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"Why Aren't Americans Fighting Back?"

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posted on Mar, 31 2010 @ 09:04 AM
I like pattons response "make the other bastard die for his country"
but this article does raise of interesting ensights as to American
society issues...


A non-US-citizen celebrates an attack on the CIA, and asks why Americans tolerate occupation?

A foreign friend of mine, who must remain nameless here, recently contacted me to wish me a happy New Year and to celebrate the martyrdom operation in Afghanistan that claimed the lives of eight CIA agents. "This is wonderful!" he enthused. "Eight CIA agents at once! They must have had excellent intelligence and pulled everything off perfectly."

I said I found it hard to get excited about a bunch of people getting killed, regardless of what they may have done to deserve it.

"That is the problem with you Americans," he said. "Half of you are too stupid to resist your oppressors, and the other half reject violence even when it is justified and necessary."

I told him I was flattered to be considered part of the non-stupid segment of the American public, but that even as a non-stupid non-pacifist I often find it hard to know when violence is justified or necessary.

"If your country were invaded and occupied by a hostile foreign power, your people slaughtered and tortured, your women raped, your religion and customs violated, your resources looted, would violent resistance be justified and necessary?"

"Of course."

"So when the people of Afghanistan blow up eight CIA agents, are their actions justified and necessary?"

"From their point of view, sure."

"What about from your point of view?"

"As an American citizen, I'm trying to change things peacefully through legal, Constitutionally-protected means of protest."

"You would be much more effective if you built a real resistance movement and blew up CIA agents. Or better yet CIA directors."

I explained to him that I wouldn't have the faintest idea of how to go about blowing up a CIA director even if I wanted to. It's obviously a lot more complicated than "stick a fuse up his ass, light it, and run like hell." And not all CIA directors are 100% bad. Remember William Colby? And what about all those former CIA people who have spoken out for 9/11 truth? What if somebody had blown them up?

"Your country is occupied by CIA-Mossad and the finance mafia that runs it," he said. "They killed the Kennedies. They killed Martin Luther King, Jr. They killed Wellstone. They killed Gary Webb. They kill everyone that gets in their way. They start wars that kill millions. They rig your elections. They listen to your telephone conversations, read your emails, and use your cell phone as a roving microphone. They blackmail everyone of note, and if they can't blackmail them, they frame them or neutralize them or kill them. Every American President since Reagan has been a CIA agent. Your Constitution is a dead letter. It was dead long before 9/11."

I admitted that this was all true.

"Your country is under occupation. In Palestine, Afghanistan, Iraq, Somalia, and other places, when people are occupied, they fight back. Why won't Americans fight back?"

I explained that a lot of us are fighting back. It's called the infowar.

"Infowar is great," he said. "But it doesn't cost them enough to change their way of doing business. If you want a bad man to change his behavior, you have to give him some incentive for change. You have to raise the cost of the bad behavior until it becomes intolerable. A lot of grumbling on the internet doesn't really cost them very much."

What would be the best way to raise the cost, I asked. A general strike? Riots in the streets?

"Yes, those are time-honored methods," he said.

I explained that the whole point of the infowar is to wake enough people up so that some day soon, when the economy gets bad enough, people will take to the streets, and the cops and troops will be on our the final scene in V-for-Vendetta.

"V wasn't afraid to use violence as part of his infowar," he said. "Nor are the people of Palestine, Iraq, Afghanistan, Ireland, Somalia, the Basque country, Vietnam, Cuba, Venezuela, Yemen, and everywhere else on earth where people are fighting occupation by the global financiers and their hired guns.

"What counts is having a culture of resistance. Where there is a culture of resistance, everybody pitches in to help. Some people set off bombs or organize attacks on occupation forces. Others, the great majority, fight the infowar and build a support network for the actual fighters. Even the biggest pacifist, where there is a culture of resistance, helps the resistance fighters by providing food, clothing, money, shelter, and encouragement, and by misdirecting the authorities and refusing all cooperation with them and sabotaging them whenever the opportunity arises."

I asked why pacifists would be helping an armed resistance.

"Because they recognize that the violence is coming from the occupier, and that only attacks on the lives and property of the occupier can raise the cost of occupation high enough to end it."

"But most Americans don't perceive themselves as victims of a violent occupation," I said. "We of the smart half see ourselves as occupiers of other countries, while the dumb ones see themselves as potential victims of violent terrorists who attack us because they hate our freedoms."

"Forget the dumb half," he said. "You need to convince the smart half that they are not occupiers. Why should Americans identify with the evil assholes who are raping the planet? Americans are under violent occupation, just like the people of other occupied lands, and they should build an effective resistance. You need to convince them to start thinking of it as an actual war, not just an infowar. In an actual war, the only thing that matters is reducing the enemy's ability to wage war, and to raise the cost of his continuing to wage war until the cost becomes intolerable."

I said I had no idea how to do that. Wouldn't attacks on lives and property be counterproductive?

"It depends whose lives and property," he answered. "Attacking ordinary Americans in their passenger airplanes and office buildings helps the occupiers, not the resistance. That's why the occupiers are behind so much false-flag terrorism. But attacks on the leading men behind the occupation of planet that could be very productive. Attacks on their property, kidnapping of their loved ones, and of course assassinations, these tactics would raise the price of their behavior. If the powerful men who craft the evil policies had to live in fear, they would have a powerful disincentive to continue crafting evil policies."

Kidnappings? Assassinations? Are you kidding?! That would be WRONG, I screamed, Nixonesque in my self-consciousness, that would be SO wrong! Why, the very idea! How utterly APPALLING! Don't you realize that the bad guys could be listening in even as we speak?!

My friend just chortled, remarked on what a hopeless bunch of boobs Americans are, told me that he wouldn't ask me to celebrate any more blastings of CIA agents, wished me well in my infowar, and went back to wherever he came from.

I chewed over his words for quite some time. I decided I'm not sure I entirely agree with him, but I'll tell you this: they'd have to waterboard me quite a bit before I'd give up his name.


[edit on 31-3-2010 by Anti-Evil]

posted on Mar, 31 2010 @ 10:09 AM
Why Americans don't fight back

1. The biggest reason is, a majority don't see too much of a problem. Many trust the government, and what they do.

2. The next largest group of people see a problem, but believe through using the system, it can be changed. Some of these people believe it is just Obama's administration, while others thing it is rooted a little deeper, but all the same they believe they can use the system itself to vote in people to change things.

Allow me to be sincere for a moment, I rallied behind Obama. I thought he could bring about change. I'll have to say, his rhetoric is simply enchanting and it was a fresh of breath air from Bush. Two months after he is sworn in, he's already breaking campaign promises that for me, were major. If a man who seemed so good for the job like Obama proved to be just a continuation of things, there is no hope for the system.

3. The last group is the most diverse. Here you'll have your revolutionaries, your anarchists, your actual libertarians. You also have remnants of those against Obama, who have become violent and over passionate.

I believe violence and revolution to achieve the means that many in this group want is not always helpful. You need to pick and choose your battles. There has yet to be an effective, wide spread, non-violent action against the government and no, the tea party does not count, because the tea party has been taken over by neo-con ideology. In fact prior to their take over in 08/09, the tea party WAS the largest non-violent action actually against the government.

This 3rd group though is dramatically split on this issue of violence vs non-violence. Most on either side believe the opposite can not work for one reason or another. Few believe they can both work side by side.

I believe the two, in the end, are irreconcilable. Basically, one of these two sides must act. The problem here is that for neither side are the needed numbers present. If you want to include the tea party, which I see as a mixture between groups 2 and 3 presented here, there may be but their focus is not solid. Lets face it, either a majority or a loud minority of tea party supporters are #ing stupid, being led around by their faux nooze figure heads and a women who's mental capabilities are all but present.

I actually believe that the purpose of all this is to create dissent. If you look back in our history, it is in times of greatest turmoil where great change comes and in our country, outside of the revolution every time of great turmoil has only been detrimental towards true liberty. The civil war was the catalyst in allowing the exponential growth of the federal government. The great depression was the catalyst in sowing the seeds in the federal government transforming it further into a bizarre mixture of fascist-socialist-corporatism. And I believe the tea party is being pushed to act as a form of violent dissent, domestic terrorism and the like, to spark a new time of turmoil for the next great change in the nation.

The powers that be, essentially, are pouring gasoline onto a pile of powder kegs. They're orchestrating something big and as everyones attention is on the explosion and the fire and as the smoke stacks trail off in one direction, TPTB are going to be striking down more on liberty and freedom as no one notices, in interest of our "security".

I don't believe this to be a possibility but eventuality. It may happen this year or in the next few years to come, but the actors are in place, have been given their lines, and the stage props are in position.

The only solution for those against this would be to muster a great amount of peaceful dissent. Not just towards the current administration, but towards the entire system. The economy, the government at every level, and everything in between. It needs to be done before it's too late, because we're going to be losing the internet before all this begins. Communication will not exist as it does and right now it's our most powerful weapon against them.

I believe the best way to do so is set a proper decorum. Not of fringe lunacy but of pure disdain for the status quo and skepticism towards everything being spoon fed to us. TPTB use certain tactics to do what they. Psychological, rhetorical, hypnotic. They know that the human mind can be controlled but not overtly. You only need to tip one domino tile over for the mind to have that tile hit the next one and so on and so forth. WE need to do the same. The deluded, apathetic masses are been made so by these methods and by these methods the masses can be turned back. We need to transform that apathetic nature into disdain for the system.

The fact is this, the government is supposed to be for the people, by the people. It is not for the people or by the people. Our revolts and actions would need to be peaceful but loud and I mean really loud. We need people who know how to speak, that know what to say, how to say it, and towards whom. Because that is the key. The word is a the most powerful weapon on the planet because it is by that means we get things done, and we need to utilize for ourselves.

A culture of resistance is needed but peaceful resistance. There are choke points in the system that if the resistance is used properly will asphyxiate the system. No violence. No aggression. But stoic, virtuous noncooperation. And if they attack us, let them attack us. If they shoot us, let them shoot at us. Let all of humanity watch as the last bastion of liberty is covered in the blood of those fighting for their liberty and not let one drop of blood from the aggressors be dropped to truly highlight who is the blood letter.

If at that time, TPTB resort to overt aggression and totalitarian control, let that be the time for violence. But let them cast the first stone. At this point, with how things are going, it's a sacrifice I'm willing to make and many others as well. Transform your anger into words and words only, let them be the uncivilized barbarians and expose them for who they truly are.

That is what I believe.

posted on Mar, 31 2010 @ 11:53 AM
Shouldn't there be an American forum on here? Where rants like this can go?

Besides, people are far too lazy to even care what happens abroad. Especially when it concerns dodgy CIA members being killed by people trying to protect their homeland.

Most Americans lead a comfortable safe life of over indulgence. So why would they try to rock the boat against a government that's basically done what it wants for the last 200 years?

[edit on Wednesday20102010-03-31T11:54:12-05:00am315420103 by thesneakiod]

[edit on Wednesday20102010-03-31T11:55:28-05:00am315520103 by thesneakiod]

posted on Mar, 31 2010 @ 11:56 AM

Originally posted by thesneakiod
Shouldn't there be an American forum on here? Where rants like this can go?

Why does there need to be an American forum on American Top Secret?

Sarcasm aside, isn't there an American specific forum anyway? "US Political Madness"?

posted on Mar, 31 2010 @ 01:12 PM
reply to post by Anti-Evil

Sounds like a pretty smart guy to me. Too bad more Americans don't even realize they're being oppressed. That's the biggest problem is they are kept inundated with pointless crap to keep them occupied and not thinking about what's really going on around them. People in America seem to be slowly waking up to things but maybe not fast enough. Reminds of the frog in the pot analogy where they slowly warm the water up and the frog doesn't even think to hop out. Instead it just eventually boils and dies. If you were to toss the same frog into already hot water they'd jump right back out but since they warm the water slowly and keep em occupied with pointless garbage and divided over pointless garbage they can't think to jump.

posted on Mar, 31 2010 @ 03:37 PM
Alright, well let's make this a constructive discussion.

I know truth is being spread, but it is mixed with so much other false or half truths that it is very difficult to know what to believe as truth. I mean I believe every person on this planet possesses the ability to be brilliant, given they are fed truth. People for the most part believe things since they think what is being told to them is the truth.

So, if spreading the real truth is the key then what exactly would that message be and what would be the best ways (in detail) to have people take notice? We saw that having a giant peace parade in the streets of LA is apparently not good enough.

Please make your responses constructive towards the topic at hand.

posted on Mar, 31 2010 @ 04:07 PM
reply to post by Redwookieaz

Too bad more Americans don't even realize they're being oppressed.

Just give me some specific examples of how I am personally oppressed???

I ask this so many times...I almost am tired of asking it...and I never get a good response.

Better yet...give me some specific examples of how YOU are oppressed.

posted on Mar, 31 2010 @ 04:36 PM
It is like one of the commenters said....there are far too many americaans who live their lives with abundance. They have no complains....why make noise if everything is allright?

The way I see it is that the US is slowly and silently taken over by a group of Skulls with Boners......

They rule passive aggresive.....they will not allow to loose a presidential election and give away that power. They have installed a member of the organisation on all key strategic positions in government, militairy and indusrty. Nobody will notice that the cards are handed out their way.

It has no use to rely on honest elections or the wisdom of the senate.
The only way to have a change is to boot them out...other wise they will not leave....that simple.

posted on Mar, 31 2010 @ 04:40 PM
reply to post by zatara

The way I see it is that the US is slowly and silently taken over by a group of Skulls with Boners

I don't mind being taken over by skulls....but I draw the line at boners. I will not be taken over by boners!!!!

But we are being taken over by skull and bones in your opinion...but to what end? What is their evil end plan that they are leading us to?

posted on Mar, 31 2010 @ 04:54 PM

Originally posted by zatara

"The way I see it is that the US is slowly and silently taken over by a group of Skulls with Boners......"

I don't know if it's in the translation, but this statement could not be said any better!!

They rule passive aggressive.....they will not allow to lose a presidential election and give away that power. They have installed a member of the organization on all key strategic positions in government, military and industry. Nobody will notice that the cards are handed out their way.

It has no use to rely on honest elections or the wisdom of the senate.
The only way to have a change is to boot them out...other wise they will not leave....that simple.

And this person from across the pond has got it figured out, much better than many Americans. Good observations!!

The clock is ticking.

posted on Mar, 31 2010 @ 04:59 PM
What a great thread Anti-Evil, immediate S&F. I believe just about everything that guy said is true.

Until we make them pay the way they are making our sons and daughters pay with their lives, it costs them nothing other than a little aggravation from a bunch of internet posters to continue doing exactly what they have been. He's right. It has to cost these people more. A LOT more, until they change their ways. If the pen is mightier than the sword, why is it they keep using swords, and we keep using pens? And you see where that's gotten us.

posted on Mar, 31 2010 @ 05:11 PM
reply to post by OutKast Searcher

Spend a little time investigating the Skull and Boners of 1909-1912 and their activities. One of them had a son and grandson become President. Both are "Skulls".

Take a look at Brown Brothers Harriman, who they were/are and what they did during, and after, WWII (the big one) for the Rockefellers. Dig deep into Prescott Bush and Averill Harriman and you might get what zatara is telling you.

The "Skulls" own this country and as we speak we're getting the b****.

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