Too many 9/11 conspiracy theories. Let´s narrow it down.

Originally posted by weedwhacker
This is a very confusing question, perhaps it seems unclear because of the way you asked it?

I infer that since they hurt nobody with the Pentagon incident, they would also not hurt anybody in the planes.

Sorry, I meant since they didn't KILL anybody with the Pentagon attack, they probably wouldn't want to kill anybody inside of the planes, either.

reply to post by kiwasabi




Pentagon victims (partial list, other than those onboard AAL 77):

projects.washingtonpost.com...

FULL list:

List of Victims at the Pentagon (Not Including Flight 77)
Note: USA - United Stated Army; USN - United States Navy

SPC Craig S. Amundson, USA
YN3 Melissa Rose Barnes, USN
MSG Max J. Beilke, Retired
IT2 Kris Romeo Bishundat, USN
Carrie R. Blagburn
COL Canfield D. Boone, ARNG
Donna M. Bowen
Allen P. Boyle
ET3 Christopher L. Burford, USN
ET3 Daniel M. Caballero, USN
SFC Jose O. Calderon-Olmedo, USA
Angelene C. Carter
Sharon A. Carver
SFC John J. Chada, USA, Retired
Rosa Maria Chapa
Julian T. Cooper
LCDR Eric A. Cranford, USN
Ada M. Davis
CAPT Gerald F. DeConto, USN
LTC Jerry D. Dickerson, USA
IT1 Johnnie Doctor, Jr., USN
CAPT Robert E. Dolan, Jr., USN
CDR William H. Donovan, USN
CDR Patrick Dunn, USN
AG1 Edward T. Earhart, USN
LCDR Robert R. Elseth, USNR
SK3 Jamie L. Fallon, USN
Amelia V. Fields
Gerald P. Fisher
AG2 Matthew M. Flocco, USN
Sandra N. Foster
CAPT Lawrence D. Getzfred, USN
Cortez Ghee
Brenda C. Gibson
COL Ronald F. Golinski, USA, Retired
Diane Hale-McKinzy
Carolyn B. Halmon
Sheila M.S. Hein
ET1 Ronald J. Hemenway, USN
MAJ Wallace Cole Hogan, Jr., USA
SSG Jimmie I. Holley, USA, Retired
Angela M. Houtz
Brady Kay Howell
Peggie M. Hurt
LTC Stephen N. Hyland, Jr., USA
Lt Col Robert J. Hymel, USAF, Retired
SGM Lacey B. Ivory, USA
LTC Dennis M. Johnson, USA
Judith L. Jones
Brenda Kegler
LT Michael S. Lamana, USN
David W. Laychak
Samantha L. Lightbourn-Allen
MAJ Stephen V. Long, USA
James T. Lynch, Jr.
Terence M. Lynch
OS2 Nehamon Lyons IV, USN
Shelley A. Marshall
Teresa M. Martin
Ada L. Mason-Acker
LTC Dean E. Mattson, USA
LTG Timothy J. Maude, USA
Robert J. Maxwell
Molly L. McKenzie
Patricia E. Mickley
MAJ Ronald D. Milam, USA
Gerard P. Moran, Jr.
Odessa V. Morris
ET1 Brian A. Moss, USN
Teddington H. Moy
LCDR Patrick J. Murphy, USNR
Khang Ngoc Nguyen
DM2 Michael A. Noeth, USN
Ruben S. Ornedo
Diana B. Padro
LT Jonas M. Panik, USNR
MAJ Clifford L. Patterson, Jr., USA
LT Darin H. Pontell, USNR
Scott Powell
CAPT Jack D. Punches, USN, Retired
AW1 Joseph J. Pycior, Jr., USN
Deborah A. Ramsaur
Rhonda Sue Rasmussen
IT1 Marsha D. Ratchford, USN
Martha M. Reszke
Cecelia E. (Lawson) Richard
Edward V. Rowenhorst
Judy Rowlett
SGM Robert E. Russell, USA, Retired
CW4 William R. Ruth, ARNG
Charles E. Sabin, Sr.
Marjorie C. Salamone
COL David M. Scales, USA
CDR Robert A. Schlegel, USN
Janice M. Scott
LTC Michael L. Selves, USA, Retired
Marian H. Serva
CDR Dan F. Shanower, USN
Antionette M. Sherman
Diane M. Simmons
Cheryle D. Sincock
ITC Gregg H. Smallwood, USN
LTC Gary F. Smith, USA, Retired
Patricia J. Statz
Edna L. Stephens
SGM Larry L. Strickland, USA
LTC Kip P. Taylor, USA
Sandra C. Taylor
LTC Karl W. Teepe, USA, Retired
SGT Tamara C. Thurman, USA
LCDR Otis V. Tolbert, USN
SSG Willie Q. Troy, USA, Retired
LCDR Ronald J. Vauk, USNR
LTC Karen J. Wagner, USA
Meta L. (Fuller) Waller
SPC Chin Sun Pak Wells, USA
SSG Maudlyn A. White, USA
Sandra L. White
Ernest M. Willcher
LCDR David L. Williams, USN
MAJ Dwayne Williams, USA
RMC Marvin Roger Woods, USN, Retired
IT2 Kevin W. Yokum, USN
ITC Donald M. Young, USN
Edmond G. Young, Jr.
Lisa L. Young

[edit on 10 April 2010 by weedwhacker]

reply to post by weedwhacker


Interesting, because in the live broadcasts they reported no deaths inside of the Pentagon. Those "victims" are fake.

reply to post by Phil Jayhan

Two planes, on two different runways, with radically different numbers of passengers, with far different landing times, with radically different evacuation times, on two different ends of the airport. One at the IX exposition center the other by the NASA Glenn hangar, MILES AWAY.

I had a chance to read some of your research and I have to say I am impressed.
One thing about searching for the truth to what really happened on 911, one must keep an open mind, and yes, one will change his or her’s mind and beliefs when confronted with credible facts.

I am now convinced both planes landed at Cleveland Hopkins Airport.
I was convinced that only one plane landed, but you have shown enough proof that flight 1989 and flight 93 did land as well.

I ask in my early post for anyone to produces eyewitness accounts or records and you did come through.

I also wanted to add this tid bit below that also proved that flight 93 couldn’t have crash where the government said it crashed.

[color=gold]United 93 Still Airborne After Alleged Crash - According To ATC/Radar


1. The NTSB Flight Path Animation approach path and altitude does not support observations.
2. All Altitude data on the northern approach contradicts witnesses published by the New York Times.
3. Witness observations of approach path contradict northern approach as described by Popular Mechanics and the US Govt. Several witnesses observed the aircraft approaching from southeast over Indian Lake and from the south prior to witnessing explosion. Parts found in New Baltimore, 8 miles southeast of crater is a direct contradiction to the northern approach claimed by the US Govt.
4. Environmental Protection Agency reports no soil contamination of jet fuel after testing 5,000-6,000 yards of earth including 3 ground wells. Smoke plume photographed by a witness does not suggest a jet fuel rich explosion.
5. Impact angle according to Flight Data Recorder does not support an almost vertical impact as the govt story and crater suggests.

pilotsfor911truth.org...


Flight 93 Did Not Crash In Pennsylvania!

www.break.com...

Both planes landed in Cincinnati.

Originally posted by weedwhacker
List of Victims at the Pentagon (Not Including Flight 77)

Funny how all those bodies were identified (BEFORE) NIST came out with the new testing that was needed to update the 2001 testing.

The new testing was not ready untill 2002.



[edit on 10-4-2010 by REMISNE]

Originally posted by REMISNE
Funny how all those bodies were identified (BEFORE) NIST came out with the new testing that was needed to update the 2001 testing.

The new testing was not ready untill 2002.

This was discussed years ago, and disproven, Roger....on these very forums.

Those new "tests" were needed to help identify WTC victims, not Pentagon victims. You know that...why bring up that sad old argument, Roger?

No plane crashed in Pennsylvania OR at the Pentagon. Donald Rumsfeld's "slip" saying, "They shot down the plane over Pennsylvania", is just clever misdirection. When they get you to believe, "The plane was shot down", that automatically makes you assume there was a plane, even if you originally believed there was no plane (remember there was no plane DEBRIS). Don't give in to their mind games.

"Again. This is not an investigation. And I´m no truth seeker."

Obviously.

"No insult was intended for anybody.There´s no shame, no measure, people say the most incredible things, because we are all anonymous."

No insult was intended, but people say the most incredible things because they are anonymous? Ha! Ha!

"HAHAHA... I don´t think even you believe what you posted here."

Since I'm anonymous, how do you know what I think? Ha! Ha!

"Then you dig a little and find that it´s all presumptions, assumptions, fictions invented by improvised "investigators" and researchers, and scam artists getting money from the gullible."

No insult was intended, huh?

"Well, thank you SphinxMontreal, for your opinion. We are all entitled to one."

Thank you for informing me that I am entitled to my opinion.


[edit on 11-4-2010 by SphinxMontreal]

[edit on 11-4-2010 by SphinxMontreal]

"Thank you GoodOlDave!! Right on the spot. As always." "Thank you GoodOlDave. AN EXCELENT description of much of the "truth movement"."

THANK YOU! Now I fully understand the point of this thread. And by the way, 'EXCELLENT' is misspelled.

If you're going to start a thread, the least you can do is spell words correctly. Because, you know, people will take you more seriously.




[edit on 11-4-2010 by SphinxMontreal]

Originally posted by gavron
Those new "tests" were needed to help identify WTC victims, not Pentagon victims. You know that...why bring up that sad old argument, Roger?

So you ARE saying that there were no fires or building collapse at building 7, that they could have used the new DNA testing to help ID bodies.



[edit on 11-4-2010 by REMISNE]

reply to post by Phil Jayhan


Well Phil. I read two of your threads on “let´s roll” about the 4 flights of 9/11.
I don´t know where to start.
I think weedwhacker has made some pretty good points about your posts, and “your” article, from the site that “you” run, where “you” make many assumptions, and “you” reach conclusions, and claim that “you” have found proof of things, many of which were actually “made up” by “yourself”.
The information on BTS that you so often mention to base some of your theories on, you´re simply interpreting wrongly. I would suggest you call the people at BTS and have them explain it to you.
You make wrong assumptions based on what you read at BTS.
Also, you create a “Hollywood” style action feature, where air traffic controllers are fooled by intersecting trajectories flown by the airliners and some specially disguised military planes (or drones) and they are switched for one another in mid-air.
Neither are hundreds of people taken to Ohio to be given new identities, or hundreds of secret agents posse as passengers for the hijacking and then killed, and not a soul of the other hundreds necessarily involved has regrets to blow the whistle, or accuse somebody of mass murder.
As far as crew members being changed or having requested to make the flights, or not make them:
You make it appear as if this is suspicious. Well, nothing further from the truth. This is perfectly normal in most airlines, specially the majors, where you have so many options to switch flights with someone else, or take a flight that somebody doesn´t want, or is not going to make because he(she) got sick, or ask to be assigned to a flight for personal reasons.
Some of them are actually mentioned in your article, and believe me, they are perfectly normal, and ordinary day to day scheduling. Nothing suspicious there.
Basically what you do IMHO is create an explanation that suits an idea that you came up with, of something that you think could have happened. And you show practically no proof to back up your claims.

Originally posted by SphinxMontreal
And by the way, 'EXCELLENT' is misspelled.

If you're going to start a thread, the least you can do is spell words correctly. Because, you know, people will take you more seriously.

Thank you SphinxMontreal.
I´m trying my best not to misspell anything, as I see that it´s so important.
You see, english is not my natural language.
Sorry to those that may have been offended by any misspelling of mine.

Originally posted by kiwasabi
Donald Rumsfeld's "slip" saying, "They shot down the plane over Pennsylvania", is just clever misdirection. When they get you to believe, "The plane was shot down", that automatically makes you assume there was a plane, even if you originally believed there was no plane (remember there was no plane DEBRIS). Don't give in to their mind games.

Could this be a new (or old) conspiracy theory??
Are people in high ranks of the Gov. playing "mind games" with us??

Originally posted by impressme

Removed to edit.

[edit on 11-4-2010 by rush969]

reply to post by rush969


Rush, you are only giving your [color=gold]opinion and you have proved nothing about “Let’s Roll” website.

Instead of critiquing someone website, why don’t you do some real research and present us some real information from credible sources that could prove “Let’s Roll” information is not all correct. I stand to support his website and if you want to disprove his work why don’t you and Phil Jayhan have a real debate in a new thread.

reply to post by impressme


Well. As I´ve said it before. I don´t mind discussing ALL the theories out there.
But, the fact is that should be somewhere else because those other subjects are not part of this thread.
The thing with Phil is that he mainly thinks up of "stuff that could have happened", and then he posts that as the answer to the questions that arise.
For example. He will take the word of ONE anonymous witness claiming to have seen a plane that "could have been" UA93 sitting on a tarmac in Cleveland, but disregards the press reports where the mistake was clarified that authorities had confused UA93 and DL1989.
Or he will tell us that "perhaps" the pax. of one flight were "hearded" to board a different flight that the ones they had tickets for.
And that the Gov. should have video tapes of those pax. being taken where they weren´t supposed to go, and that on those tapes we should see the pax. protesting this treatment.
And stuff like this. It´s all made up. Fiction.

Originally posted by REMISNE

Originally posted by weedwhacker
List of Victims at the Pentagon (Not Including Flight 77)

Funny how all those bodies were identified (BEFORE) NIST came out with the new testing that was needed to update the 2001 testing.

The new testing was not ready untill 2002.



[edit on 10-4-2010 by REMISNE]

It's been proven to you before that this is not the case, that the new testing was not required to identify the Pentagon bodies (bar five for which it is unclear whether the new testing was sufficient or not). Why do you continue to repeat it as though it's true?

Originally posted by TrickoftheShade
It's been proven to you before that this is not the case, that the new testing was not required to identify the Pentagon bodies (bar five for which it is unclear whether the new testing was sufficient or not). Why do you continue to repeat it as though it's true?

Well i am going by the fact that there was fire and collapse at the Pentagon according to the official story. Fire and collapse was the reason the new testing was created.

So unless your stating now that there was no fire and collapse at the Pentagon then the new testnig was needed.





[edit on 12-4-2010 by REMISNE]

Originally posted by REMISNE

Originally posted by TrickoftheShade
It's been proven to you before that this is not the case, that the new testing was not required to identify the Pentagon bodies (bar five for which it is unclear whether the new testing was sufficient or not). Why do you continue to repeat it as though it's true?

Well i am going by the fact that there was fire and collapse at the Pentagon according to the official story. Fire and collapse was the reason the new testing was created.

So unless your stating now that there was no fire and collapse at the Pentagon then the new testnig was needed.





[edit on 12-4-2010 by REMISNE]

You do know that there are different kinds of fire and collapse?

My uncle's garage caught fire and collapsed last year. I think it would be a stretch to suggest that it was a similar incident to the WTC. And if he'd been in it I don't think we would have needed new DNA techniques to identify him.

Although according to you, we would.

They have been narrowed down 2 only 1 theory-not many