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America: The Grim Truth

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posted on Apr, 7 2010 @ 02:20 PM
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reply to post by warequalsmurder
 


That's what the article is saying along with some of the people here in this thread. Before I quit my job, I had $150 taken out of my checks for benefits. All I had to pay for visits was co-pay. My health care plan was 100% paid for.




posted on Apr, 7 2010 @ 02:20 PM
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Originally posted by johnnyg5646
I think everyone should post their education level when responding to a post from now on. So many of the people on these boards have NO idea how to do real research, or how to tell what research is valid.

To anyone on either side of the argument who cite facts from their own lives as reasons for supporting their claim, please don't do that. It makes you look uneducated.


Psychology Major 3 years.
Regressive Therapy 1 year.

Finished neither, started a career and my job has NOTHING to do with either lol.

You don't have to have your brain plucked out and hung on a wall with a tassel to be intelligent or educated though! Some of the most brilliant people I have ever met had nothing more then a basic education, but they knew how to learn.



posted on Apr, 7 2010 @ 02:21 PM
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I hate to break it to most of you guys but America is not a bad place to live. If it was then why do millions try to become American citizens every year??
Best places to live (because I have been there) have to be Australia, Canada, pretty much all over Europe, and America. All you Amercians act like your life is soo hard
. Yet you have shelter over your head, an internet connection, and an income. There are countries where they don't have a fraction of what we take advantage of everyday and we don't even think twice about it. I would advise everyone that is crying about America or any of the countries/continents I listed above to go to Africa, Iraq, Afghanistan, Russia, Mexico, or Somalia. Those are the people that really have something to btch about. So shut up and stop crying or leave your country because we don't want you anyway.



posted on Apr, 7 2010 @ 02:23 PM
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reply to post by Clisen33
 


Your still living at home and going to school. This is why you don't understand much about people's gripes here. Once your safety net is gone and your power/water get's turned off for the first time because you chose to pay your state car insurance so that you can get to you job and pay your rent, reality will fall on top of you like a ton of bricks.

The youthful, idealistic, patriotism that glimmers in your eye at this moment will be at last extinquished.



posted on Apr, 7 2010 @ 02:28 PM
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Originally posted by Clisen33
reply to post by warequalsmurder
 


That's what the article is saying along with some of the people here in this thread. Before I quit my job, I had $150 taken out of my checks for benefits. All I had to pay for visits was co-pay. My health care plan was 100% paid for.


That's right, you had to pay for it. Ask yourself what $150 will do to your budget once rent, car payments, auto insurance, sky high food prices, gas, utilities, clothing, phone, internet, and all factor in.

Mind you, Walmart isn't paying a middle class wage to begin with.



posted on Apr, 7 2010 @ 02:28 PM
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Originally posted by johnny2127
I constantly wonder why people do not realize that there is a difference between being compassionate and incentivizing people to be dependent on govt and producers. You can be compassionate and think that people sometimes fall on tough times and need help, but also think that govt has no responsibility to provide for everyone. The problem with the US right now, and Europe in general, is we used to be a country of doers. A country where people did not look to govt for a handout or for support. . But instead to take care of themselves. A country where govt was limited and worked for the citizens not against them.


I completely agree with everything you said. There's too many whiners in this country. People here got used to being taken care of instead of working for the things they want. Too many people want free this and free that, yet they don't want to get off their ass and do something about it.

I know too many cases of immigrants living here in the U.S. who came here with NOTHING and worked their way into huge salaries, in some cases became millionaires because the opportunities (if only you use your brain) are plenty more than in most parts of the world. When these people come here they can't believe all the possibilities.

Then you have the case of the Americans who were born here. A lot of them can't spell or read as well as an immigrant who moved here only three years ago, and English is a new language to him/her. I'm an immigrant, I had to learn English from scratch and without trying to boast about it (only trying to prove my point), I find myself correcting the spelling and grammar of Americans born here. My spelling and grammar skills aren't perfect, but they sure as hell are better in many cases.

I disagree with the original post. Life in different countries with different rules is better and worse. You trade freedoms for freedoms. There will be some places that are marginally better or worse than others, but to say that living in America is terrible, that's just not true. You make your life what it is. If you can't make it in America, I honestly can't imagine where in the world you would be able to make it.

We can't all be millionaires, and we can't expect to be paid a huge salary even though we lack skills, motivation, ambition and education. If what you're doing isn't working, do something else. Use your head. Don't blame your failure on everything but yourself. Take responsibility for the actions you have taken. Life isn't easy anywhere in the world, unless you're born into wealth, and even then just because you have all the money you could ever spend, you just might end up unhappy due to your relationships, environment and who knows what else.



posted on Apr, 7 2010 @ 02:31 PM
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Originally posted by warequalsmurder

Originally posted by johnny2127
reply to post by warequalsmurder
 



This is what those govt's want..... a drunk, powerless, unmotivated public that is therefore unlikely to rise against them.



As opposed to what our government wants?..... a stupid, powerless, apathetic public that is therefore unlikely to rise against them?



“To move ahead you need to believe in yourself...have conviction in your beliefs and the confidence to execute those beliefs.”
“Without faith, hope and trust, there is no promise for the future, and without a promising future, life has no direction, no meaning and no justification.”

So keep the people hopeless and they will do whatever you want them to do. They have no hope, they have no hope to change anything, they have no drive to change their situation.

Like breaking a horse, you put a large lead rope on a young horse and train it to think it can't get away. It then will forever think that the simplest rope will hold it, when in reality it can break away from most all lead ropes.

Now I once owned a horse that learned that if it sat back while it was tied it could break the lead rope and wouldn't be saddled. (So we shot it.)
KIDDING!! We stopped using the cross tie.



posted on Apr, 7 2010 @ 02:40 PM
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reply to post by warequalsmurder
 


[snip]

That has happened already. My wife and I have been through those hardships almost to the exact, which is the reason why we don't live in our own place, by choice. The choice to move in with our parents in order for me to go to school full time is our choice, and a damn good one in my opinion.

And yes that "safety net" is what you call family compassion.

[edit on 7-4-2010 by Clisen33]

Mod edit: Let's keep the insults out of it please.


[edit on 7-4-2010 by Dr Love]



posted on Apr, 7 2010 @ 02:46 PM
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Originally posted by warequalsmurder

Originally posted by Clisen33
reply to post by warequalsmurder
 


That's what the article is saying along with some of the people here in this thread. Before I quit my job, I had $150 taken out of my checks for benefits. All I had to pay for visits was co-pay. My health care plan was 100% paid for.


That's right, you had to pay for it. Ask yourself what $150 will do to your budget once rent, car payments, auto insurance, sky high food prices, gas, utilities, clothing, phone, internet, and all factor in.

Mind you, Walmart isn't paying a middle class wage to begin with.


I wasn't working at Walmart while receiving that plan. I was able to afford all of the other bills plus some extra money on the side. You're acting like everyone is living the life you stated.



posted on Apr, 7 2010 @ 02:54 PM
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Originally posted by Clisen33

I wasn't working at Walmart while receiving that plan. I was able to afford all of the other bills plus some extra money on the side. You're acting like everyone is living the life you stated.


You are talking in strange circles now. If you were so able to aford all of your bills than why do you live with the parents now?

[snip]



[edit on 7-4-2010 by warequalsmurder]

Mod edit: No need to throw logs on the fire.

[edit on 7-4-2010 by Dr Love]



posted on Apr, 7 2010 @ 02:59 PM
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reply to post by 2manyquestions
 


It is possible, but not EVERYONE can be the Boss, there are not enough jobs to go around with huge paycheck. The system is broken.

In my culture we were taught to honor and protect our elders, family and nation. We are only as strong as our weakest link and only as healthy as our sickest person. True spiritual people know this. We are our brothers keepers.

Its the responsibility of the strong to watch after the meek.
ITS MY JOB to attend my nation and bring us ALL up together. When faced with a person who is not a good hunter, then instead of putting them to the back of the trail that person is lead to the front and taught by the party to do better. The kids who are great hunters right away are let be and they grow on their own, the kids who had troubles were given the attention to make them better, that way EVERYONE GOT TO EAT.

Again, the I before U mentality is whats caused our troubles. ME ME ME and MINE MINE MINE is killing us all and sooner or later those with nothing and nothing to loose will come after all that the greedy folk had horded.
And its never a nice "mind if I have some?" its a BANG "your dead and I'm taking what you kept."

I'm not talking utopia, I am talking basic human needs met and then when they are met you can grown and become better.

Like "Clisen33' who moved back home to go to school. His needs are being met allowing him to grow further. His family has taken the role of provider until he can do it own his own. We all need to realize we are all family.

Until we pay a little more attention to our fields here at home, the grass will of coarse be greener in Canada (:-P joke ) on the other side.

[edit on 7-4-2010 by Loki Lyesmyth]

[edit on 7-4-2010 by Loki Lyesmyth]



posted on Apr, 7 2010 @ 03:02 PM
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reply to post by warequalsmurder
 


You insulted me by stating I was youth, and know nothing of house hold responsibilities.

I am majoring in computer networking technology, going to a university full time. In order for me to do this, I had to quit my job with SGS.

SGS

Yes I had opportunity, but I did not want to work in that industry. I was paid $18.00 an hour with no formal higher education. I would have to do a large amount of grunt work to move up, which takes a lot of time.

Is that good enough for you?

[edit on 7-4-2010 by Clisen33]



posted on Apr, 7 2010 @ 03:03 PM
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Thats right, if these people dont like america, something must be wrong with them! (sarcasm)

Its not that living here is intolerable. Its that the people in charge take great advantage of the workers, and share as little of the profit with them as possible. This is legally mandated by the corporate setup. Further, to all those who want to say how wonderful america is because living here is better than living in mexico or africa or somalia....first off, i would point out what a flawed rationale that is. Secondly I would have you examine at what expense our life is better than in those places. Many of our comforts and luxuries come from forcing many of those living in third world countries into sweatshops and slave type labor situations. Many of our excesses are born on the cost of stealing other nations resources, of putting dictators into power who cater to our corporate agendas, such as the Shah, Papa doc, trujillo, baby doc, suharto, etc. Much or our largesse comes from crushing fledgling democracies that attempt to wrest their countries natural resources from american corporate control, and installing leaders willing to sell their natural resources to us for cheap.

Many who come here as foreigners and wonder at the riches here often never realize that much of that is provided by america bankrupting the very countries that they come from. Read "Confessions of an economic hitman", or "peoples history of the united states", "shock doctrine", or many other books that show how we manipulate other nations policies to funnel resources and wealth to american corporate owners....who then funnel much of that money to 3rd party banks to avoid paying american taxes on it. Learn about the true motives for many of our wars and altercations, and about how those in power really abuse that power for their own interest, as congress regularly makes legislation that supports lobbyists and corporations, directly contrary to the interest and well being of the american citizen, and other citizens of the world.



posted on Apr, 7 2010 @ 03:08 PM
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I'm out of here, this has gone way too far. I'll continue what I'm doing regardless of what others think or see what they want to see.

America is not as bad as people want it to be...



posted on Apr, 7 2010 @ 03:09 PM
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reply to post by OnceReturned
 


I agree, this article is nothing more than anti american propaganda.

I have a good life, because I work my ass off. Not because my government pays my bills. Ive traveled extensively, and I feel there are MANY awesome places in the world. Materialism, and healthcare are extravagances. Why, there are places in this world that are so beautiful, serene, safe, but the people have no doctors within a hundred miles, their water is dirty, and food is often scarce, but they're still happy.

So when you put things into perspective, how exactly do we gauge the "quality of ones life?" Are there some crack pot doctors going around the world asking people "how happy are you?", then taking notes? BS

I bet the author of that article, fled the US because he got caught diddling little kids. Im sure he loves living in his new country that doesnt frown so much on those sorts of weirdos



[edit on 7-4-2010 by WhiteDevil013]



posted on Apr, 7 2010 @ 03:15 PM
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By the time i began seeing my home land for what it was while still residing in it, i would share my thoughts and opinions about what i was noticing, and often was told 'well if you dont like America, leave it'..i took that advise and ran like hell with it! There are many people who love it there, who remain 'faithful' to the backwards mess of a place and continue to jump to defend the nation at every turn.. and either these people have yet to see what the place really is, or they simply dont care..If i am seen as 'anti american' by some, so be it.. i tire of apologizing for my beliefs based on actually living there, and then being able to step back from the place when i first moved over seas, which all together gave me a whole different view of my birth place..as a child i was a proud american, thinking (as all americans were and are taught) that we were free, powerful, and the best of the best.. only to grow up and realize how sadly far removed from truth or fact any of that actually is..its bred a populace of arrogant, over the top with everything, greedy, ignorant consumer whores..even my most loved and cherished family and friends over there fit into this sentence...imo the entire country needs knocking down a few pegs...maybe the time will come, or maybe it wont.. I understand people standing up for this country, it was born, bred and pushed to all citizens to do just that, but one day that veil will slip, and when it does it will be a very big, life altering shock for many.. but hopefully if this does happen, it will help make it more clear what a huge dung heap the place is. A flimsy plastic country that feels exceedingly unstable...flame or ignore me if youd like to, please.. but this is my '2 cents' regardless of what others may think of me for feeling the way i do on this subject... On my post i wrote to explain my dislike of America a few weeks back (titled American Hostility) someone told me that i was a whining poor kid (or such to that extent) because the system didnt work for me, automatically assuming i lived my life there on government hand outs.. very far from the truth.. my partner and i both busted our butts to get ahead after we had our child.. to no avail. (my parents, friends and sibilings as well broke their backs- my father -a VERY patriotic man btw- did so quite litterally, to simply live happily..) and sense America is indeed a consumer/materialistic nation on most levels, it has become a rich mans country... and the rich men certainly didnt get that way by working hard and being honest! But all of this comes down to perspective as well, yes maybe i and my family as a whole did just have a bad experience of life there, but this seems to be more and more the case for many others who have tried and pursued a good life within its borders, only to realize it just doesnt work like they had been led to believe. Sorry for length, i will not rant here on this again lol..



posted on Apr, 7 2010 @ 03:20 PM
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reply to post by Clisen33
 



No, not really.

But don't forget that it was you who chose to criticize my decision to leave a broken system.

A system that forces adults (there, no youth word used this time) to move back in with their parents in order to succeed. Not everyone enjoys such a fortunate safety net.

A system that is becoming more and more fascist by the day.

The OP had valid points. I agreed with them. You did not.

You may feel free to keep struggling in a system that keeps moving the goal posts further and furhter away brother. I'm not saying you should be barred from doing just that if you choose. But please don't try and tell me words to the effect that I'm at fault for deciding to go down a different path.

I agree to disagree at this point. So let's move on.



posted on Apr, 7 2010 @ 03:21 PM
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my freind who is from Canada told me today that when he gets older, he wants to move back there because of how much better it is there than here. i always thought it would be better there than here because they have universal health care and that itself is much better than the # we have in america. I always dreamt of moving to a country in Europe or moving to Canada. Probably northern Canada because I love the cold, it would be peaceful up there and I know French.



posted on Apr, 7 2010 @ 03:24 PM
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"The nine scariest words in the English language are "I'm from the government and I'm here to help." - Ronald Reagan



posted on Apr, 7 2010 @ 03:35 PM
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reply to post by warequalsmurder
 


You see the problem all started when I neglected to do well in high school. If I had finished high school and went on to college in what I'm doing now, I wouldn't be in this situation.

The OP just linked an article and agreed with it. The article is biased and the idea in it was taken way out of proportion. "You have the worst quality of life in the developed world – by a wide margin."

[edit on 7-4-2010 by Clisen33]





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