The American way. The Right way. THE ONLY WAY!

Originally posted by Subjective Truth
reply to post by Merriman Weir

 

You would need alot more then guns and free speech to fix Britains problems. They have embraced progressive ideals just like the Canadians and what does this lead to.


Less freedom senors on you garbage the Internet being censored and bad food being taken away and so on........


People needed something and they gave it to the security but true security can not be given it has to come form the inside out if you catch my drift.

You know David9172???

The guy who bashes Beck -

You questioned his Authenticity, but he was just like you a year back

I suggest you also examine the otherside as well as you excoriate the Progressives.
For your ideas, Becks ideas are also the suspension for some PTB out there...

You want truth, you do both

HCR is progressivism and will lead to bad

and so would have a 200% HI general cost which has inflated 150% and was scheduled
to increase 160% in the next decade.

That would have meant GDP in three decades on healthcare expenses IF nothing changed, hell might still be the case...

BOTH ARE FOOKED right?

Anyhow I sense you want the truth, but you can't do that if you allow yourself to be
nationalistic or looking from the right to left exclusively.

Do you fight TPTB or DEFEND IT???

you should REALLY think about that for a spell

reply to post by Subjective Truth


No, I have no time for someone wants to promote intolerance and racist ideals.

Free speech is a wonderful thing and I practice it everyday. Had I lived in Ottawa I may have even practiced it to protest Ms Coulter's appearance.

The difference is I don't see the expression of racist views as freedom of speech. In fact supporting racism one of the absolute worst abuses of freedom I can imagine.

Again, you are ignoring the fact that it was the decision of Ms Coulter's staff that cancelled her speech, not the Canadian government, not the Canadian people. Free citizens showed up to exercise their freedom of speech against her views and she chickened out.

Get your last word in, then move along, we're done here.

Originally posted by Merriman Weir

Originally posted by Clark Savage Jr.
So we stick by 'our' way because we all know damned well that, believe it or not, our way is STILL worth preserving.

That's great and, for right or wrong, perhaps to be applauded. However, preserving the American Way and proclaiming the American Way to be the best way or the only way are very different things. I see a lot of the former, sorry.

Also, the idea that America is somehow special because it can dig deep and pull together when it needs to is pretty strange. That's not a particularly American trait and is something that can be seen the world over.

If you do not see what is special about America then words are not going to change your mind. But think about this who gives the most? And also who is the largest beacon of democracy?


Every country has something to give and good people. And so does America.

Originally posted by Subjective Truth
reply to post by Merriman Weir

 

You would need alot more then guns and free speech to fix Britains problems. They have embraced progressive ideals just like the Canadians and what does this lead to.


Less freedom senors on you garbage the Internet being censored and bad food being taken away and so on........


People needed something and they gave it to the security but true security can not be given it has to come form the inside out if you catch my drift.

Well done for merely proving my point about the American way and how Americans know how to fix everyone else's problems. You can keep your Franklin quote thanks.

[edit on 24-3-2010 by Merriman Weir]

Originally posted by [davinci]
reply to post by Subjective Truth

 

No, I have no time for someone wants to promote intolerance and racist ideals.

Free speech is a wonderful thing and I practice it everyday. Had I lived in Ottawa I may have even practiced it to protest Ms Coulter's appearance.

The difference is I don't see the expression of racist views as freedom of speech. In fact supporting racism one of the absolute worst abuses of freedom I can imagine.

Again, you are ignoring the fact that it was the decision of Ms Coulter's staff that cancelled her speech, not the Canadian government, not the Canadian people. Free citizens showed up to exercise their freedom of speech against her views and she chickened out.

Get your last word in, then move along, we're done here.

Wow you have alot of anger and this is like what the third time you said you were done. But I thank you for being honest you are no better then the Nazi's and you don't even realise it.


Just like they did you stand atop your ivory tower judging speech. I hope you get to see what real freedom is so that you hold on to it a little tighter. I wonder if most Canadians feel the way you do?


Racist should have a voice and so should people who are intolerant. What exactly is intolerance. And who judges it. This is what Canadians should be asking.

Originally posted by hawkiye

Originally posted by Janky Red

Originally posted by hawkiye
Every socialist democracy in history has failed the same way.

As one of our American founding fathers Benjamin Franklin once said Those who give up Liberty for Security deserve neither and will have neither! God helps us all...

"...the well being of the poor and retched is a duty charged to private, public and charitable means and funds, for the health of the retch is the health of a nation."

Ben Franklin Penn Gazette - 1743

First of all I suspect that quote is bogus. I have some copies of the Penn Gazzette and no such quote is in them. I could be wrong but I would love for you to substantiate that quote in one of the published Penn Gazettes and attributed to Ben Frankin. He bought the paper and often published statements from others. It may have been attributed him as the editor but I doubt he actually wrote it or if it turns out he did it is likely completely out of context..

Having said that if your intent was to suggest Ben Frankin would advocate government forcing men to give to the poor through taxes or other means you are sadly mistaken. He like most men of his time would espouse the Christian doctrine of helping the poor but only voluntarily not by any means of force, coercion, or socialism.

I'll leave you with this quote from him:

The Constitution only gives people the right to pursue happiness. You have to catch it yourself.
Benjamin Franklin

PG. 43

Healthy, Wealthy and Wise : A Variety of Enduring Selections from the Press of Benjamin Franklin 1706 - 1790

You sure do quote some stock Ben

I have been reading lots of him, he is not what many of you guys assert with your small pool of quotes.

We believe what we like now don't we??? Blame the evil Socialist Ben, not me...

reply to post by Merriman Weir


It is called personal truth and I have the right to it. Do I speak for America NO. I speak for myself. We have many viewpoints and races in this country and it is another reason we are special. But your hate will not let you see it. And I have no idea what you are talking about with the quote thing.

Originally posted by Subjective Truth

Originally posted by [davinci]
reply to post by Subjective Truth

 

Racist should have a voice and so should people who are intolerant. What exactly is intolerance. And who judges it. This is what Canadians should be asking.

I agree with you, provided it was the state who censored the racist...

Was it???

and who?

Originally posted by Subjective Truth
If you do not see what is special about America then words are not going to change your mind.

I'll join the other poster in enquiring about your medicine regime then.

I'll also point out that, if words are not going to change my mind, then why are you trying to change my mind with your words? Are you a personal shining beacon leading the way in stupidity and futility rather than liberty and democracy?

Originally posted by Merriman Weir

Originally posted by Subjective Truth
If you do not see what is special about America then words are not going to change your mind.

I'll join the other poster in enquiring about your medicine regime then.

I'll also point out that, if words are not going to change my mind, then why are you trying to change my mind with your words? Are you a personal shining beacon leading the way in stupidity and futility rather than liberty and democracy?

Because others read the post. And no matter how closed minded you are the next reader might see the light. And I have not made it personal because it shows weakness and I am not a troll are you weak or a troll? Keep to the facts and we can play nice and also please keep going unlike the other one's who tucked tail and ran because I want the truth to get out. No matter how dirty or how much people disagree with my viewpoint. Personal truth is subjective and what is good for me may not work for you.


But by keeping it nice we can sometimes find middle ground. So please no personal attacks.

[edit on 24-3-2010 by Subjective Truth]

[edit on 24-3-2010 by Subjective Truth]

Originally posted by Subjective Truth
reply to post by Merriman Weir

 

But your hate will not let you see it. And I have no idea what you are talking about with the quote thing.

See, the thing is, as weird as this might seem to some posters on here, I didn't grow-up hating America. As a small child in the early 1970s, I remember the thrill of finding Marvel and DC comics on a spinner rack in an obscure newsagent. Compared to British comics, the stories and particularly the adverts all seemed so thrilling exotic. Living in one of the wettest, coldest and dismal parts of England, I marvelled at the films and television shows that appeared to show nothing but sunshine, happy faces and big wide open streets. Laughably now, the people on television always seemed so nice, so friendly and so heroic when they needed to be. I even knew a couple of American children whilst at junior school. When I got older I revelled in what's superficially American forms of music both as a listener and a performer. I've literally 1000s of albums just of mid-late 1960s music from America alone.

All that lasted for most of my life. Then, around 1997, I started using the internet and the largest demographic of people I've come into contact with since then have been Americans. You've no idea just how many times I've been told that my country is #. You've no idea how many times I've heard how America single-handedly won WWII and saved me personally from speaking German (which, ironically, was mandatory at grammar school anyway along with Latin and French). You've no idea how many times I've been told I shouldn't have 'allowed the government to take my guns away' and how, if I had a gun now, I'd seemingly never be attacked, mugged or robbed and the government wouldn't dare impose laws on me I didn't want - oh, the irony. You've no idea how many times I've been told, unprompted, that America is just the best country in the world in every way imaginable.

After 13 years, my love for this pearly-smiled, exotic country to the West across the ocean was killed-off, ironically, by Americans themselves. Like a marriage with a nagging spouse, the drip, drip, drip of hearing it practically every time I engaged with an international community just got to the point where I started grimacing and spontaneously clenching my fists.

reply to post by Merriman Weir


We have common ground I feel the same way. That is why I want to change America back. You cannot spread freedom down the barrel of a gun it should spread by example and to fight only when that very freedom is a stack like in ww2. All I want is to raise my family and be able to earn enough to take a vacation every couple of years and maybe own two cars and retire when I turn 70 is that to much to ask?



Right now in America is getting very tough to do this. And for all of you that say I am doing it be thankful.

Originally posted by Subjective Truth
reply to post by Merriman Weir

 

We have common ground I feel the same way. That is why I want to change America back. You cannot spread freedom down the barrel of a gun it should spread by example and to fight only when that very freedom is a stack like in ww2.

With respect, I don't think you do. You seem to think that America has some how changed and that you want to return it to some point in the past. Me? I've come to the conclusion that what I'm seeing and hearing is the way that America is, was and perhaps always will be.

If anything, I think it will actually get worse, because if this is the way Americans are crying now, after only a few years of, for want of a better word, backlash, then - as I've said many time before on here - wait until they're still feeling backlash in ten or even a hundred years time like the English.

reply to post by intrepid


I may not look it, but I am a fairly patriotic person. We had an American flag hanging on the living room wall all of my childhood. But, having said that, I have been ashamed to be an American at times. One should never have to feel shamed by their country. I honestly think America can take more than a few lessons from Canada. I can't understand the level of BS that Canada endures in America. She is treated like a joke on many platforms. It really is ridiculous. Of course, I have never been the "Our way is the RIGHT way" kind of patriot either. I simply believe in the things that we're all taught America is supposed to stand for, Truth, Justice, and Freedom. I consider myself an honorable man, beset on all sides by men who have none, nor even understand the concept. These are trying times, and it saddens the heart to see some of the travesties unfold here at home, and abroad, via American influence and policy. I sometimes wonder if I am the last sane man in a country of insanity. Then I come to ATS and see many like-minded individuals and I breathe a sigh of relief. It seems the ignorant fools on ATS outnumber the informed, but even so, it makes me feel quite a bit better to realize that I am not alone in my thoughts.

Chrono

Speaking as a long term member of ATS and a Kiwi I have found that a lot of Americans on the boards have not been able to reconcile the ideals of there founding fathers with today 21st century world . The fact that Americans have a reputation for being insular and ignorant of the wider world can be demonstrated by , the fact that only tourists of that nationality ask about driving between Christchurch and Queensland . It is a great shame that the AP Show is dead and buried for this topic would have made for a great show with member contributions and all .

[edit on 24-3-2010 by xpert11]

reply to post by Subjective Truth


yes hun, most canadians feel the same way. we do not allow any form of hateful behaviour and we like it that way. i also dont know a single canadian who feels that they're freedoms are limited because they are not given the right to be hateful. we actually enjoy a country full of people who know how to be nice to each other

*edit to add

most canadians probably feel even MORE FREE knowing that they wont have to be subjected to hate from other people. we dont live in fear, and i think thats a pretty darn free way to live. i'd rather be free of fear...to me, thats the ultimate freedom.

[edit on 24-3-2010 by devilishlyangelic23]

reply to post by endisnighe


I am sorry to burst your bubble but...let me breakdown some of the stuff you said...


first of all,you said is that you pay 50% of your earning to the gov,
wich is totally normal when you see the tax break rich people get in the usa,amount of govermental fraud,overpaid offical and the largest police department in the world.
you also have the military issue that is sucking more money then most country's whole economy.

second,nobody forces you to be the police of the world,it is your government decision.

you also said you GIVE money to 150 countrys wich i doubt is true since
most of the time you get something back.
Like weakened government controls on infrastructures that allows free market corporations to come in and set up shop.
The US doesn't GIVE money away, it BUYS something for its money.
Argentina, Zambia even Russia have all reduced tariffs, reduced government control on oil, reduced government control on water, electricity, etc.
All had collapsing economies after all the reduction.
For more info look up Antonia Juhasz.

third....CHARITY...i have two words for you :TAX HEAVEN.

fourth but not least you said americans are FORCED of pollicing,to donate money,to distribute food...but if majority think they are "FORCED" to do all this i dont understand why more people rally to brag about it...besides the internet i dont see millions of americans walking in the street protesting.


this is only my opinion...but i think you should get more information before stating stuff like this.it is frustrating to see people blame others when their mentality is the main problem.

Originally posted by Subjective Truth
If you do not see what is special about America then words are not going to change your mind. But think about this who gives the most?

Who gives the most ?? To the rest of the world ?? Not the US, champ...

The US gives 0.18% of GNI to the rest of the world every year, which is near the bottom of the list...Granted many other countries give the same or even less...

However, to say "America gives the most to the rest of the world" is pure garbage

My experience is that SOME Americans, don't do their own country's reputation any favours, by displaying the "USA is #1" attitude, which can easily be perceived as arrogance by those on the receiving end of it.

Not ALL Americans obviously, but enough of them to ruffle the feathers of many other nations and cultures.

To demonstrate the issue;
If you take the Nationalistic angle out of the equation, and turn to someone from your own background, and say "I am the best, I'm No.1, and I do soooo much more good than you do."
What reaction do you think that you'd get?

Would they say "Yeah!!! Good for you, you really ARE the best!!"
or are they more likely to be upset, and question why you think you're better than them?

Food for thought?

Originally posted by Subjective Truth

If you do not see what is special about America then words are not going to change your mind. But think about this who gives the most? And also who is the largest beacon of democracy?

The largest beacon of democracy?

A two party system with very little difference really in their idealogies and a system where 22% of the population elected a man to almost limitless power.

Democracy you say?

In a country where to have any left-wing leanings means to be vilified and ostracised in the name of democracy?

You do see the hypocrisy don't you?

Every country has something to give and good people. And so does America.

I agree 100% but your version of democracy certainly isn't one of them.

There are indeed many good American's and the world is a far better place for the USA's presence, but perfect you are not and there are many other way's which offer the world a better vision for the future.

[edit on 24/3/10 by Freeborn]