Christians are discriminated against and 'treated with disrespect', senior bishops warn

Originally posted by Cosmic.Artifact

Originally posted by K J Gunderson
Good catch. So then we just go back to the fact that neither is universal.

the question was, is the search for god or knowledge of god not religion... (I admire your failed curve ball though)

No, that does not change anything. The search for GOD or knowledge OF GOD is NOT UNIVERSAL. Nice try though. I missed a word and accepted that. I already pointed out that it did not change the fact that putting any god into it makes it no universal.

That is exactly what I responded to and you know it. I see that you think because I am willing to admit I am wrong about something, you can just convince me I am wrong about anything and everything. That only works on the types of people that wake up looking for a god to worship.

Let me say it a third time for you so that you get it this time.

SEARCHING FOR GOD OR KNOWLEDGE OF GOD IS NOT UNIVERSAL.

We all clear on that now? Argue it if you like but do not try and pretend I keep getting it wrong. I am sticking by my very first response and that is that it is NOT universal. Feel free to prove me wrong.

see below...

There is no logic there at all. Atheism is not dependent on religion to exist at all. You seem to be confusing something else with Atheism altogether. Do you know what Atheism means? You are mistakenly equating lack of belief with doubt. They are not the same thing.

your religion relies on there being belief/faith in the first place, why else would you guys like saying things like "your god" so often ? I think this has alot to do with the being cool factor.

LOL. That is your problem right there. You are so caught up in your idea of your god that you think everything is a religion. Not only is Atheism not a religion, it is not even in the same realm as religion. It is the complete lack thereof. It is not opposition. It is not the yin to your yang. It is simply the lack of your fairy tale ideals altogether.

Back to that accusation, until you get a dictionary this is going to go nowhere very fast. Atheism relies on nothing to exist as it is NOT a religion.

Hence (do I know what atheism means?) yes I happen to know that... lack of belief IS doubt !

LOL. You are killing me here. Atheism is NOT DOUBT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

In order to doubt a concept, that concept has to be introduced. Atheism does not need any religion or gods in order to exist. You seem very confused as you are looking through very religious lenses at all this.

let me take a wild guess here, you must be Canadian?

[edit on 30-3-2010 by Cosmic.Artifact]

Hardly.

Originally posted by Cosmic.Artifact
grant me one more rant on that video plz...

at the very end where she (mom) says that she don't understand why 'they' can go out and preach on a street corner, blah blah and if she tried to go out and put in the same time...

does she even realize what she is saying ? is she not acknowledging or realizing her religion is non acceptance in the first place ? why do battle if her religion states it does not believe in the battle in the first place...

ignorance is not bliss... well on tv anyway !

lower than the homo's

that was pretty funny too

Obviously many religious people really have a hard time with the concept of what Atheism actually is. It is NOT a religion people. You cannot try to assess it based on your views of what religion is or should be. It is not a freaking religion!!!!

Originally posted by K J Gunderson:

Let me say it a third time for you so that you get it this time.

SEARCHING FOR GOD OR KNOWLEDGE OF GOD IS NOT UNIVERSAL.

We all clear on that now?

no not really.. just what are you trying to say ? please make yourself clearer maybe even going back to reread my posts. I have never used the word 'Universal' you introduced this word. (as the posted poem says... to paint a face)

oh can you please try to number your response, if there is one... (like I did in my previous post when I quoted you) you are getting kinda hard to follow.


*(atheos), meaning "without gods", which was applied with a negative connotation to those thought to reject the gods worshiped by the larger society.*

reject/deny/Doubt...

for being a master at shifting topics away from truth and tailoring them to your own needs... you speak in circles, it's no wonder why you appear quite lost. Atheist think they know something everybody else does not, and for most of them their intellectual level is a direct reflection of their enlightenment.

your religion relies on us religious peoples in the first place or you would not even exist, so tell me what would you call atheism without all of the mass majority who have a belief ? One could easily surmise that atheism relies on other religions for it to exist in the first place.

you see WE/religious peoples should be calling you Atheos... and YOU/atheist should be calling yourself (nothing) nothing at all !

but it sure sounds cool eh ?






[edit on 31-3-2010 by Cosmic.Artifact]

Originally posted by Cosmic.Artifact
no not really.. just what are you trying to say ? please make yourself clearer maybe even going back to reread my posts. I have never used the word 'Universal' you introduced this word. (as the posted poem says... to paint a face)

Huh? I am only allowed to use words that you previously used in my responses? You said it applies to everyone. I called that universal. What are you confused about?

oh can you please try to number your response, if there is one... (like I did in my previous post when I quoted you) you are getting kinda hard to follow.

Number them how? This would be the second paragraph. How would putting a 2 in front of it help you when you do not number your questions? Your numbers have done nothing to help me out.

*(atheos), meaning "without gods", which was applied with a negative connotation to those thought to reject the gods worshiped by the larger society.*

reject/deny/Doubt...

WITHOUT GODS - WHICH WAS APPLIED in a manner you can twist to almost say what you think you want it to. Why did you not just post the definition of Atheism as it listed in any English Dictionary?

I never disputed that it meant without gods. You are the one trying to insist that it is a rejection of god it is not. Based on that, religion would need to exist in order for Atheism to exist and that is just not true. Not even a little.

for being a master at shifting topics away from truth and tailoring them to your own needs... you speak in circles, it's no wonder why you appear quite lost. Atheist think they know something everybody else does not, and for most of them their intellectual level is a direct reflection of their enlightenment.

I have not talked in any circles nor shifted anything. I am simply responding to the things you say - LINE BY LINE!!!! If it shifts off topic, that is your fault but I do not even see that happening.

Speaking of people that think they know something others do not, you are the one here trying to tell me what Atheism is and that I somehow am lost for using the actual definition of the word.

6. Ironic.

your religion relies on us religious peoples in the first place or you would not even exist, so tell me what would you call atheism without all of the mass majority who have a belief ?

How many times do I need to say this?

ATHEISM IS NOT A RELIGION!!!!!!!!!!

You can not define it in religious terms. That is your first mistake. You are so devoted to the belief in imaginary friends that you can not even understand the concept of what Atheism actually is. I know you have seen it said over and over again but you are just ignoring it. Is that because it confuses that religious brain of yours?

ATHEISM IS NOT NOT NOT NOT NOT NOT NOT NOT A RELIGION.

There. Now maybe next time, instead of just saying it again you can try to actually understand what you are saying.

One could easily surmise that atheism relies on other religions for it to exist in the first place.

Only one who is willfully ignorant and suffers severe cognitive dissonance. You are STILL confusing opposition with a lack of acknowledgment. Do you need me to explain the difference to you?

y

ou see WE/religious peoples should be calling you Atheos... and YOU/atheist should be calling yourself (nothing) nothing at all !

No logic in that at all.

but it sure sounds cool eh ? [edit on 31-3-2010 by Cosmic.Artifact]

Yes, that is it exactly. It is all a big quest to use words as they are defined in direct conflict with what you personally want to define words as all because it sounds so super cool. You got me there.

Obviously you are not even trying to understand anything anyone tells you so please do not even bother responding if you are just going to repeat crap I have already addressed for a third time.

you seem to be very proud to glorify your 'ism' which ironically makes it a religion...

also you assume entirely too much.

Originally posted by Cosmic.Artifact
you seem to be very proud to glorify your 'ism' which ironically makes it a religion...

also you assume entirely too much.

What I "seem" to be is purely your opinion and not a fact.

Even if it were true, it does not make it a religion.

What part of the dictionary is troubling you so? The definition of Atheism or the definition of religion?

Seriously. This is not your pulpit from which to preach your personal definitions of words and ATS is not full of your congregates waiting with baited breath for your clarification on what words really mean - Satanic Webster lies!!!!!!

If you want to discuss something like a real person, that is great. If you just want to tell me that Atheism is religion over and over and over again, then just stop. Repeating something is not the way to discuss anything. What do you hope to achieve? Expect to save anyone by claiming words mean what you want them to instead of what they actually do?

I am more than willing to entertain a cogent argument about how Atheism needs your god or any god to exist. I am not hopeful for your chances of convincing me, but I would at least have that conversation. You have just said the same thing over again in 4 different posts now.

I am not really interested in that. Perhaps you should just get back on topic or find another thread to troll.

oh my, I really must ponder you before I speak...

the moment you try to impose your opinion on others is about the point it comes to a religion, so what if I don't accept your personal philosophy ? what if you were Hitler or Stalin or Mao something. The peoples of the world will come to your faith/belief (same thing really) if it is the truth...

I believe in non-belief !

HA !!! yeah lets run that one by the masters... say Socrates maybe



[edit on 31-3-2010 by Cosmic.Artifact]

Originally posted by Cosmic.Artifact
oh my, I really must ponder you before I speak...

the moment you try to impose your opinion on others is about the point it comes to a religion, so what if I don't accept your personal philosophy ? what if you were Hitler or Stalin or Mao something.

WHAT?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!

Do you know what a religion is??????????????????

Do you even have the most remote idea what religion is?????

I am not trying to impose anything on anyone. I am simply expressing myself, the same as you. Unless you are also a Hitler? I could care less if you accept my personal philosophy. This is the problem I keep pointing out. You are stuck thinking of things in terms only you seem to be able to comprehend - religion. I am not proselytizing. I am not recruiting. It matters not one bit to me whether you want to believe in your imaginary friend or not.

I believe in non-belief !

HA !!! yeah lets run that one by the masters... say Socrates maybe

You really have no clue what you are saying. There is no such claim as "I believe in non-belief"

It is quite simply, "I do not believe you."

That is it. That is all there is to it. I was born without a god and without a need for a god. I was born an Atheist. People like you come along and tell me about this BS fairy tale and I simply say "I do not believe that." That is it. I was an Atheist before any of you told me about your god and remain one. I never needed it in order to just simply not believe in it.

This Thread is about discrimination against and growing disrespect for, Christians. The article referred to in the OP, was about how a group of Christian Bishops in the UK have decided to bring their concerns about this into the open.

Many posters have provided articles and anecdotal evidence in support of the premise in the OP article.

Sadly, this is another Christian Thread that has been subverted.

Are there any non Christian posters on this Thread who are concerned about the growing discrimination and disrespect for this group in British society? If Christianity is completely suppressed in the UK, do you think any other group will then be targeted in the same way? Perhaps until all personal value or ideological systems are destroyed?

Considering other current factors that indicate relentless systemic control of all the peoples and nations of the Earth, (for example, there are other ATS Threads about life in the UK that address issues of surveilance, data mining, state sponsored paranoia about terrorism and other violent crime, draconian health and safety restrictions etc etc etc), it is clear to me that outright discrimination and ongoing failure of the authorities to action the laws designed to protect the rights of all UK citizens, is not merely a British Christian problem but one for all humanity.

[edit on 31/3/2010 by teapot]

In the UK, those of a leftist persuasion despised Britain, they despised the institutions and history of the nation and thought of it as a racist, sexist hell hole (when in reality, we lived better than most of the world's population)- our history is born out of a Christian nation, so they automatically grew to hate Christianity- much of what they do is driven by desire to remove Christianity from the ethos of the UK (they become so extreme that they even fall into bed with people of other religions who offer a brand of religion which is actually akin to the "severe" Christianity of many centuries ago!)


As an aside, I must admit that this is not all leftists, the old Labour party used to be quite patriotic, or rather its members did- the members would be working class communities who, whilst looking to Labour for economic issues, were quite tradiotnal in terms of values, morality, social issues etc


Modern leftists have absorbed some "liberal" (and even the phrase "liberal is a disservice to the original meaning of the word) identity and on social/moral/cultural issues are far removed from the "conservative" views of the Labour party of old

Originally posted by teapot
Are there any non Christian posters on this Thread who are concerned about the growing discrimination and disrespect for this group in British society? If Christianity is completely suppressed in the UK, do you think any other group will then be targeted in the same way? Perhaps until all personal value or ideological systems are destroyed?

For one thing, the article in the OP is not really about religious discrimination. It is about someone wishing they could use that excuse to violate a hospital policy against wearing items around your neck.

More importantly, many posters have claimed that religion is a private and personal thing. If you keep it that way, you have nothing to worry about.

Originally posted by K J Gunderson

Originally posted by teapot
Are there any non Christian posters on this Thread who are concerned about the growing discrimination and disrespect for this group in British society? If Christianity is completely suppressed in the UK, do you think any other group will then be targeted in the same way? Perhaps until all personal value or ideological systems are destroyed?

More importantly, many posters have claimed that religion is a private and personal thing. If you keep it that way, you have nothing to worry about.

If? Nothing to worry about? Sounds ominous!

Originally posted by teapot

More importantly, many posters have claimed that religion is a private and personal thing. If you keep it that way, you have nothing to worry about.

If? Nothing to worry about? Sounds ominous!

LOL. "IF" actually jumps out at you? Not even sure what that means. If you think it sounds ominous, that is your fault. I was addressing your mention of this threat. I did not mention the threat, you did.

Originally posted by Cosmic.Artifact

majority rules ! and obviously the community dealt with this by shunning the couple that could teach their kids no love for their fellow peers and possibly do others harm. The community was most likely fearing for their children and any influence to their young impressionable minds.

Oh yea, Majority rules, that totally justifies you stomping all over the atheists out there. This just proves my point from earlier-No one cares about discrimination until they feel they have been discriminated against. What are you talking about these people couldn't teach love to their kids? These kids were harming others? What because they didn't go to church? These parents didn't want their kids being taught the bible in school and that's their right. The school had no business teaching it anyway.

Originally posted by K J Gunderson

Originally posted by teapot

More importantly, many posters have claimed that religion is a private and personal thing. If you keep it that way, you have nothing to worry about.

The above words are not mine, They are yours.

If? Nothing to worry about? Sounds ominous!

The above words are mine.

LOL. "IF" actually jumps out at you? Not even sure what that means. If you think it sounds ominous, that is your fault. I was addressing your mention of this threat. I did not mention the threat, you did.

What threat?

[edit on 31/3/2010 by teapot]

Originally posted by teapot

What threat?

The threat of being discriminated against!!!!!!!!!!! If you can not even follow your own posts, please do not bother addressing mine.

This Thread is about discrimination against and growing disrespect for, Christians. The article referred to in the OP

These are your words, not mine.

If y'all keep it personal and private, no need to worry about discrimination. All clear?

[edit on 31-3-2010 by K J Gunderson]

reply to post by teapot


I whole heartedly agree... There is some crazy things happening in the UK at the moment.... Its not just about Christians... This affects everyone... Here is a point in example:

A GREAT-grandmother has been electronically tagged, placed under curfew and fined £1,000 for selling a GOLDFISH to a 14-year-old boy. Pet shop owner Joan Higgins, 66, landed the punishment after mistakenly selling the tiny fish to a schoolboy. The pensioner failed to spot that the lad was under the age of 16 as required by law to buy a pet and fell foul of a sting by trading standards officers. Read more: www.thesun.co.uk...

Incredible no??? This country is getting unbelievable!!

reply to post by Yissachar1


Not being funny, but I think you know absolutely diddly squat about Britain.

There are some crazy things going on here, you're right - but for the wrong reasons. Religion isn't wanted in our lovely Secular state of Britain. Bye Bye disgusting religion.

Parallex.

reply to post by Parallex


Errrrrr.... Yes I do...... Was born here.... Fought in its wars.... I know this country........

Too bad we are not going anywhere....

reply to post by Yissachar1


It amazes me to see this whole NWO total control agenda being introduced in the UK!

It is just so blatant! That woman in the story has been DNA'd through entrapment or commissioning another in the execution of a crime, which I understood to be illegal!

The erosion of civil liberties, the deliberate criminalisation of the general population, deliberate discrimination against one group whilst appeasing others.

It is just so gobsmackingly riduculous! Can't they think of better ways to spend their time?

Personally I think the UK has been selected by the NWO as a Pathfinder nation. This type of social engineering will be rolled out across the Globe.