Homosexuality is a choice and nothing else!

reply to post by ModernAcademia


Alright first off, homosexuality is not really a choice. It may be a choice to act upon your homosexuality, but people are gay from the beginning of their childhood. I believe they have the ability to go either way at a young age, and once the brain develops to a certain point the child is either rendered heterosexual or homosexual (if this is not true, then they are born either way simple as that).

How do I know this, and why do I think this?

I have a half brother thats gay, and a cousin that is gay. My brother grew up hiding his homosexuality by dating women, sleeping with them etc. however he used it as a front - from the beginning. His relationships were odd, and he felt the need to talk to me about his sexual escapades when we talked about women much more than I had asked him to explain about certain women he had dated. He tried to take pride in sleeping with those women but in reality I have no idea how much of what he said was true.

Now my cousin is a great example of how a person is gay from birth, or as I said above, how a person may become gay at a young age when their brain develops fully in that 'section' of the brain.

My cousins and I all would hang out when I was young, probably around 8 years old. They are both approx. 10 years older, but I remember my straight cousin always wrestling around with me, being interested in sports (please don't flame me here for generalizing I'm just using examples and I'm not saying homosexuals cannot like these things), and just generally doing the more masculine activities apposed to my gay cousin who would sit on the side lines so to speak. He would sit out while we did the more masculine things, and he is now a proud homosexual and I have no problem with neither him or my half brother.

Too add to what I'm saying, my father for example, always said he thought my step brother way gay (he has no problem with it either, no one in my family bashes gays in ANY way, we accept people for who they are). He said he knew he was gay since he was a young child (which coincides with what I've been saying), and this is way before my step brother ever admitted or hinted towards being gay to the public. I guess the bond between my step brother and my dad allowed him to see through the lies and the front that he put up.

And someone mentioned, well if people are gay by having some sort of 'gay gene' how do they pass it on if they do not reproduce? Well that's simple. A lot of homosexuals are closet homosexuals - many of them put up the front just like my step brother, and while having sex with females they can easily have a child just like any other man.

As I've said, I nor anyone in my family have nothing against homosexuals, especially since we have family members who we have fully accepted as being gay and we love them just as much as anyone else in the family, and I always will.

But, I do have one issue with homosexuals, nothing horrible at all.
The only issue I have is that they do not reproduce (unless of course they put up the heterosexual front and reproduce before 'coming out of the closet'

To reply to the initial post. I'm definitely not going to flame you.

Yes, it is a choice. Similar thing, like if a person has an urge to kill. Extreme example, but similar nonetheless. Does this person need to then say, "I am a mass murderer! I am the product of my urges, nothing I can do about it." Of course not, you have a choice. It is a huge lie laid down on our society, to say that you don't have a choice. You do!

The change is possible, you bet it is!

The way you live your life, is, of course, your choice. So, if you are "gay," I ask that you take a moment, take a look at this lifestyle, and ask yourself, does it promote the survival of our species? This isn't about a guilt trip, or feeling bad about your actions. It's just taking a cold hard look at civilization and how you fit into it. I mean, homosexual urges, put them aside, and take a look. Look at your body, look at other people's bodies and find out what your role really is in society.

I'm not going to force you to be straight, I'm not going to force you to change, but to those who might be a little curious, have a look. And if you want to change, know that you can. Urges are just urges, you are what you decide to be. But, if you really are hell bent on being gay, then that is your choice. I can't say that I agree with you on that, but your life is your life.

Troy

reply to post by nomorecruelty


A little about The Epistle of JUDE....

The Book of Jude...

Chapter 1 verse 7.. Quote;

7.
as Sodom and Gomorrah,
and the cities around them
in a similar manner to these,
having given themselves
over to sexual immorality
and gone after strange flesh,
etc etc.

Is NOT talking of homosexuality but is referring to "the watchers" in the Book of E'Noch... Please be patient and read on regarding this...

this is a Quote from “The Book of E’Noch I-XXXVI in “The Epistle of Jude”.

14.
Now Enoch the seventh from Adam,
prophesied about these men also,
saying,
"Behold, the Lord comes with ten thousand of His Saints,

15.
"to execute judgment on all,
to convict all who are ungodly among them
of all their ungodly deeds
which they have committed
in an ungodly way,
and of all harsh things
which ungodly sinners
have spoken against Him.

16.
These are grumblers,
Complainers, walking according
to their own lusts; etc etc.

These verses above are from "The Book of E’Noch I-XXXVI"

Chapter 1 Verse 9.


But anyway… What I am saying is that “The Epistle of JUDE” is referring to the book of E’Noch And the fornication of "the Watchers"…quote;

The Book of E’Noch I-XXXVI

the children of the heavens, saw and lusted after them, and said to one another:

“Come, let us chose us wives from among the children of men and beget us children.”

03.
And Semjaza, who was their leader, said unto them:

“I fear ye will not indeed agree to do this deed,
and I alone shall have to pay the penalty of a great sin.”

04.
And they all answered him and said:

“Let us all swear an oath, and all bind ourselves by mutual imprecations
not to abandon this plan but to do this thing.”

05.
Then swear they all together and bound themselves together by mutual imprecations upon it.

06.
And they were in all two hundred;
who descended in the days of Jared on the summit of Mount Hermon, and they called it Mount Hermon,
because they had sworn and bound themselves by mutual imprecations upon it.

07.
And these are the names of their leaders:
Semiazaz, their leader, Arakiba, Rameel, Kokabiel, Tamiel, Ramiel, Danel, Ezeqeel, Baraqijal, Asael, Armaros, Batarel, Ananel, Zaqiel, Samsapeel, Satarel, Turel, Jomael, Sariel.

08.
These are their chiefs of tens.

Chapter 7.

01.
And all the others together with them took unto themselves wives,
and each chose for himself one,
and they began to go in unto them and defile themselves with them,
and they taught them charms and enchantment’s,
and the cutting of roots, and made them acquainted with plants.

02.
And they became pregnant, and they bare great giants,
whose height was Three Thousand Ells:

03.
Who consumed all the acquisitions of men.
And when men could no longer sustain them,

04.
The giants turned against them and devoured mankind.

05.
And they began to sin against birds, and beasts, and reptiles, and fish,
and to devour one an others flesh, and drink the blood.

None of this refers to Homosexuality….

The Referral to Sodom and Gomorrah refers to the sins of the watchers as mentioned above…

reply to post by cybertroy


I think you are the missing point.

You are wrong about "homosexuality" being a choice. At the same time you are right because homosexual behaviour is a choice.

But at the end there is only one thing that matters.
Will you judge or live in mutual respect towards one and others life style ?

There is one and only one breeding impulse. Nature does not issue an impulse for every possible combination. There are three basic responses, ignore, mate, misdirect. What is natural is to ignore or mate. Based on the karmic condition a creature may misdirect. People who misdirect have a right to do so along with their privacy. The social problem is that there are two basic ways to "come out of the closet". With humility and contrition as in Alcoholics Anonymous or by arrogance and brutishness as in the gay community. While the alcoholic recognizes their "problem", the gay community thinks they have a blue ribbon. The problem isn't so much with the tolerance. it's with the arrogance, propaganda, brainwashing, intolerance, and manipulations used by the gay community to try and subvert the free will and pervert the truth in support of their delusion. We've seen umpteen posts of manipulation by the gay community on ATS. Over and over, it's not the gay with a problem it's everyone else. The gay has the gold medal everyone else is blind or crazy or whatever for not seeing and appreciating it that way. It's simply a matter of reality, honesty and truth.

Now here's some arguments for the gays to use.
1. Nature is selecting us not to breed because our genetics are .... so the misdirection is natural way of filtering us out. We're not filtered out because we're gay, we're filtered out because of some other DNA attributes nature has decided to obsolete. (That's a cleaver one huh?)

2. Oh, there is no such thing as a breeding impulse in nature. Why how would that fit in with "evolution"?

Originally posted by woodwardjnr
homosexuality occurs naturally within the animal kingdom, do you think those animals choose to be gay? Thats all I have to say on the matter for now

Defect of nature.
That's all I have to say about that.
Do cancer patients choose to have cancer?
Do children choose to be born with Down Syndrome?
(Although somehow that won't be acceptable by gays, because it's different, right?...)
Facts are facts. Period. Live with it. You choose to be gay, and that's fine with me. Just stop blaming nature and stop being so damned flamboyant about it. I'm heterosexual, but I don't feel the need to have a bumper sticker telling the whole world that I love vaginas. Why do I need to impose that upon everyone? I don't! Get a clue!
*edited for grammar*

[edit on 26-3-2010 by GroundZero]

reply to post by Arles Morningside


Animals don't have the mental capability to make decisions and think.

They go by instinct.

They have no thoughts.

It's a choice, it's not a choice; it's in the genes, it's not in the genes; you're homosexual, you're heterosexual, or you're at some point in between---the ultimate answers to these questions and where people lie in the spectrum are irrelevant to the question of whether or not gay people are entitled to basic civil rights. It would be a shame if policies are made depriving gays of such rights solely on the contention that we don't have ultimate clear cut black and white answers. But then I'm one of those evil left-handers, so what is my opinion worth.

[edit on 26-3-2010 by Monsieur Neary]

reply to post by GroundZero


Yet another contradictive statement! If cancer patients can't choose whether or not to have cancer, and people afflicted with down syndrome can't choose whether or not to be born with down syndrome, then how can gay people choose whether or not to be born gay?

[edit on 26-3-2010 by Torgo]

reply to post by Emerald The Paradigm


Then how do you explain homosexual relationships that occur in the animal kingdom? If God is controlling everything, then why did he make gay sheep?

A study published in the February issue of the journal Endocrinology demonstrates that not only are certain groups of cells different between genders in a part of the sheep brain controlling sexual behavior, but brain anatomy and hormone production may determine whether adult rams prefer other rams over ewes. 'This particular study, along with others, strongly suggests that sexual preference is biologically determined in animals, and possibly in humans,' said the study's lead author, Charles E. Roselli, Ph.D., professor in the Department of Physiology and Pharmacology, OHSU School of Medicine.

www.medicalnewstoday.com...

Is this simply another trick employed by Satan, like dinosaur fossils or radiometric dating, to lead astray those who trust in the answers that science (common sense) provides us?

reply to post by Torgo


I don't like this attitude of we should follow animals.

If you want to follow animals and do what they do then by all means go for it.

You might as well take poo out of your butt and throw it at people too like monkeys.

Just because animals do it doesn't mean that it's right, and it's a pretty pathetic excuse to justify the homosexual lifestyle.

Not buying it.

I myself am not gay so I cannot speak from that perspective. But from the outside looking in it would seem a lot of gay people end up killing themselves over the crushing discrimination they must endure instead of just making the 'choice' to be straight. It just seems to me to be so much easier to 'choose' to be heterosexual instead of being bullied in school, sometimes disowned by your family, discriminated against in your day to day life, and treated like a none person by not sharing the same basic rights that your straight neighbors enjoy.

I am then forced to assume that they are in fact gay not by choice, but from birth. That and I've babysat for young children at the age of 2 who were clearly gay and they didn't even know what that would mean at that age. When they get a little older, surprise, guess who's gay.

reply to post by FeralMonkeyMagic

In psychology it is WELL KNOWN than people do NOT choose to be gay, but they ARE.

Precisely. It's not as if there were even any question left about it--among either psychologists or biologists.

It's just homophobes and religious ostriches who haven't got the word yet.

*

reply to post by nomorecruelty

With homosexuality - you have a choice. You can go with it, or you can reject it.

And if you reject it, you automatically become heterosexual. How's that working for you, then?

Apart, perhaps, from the old saying that misery loves company, is there any other justification you can offer for forcing people other than yourself into a life of loveless, celibate misery? Your description of the 'damage' done to society by consenting homosexual adults was pretty feeble--the 'damage' was to your personal tastes and sensibilities, not to society at all.

You are a lesbian in flight from her own sexuality. That is your choice--but how tragic a choice it is, and how repellent that you should wish to force it on other homosexuals. Your story is yet another example of how religious faith perverts the morality of essentially decent people.

*

On a personal (but relevant) note, my ex-wife is a lesbian who refused to face facts until we had been married seven years. As highlyoriginal says,

Originally posted by highlyoriginal
there are many people out there who are sexually confused... We struggle each day trying to identify ourselves with who we really are... This is a problem we all face, not just heterosexuals, but also homosexuals, or bisexuals.

My former wife was confused in this way. Her final acceptance of her sexuality destroyed our marriage, which had been fully sexual, mutually supportive and deeply loving--as she will proudly testify to this day. But she is happier now, and twice the woman she was when we married. Coming out was so much the best thing that ever happened to her that the ruination of our life together seems worth it, even to me. We remain the best of friends.

*

reply to post by tovenar

Think of a non-sexual trait in humans by way of comparison. Say, obesity. Is obesity a choice? Granted, no one would choose obesity. Yet on the other hand, people are obese as the end result of a whole slew of choices they make, regardless of whether the individual accepts any personal responsibility for their habits.

There is only one 'choice' (if indeed it really is a choice) that results in one's becoming obese: choosing to eat too much, particularly of the wrong food. There is nothing else to it; even choosing to exercise or not to exercise doesn't really affect the result.

Now, O Wise One, could you please explain

1. what you think the choices are that end up in a person becoming homosexual, and
   
   
2. whether you consider lifelong sexual abstinence preferable to having sex with others of a similar persuasion to oneself?

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reply to post by Armin

God's opinion matters more to me than any person that would try to tell me and convince me that homosexuality is not a choice... the Qur'an and the old scriptures teach me to warn people that if they commit in homosexual behavior, then they will be dealt by God when their day comes.

I wouldn't dream of trying to convince you of anything, Armin, but why in the world do you think the opinion of someone who has chosen to bury his brains in the ground for the sake of his so-called soul is worth two hoots to any reasonable person?

*

reply to post by ModernAcademia

Can I make the decision to pick up a knife and stab a the neighbourhood cat that's always screaming? No because i'm not like that. It doesn't mean I have a gene inside of me that doens't like to murder innocent cats

For somebody so sure homosexuality isn't genetic, you seem to be almost totally ignorant about genes and their effect on behaviour. Why do you think your opinion on the subject is worth any more than Armin's? At least he or she has the honesty to admit that their position is based on sectarian bias. You, on the other hand, hypocritically wrap your bigotry in pseudoscience.

Why don't you study the issues you're interested in a little before shooting your mouth off about them? Who knows, you might even acquire a little respect beyond the sad little circle of Banana Republicans who star your posts.

reply to post by Emerald The Paradigm


I'm not the one trying to argue that humans exist outside of the natural order. Don't get me wrong, I'm not a primitivist, but I do believe that there are natural causes underlying human nature.

every single one of you that is saying it's a choice is missing the point.

DID ANY OF US CHOOSE TO BE HERE??? IN THIS WORLD IN THIS UNIVERSE/

NO

u have no control over naturally occurring things, so get the fvck over it and accept people as equals and stop trying to justify your own bias or hatred for others with "unnatural" arguments and self imposed grandeur.

it's just a constant back and forward with the anti-gay stuff, honestly, what effect does even a bumper sticker have on you? nothing, they are not kissing or hugging or F***ing you.. so what do you care.

btw, i see plenty of car stickers saying, "i love pussy"..

so again, there are the small demographic in both hetero communities and homo communities that are over-the-top proud of what they are. Is there anything wrong with that? No, kudos to them and enjoy your lives! as long as they respect others boundaries. key word here RESPECT.

Homophobia is no different to xenophobia. It's an overt fear of differences that the person interperets as an extreme threat to them or their lifestyle.

We are all humans, living on the same planet. Could you really be a xenophobe if you stopped being country based patriotic and became planet based patriotic?? i think not.

Sometimes im ashamed of how heterosexuals, like me, speak about others with complete disregard for emotion or compassion. To be honest, i dont think i have ever heard of a gay group getting together and rounding up heteros and killing them... but we all know there are some psycopthic heteros that speak the same as some people here - who commit this kind of hate crime.

Im proud to be hetero and im proud that other people can be proud of their persuasions. It takes a mature person to be supportive of others with differences.

unfortunately the loud, closed-minded type get their views seen and heard more than the respectful quiet.

reply to post by ModernAcademia


I had this very conversation years ago, with an openly gay man i worked with.

I had proposed that being homosexual wasn't just a lifestyle choice, although that obviously plays a role, but more a genetic mutation, perhaps affecting the chromosomes (X, Y, XX, YY etc).

Needless to say he wasn't happy in the least me essentially calling him a mutant! But i was trying to speak objectively in a semi-scientific capacity. Which being a rash young man, must have come across to him as rude and condescending.

I DO reckon (not believe, as i have no evidence), that there is a combination of genetics primarily, and lifestyle involved in determining peoples sexual orientation. Also, upbringing and paternal influences play a role too.

To suggest being gay or lesbian is simply a lifestyle choice is wrong. It also doesn't do justice to the fact that MANY young gay and lesbian people, and older people too actually, commit suicide because they have such difficulty coming to terms with the sexuality they 'just don't want'.

Many fight against, in a lot of cases for most of their lives their own sexualities. They go on to marry, have children, leading outwardly heterosexual lives, all the while in turmoil because they know they are living a lie. The guilt must be unreal.

If being 'gay' was simply a lifestyle choice, we would not be seeing people, fighting against a simple choice, essentially for most of their lives, or even going so far as to take their own lives, would we?

Societal conditioning (read that as 'religious') must shoulder much of the blame and apologise (in my view) for the institutionalised discrimination against homosexuals that has played a pivotal role in and led to the suicide and misery of many, many people.

Good question, S&F.

reply to post by ModernAcademia


if you follow your heart instead of what society thinks it's moraly accepted then it's a choise

otherwise you'll be living a lie all your life, can't change what you feel, you got to remember there's love somewhere out there, not just f**king!

if it's just sexual with no feelings involved, then sex is damaging for both homosexual and heterosexual

you are conscience, you are soul, you have no gender, you have no sex, the body you're in now is either male or female
so the homosexuality debate is absurd to me, those evolved enough would understand.... you love who you love.... cause in the end it doesn't even matter the gender, it's the SOUL

reply to post by raynemarina


Oh come on...this is the real world, not a hypothetical idealist one.

In the real world, people KILL themselves because of their sexuality and the pressures society and (mostly) religion places upon them.

If gender was as irrelevant as you maintain, then WHY are people attracted, in a sexual capacity to one sex preferentially over another?

Surely, if what you say was so, the whole world would be Bisexual and routinely sexually attracted as such, would it not.

In some distant past, perhaps following a major calamity such as a flood or asteroid impact, or great disease killing off large swathes of humanity this anti-homosexual / bisexual initiative was implemented.

In those circumstances, i could appreciate the need to condition people's sexuality toward opposite sex unions, due to the need for procreation to repopulate...but when everyone and his dog is claiming overpopulation of the world, it seems that the authorities should actually be PROMOTING homosexuality and same sex unions, in order to reduce population.

Perhaps this is why religious cartels, discourage homosexuality (at least publicly), as a throwback to a time when humanity was in danger of dying out, but have forgotten the original reasons involved.

[edit on 26/3/2010 by spikey]

reply to post by spikey


if humanity is dying out that's because of GMoes, fluoride, vaccines ans chemtrails, NOT because they turn "gay"

thank the PTB that don't want you to be happy.... they want humanity to suffer,
the anti-homosexual thing is nothing but political, they don't want people to claim back their freedom to be what they are, to love who they want... it's FREE WILL "they" are against, NOT homosexuality

THAT is the main thing, it THEY (TPTB) accept and encourage homosexuality it's like acknowleging their bible BS