Energy Healing - does it work?, page 1

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ATS Members have flagged this thread 7 times

Topic started on 22-3-2010 @ 07:50 AM by stumch

Hey ATS

Been researching this area and am considering getting into it, I need a change in life and feel like doing something interesting, rewarding and useful to society. Have booked a session in Reconnection therapy to see first hand what it is all about.

My question is whether anyone here has any experience with these types of healing techniques. I am looking at the following modalities so far:

Reiki
Reconnection (Dr Eric Pearl's technique)
Tapping/Emotional Freedom
Pysch-K (not strictly energetics but similar principles I think).

Has anyone had any of these done? Is anyone here a practitioner of these or any others? What is your experience, if any, of the results?

I really want to think that this is part of the future of medicine, and that the old, Newtonian, reductionist approach to health is dead. That we learn to live well, rather than pump ourselves full of drugs and bad food.

I am considering a degree in Holistic Health, and specialising in one or more of the above. If anyone has any advice on any of these matters I will be indebted to you.

Cheers

reply posted on 22-3-2010 @ 08:19 AM by InfaRedMan

Energy healing (in itself) is a gip! There is no empirical evidence to suggest the phenomena is real. The only reason it appears to work is through placebo. The ability of the body to heal itself... with a liberal dose of 'belief'. And then it's completely possible that the body was going to heal itself anyway. No energy healer required!

I guess the real question to be debated here is, Is there something tangible coming from the hands of the 'healer'? Apart from regular body heat, Science suggests 'no'.

IRM

reply posted on 22-3-2010 @ 08:52 AM by SeeingBlue

Originally posted by InfaRedMan
The ability of the body to heal itself... with a liberal dose of 'belief'.

Maybe that's all that is really needed and shamanism or healing hands is just what the mind needs to convince it's self that it can fight this problem on it's own.

Science also doesn't currently recognize any energies within and around our bodies that can be used to diagnose sickness or to manipulate it. That doesn't mean they don't exist, we just have gotten that far yet.. but I believe both of the above may be the case.

reply posted on 22-3-2010 @ 09:00 AM by krunchy

My wife is a "licensed" Reiki practitioner, so I can speak from first-hand experience.

Its a total scam. There is zero evidence that it works at all, and having been through several Reiki treatments all I can say is its 100% bogus.

reply posted on 22-3-2010 @ 09:10 AM by ethelbert

I just joined ATS so I could make this post.

From personal experience I became a reiki master out of curiosity and found that I got positive results. Later I became a certified Matrix Energetics practitioner which really works. I suggest you check out the website: matrixenergetics.com.

reply posted on 22-3-2010 @ 09:13 AM by MischeviousElf

Originally posted by InfaRedMan
Energy healing (in itself) is a gip! There is no empirical evidence to suggest the phenomena is real. The only reason it appears to work is through placebo. The ability of the body to heal itself... with a liberal dose of 'belief'. And then it's completely possible that the body was going to heal itself anyway. No energy healer required!

In randomised double blind trials, I am sure being a Scientist as you speak with such conviction on this topic, I am sure you would agree in your above "The Only Reason etc" is negated if double blind trials are done?

Then you state there is no Emperical Evidence?

Can you source that please?

I guess the real question to be debated here is, Is there something tangible coming from the hands of the 'healer'? Apart from regular body heat, Science suggests 'no'.

Please can you show me Who, What Where in "Science" using such broad states this?

Science being the study of the nature and behaviour of the universe and its constituent parts on each other, and finding through experiments events that hold a law or truth, that is its repeatable?

So your Science please these experiemnts or trials?

...................

OP you may find the following interesting:
Pilot Crossover Trial of Reiki Versus Rest for Treating Cancer-Related Fatigue

They were diagnosed with a variety of cancers, most commonly colorectal (62.5%) cancer, and had a median age of 59 years. Fatigue on the FACT-F decreased within the Reiki condition (P=.05) over the course of all 7 treatments. In addition, participants in the Reiki condition experienced significant improvements in quality of life (FACT-G) compared to those in the resting condition (P <.05). On daily assessments (ESAS) in the Reiki condition, presession 1 versus postsession 5 scores indicated significant decreases in tiredness (P <.001), pain (P <.005), and anxiety (P<.01)

And Further:
Autonomic Nervous System Changes During Reiki Treatment

Results: Heart rate and diastolic blood pressure decreased significantly in the Reiki group compared to both placebo and control groups.

Conclusions: The study indicates that Reiki has some effect on the autonomic nervous system.

In Addition:

Biological correlates of Reiki Touchsm healing

Results. Comparing before and after measures, anxiety was significantly reduced, t(22)=2·45, P=0·02. Salivary IgA levels rose significantly, t(19)=2·33, P=0·03, however, salivary cortisol was not statistically significant. There was a significant drop in systolic blood pressure (SBP), F(2, 44)=6·60, P < 0·01. Skin temperature increased and electromyograph (EMG) decreased during the treatment, but before and after differences were not significant.

Conclusions. These findings suggest both biochemical and physiological changes in the direction of relaxation. The salivary IgA findings warrant further study to explore the effects of human TT and humeral immune function.

Also:

Journal of Pain and Symptom ManagementA phase II trial of reiki for the management of pain in advanced cancer patients

Quality of life was assessed on Days 1 and 7. Participants in Arm B experienced improved pain control on Days 1 and 4 following treatment, compared to Arm A, and improved quality of life

The best way for you to approach this is to speak to people who have actually had the treatment first who have and have not recovered or had benefits to make up your own mind.

Dont use balnket terms by those who pin such worldveiws on subjects such as Science says no because it has not been on the news or in a school textbook, Also understand the research is not very detailed and more needs to be done.

Whatever modality you choose only in time as the actual mechanics of operation of all healing work is still poorly misunderstood, studied and quantified.

Something is happening though, and just because Science today cannot account for 75% of the "Missing Universe" or dark matter etc, does not mean it not there, or exists. If poorly understood. The same with healing

Search carefully this field attracts many mnay scams too, some will want to charge lots to give you empowerments and such like, Reiki does need the practitioner to charge for its teaching, as the initial reiki work done by the founder did not help people in this area of life, ie they got better where healed but stayed in the same situation economically and socialy, allowing these environmental effects to cause the diseases again

Therefore he modified it... but but take the direct words of those who have trained under someone first before signing up. Well make that a group of them more than one.

Love and Light

Elf

[edit on 22-3-2010 by MischeviousElf]

reply posted on 22-3-2010 @ 09:21 AM by krunchy

Originally posted by MischeviousElf

The best way for you to approach this is to speak to people who have actually had the treatment first who have and have not recovered or had benefits to make up your own mind.

Actually, the best way is to read the science. The studies you posted have all been found to be un-scientific, in that they do not account for the placebo effect. From wiki:

"A 2008 systematic review of randomised clinical trials assessing the evidence basis of Reiki concluded that efficacy had not been demonstrated for any condition.[5] Nine studies fit the inclusion criteria; a modified Jadad score of methodological quality was used, taking into account the difficulty of blinding practitioners. Non-randomized studies were excluded, as the potential for intentional or unintentional bias in such studies is large, rendering the results uninterpretable. Overall, the methodological quality of the evidence base was found wanting, with even high-ranking studies failing fully to control for placebo effects and most studies suffering "methodological flaws such as small sample size, inadequate study design and poor reporting."[5] As trials with such flaws are known to be likely to show exaggerated treatment effects, there is insufficient evidence to indicate that Reiki is effective as sole or adjuvant therapy for any medical condition, or that it has any benefits beyond possible placebo effects.[5][6] Placebo trials of Reiki are complicated by the difficulty of designing a realistic placebo."

To date there are zero scientific studies which confirm Reiki as anything but a scam.

reply posted on 22-3-2010 @ 09:56 AM by yodagod

reply to post by stumch

I have personally offered myself up as a Guinea pig for several types of juju masquerading as healing power and such.

There is simply no evidence for this mumbo jumbo nor praying to jesus or wrapping yourself in bacon and spinning 3 times.

The best you're going to get is the placebo effect for every magic healing you can put a name to.

If anyone wants to argue this then please feel free to heal me, I have offered my services to the witch doctors on ATS before and unsurprisingly they declined to participate in the experiment, claiming it won't work for one silly reason or another.

reply posted on 22-3-2010 @ 10:00 AM by yodagod

reply to post by ethelbert

Later I became a certified Matrix Energetics practitioner

What the hell is that nonsense supposed to be when it's at home, is it like being a jedi master ?

Did you actually part with money for a label that says Matrix Energetics, who gave you the award ? Neo?

reply posted on 22-3-2010 @ 10:03 AM by MischeviousElf

reply to post by krunchy

Originally posted by krunchy

Originally posted by MischeviousElf

The best way for you to approach this is to speak to people who have actually had the treatment first who have and have not recovered or had benefits to make up your own mind.

Actually, the best way is to read the science. The studies you posted have all been found to be un-scientific, in that they do not account for the placebo effect. From wiki:

Lol thats fun using WIKI as science.

PLEASE do your homework.

NONE of the papers I linked to which all went to be published in journals of healthcare proffessionals were not of the Study you mention in WIKI (OMG lol)!

INfact if you do the research instead of a Google click 1 min read and accept as fact proof to back up your beliefs, and then link you will find, on reading the full papers that two of the studies included both "Sham Healers" and also Randomised Double blind protocols using "Placebo" as some thought they were getting it, the reiki but none was given.

Read the papers, get the journals look at the CONTROL groups ie
Reiki
Sham Reiki
No Treatment but pretend (placebo)
Normal conventional approach

Thank you.

OP read the research, speak to people, dont accept WIKI lol as definative on anything except links, and certainly dont base your worldview on SCIENTISTS who dont even read the papers or research first before stating a fact, to the opposite.

Elf.

[edit on 22-3-2010 by MischeviousElf]

reply posted on 22-3-2010 @ 10:10 AM by krunchy

Originally posted by MischeviousElf
NONE of the papers I linked to which all went to be published in journals of healthcare proffessionals were not of the Study you mention in WIKI (OMG lol)!

You are mistaken. The study you linked to "Pilot Crossover Trial of Reiki Versus Rest for Treating Cancer-Related Fatigue" is mentioned in the wiki article, as well as the 2008 review of results. In addition, the researched included 16 people which is hardly a sufficient sample to take any relevant scientific information. And as been mentioned several times before, the study ignored placebo effects.

reply posted on 22-3-2010 @ 10:24 AM by krunchy

I also took a look at the study "A Systematic Review of the Therapeutic Effects of Reiki" that you linked, and I was surprised to read that this study ranked the results of reiki as "poor". Perhaps your little jab at me to do my homework was misplaced?

Results: The modified CONSORT Criteria indicated that all 12 trials meeting the inclusion criteria were lacking in at least one of the three key areas of randomization, blinding, and accountability of all patients, indicating a low quality of reporting. Nine (9) of the 12 trials detected a significant therapeutic effect of the Reiki intervention; however, using the Jadad Quality score, 11 of the 12 studies ranked “poor.”

Conclusions: The serious methodological and reporting limitations of limited existing Reiki studies preclude a definitive conclusion on its effectiveness. High-quality randomized controlled trials are needed to address the effectiveness of Reiki over placebo.

reply posted on 22-3-2010 @ 10:31 AM by MischeviousElf

reply to post by krunchy

It does not ignore placebo as the control groups include this. Basic stuff im afraid.

Anyhow the best people to ask if reiki works is those who experience it, and work with it, who are also real scientist's infact top of their game in medicine, and incorporate it into their mechanical medicine worldview.

Maybe someone on TV so in the age of celeb it is accepted more how about Dr. Mehmet Oz ?

His medical and scientific work is pioneering, andbeyond any recourse. He holds several medical patents, and has written many mnay papers that have gone to peer review and been corroborated.

His Bio for any in doubt to this mans knowledge of Modern Science and medicine is to be found Here

2001-present Professor of Surgery
Columbia University College of
Physicians & Surgeons, New York, NY

2001-present Medical Director, Integrative Medicine Program
NewYork-Presbyterian Hospital/Columbia University Medical Center, New York, NY

1993-present Attending Surgeon
NewYork-Presbyterian Hospital/Columbia University Medical Center, New York, NY

Is he a Sham or snake oil seller to?

His honors and standing in the world are a long read but include:

* Named Time Magazine's 44th Most Influential Scientist and Thinker 2008
* Honored by the New York Open Center [1] for his "outstanding research in writing and communication [and for] bridging Western and alternative/complementary medicine." 2007
* Listed in Doctors of the Year Hippocrates Magazine
* Listed in Healers of the Millennium Healthy Living Magazine
* Listed in Best Doctors of the Year New York Magazine
* Listed in Castle Connolly Guide
* Named Global Leader of Tomorrow at the 1999 World Economic Forum meeting
* Named Turkish American of the Year 1996
* Books for a Better America Award for Healing from the Heart, 1999
* Robert E. Gross Research Scholarship from the American Association for Thoracic Surgery, 1994–1996
* Research Award, American Society of Laser Medicine and Surgery, 1991
* Blakemore Research Awards, Columbia University College of Physicians and Surgeons 1988-1991
* Named one of the 500 most influential Muslims 2009

So I think his take on the effects of reiki on healing is above anything mentioned here already by any of us. What does he do with reiki?

the use of reiki during open heart surgeries and heart transplant operations. Says Dr. Oz: "Reiki has become a sought-after healing art among patients and mainstream medical professionals."

Read more at Suite101: Reiki in Complimentary Medicine: Reiki is now being practiced in several hospitals in the US

Healhcare Research

Nurses who use it daily:

Marilyn Vega is a nurse who has given reiki sessions to patients in both hospitals. "Reiki sessions cause patients to heal faster with less pain," says Vega.
nip>
Dr. Mike Cantwell, a pediatrician specializing in infectious diseases, provides one to three hour-long reiki sessions. When asked how reiki helps his patients Cantwell said, "I have found reiki to be useful in the treatment of acute illnesses such as musculoskeletal injury, pain, headache, acute infections and asthma. Reiki is also useful for patients with chronic illnesses especially those associated with chronic pain."
nip>
Dr. Nancy Eos of the University of Michigan Medical School is one of the increasing number of doctors who incorporates reiki in their medical practice. "I can't imagine practicing medicine without Reiki," Eos says. "With Reiki all I have to do is touch a person. Things happen that don't usually happen. Pain lessens in intensity. Rashes fade. Wheezing gives way to breathing clearly. Angry people begin to joke with me."
nip>
Tests conducted at Hartford Hospital in Hartford, Connecticut show that Reiki used during pregnancy reduced anxiety by 94 percent, nausea by 80 percent, pain by 78 percent and improved sleep by 86 percent.

Healthcare research

Op as said ive linked some research, there is more out there, speak to those who have experienced it, and AS SAID those who it did not work for, speak to health care providers who use many differant modalities for the best one for you to explore.

Something is happening, its not just placebo time will tell, beware the scammers and debunkers on both sides, get facts, look at how and what effect it is being used today by real scientists and doctors etc, make your own mind up.

Kind Regards,

Elf

reply posted on 22-3-2010 @ 11:00 AM by schrodingers dog

I can only speak from personal experience so the following is at best anecdotal evidence.

Does energy healing work?

Yes for some things no for others.

Just like any tool it is useful for a purpose and not across the board.

We are all energetic beings, this isn't a spiritual position it is scientific fact ... atoms colliding, manifesting as solids, liquids, and gases into our living form. Illness is a broad term but in many cases can be defined as our bodies not functioning as they should, by logical consequence when the above is happening the energy field they create isn't their natural one and isn't in harmony with the rest of the body ... hence illness.

I happen to be a very empathic person despite myself, that is to say that I absorb others' energies by default. Due to the work I used to do I was exposed to thousands of folks' energies on a weekly basis and inadvertently used to absorb much of their suffering. At the time I didn't know how to rid myself of it and thus I stored it all in my lower back, to the degree that it became practically debilitating.

A good friend of mine who was/is a naturally gifted energy healer used to work on me and my back during those times and would manage to relieve much of the suffering stored within my body ... but a a great cost to himself. He used to thrash whilst doing it and cry uncontrollably for days until he managed to get it out of his own body, but at least he knew how to do that for himself.

The body has a great ability to heal itself and energy healing can assist it in that process in the short term and in some cases when it is apt.

reply posted on 22-3-2010 @ 11:12 AM by v01i0

Of course energy healing works! Or at least has potency to work. It is psychological energy and it manifests itself as placebo effect (as known to medical sciences). If you believe in Jesus Christ, and believe that someone has capability to heal in his name, then it has good change of working - but of course, if you don't get healed, your sins are to blame.

In the same way, if you believe in modern medicine, receive a nice pill from a doctor who you know to be a specialist, the pill is ought to work quite likely, even if it's only sugar. If it doesn't, your disease is perhaps a persistent type.

It is the mind that can do wonderous things. Get to know it!

-v

reply posted on 22-3-2010 @ 11:20 AM by schrodingers dog

reply to post by v01i0

Whilst you are correct that the mind is a powerful tool and that the placebo effect has merit, you are actually selling short something that you haven't experienced and thus do not understand.

In my experience there was nothing psychological to the process. The man simply put his hands on my back, after five or so minutes both his hands and my lower back started burning to an almost unbearable degree, and I could actually feel the energy flowing from me. When he was still coming to terms with his ability and didn't know his own strength and how to control I observed him drop adult men like a stone out of the blue simply by putting his hand on their chest or forehead.

You may dismiss it with lol smileys if you so wish, but since you took the liberty to suggest that we look into our minds, may I in turn suggest you allow yours to perhaps be a little more open.

reply posted on 22-3-2010 @ 11:35 AM by v01i0

reply to post by schrodingers dog

You are right, I haven't experienced energy healing in the way that I would've been to a energy healer.

I never denied the potency or possibility of actual energy healing. I just spoke about my own experience. How would I be able to talk about anything else? I cannot really comment something that I have no experience nor opinion about.

Well, carry on!

-v

reply posted on 22-3-2010 @ 11:37 AM by freebourn

I have done Reiki for a few years now.

Its really amazing, I highly recommend it.
I get great feedback about it all the time from people whom I use it on.

reply posted on 22-3-2010 @ 11:38 AM by earthdude

My father has introduced me to the work of Burt Goldman. He energizes a glass of water and it supposedly made a guy's acne dissapear overnight. I am taking this info with a grain of salt. Salt cures everything.

reply posted on 22-3-2010 @ 11:42 AM by polychronopolis

I've been a Reiki master for a few years now and, yup, it works...probably not the way you think though. Although I have been trained to use it on other people, I just use it on myself...I have another, unrelated professional career as my "day job".

Anyone can learn how to do it...took me a few years to become a "master" but some people take much shorter courses and usually get the general idea of it.

It's not "magic" or any other "hocus pocus"...so if that's what you're looking for, then keep looking. It's merely a martial art that teaches people how to direct and focus positive energy flow (i.e. "chi", "qi", "ki", etc...) to clear and fill various energy centers (i.e. "chakras") in the body when they become depleted and/or unbalanced. Instead of using the energy to break a board or kick someone's a$$, like in karate, reiki practitioners use the energy to balance the chakras...it's the same energy...just used differently.

As far as looking for "empirical" evidence or any other "scientific" studies to prove that it works...good luck...problem is that we don't have any machines yet that can measure it because we don't really know what it is...I tend to believe that once we make further advances in quantum physics, we'll understand all this stuff much better...that is if we can keep from fighting each other and blowing ourselves up !!!

Anyway...you don't know me, and although I'm telling you the truth, the only way for you to be sure about it is to try it out for yourself if you're curious...have fun !!!

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