit indirectly. Kill in a gruesome way as long as it gets the job done, but make damn sure you kill the right people. And never compromise the safety of innocent bystanders to do it.


Besides, the military and Washington aren't the only ones to blame for this mess.

The least we as humans, not as soldiers, politicians or whatever, can do if we're going to bring war to a country, is to minimize civilian casualties, and make sure whoever is responsible for said casualty becomes a casualty themselves. Don't screw around and whine about it - tell it to the head honchos straight, and in no uncertain terms. We're talking about innocent lives here - not Americans or Iraqis, but humans. The least we can do for them is to get genuinly, flat-out pissed off, big time, and demand retribution for their deaths, in blood, and no less.

There shouldn't be room for half-baked regrets. Because it's half-baked regrets and hindsight whining over nasty photos shown on prime-time television, that allow the politicians to screw the pooch like they did in Iraq in the first place. And allows them to do it again and again for as long as they want.

[edit on 8-4-2010 by David_Reale]

Originally posted by Destiny Of Souls

Originally posted by oozyism
reply to post by rich23

 

The American terror is exposed daily, can't wait till the "what goes around comes around", statement becomes true..

Americans better do something now or seriously, a lot of pissed of people will be knocking on your door..

"Why do they hate us", makes me sick

I have been saying this since long time now, but it has finally come true in regards to America, I have always said that, once an empire is in a decline, the truth comes out..

LOL, 'what goes around comes around'? Empire in decline? Are you absolutely delusional?

Tell me, who is going to come to our doorstop and try to mess with us? Honestly?

Who do you think? You don't seriously believe this is a country for the people and by the people? You are going to sit there and tell everyone that the U.S is not in trouble? If you read the constitution and saw how far we have drifted from the ideals that were established, how fake our visible governance is and how evil the rulers of this world are, you might be singing a different tune.

reply to post by rich23


I do see your point.

I am not a warmonger...but the spread of ideas is done via honey not the sword.

We should at the very least educate the women and try to allow a liberal society rather then a theocracy of sorts.

Utopian...not...but to leave Iraq as we did Afghanistan after helping beat the Soviets left us with what?

Another war.

Why does anyone believe the initial report of a three headed baby and why does anyone think DU could responsible for this?

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov...

Two-generation reproductive toxicity study of implanted depleted uranium (DU) in CD rats.
Arfsten DP, Still KR, Wilfong ER, Johnson EW, McInturf SM, Eggers JS, Schaeffer DJ, Bekkedal MY.

Navy Drug Screening Laboratory, Naval Air Station Jacksonville, Florida 32212-0113, USA. [email protected]

Abstract
Depleted uranium (DU) munitions and armor plating have been used in several conflicts over the last 17 yr, including the Persian Gulf War and the Iraq War. Because of its effectiveness and availability, DU will continue to be used in military applications into the foreseeable future. There is much controversy over the use of DU in weapons and equipment because of its potential radiological and toxic hazards, and there is concern over the chronic adverse health effects of embedded DU shrapnel in war veterans and bystanders. This study evaluated the effects of long-term implantation of DU on the reproductive success of F0 generation adults and development and survival of subsequent F1 and F2 generations in a two-generation reproductive toxicity study. F0 generation Sprague-Dawley rats, 8 wk of age, were surgically implanted with 0, 4, 8, 12, or 20 DU pellets (1 x 2 mm). Inert implant control animals were implanted with 12 or 20 tantallum (Ta) pellets. The F0 generation was then mated at 120 d post DU implantation. In the F0 generation, when measured on postimplantation d 27 and 117, uranium was present in the urine of DU-implanted animals in a dose-dependent manner. F0 reproductive success was similar across treatment groups and the maternal retrieval test revealed no changes in maternal behavior. DU implantation exerted no effect on the survival, health, or well-being of the F0 generation. Necropsy results of F0 animals were negative with the exception of a marked inflammatory response surrounding the implanted DU pellets. For the F1 generation, measures of F1 development through postnatal day (PND) 20 were unremarkable and no gross abnormalities were observed in F1 offspring. No uranium was detected in whole-body homogenates of PND 4 or PND 20 pups. Necropsy findings of F1 PND 20 pups were negative and no instances of ribcage malformation were observed in F1 PND 20 pups. Body weight and body weight gain of F1 rats through PND 120 were similar across treatment groups. Eight of 414 F1 animals observed from PND 20 to 120 died of unknown causes; 7 were from litters of DU-implanted F0 mating pairs. F1 mating success at 10 wk of age was an overall 70% compared with 91% for F0 mating pairs. Mating success was similar between F1 animals derived from DU-implanted F0 adults and those derived from F0 implant control adults suggesting that the comparatively low mating success was not due to F1 DU exposure. The gestational index of F1 animals derived from mid-dose F0 mating pairs was found to be lower compared with F1 controls. The average gestation duration of F1 animals derived from high-dose F0 mating pairs was found to be significantly longer than F1 controls. F1 sperm motility analyses did not differ among experimental groups and no gross abnormalities were identified at necropsy among surviving F1 animals at PND 120. Histopathology of kidneys, spleen, thymus, bone marrow, ovaries, and testes of F1 high-dose animals did not differ from F1 controls. F1 high-dose females had significantly higher mean relative liver and heart weights compared with F1 controls; the biological relevance of this finding could not be determined. For the F2 generation, measures of F2 development through PND 20 were unremarkable and no gross abnormalities were observed in F2 offspring. Necropsy findings of F2 PND 20 pups were negative and no instances of ribcage malformation were observed in F2 PND 20 pups. Body weight and body weight gain of F2 rats through PND 90 were similar across treatment groups. Mean relative heart weights of males derived from high-dose F0 parents were significantly lower compared with F2 controls. Sperm motility and concentration analysis of F2 males at PND 90 were similar across F2 groups. Overall, the consistent absence of positive findings in this study seems to suggest that DU is not a significant reproductive or developmental hazard, particularly when one considers that mid- and high-dose rats were implanted with the equivalent of 0.3 and 0.5 lb of DU in a 70-kg human, respectively. However, the findings that seven of eight F1 adults that died postweaning were from DU-implanted F0 mating pairs, and that mean relative heart weights were elevated in high-dose F1 and F2 pups, suggest conservatism is warranted in characterizing the reproductive and teratogenic hazards of embedded DU until further studies are completed.

This study was done with equivalent of 0.3 and 0.5 lb of DU in a 70-kg human. And they say DU is not a significant reproductive or developmental hazard.

reply to post by Albastion


Did I say that depleted uranium is NOT responsible for the birth defects? No, but you feel that I'm saying that. Or you have an agenda...I don't know what is causing the birth defects, so I propose that it should be studied to determine the cause. If it's DU, so be it. My feelings against war and injustice are very strong. I'm completely against using DU and bullets for that matter. We should not be there.

But, you seem to want America to pay $...why?

[edit on 8-4-2010 by ibiubu]

Originally posted by Chevalerous
That's delusional man!

Many of the corporations which now are polluting in China are Multinational corporations and often American owned, who fled the tight regulated western world for less regulations and cheap labour in China.

Suck on that one for a minute!

I thought that to be obvious so didn't feel like it should be explicitly pointed out. Besides only some are American, a lot of them are from EU as well, actually the most polluting ones were from EU and Japan (suck on that? ). Not that Chinese prosperous government makes it any harder for them to wreak havoc.

reply to post by Destiny Of Souls

LOL, 'what goes around comes around'? Empire in decline? Are you absolutely delusional?

Tell me, who is going to come to our doorstop and try to mess with us? Honestly?

Umm Justice will come and knock on your door ^^ Justice went for Germany too remember..

Originally posted by ibiubu
reply to post by Albastion

 

Did I say that depleted uranium is NOT responsible for the birth defects? No, but you feel that I'm saying that. Or you have an agenda...I don't know what is causing the birth defects, so I propose that it should be studied to determine the cause. If it's DU, so be it. My feelings against war and injustice are very strong. I'm completely against using DU and bullets for that matter. We should not be there.

But, you seem to want America to pay $...why?

[edit on 8-4-2010 by ibiubu]

I don't have an agenda and I don't want America to pay money. I am an American citizen so of course I am against this. To me it's not about money at all, but about ethics.

I hated seeing in the article about Iraqi doctors "not wanting to embarrass America" about all the birth defects. As if America being embarrassed is the worst thing here... we are talking about human life being thrown away continuously, including this very moment right now, just to stop certain individuals from becoming embarrassed. The practices that are causing all of these defects continue unchecked... they are still going on. Whether or not there was a 3-headed baby is irrelevant. It is very likely just as dead as all the other hundreds of other deformed babies born in the war zone. A death is a death is a death is a death, and there have been hundreds.

I hated seeing arrogance like in the two-headed girl post, or straight ignorance like the ones suggesting that increased cancer is due to drug use. It really takes a delusional view of reality to turn a war zone into a drug-filled rave, and on top of that drugs don't give you cancer that quickly... so why even bring that up? It really feels like certain individuals in this thread are trying to obfuscate the effects of war on a region.

Some people may think they are helping a cause by blindly defending everything the military does at all times. However, we are talking about materials that are known to be very dangerous and harmful to our servicemen and women. When DU shells impact, they aerosolize and get picked up by the wind, where people hundreds of miles away can breathe it in, especially if it gets picked up by the jetstream. This includes civilians, our own military personnel, and possibly even Americans in America could be breathing in these particles and being harmed by them.

Call it whatever you want, but something about America going to war with a region seems to result in huge spikes of cancer and birth defects in those areas.

Can we blame Bush or is that over with.
I wonder if any DU arms handlers are affected like the agent
orange handlers from the Nam days.
So smart to avoid jungles this time and go to town in dust bowls.

RE: the OP....disgusting behavior. The people who run nations all over the world are disgusting people.

RE: America bashers....going to crap all over another thread, are we?

If i am ever in a concentration camp (which i won't, i will die fighting) and people come to our shores to overthrow the government, i doubt i will fear them. I will likely cheer them on.

But if America crumbles, what then? When that happens, the whole world will go to hell. And you will be left with Russia and China holding all the cards. Good luck with that.

reply to post by Albastion


I agree. If people think the DU rounds are so safe, why not purchase them to use for deer hunting?

If i put a few boxes of them in your house for safekeeping, would it be ok?

It is obvious.

reply to post by rich23


My God, that is a very disturbing story. It breaks my heart to think of what these poor women and their families are going through.

It also makes me so angry --- I (like many here) have never agreed with the US invasion of Iraq. And this story on top of the horrifying videos now coming out of Iraq -- makes me sick.

I've never understood why if we really want to help other countries --- we don't just build them houses rather than burn everything down. Heck, if we really wanted go nuts we could maybe help them farm and purify their water. But then we don't even take care of our own people. And of course TPTB dont really want to help anyone but themselves.

Very angry and sad.

Potential health effects of exposure to depleted uranium
In the kidneys, the proximal tubules (the main filtering component of the kidney) are considered to be the main site of potential damage from chemical toxicity of uranium. There is limited information from human studies indicating that the severity of effects on kidney function and the time taken for renal function to return to normal both increase with the level of uranium exposure.
In a number of studies on uranium miners, an increased risk of lung cancer was demonstrated, but this has been attributed to exposure from radon decay products. Lung tissue damage is possible leading to a risk of lung cancer that increases with increasing radiation dose. However, because DU is only weakly radioactive, very large amounts of dust (on the order of grams) would have to be inhaled for the additional risk of lung cancer to be detectable in an exposed group. Risks for other radiation-induced cancers, including leukaemia, are considered to be very much lower than for lung cancer.
Erythema (superficial inflammation of the skin) or other effects on the skin are unlikely to occur even if DU is held against the skin for long periods (weeks).
No consistent or confirmed adverse chemical effects of uranium have been reported for the skeleton or liver.
No reproductive or developmental effects have been reported in humans.
Although uranium released from embedded fragments may accumulate in the central nervous system (CNS) tissue, and some animal and human studies are suggestive of effects on CNS function, it is difficult to draw firm conclusions from the few studies reported.

So who would give a report like that the W.H.O. World Health Organization.

www.who.int...

Originally posted by bigfatfurrytexan
reply to post by Albastion

 

I agree. If people think the DU rounds are so safe, why not purchase them to use for deer hunting?

If i put a few boxes of them in your house for safekeeping, would it be ok?

It is obvious.

What is the danger of storing DU in a house? You can store them here. The reason DU is not used for deer hunting is that it is expensive. Lead is cheap. Led is also interesting in that world production has increased each year. Peak-lead has not been reached.

reply to post by stereologist



Very good. Store it at your place then.

I mean, there is nothing to fear from a product called "depleted uranium". Sounds almost like it could be called "Huggy Kissy Sugar Bear".

The problem with uranium is not the radioactivity, but the toxicity. The danger is that is like lead and mercury leading to heavy metal poisoning.

The depleted means that it has been depleted of much of the radioactive forms of uranium.

reply to post by Albastion


My point of view is quite similar to what you've written in this post. I most certainly was not defending the military, but I understand why you might have thought that based on your statements. No harm, no foul...Peace

I would have no problems with storing Depleted Uranium in my home. It's harmless in that regard. However that's not what this is about - we're talking about using it as a weapon, where on impact with armor DU ignites forming a dust. People ingest it through groundwater (etc) or breathe it in.

I mean, there is nothing to fear from a product called "depleted uranium". Sounds almost like it could be called "Huggy Kissy Sugar Bear".

Err, they call it Depleted Uranium because it is Uranium that has been depleted of its fissionable isotopes. Rather us call it Uranium-238 or Staballoy?

As far as DU goes...well, it may or may not have been the source of these deformities. My guts tell me it was. Regardless, however, the # is bad for you. It shouldn't be used. In the first place, it's only used to make up the balance for its lack of stopping power after getting rid of the old 7,62 mm rounds.

To my understanding no 5.56 round contains DU.

[edit on 9/4/2010 by C0bzz]

[edit on 9/4/2010 by C0bzz]

reply to post by C0bzz


i will not trust a government that is willing to experiment on me, a tax paying citizen.

asbestos was perfectly safe. cigarettes, too. hell, my tap water (that tastes like dirt and smells like fishy iron) is even called "safe", despite failing state quality tests for 4 consecutive months.

I believe i am given common sense for a reason. i have seen the ads proclaiming "heroin as a miracle tonic".