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Who is in your tribe? Is it strong? Will it change the world?

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posted on Mar, 26 2010 @ 07:16 AM
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With all of the buzz around the "revolution" meme, it got me wondering more about change and communities. How do we grow and evolve? How do we move forward, particularly in a world that seems too big and too complicated to get everyone on the same page.

Like all ideas, change spreads like a meme among people within a community, a "tribe" if you will.

As it turns out someone has given great thought to various types of modern tribes, their productivity and their ability to induce change.

I was really excited about this idea. I see it in my own life. I was counting up all of the various tribes I was in - my family, my workplace, my friends, my neighborhood, ATS, etc. All just groups working in cooperation toward a common goal.

Thinking about society in this way made me feel like our problems are not insurmountable. If we focus on defining our tribes, nudge our tribes along more positive and sustainable paths and network to source good ideas and positive thinking with other tribes, and when possible join more tribes - then maybe we really can move forward from the morass that the world seems to be stuck in.




sojournerblog.blogspot.com...


The 5 Stages Logan identifies:

Stage 1: Life Sucks! -- When people form tribes around their common disdain for life.

Stage 2: My Life Sucks! -- When people form tribes around their common hatred of their own lives or situations.

Stage 3: I'm great; you're not. -- The most abundant tribal form, common in executive offices, bowling teams and Neighborhood parties...anytime people gather around some common quality or experience but focus their energy on comparison & competition with other tribe members.

Stage 4: We're great! -- When people transcend individualism and see themselves as a part of a positive thriving cooperative community.

Stage 5: Life is great! -- When Stage 4 tribes move past the awesomeness of their own community to focus on creating beauty in the world. These tribes, says Logan, represent only about 2% of all tribes on earth and are the ones that create the most positive change in the world.


Most of my tribes are in stage three or four but I think society at large is stuck in one, two or three, depending on location and socio-economic factors.

My seven year old came in while I was watching the video and he "got it". He started naming his tribes and how they work together. I could tell he was connected and invested with all of his tribes. It made me hopeful for all of us.




posted on Mar, 26 2010 @ 08:13 AM
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ATS is my tribe!


How do we grow and evolve? How do we move forward, particularly in a world that seems too big and too complicated to get everyone on the same page.


The only way I know right now is to continue to open peoples eyes to things they previously did not know. There are many people that are so hypnotized by reality TV, they don't know what is happening tin their own reality.

Looking forward to stage 5!

-E-

[edit on 26-3-2010 by MysterE]



posted on Mar, 26 2010 @ 08:24 AM
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Bleh... I've seen his speech before. Thought it was going to be something interesting on some new dynamic in tribal psychology, but it only contains enough to bastardize in the name of promoting intra-office synergy and positive attitudes. A damned corporate pep-talker with lots of self-empowering fluff... but no substance.

I'll just repost my original response to the video from YouTube.

------------------

So what does this tell us which isn't already better quantified, explained, and predictive by other fields of Psychology?

The current "Tribe" you're in at any given moment, as well as your rank in it, is entirely subjective to the observer. This then makes ranking them pointless. It's putting a label on something for the sake of putting a label on it. How does his idea correlate then with, say, the Stanford Prison Experiment and Zimbardo's Lucifer Effect that suggest environment pressures?

And this is to say nothing of arbitrary ranks. Why ascending/descending order? At the very least, it implies "better" or "worse" attributes (which are also arbitrary) - suggests the idea of "perfecting" the human species through social means. Even in these comments here (YTube), people are ranking themselves and judging other's responses to see what "stage" they're in... again dividing and subdividing moralistic hierarchies.

Yes, we are very much tribal creatures... but the values of those tribes are subjective to the culture, the environment, and the individual. What tribe do Islamic Fundamentalists belong to? On their criteria, to convert or kill infidels is the greatest good they can do for humanity - righteous in their pursuit. Is the suicide bomber who kills 50 infidels for reward of virgins at stage 2, and then the suicide bomber who kills 1,000 infidels for naught but the glory of Allah at stage 4~5?

Where is the impartial and outside observer and metric for this ranking?

----------------------------


Johnathan Haidt's TEDspeach covered his work on the foundations of moral psychology so as to better identify the "moral matrix" we lock ourselves into and try to understand others (specifically in the context of Liberal vs. Conservative elements which emerge human societies) by better understanding their moral foundations - even if you don't agree with them.

Haidt is a proponent of Tribal/Evolutionary psychology, and his work on identifying human universals for morality is generally regarded as rather soft science in it's own right. Yet compared to David Logan's talk, Haidt's work more resembles some chalk-board filling physics equation from Niels Bohr by comparison.



posted on Mar, 26 2010 @ 09:00 AM
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Originally posted by Lasheic it only contains enough to bastardize in the name of promoting intra-office synergy and positive attitudes. A damned corporate pep-talker with lots of self-empowering fluff... but no substance.


I totally get how someone can feel that way. God knows I've had a belly-full corporate speak and I try to call BS on it at every turn. But there is a simple truth to Logan's presentation. One that I think anyone, including 7-year-olds can understand and act upon. We have to start somewhere right?

With regard to Islam, you make some concerning points about how what it means to elevate the group depends on the group itself but...Logan's further point is that the more tribe's we join and spread ideas and common goals, the less conflict there will be among varying tribes.

So now I'm off to look into Haidt.



posted on Mar, 26 2010 @ 09:17 AM
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I am my own tribe and thus very much a loner.

Although groups do have there place, I feel that it's actually the individual that makes the most difference in the world.

hence the "wilder"...



posted on Mar, 26 2010 @ 10:07 AM
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I have a tribe of helpers living within my body. Different aspects of myself are the different members of my tribe.



posted on Mar, 26 2010 @ 10:30 AM
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reply to post by kosmicjack
 



Thinking about society in this way made me feel like our problems are not insurmountable. If we focus on defining our tribes, nudge our tribes along more positive and sustainable paths and network to source good ideas and positive thinking with other tribes, and when possible join more tribes - then maybe we really can move forward from the morass that the world seems to be stuck in.


this is wonderful Kosmic

my head is about to explode :-)

It’s easy to see that we are each members of each of these tribes from time to time. We visit each tribe regularly.

When we look at Tribe 5 as the ultimate tribe, I wonder if it really should be considered ‘our goal’.

I only mean that maybe instead of looking at each tribe as a step – we should see each tribe as a necessary part of a working machine. Or rather – a process. We can’t move away from a step or graduate necessarily. Each tribe has to exist just as it is in order for Tribe 5 to exist at all.

I’m not saying anything the speaker hasn’t just said.

The individual never really loses the Id, Ego or Super Ego - or any of the many, many parts that go into making a self whole. An individual progresses and matures, but remains the sum of it’s still existing integrated parts and history.

I see that final tribe as the tribe that can recognize it’s self on it’s own journey. It understands where it’s been and how it arrived where it is. It’s the tribe that can look at itself in the mirror, forgive itself it’s failures – like itself (love and respect itself hopefully) then move on.

And just as Mr. Logan suggests, it’s the tribe that can council its own self at each and every stage - leaving no one behind.

The idea of the many and the few – all based on the individual – has always interested me.


Stage 4: We're great! -- When people transcend individualism and see themselves as a part of a positive thriving cooperative community.


we are great :-)

always been my favorite stage – those times when you can really see us – and just love us to death

I’ve never really felt lonely in this world – and it’s all because of Tribe Number 4

It’s made it possible for me to spend most of my life gazing upon Tribe Number 5 with adoring eyes. We can’t even see Tribe 5 without Tribe 4 :-)

S&F



posted on Mar, 26 2010 @ 10:37 AM
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reply to post by Lasheic
 




Bleh... I've seen his speech before. Thought it was going to be something interesting on some new dynamic in tribal psychology, but it only contains enough to bastardize in the name of promoting intra-office synergy and positive attitudes. A damned corporate pep-talker with lots of self-empowering fluff... but no substance.


I worked in the corporate world for many years. Not a fun place much of the time.

The planet is not a fun place much of the time.

One thing they both have in common: people - and everything that comes with them.

I have to say though - I loved many of those people - and I still had some really good times in that world. Many of those people were like family to me.

what's your tribe Lasheic?

:-)



posted on Mar, 26 2010 @ 10:39 AM
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Originally posted by Spiramirabilis
reply to post by kosmicjack Or rather – a process. We can’t move away from a step or graduate necessarily. Each tribe has to exist just as it is in order for Tribe 5 to exist at all.


You're right.

And when you get to 4 or 5, you must still network with 1, 2 or 3 to effect any real societal change. Plus, as we elevate across our culture, the definitions of the levels must necessarily change and elevate as well.

I think.

It's complicated.




posted on Mar, 26 2010 @ 10:43 AM
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reply to post by kosmicjack
 





And when you get to 4 or 5, you must still network with 1, 2 or 3 to effect any real societal change.


:-)

Society exists as a combination of children, adolescents and adults - we all take turns in those different roles

it takes a village...

hope this goes long - very interesting conversation



posted on Mar, 26 2010 @ 01:14 PM
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There's nothing worse than social systems designed by humans. There are always sides and wars. It will only end when people see the truth and act on it.
There would be no need for tribes or any governmental system if every human being woke up to themselves.




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