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MPs call for review of arms exports after Israeli assault on Gaza

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posted on Mar, 30 2010 @ 05:25 AM
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MPs call for review of arms exports after Israeli assault on Gaza


www.guardian.co.uk

A cross-party group of MPs will call today for a review of the way arms sales are approved after the government admitted British equipment was "almost certainly" used in the assault on Gaza last year.

"It is regrettable that arms exports to Israel were almost certainly used in Operation Cast Lead [the attack on Gaza]," the Commons committee on strategic export controls says in a report published. "This is in direct contravention to the UK government's policy that UK arms exports to Israel should not be used in the occupied territories."
(visit the link for the full news article)


Related News Links:
www.haaretz.com
www.jpost.com
www.ynetnews.com
www.maannews.net

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posted on Mar, 30 2010 @ 05:25 AM
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This is excellent news. The U.K is actually starting to take steps to pressure Israel into a peaceful settlement with the Palestinians and not soley relying on harsh words of condemnation.

This site lists the military equipment Britain sells to Israel.
www.caat.org.uk...

From the Guardian


''After the attack on Gaza, David Miliband, the foreign secretary, told the Commons that all future applications for arms-related exports to Israel "will be assessed taking into account the recent conflict".

He said Israeli equipment used in the attack on Gaza "almost certainly" contained British-supplied components included in cockpit displays in US F-16 combat aircraft sold to Israel, and components for the fire control and radar systems, navigation equipment and engine assemblies for US Apache helicopters.

The equipment also included armoured personnel carriers adapted from Centurion tanks sold to Israel in the late 1950s and components for the guns and radar in Israeli Sa'ar-class corvettes which took part in the operation.''


This equipment seems pretty vital in keeping the IDF/IAF running. Although i am sure they will find another supplier if the U.K actually follows through and bans some of these exports.

With the expulsion of the Mossad chief last week and now this, Israel is really going to have to start considering its actions in relation to the Palestinians.

I wonder if U.S/U.K actions towards Israel are being co-ordinated? Its pretty clear Obama is not willing to back down on forcing a real Israeli commitment to a peaceful two-state solution with the Palestinians.

The Quartet also recently affirmed the commitment to a Palestinain state by 2012.


But a two-year goal for the creation of a Palestinain state was reiterated.

UN Secretary General Ban Ki-moon said: “The Quartet continues to support the Palestinian authority’s plan of 2009 for building a Palestinian state within 24 months, as a demonstration of the Palestinians’ serious commitment to an independant state that provides good governance, opportunity, justice and security for the Palestinian people.”


www.euronews.net...

Is this now turning into an international consenus and commitment to action on who is to really blame for the continuing conflict?

Could the U.S and the rest of the world begin to scale back arms exports to Israel?

www.guardian.co.uk
(visit the link for the full news article)

[edit on 30-3-2010 by Peruvianmonk]



posted on Mar, 30 2010 @ 05:45 AM
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reply to post by Peruvianmonk
 


Nothing will come out of this, Israel has too much influence over the whole of Western world, or maybe the other way around, who knows. They are playing mind games with us, they have been doing it for a long time..

Mind games are simple, effective and cheap.. Best way to control the population.

Good Job Politicians, very awesome Job indeed..



posted on Mar, 30 2010 @ 05:54 AM
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reply to post by oozyism
 


I do think something could come of this. This is quite a broad range of politicians throwing their weight behind this call.

I do not think there is much sympathy with Israel among the British population, so i do not think it would be a politically risky move.

I think this argument about Israel being able to control Western politicans is starting to fall apart. What with Obama's treatment of Netanyahu, Britain's expulsion of the Mossade Chief, the head of the U.N calling the settlements in E. Jerusalem and the W. Bank illegal whilst on a vist to Israel and the international commitment to a Palestinian state by 2012.

I see little control and influence being exercised by the Israeli government over the international situation.

Still we need to keep our fair share of cyniscim on this issue
, as when hopes have risen for a peace settlement in the past they have been savagely cut down again and again.

[edit on 30-3-2010 by Peruvianmonk]



posted on Mar, 30 2010 @ 06:14 AM
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reply to post by Peruvianmonk
 


It has been proven that politicians lie to keep people happy for a certain time, they measure anger similar to temperature, hence once they get too angry they will do something to reduce the anger, at least something.. Kicking the Mossad chief out of the country is that something, but seriously is that a solid action? Or is it a show?

The settlements have been illegal for a long time, but what can the UN chief really do? Israel has been condemned more than any country in this whole world, when thinking about its short existence..

How many resolutions have been passed against Israel? Even in the security council? Who always supports it? The Western nations.. Even in regards to war crimes we haven't seen any Western states cut ties with Israel.

Cutting ties is what I call a solid actions, stopping aid is what I call solid actions, calling for sanctions is what I call solid action.. Why has America banned all trades with Cuba? Has Cuba committed war crimes? Has Cuba built a Concentration camp? Has Cuba spied on Britain, or used British passports to commit crimes against sovereign states?... etc



posted on Mar, 30 2010 @ 06:18 AM
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We shouldn't even be selling arms to Israel in the first place, what with them being a rogue nuclear power and all that, so the fact that a few MPs have got the hump over Cast Lead is, quite frankly, a joke. It might also help if the US, which itself operates illegally by supplying Israel with financial and military aid would stop abusing their veto power at the security council and impose and enforce an arms embargo against them.

Then again, we're all a bunch of war criminals who couldn't give a monkeys about international law so yeah, nothing will come of this.



posted on Mar, 30 2010 @ 06:29 AM
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reply to post by oozyism
 


I agree with you on the treatment of Cuba. Disgraceful.

But cutting ties with Israel is not the way to go. Firstly that is not how international politics works. The U.S/U.K and others cannot simply cut all ties overnight after supporting Israel since its creation.

This move would also strengthen the hand of extremists in Israel and a siege mentality would eusue and the situation would degenerate even further. Consistant pressure from ALLIES is what will lead to a change in the situation between the Israelis and the Palestinians.

I believe this is what is beginning to happen.

You are right in that the U.N, at the moment, cannot enforce anything on Israel in relation to Israel on the illegal settlements. However abstaining on issues relation in relation to Israel, such as a possible resolution against Israeli settlement building in E.Jerusalem,
news.bbc.co.uk... is a tactic that the Obama administration is considering as the AIPAC loving Congress cannot interfere in voting at the U.N. This will start to give the U.N more power over the issue.


This kind of tactic by the Americans towards France (an ally) , who they had previously supported at the U.N, over their occupation of Algeria, helped eventually force a French withdrawl in 1962.

I think we have to hope that the coalition in Israel will collapse and that the Kadima party will come to power. They are by no means peace loving hippies but they have at least shown a willingness to further peace with the Palestinians.


[edit on 30-3-2010 by Peruvianmonk]



posted on Mar, 30 2010 @ 06:42 AM
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reply to post by Peruvianmonk
 


How can they cut ties? They are all in this together, that is why I claimed they are playing mind games with us..

I'm saying if they weren't in this whole thing together, they would have cut ties by now, or at least take some form of solid action against Israel.

Let's just wait and see..

You are an optimist, nothing wrong with that



posted on Mar, 30 2010 @ 06:56 AM
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reply to post by oozyism
 


There is still a lot of Western guilt over the Holocaust. This is one of the reasons the ties would never be cut. After all it happened in Europe, and the Allies made little attempt to directly aid the Jews and OTHERS being exterminated in the death camps even when it became very evident to the whole world.

The Israelis know how to exploit this guilt. However I do not believe they are all in this together. The U.S is FINALLY starting to realise that Israeli and U.S interests are not intertwinned and that Israeli policy is damaging the U.S.

After all, Bin Laden and his irke are quite specific in their condemnation of U.S support of Israel in its occuption. This was one of the main reasons given for the 9-11 attacks,www.cbsnews.com... however others believe Bin Laden just uses the Palestinians for political capital, www.juancole.com... like many other Arab leaders.

Obviously that is if you believe the official 9-11 story?


My optimism is based on the fact that regimes and occupations such as Israels rarely last for centuries. It will end, i just hope not in an overly violent way.


[edit on 30-3-2010 by Peruvianmonk]



posted on Mar, 30 2010 @ 07:13 AM
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I have to disagree with those who believe that nothing will come out of this. We have seen more international scorn on Israel in the last while than in the whole history of Israel...

This is a positive thing as more and more countries are starting to stop blindly loving this horribly led regime and beginning to question giving them everything out of pitty for something that happened 60 years ago... More and more countries are starting to openly criticize Israel...

It's starting to be the time where things will be made right and when people will see the true side of the horrible monster's face...

Magnum



posted on Mar, 30 2010 @ 07:38 AM
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Originally posted by Magnum007
I have to disagree with those who believe that nothing will come out of this. We have seen more international scorn on Israel in the last while than in the whole history of Israel...

This is a positive thing as more and more countries are starting to stop blindly loving this horribly led regime and beginning to question giving them everything out of pitty for something that happened 60 years ago... More and more countries are starting to openly criticize Israel...

It's starting to be the time where things will be made right and when people will see the true side of the horrible monster's face...

Magnum

I don't think it concerns politicians, I believe it concerns individuals, individuals are waking up, and that concerns politicians which forces them not to change policy but to change appearance, after all they are magicians..

They haven't change policies for so long but they have change appearance many many times to give people that hope, that someday it will change.

An example would be Iraq, every time people got angry, they made an announcement on tv in regards to a deadline when the US troops would leave Iraq.

Then people calm down, when the deadline passes, they give another deadline..

Another example would be Guantanamo, Obama promised he will close it, never happened.

If they want to do something against the will of the people, they will just sell a promise and the people will love them for it, until they realize it was BS then they get angry again, then they get happy again..

Sounds like the mentality of a P head to me..



posted on Mar, 30 2010 @ 07:46 AM
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reply to post by oozyism
 


I have to say that your opinion does make a lot of sense... I'm guessing that the only way to tell whether these are actions or just words to please, will be to wait and see what actual moves the governments take...

I just think that maybe, just maybe, there is hope for some actual change in mentality in this world when it comes to the Israeli question.

Magnum



posted on Mar, 30 2010 @ 07:56 AM
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Personally I am very ?????? about all this talk of Israel from this shower of *, regardless if it is cross party or not..

Personally I think since we are coming into an election campaign this is a vote stealer for whoever can come across as hard on Israel.. but it is all smoke and mirrors to gerrymander the vote.

Just look at how silent we have gone on sanctions against Iran! suprise suprise, we move from the vocal front rows of calling for sanctions to the very back..

And don't get me started on this whole Falklands thing, with Barclays sorting out the Argy debts.. what a set up that was to make good old Gordo look like he is defending British interests "bah humbug"

There have in my opinion been way to many things happen recently that appear to my eye to have been stage managed, and this like all those others simply smells wrong.



posted on Mar, 30 2010 @ 09:53 AM
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reply to post by thoughtsfull
 


I assume shower of # refers to MP'S. I think that is unfair, they aren't all bad. For example my Local MP John Denham resigned over his oppisition to the invasion of Iraq.

I do not see how this is engineered to be a vote winner. Most people eligible to vote in this country have either no interest or no knowledge on the situation between Israel and the Palestinians.

I see this as a genuine effort to increase pressure on Israel. Backbenchers in the Labour party and a lot of the Liberal party have been crictising Israel for years, was all that an attempt to win votes?



posted on Mar, 30 2010 @ 10:03 AM
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This is a link to the the full report of the committee in PDF fromat. It delas with Israel and other countries the U.K. and E.U. export weapons to. Look at pages 49-51 for reference to what we are discussing.

www.publications.parliament.uk...



posted on Mar, 30 2010 @ 01:40 PM
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reply to post by Peruvianmonk
 


No knowledge or interest of the conflict between Israel of Palestine in the UK?

That is a rather harsh position to take don't you think? And even tho they might not have knowledge, there is from my perspective a definite opinion on the issue, A operation called cast lead has in my opinion (perhaps not yours) created a great deal of opinion around the world, including the UK.

As for the shower of # comment, it was directly aimed at MPs in general, I too can claim a decent MP, one Norman Baker who stood down from the Front bench to dig deeper into the Dr David Kelly affair
but a few decent ones does not change the fact they are in my opinion a shower of #

FYI. Even tho he is a LibDem I will be voting for Norman Baker again.

This all just goes to me saying that I stand by my comments that we are coming into an election, and none of the UK's main parties will want to be seen as supporting Israel.. I am very cynical on the timing as this feels to me as tho it has all stage managed.

finally I will add that I hope the UK Gov finds it's moral compass again, but I will not be holding my breath.



posted on Mar, 31 2010 @ 10:40 AM
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reply to post by thoughtsfull
 



Yeh fair enough thats your opinion. You may well be right that 'Cast Lead' bought about a greater understanding about the conflict and anomosity towards Israel. But who, unless you take an interest in the region like we on here do, remembers or cares about it now?

It may be a harsh description on the British electorate in general, but i think pretty fair. Any policy regarding Israel/Palestine will pale in comparison to the economy on who people will vote for.



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