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Stop fighting with trolls! You are aiding in the derailment of a thread!

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posted on Apr, 2 2010 @ 08:40 PM
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So we all know that trolls and partisan baiting run rampant in this and other forums here on ATS. I've been seeing countless threads and posts where people lash out against these "disinfo agents" and "ignorant sheep" as if it's going to stop them from continuing.

You know what the best way to not get a thread derailed is??

COMPLETELY IGNORE THEIR POSTS.

By wasting a post trying to fight them, or point out that they are spreading disinfo only derails the thread even more. I know this is hard for a lot of people. Somebody will post something and it makes your blood boil. You want nothing more than to put them in their place or get into an argument with them to show them how they are trolling or otherwise spreading disinfo. Whenever you do this, you've successfully contributed to derailing that thread.

So stick to the topic in the OP, and if someone is trolling, don't even address them. Everyone knows a troll when they see one, and if we all start doing this, we may be able to actually have some relevant discussions on this site without four pages of posts containing nothing but petty arguments over details.

[edit on 2-4-2010 by paradigm619]




posted on Apr, 2 2010 @ 08:42 PM
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reply to post by paradigm619
 


Flagged, I totally agree, thus the thread I made just a while ago on this issue.



posted on Apr, 2 2010 @ 08:53 PM
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reply to post by paradigm619
 


Good Advice . I fell for that " Trap " once here and it earned ne a " Stop Sign " and -500 Points . I Repent !.................And WILL Not Forget .........


[edit on 2-4-2010 by Zanti Misfit]



posted on Apr, 2 2010 @ 09:10 PM
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completely agree, however get ready, they should be here to derail this thread in

3....

2....

1...



posted on Apr, 2 2010 @ 09:14 PM
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reply to post by paradigm619
 


I agree with your post, I do, but SkepticOverlord has already created a thread outlining the importance of not feeding trolls: I'm pissed!! (political trolls and hacks) as well as many other members. We don't need any more.



posted on Apr, 2 2010 @ 09:16 PM
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Where's your proof????

Just kidding, I raised a flag for ya. I just want to follow the countdown.

I've been sucked in by the trolls, I'll try to elevate if I can above replying to them.



posted on Apr, 2 2010 @ 09:16 PM
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Originally posted by paradigm619
So we all know that trolls and partisan baiting run rampant in this and other forums here on ATS. I've been seeing countless threads and posts where people lash out against these "disinfo agents" and "ignorant sheep"


Oh Dear!

So if someone doesn't agree with your point of view, they are either 'disinfo agents' or 'ignorant sheep'? Honestly!

Though I understand the general message you are trying to convey; you kind of screwed it with ad hominems... and it starts to sound more like sour grapes toward anyone with an opposing point of view.


IRM



posted on Apr, 2 2010 @ 09:27 PM
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Totally agree with OP.
I just got a warning for asking a troll to show proof, as they always do

Maybe the " or s t f u didnt help.
But you are right, last time I get baited..



posted on Apr, 2 2010 @ 09:59 PM
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reply to post by paradigm619
 


It's sometimes difficult for a novice like myself to discern a strongly differing opinion from a post meant to troll.

If I accidently step in crap, am i as guilty as the dog that left it?



posted on Apr, 2 2010 @ 10:03 PM
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reply to post by InfaRedMan
 


You're right, and I was worried it might sound that way in my OP. I'm not trying to stifle differing opinion, as that is something that makes this site great. But I think we can all tell when someone posts something knowing full well that they are trying to get a reaction out of people with opposing viewpoints.

These are the trolls and posts I was referring to. I'm all about differing opinions as long as there is room for discussion.

EDIT: Just thought I'd add that the ad hominems I mentioned in the OP are simply references to what I've seen others on ATS call people that do this. I wasn't trying to say that everyone I define as a troll is a disinfo agent or ignorant sheep.

[edit on 2-4-2010 by paradigm619]



posted on Apr, 2 2010 @ 10:18 PM
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I'm wondering if any of you know the meaning of ad hominem?

Wikipedia's explanation is as follows:


The term ad hominem has sometimes been used more literally, to describe an argument that was based on an individual, or to describe any personal attack. However, this is not how the meaning of the term is typically introduced in modern logic and rhetoric textbooks, and logicians and rhetoricians are in agreement that this use (equated with "personal attack") is incorrect.


Or


Ad hominem abusive usually involves insulting or belittling one's opponent, but can also involve pointing out factual but ostensible character flaws or actions which are irrelevant to the opponent's argument. This tactic is logically fallacious because insults and even true negative facts about the opponent's personal character have nothing to do with the logical merits of the opponent's arguments or assertions.


en.wikipedia.org...

Just thought I'd throw that into the mix.....

[edit on 2-4-2010 by Damian-007]

[edit on 2-4-2010 by Damian-007]



posted on Apr, 3 2010 @ 02:41 PM
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It's amusing to see the trolls of ATS claim they await for trolls to come derail this thread.

Good stuff.

Anywho,

There have been many threads about this. If you don't like it, ignore the noobs...why make a thread about it to feed them?



posted on Apr, 3 2010 @ 02:42 PM
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I take this approach (if I am thinking clearly that day).



First address their concerns, maybe they are NOT a troll and actually have a legitimate issue/concern.

For good measure we should address these accordingly.

But, after repetitive obvious instances of ignoring counter-points, continually attempting to escalate the debate yet never addressing counter-points, and repetitive name calling designed to provoke flaming; we have to be admitting by now this poster is being a unfair.

By this point, they should be ignored. Because it is obvious they are not seeking debate but rather they seek anger and frustration. (For "LuLz")

But never automatically assume someone is a troll, this is prejudice and wrong.

Test someone first (by engaging in legitimate debates) before you label them, that way you at least have an idea what they are truly here to accomplish.



posted on Apr, 3 2010 @ 02:50 PM
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reply to post by 23refugee
 


No, it's not your fault that is why it is called an accident.

If you started eating the dog troll poop and then waived your hands around drawing attention to the mess you have gotten in - then it just becomes an accident prone person looking silly who is in fact covered in someone else's poop.



posted on Apr, 3 2010 @ 02:54 PM
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Ok and here are some differences between name calling.

For instance, people often call other people "sheep" (I try to avoid using this term).

Sheep is not a inflammatory label, it is designed to provoke the person being called it to re-evaluate their mental stance. Of course, that term "sheep" or "sheeple" is way overused in totally the wrong context, more often than not.

In the same vein, when someone calls a person supporting violence a "terrorist", it is not meant to start a flame war. The label is meant to cause the person spouting violent ideology to re-evaluate their position and perhaps consider adopting a more peaceful and less "terroristic" approach.

On the other hand, "Trolls" use "inflammatory labels".

Terms like the N word, redneck, "jew", etc, have deep histories and many rooted issues of frustration and anger. By calling someone one of these words in a derogatory manner, you are seeking to "dig up" those old ancient negativities buried within us all.

Another example, the other day a poster repetitively called me "Snowflake" or "Sweetheart" or "Son". This form of derogatory speech was designed purely to provoke me into a flame war with him. It was all too obvious, and so I never allowed him that satisfaction.

That is why they are a "troll" seeking a "flame war drama event", which destroys a thread (its an excellent tactic to defeat legitimate issues on websites like this).

In real life, if you called me snowflake, son, and sweetheart in that tone of voice I would gladly go to jail for breaking your nose right there. I would not mind you winning the fight, but by God I would get a piece of you first.
Hey look we are all human, people can easily press our buttons if we let them.

But this isn't real life, he was calling me that on the Internet because he wanted to start crap. I can't punch him for it. I can only post a response.

Therefore it is prudent to post a response based on rational argument or better yet, Ignore him altogether (which I did once I realized what he was actually trying to do- start crap).



posted on Apr, 3 2010 @ 02:59 PM
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Originally posted by KeepUptheMATRIXing
reply to post by 23refugee
 


No, it's not your fault that is why it is called an accident.

If you started eating the dog troll poop and then waived your hands around drawing attention to the mess you have gotten in - then it just becomes an accident prone person looking silly who is in fact covered in someone else's poop.


Yeah well, if that is an issue perhaps the issue should be left up to those with experience who can detect the poop and handle it without getting any on themselves.

Then safely remove it from the area of interest.

Don't like touching poop? Use Tongs and a Dust Bin.


Gloves help too. Poop removal is not too delicate a matter..

Hey it's your metaphor.



posted on Apr, 3 2010 @ 03:06 PM
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Originally posted by InfaRedMan

So if someone doesn't agree with your point of view, they are either 'disinfo agents' or 'ignorant sheep'? Honestly!

Though I understand the general message you are trying to convey; you kind of screwed it with ad hominems... and it starts to sound more like sour grapes toward anyone with an opposing point of view.


IRM


Correct this is why specific criteria have to be set in order to use these terms accurately.

Without using specific criteria and organizing our thoughts in this way, we will be simply doing exactly what you said.

We will be no better than the ones we condemn, because we will be ignorantly labeling them just as has been happening over and over for all of human history.

To break out of this prison of ignorance, this repetitive pattern of stupidity, we must utilize the Scientific Method.

We must test our hypothesis by engaging in productive debate and attempting to find logical and rational solutions to our questions.

Those who seek to derail this logical and rational debate with "inflammatory name calling" or "use of logical fallacies yet never admitting the fallacy when confronted with overwhelming evidence to indicate they were incorrect".

There is a fine line between "hard headed or stubborn" and someone who is "intentionally attempting to destroy any semblance of discussion debate".

Only though the scientific method can we establish accurate facts to work with in the matters of "detecting trolls".

I admit, I haven't really thought about it much until this thread. So I am kind of typing this on the fly here. I suppose I am just philosophizing.

[edit on 3-4-2010 by muzzleflash]



posted on Apr, 3 2010 @ 07:15 PM
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reply to post by KeepUptheMATRIXing
 


You've just witnessed an accident by the accident-prone.

In an attempt to avoid a dry monologue, I lamely chose to attempt a pithy "bon mot".

Not everyone realizes that they're the troll.



posted on May, 15 2010 @ 01:42 PM
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Hi, everyone. I thought I'd give this thread a bump because I feel it needs to be viewed again. Plus there seems to be more trolls coming out of the woodwork lately.

I've noticed that more & more trolls are latching onto the threads with themes involving the environment & animal abuse/killing.

Although I appreciate someone else's point of view, I find it disheartening that certain unnamed individuals are targeting these threads because they know that environmental & animal topics tug at our heart strings. It doesn't take a genius to know that environmentalists & animal lovers are easily upset when a troll pops up telling us their "viewpoint" about why we need to relax or why someone deserved to have their dogs shot.

Seriously, you trolls need to find a new outlet for your anger issues. Stirring the pot in these forums & causing the topics to become derailed by your ignorance & arrogance is not accomplishing anything. If anything, you're making those who care about animals & the environment even more passionate, so your sick agenda is working against you anyways.

So, what I am trying to say is that we need to remember that we shouldn't fight with trolls. It does truthseeking no good. Feeding them only fuels the fire & they truly need to starve to death.



posted on May, 15 2010 @ 09:26 PM
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I am sooooo guilty of fighting trolls. It's my fear that if someone posts something factually wrong, like "Obama is trying to ban all guns." I feel the need to correct that before some kid reads it without a fact check and will believe and go around spouting the same crap.

Kinda like Fox News viewers!




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