In reading some of, not all, of the posts in this thread, it's apparent to me that many of you here don't understand the bill that was just passed or have not familiarized yourselves with it's content. I won't even attempt to summarize it's 2000 plus pages of bulls@#t.

Suffice it to say that the only ones that will benefit from this bill are the, already greedy, pathetic, insurance companies that out right refuse to provide adequate health care for your hard earned dollars and constantly refuse coverage for things based off closely worded stipulations in their contracts that allow them the right to do so.

These are the same companies that just got bailed out to the tune of billions of our hard earned dollars for nothing short of gross criminal malfeasance. The kind of practices that if you or I had done in our mom and pop businesses, we would be arrested.

Not only did we let these same companies steal our hard earned tax dollars, but they and others like them managed to loose many of your future pensions in the form of 401k's, so that many of you who, at one time, might have been able to afford to pay for your own health care in your twilight years, can no longer afford to do so because it's lost the TPTB.

I am neither republican nor democrat. In fact I'm rapidly reaching the point where I'm embarrassed to even call myself an American for allowing this nonsense to continue unabated for as long as I have, without so much as a letter to TPTB, or standing up and yelling at the top of my lungs to those criminals in Washington that we've had enough of this crap and were not going to allow it to continue.

What is not realized here is this bill doesn't help those that don't have jobs as most of them are already on state aid health insurance. It does however hurt those of us that are working but barely making ends meet. We can't afford the insurance through our work, and because we have insurance available through work ( even tho the premiums would kill us) we cannot get state aid.

My speculation is that a majority of us that are without health insurance ( me included) are that way do to affordability issues. Now I get to look forward to being penalized for working my butt off but not being able to afford insurance. Lovely. As I have stated earlier, I would be better off going on welfare and foodstamps to get state aid health insurance and I might be even able to get ahead financialy that way. Sad when the only way to actually afford health insurance is to leave you job and have your state and fellow taxpayers pay your way. No wonder why those in that scenario already are so reluctant to give it up. They would be worse off finding a job! Sad times we live in folks. Sad times.

Good post!

every patriot should CALL OUT his corrupted Congressmen and vote them out.....every patriot should CALL OUT the corrupted MEDIA who effectively brain wash people by showing issues from perspectives that appease Big indsutry.....news is a business now......when it comes to the truth about the MASSIVE conflict of interest and collusion between corporations regulators and gov't the MEDIA barely makes a squeak.

Most people have busy lives ....so they don't like to carry on with a reasearch project ( regarding the propoganda and big biz collusion )..when they go home and watch or read the Main stream MEdia.........in fact they have a wife and kids to deal with so they would rather be comfored by thinking everything else is on the up and up.

These people are usually ignorant and happily so....and that is why those who read between the lines sometimes refer to them as sheeple.

Originally posted by Silver Shadow

Originally posted by mr-lizard

But in my 'ignorance' - i fail to see why you don't want health care for those who cannot afford it?

The difference Mr Lizard, that in Australia, we went through something like this health care controversy about "Medicare" a few years ago.
There was massive public opposition to it at first. But the government were honestly trying to introduce a better and fairer health care system for the Australian people.
As soon as an extra new health care tax was suggested, people just freaked out.
The government did introduce "Medicare", and it is now recognized that it not only works, but is a winner.

But the situation in America is VASTLY different to Australia.

The US government are now desperately trying to raise taxes and revenue to obscene levels, and they have absolutely no intentions of funding health care with the windfall income this travesty creates.

It is all about funding the health insurers, which then invest the money collected (plundered !) in Wall Street.
US investors are totally tapped out, broke. So the public need to be bled by force to keep the Wall Street scams going just a bit longer.

It is a last ditch effort to plunder the American people, and prop up the markets, before TSHTF and the financial system collapses totally.

The new health care bill COULD be a wonderful thing for the American people, if only the US government were honest and sincere.

But quite obviously the elite are just criminals hell bent on plundering as much as they can, as quickly as they can, before hiding in their luxury underground bunkers, safe from the hell that is coming..

*edited for spelin.

[edit on 23/3/2010 by Silver Shadow]

best reply in the thread.....

Originally posted by Aggie Man
I will have to disagree somewhat with your wording here.

Maybe the wording is different from abuse cousellors would have us believe but, only in my opinion, habits and addictions are virtually the same.

When a habit destroys someones body beyond the point of no return, then that someone needs to consider the fact that they're not doing themselves any good. The same thing goes for people who have these "addictions".

Most everyone learn from an early age that when you eat too much, you're going to gain weight. We also learn that smoking and drinking alcoholic beverages deteriorates our minds and bodies. Yet, in knowing these things, people will still insist on trying these vices and succumb to the euphoric spells these vices possess.

What I'm trying to say is that if an addiction(habit) can become a part of someones life then it can be parted from their lives also, with the realization that these vices are killing them or destroying their family or social lives. There is help for addictions. Help has been around way before this health reform was even uttered. Programs have been around for generations now and have a high success rate.

All we need to do is take care of our minds and bodies and they'll take care of us. It just takes a willingness to do so and nothing less.

"FINE we said..." You seem to think you talk for a majority of the people, which is sad.

Yeah yeah, we've seen dangerous reactionaries like you before and you're just venting because you're scared of change. The fact that you served the US really doesn't give you any sort of sovereignty

medicare broke
medicaid broke
social security broke

a trillion more spent WHEN PEOPLE WILL NOT BE GETTING A SOCIAL SECURITY/DISABILITY RAISE for the first time in 30 years.

and taxes continue to go up.

and the arrogance of the democrats sickens me to no end right now. spouting off how they have the peoples best interest in mind.

now this healthcare bills trash and changed nothing for forcing u the american citizen to buy. for the first time in us history.

its nothing but a power grab more intrusion in to your daily lives.

what part of not having the money for this do people not get?

wheres the money gonna come from????????????

higher taxes or china?

liberals what everything and do not want to pay for it.

seriously what part of broke do people not get?

i am mad as hell and they did this intentionally. they want people like me and you if your mad as hell right now to act like the bill ares,etc but dont give them the satisfaction.

2010 and 2012 show them what real power is. keep the faith!

[edit on 24-3-2010 by neo96]

It's my understanding that we will all begin to "pay" for this bill almost immediately, though most of it will be implemented over a period of years (correct?) and if this is true... what are those pymts. going to cover?

Will they be used to reinforce Medicare/caid or Social Security (we know they're broke) or will it be used for pymts. to the deficit (not likely) or will it be used for other unknown ventures? the money will certainly not be left sitting idle...

In my opinion, these politicians would rather let people die than live. This is whats wrong with us. Don't get me wrong, but our fellow man would rather receive the $$$ in exchange to help the wounded/dying. Where is the REAL care for human life being shown?

The enemy has always been money, and its really showing itself here.

I'm in my 20's. Finding a job is hard enough, but I shouldn't have to pay so that someone can save the life of another. I see now that money determines whether someone lives or dies.

correct me if im wrong.

As a vet and coming from a very long line of vets...I could not agree with you more...

so if they want a fight... sign me up..

After looking at this, I won't be surprised if the government ends up with unforseen overload with requests for newly formed co-ops to be legally certified health insurers. Such would probably cover the bare minimum to get by the government mandate, yet if you're in it you own it - and if the people forming them are clever enough with policy rules there would also be a way or two to still get your money out for non-health reasons. Just a little something to get around the new burden created when money in most households is already tight.

But how they did things in this bill is the wrong way. The industry should be regulated more and tort reform put in place (Lawyers ruined things yet again, that's why high medical fees and insurance got started), and not an extra weight levied upon the citizenry. Or if everyone must pay for it, it should be covered by existing taxes rather than via yet another unnecessary levy structure. (In other words it should be an expanded part of a reformed social security program and not being forced to do business with private insurers.)

Also both parties are guilty in creating the current economic mess. So if you vote republican to "undo" what the democrats did in this scenario, you're still not helping and may as well be wearing blinders while pushing the turnstile while knee-deep in you-know-what. Getting rid of both of those parties next election is the only way to honestly give office holders in government the necessary wake-up call.

I'm a bit late in going with the crowd, but now my 2¢ have been put in.

this bill is not for the people and is going to screw us all lets see follow the money and eventually its going into some politicains pocket

this is a good example of what we all should do from time to time

people whining over the reform should watch the movie Sicko by Michael Moore. Then you realize why the system had to be changed.

Anyway, after the reform US still has a private greedy insurance system. It certainly has not changed enough but it's a step in the right direction.


US should adopt a similar system like Canada, UK, France, Germany and the rest of the western world with universal health care.

And to all those crying socialism, do you really think for example Canada and the UK are socialist counties just because it has universal health care paid by the government?

Originally posted by Shades1035
people whining over the reform should watch the movie Sicko by Michael Moore. Then you realize why the system had to be changed.

Anyway, after the reform US still has a private greedy insurance system. It certainly has not changed enough but it's a step in the right direction.


US should adopt a similar system like Canada, UK, France, Germany and the rest of the western world with universal health care.

And to all those crying socialism, do you really think for example Canada and the UK are socialist counties just because it has universal health care paid by the government?

And then for a reality check watch any number of the specials tat John Stossell has done. I'd love to see those two go head on a no holds barred debate. Moore would get his fat cottage cheese butt handed back to him.