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The Questions they will not answer

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posted on Apr, 6 2010 @ 01:28 AM
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I want to know why war was a major topic with the left 3 years ago and now they have seen the light. WHY? Did I miss something? Honestly I want to know is this war now justified that it is under new control? And what about the patriot act. Just because Obama may not use it does not mean the next guy wont. And lastly is it alright to kill American citizens without a court trial?


To tell you the truth it seems like it is not about the issues but who is putting them forward. Both sides should look at the issues and not just go with the plan. This is my last post for awhile I am taking a break from ATS. The trolling is to the point that it is not about the issues but what side you are on. I will answer questions in this thread but I am not going to post for awhile. I need a break.


[edit on 6-4-2010 by Subjective Truth]




posted on Apr, 6 2010 @ 01:34 AM
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War is the health of the State.

That's all you need to know about why Democrats now support the war.



posted on Apr, 6 2010 @ 01:37 AM
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Originally posted by mnemeth1
War is the health of the State.

That's all you need to know about why Democrats now support the war.




I find it so hard to understand? Just because the white house is under new management now the wars are alright? This is a crazy way to look at it.



posted on Apr, 6 2010 @ 02:03 AM
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I don't like the wars, I think that we need to stop these wars and bring our troops home.

I think it was wrong for Obama to commit more troops to Afghanistan (even though that during the campaign, he did say he was going to send more troops to Afghanistan) I think it was a wrong decision.



posted on Apr, 6 2010 @ 02:14 AM
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Look at it this way ST, the US government is financed and controlled by whom? Who do they protect? Where are our bases located at?

If you look at the 700+ bases it will answer your questions. All bases are located at locations of major corporate headquarters or manufacturing facilities. What did the government say when we had Mexican helicopters and drug lords coming over the border? Better arm yourselves.

Sorry, the government does not exist for the individual, it exists for the corporations. Which if you use the definition under US code, corporations are persons.

See here-Tell me, are you a person, citizen, resident, corporation or a HUMAN BEING?


edit to add-ST states this-



I find it so hard to understand? Just because the white house is under new management now the wars are alright? This is a crazy way to look at it.


Look here for your answers from these people-
Now that the Democrats are in Power "War is good"!


[edit on 4/6/2010 by endisnighe]



posted on Apr, 6 2010 @ 02:21 AM
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reply to post by endisnighe
 


You are a good man and I will continue to enjoy your posts keep up the good fight. And your new avatar is impressive.



I truly believe that agendas are what is running America all the way down to the bottom. We do need change but the change we need is to remember who we are and why America is great. We dont need to prove this down a barrel of a gun. We prove it by living in a free country were all men and woman are equal. This is why we are great.



posted on Apr, 6 2010 @ 02:48 AM
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One thing I did notice is that war became Just a bit more acceptable now that Obama is in office. I remember talking to a friend of mine about the deployment of more troops into Afghanistan. He said he actually agrees with that because that's where the enemy is located.

I couldn't believe my ears.

I don't love Obama.
I don't hate Obama.
I'm just disappointed with his policy to keep the war going where it doesn't belong. In fact, it doesn't belong anywhere. If we want to stitch up our image in the world, especially Middle East, we need to withdraw our troops from Afghanistan and Iraq. Sadly, we'll Never leave the two.

But anywho, sorry for the rant. Interesting topic to say the least. Hell, I'll flag and star it



posted on Apr, 6 2010 @ 03:03 AM
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reply to post by GorehoundLarry
 


Thanks I think it has alot to do with party politics. And we lose sight of right and wrong. We need to look at the issues not the men who are selling them.

[edit on 6-4-2010 by Subjective Truth]



posted on Apr, 6 2010 @ 03:27 AM
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reply to post by Subjective Truth
 


There is essentially no difference between the current occupant of the White House and the previous President. The left is staying quiet about the wars and the fact they are continuing because they cannot bring themselves to admit they have been had.

With the possible exception of Ronald Reagan, the only real Presidents we have had in my memory are Dwight Eisenhower and JFK. Both of them left us with wisdom that has been ignored. America as I knew it died the day Bush Sr, LBJ and the CIA killed John Kennedy.

Eisenhower: "beware the military industrial complex"

JFK: "The very word 'secrecy' is repugnant in a free and open society."

We have a government that is controlled by the military industrial complex and secrecy that is totally out of control. A huge amount of the so called "secrets" are secrets which any foreign government is well aware of but which is secret only to protect the butts of those in power here.

America once was the bastion of peace, we did not start wars, we finished them, we were a beacon of hope to the rest of the world. Now we are being turned into a third world socialist/communist state where the elite whether they be Democrat or Republican live their special life while sucking the lifeblood from the lowly serfs.

We are too busy trying to survive and fighting amongst ourselves about fake "politics" to realize we have been royally screwed.



posted on Apr, 6 2010 @ 03:30 AM
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reply to post by GorehoundLarry
 


Holy# and pigeon turds. I just gave GHL a star. Did it just make a dent in his world or did he just dismiss the anti war stuff because he is a diehard dem.

Hmmmm?

Question, if a dem was anti war before Obama and they are pro war, does that make them a hypocrite?

As old Ben use to say-

"Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."

"Sell not virtue to purchase wealth, nor Liberty to purchase power."



posted on Apr, 6 2010 @ 03:33 AM
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reply to post by expat2368
 


I agree 100% with you. We need to not start wars and only fight when we have to. We should always keep a big stick but only swing it when we are really sure who we are swinging it at.

War has become a industry just like soft drinks or pizza. We need to lead by example and not down the barrel of a gun. I wish the liberals would realise they have been lied to. There is nothing wrong with making a mistake but eventually you need to be honest with yourself. It is never to late to change the path you are on.



posted on Apr, 6 2010 @ 08:12 AM
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I think 'expat' is bang on the money with this one.

Government is becoming ever more insular and lacking in understanding of how real people have to live.

I feel sorry for the service people. They give every part of themselves and die for the Government and its just one big confidence trick.

Lions lead by donkeys?



posted on Apr, 6 2010 @ 10:11 PM
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Originally posted by Subjective Truth
I want to know why war was a major topic with the left 3 years ago and now they have seen the light. WHY? Did I miss something? Honestly I want to know is this war now justified that it is under new control? And what about the patriot act. Just because Obama may not use it does not mean the next guy wont. And lastly is it alright to kill American citizens without a court trial?


To tell you the truth it seems like it is not about the issues but who is putting them forward. Both sides should look at the issues and not just go with the plan. This is my last post for awhile I am taking a break from ATS. The trolling is to the point that it is not about the issues but what side you are on. I will answer questions in this thread but I am not going to post for awhile. I need a break.


[edit on 6-4-2010 by Subjective Truth]


This is typical Rovian-style political baiting. You ask the question 'what has happened to change liberals thinking?'

Are you kidding? That is the fundamental question that discredits the obama-hating conservatives that are beginning to border on traitorous in their rhetoric and behavior.

Were you there when we were marching against the wars (2 of them costing trillions)? Medicare Part-D pharmaceutical welfare plan? Bush being selected by the supreme court with a MINORITY of votes? And on and on and on.....

No you weren't. Do you remember what guys said about protesters way back then??

Code Pink
Cindy Sheehan
ANSWR
WTO
G 20

Were you there? Or, did you mock the protesters, call them crazy, unamerican, and traitorous?

Did you question the 2000 election, or did you wish you had one of those 'Sore/Loserman' shirts?

Did you chant 'up or down vote' when democrats threatened to filibuster? Remember the nuclear option for judges? Were you all mad about secret tricks and parliamentary maneuvers?

How about the vote being held open for hours and hours so Bush could twist arms on the medicare part d vote?

God, this list could go on for miles about how you mocked people that questioned the government. So, don't even try to make this into 'liberals aren't being consistent.' Especially, because liberals are upset with many aspects of Obama, and have been vocal.

Best,
Skunknuts

P.S. Since you say you are leaving ATS, and you are the one poster constantly accusing people of 'posting for pay,' shall I ask if your contract is up?? That would just be too perfect if you were the mole all along, lol. Kinda like how the most homophobic people are often the biggest closet cases, you know?



posted on Apr, 6 2010 @ 11:22 PM
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Alright I'll bite on this one:

Afghanistan: I have always supported the United States/NATO action in Afghanistan. Contrary to popular belief on ATS, I do believe the US was attacked on 9-11 and has full recourse to attack the people that bombed your country.

Iraq: I have opposed this war since the rumblings of it began, and I continue to think it an illegal and amoral action by the United States. That said, it would be foolhardy to just pack up and leave in the middle of the night. Phased withdrawals are the best solution and I agree with President Obama on that point. Get your boys home safely and securely.

Now I'll throw one back at conservatives: When President W. Bush was in office I constantly heard the mantra of "support the president because he is the president." Where did that one go?

It seems instead that you have adopted the liberal mantra of "dissent is patriotic." I have never said that protesting is against the spirit of the United States, as much as I disagree with the protesters on healthcare reform, I support their right to lawfully assemble and make their voices heard as much as they wish to.

Just admit it though, the "support the president because he's the president" line was bull.



posted on Apr, 6 2010 @ 11:42 PM
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Originally posted by Subjective Truth Honestly I want to know is this war now justified that it is under new control?


Under international law, there are only two legitimate reasons to war with another nation.

1/ If your own country is physically attacked, you are permitted to defend yourself with "reasonable force".

2/ If the United Nations Security council votes that some type of combined military action needs to be taken against a rogue nation that poses a dire threat to world peace and stability.

America has not been militarily attacked by either Iraq, Afghanistan, or Iran.

The UN has decided to act jointly in Afghanistan, but not to act against either Iraq or Iran.
Simply because there is no reason to do so, at least no reasons compelling enough to convince the majority of UN member nations to act.

As far as the Patriot act, homeland security, US gun ownership laws, or martial law in America, that is an internal American political matter that must be decided by Americans themselves.



posted on Apr, 6 2010 @ 11:54 PM
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Originally posted by ProjectJimmy. Contrary to popular belief on ATS, I do believe the US was attacked on 9-11 and has full recourse to attack the people that bombed your country.


And the way that was done, and subsequently covered up, you can only draw two possible conclusions.

1/ It was an inside job by the US government and government agencies.

2/ It was carried out by a foreign power, so entrenched and entangled in the US government and government agencies, that they are inseparable.

From what is now being said, and increasingly incriminating evidence, Israel is a far more likely culprit, along with traitors within America, than a few guys sitting around a camp fire in a cave in Afghanistan.



posted on Apr, 7 2010 @ 02:22 AM
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reply to post by Silver Shadow
 


Yep, see I knew this was going to be the response to my post. Instead of actually commenting on my views on the wars and the nature of political debate, you just repeat the 9-11 "conspiracy" idea. Way to dodge my entire post!

I am not in this thread to debate 9-11. Instead, I will debate the nature of the wars, and my views on them.

Since I do believe that Islamic terrorists attacked the United States by turning your own airliners into missiles, I believe that the US has a right to defend herself from what was a blatant act of war.



posted on Apr, 7 2010 @ 02:38 AM
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I believe strongly in defense of hearth and home. I disagree strongly with "might makes right." My Dad, a WW2 vet, told me about that.
It seems no matter what party or ideology, people will jump on the bandwagon with whomever they deem strongest.
I will jump on the wagon of those I deem best.
I live in one of the best places in the US.My neighbors are pumped up and physically strong. They have tats, goatees, trucks, and harleys.
They are a batch of ignorant fools.
Many cannot even use a computer, some can't even read.
They are racists, bigots, ageist, sexist, machine-heads, alkies, drug users, or retirees who have no interest. This is my small-town America.
I love them for who they are, but I will drive my own wagon, as long as I live here.
I jump on the wagon with my truth-seeking friends worldwide online, tho my posts sometimes get deleted !
They can't answer real questions, they have no basis to contrive an answer from.
blessings.



posted on Apr, 7 2010 @ 02:41 AM
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reply to post by CestLaVie
 


It seems you are wanting to put them all in the same box that you have made in your mind. Every person is different and just likes books it is not what is on the the outside that counts.



posted on Apr, 7 2010 @ 02:44 AM
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reply to post by skunknuts
 


Just like always you assume to know just exactly were I stand I hate Bush just as much as I hate Obama. They are brothers from different mothers. But I know it is not about the facts with you it is more about the cause. I see you for what you are.




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