##ATTENTION ALL 9/11 POSTERS- FORUM REJUVENATION##

I don't think we'll ever get away from the rude and "i know all" posts. Everyone thinks they're right and the rest are wrong.

This goes for Both sides of the debate.

This is likely the most significant and watershed issue of our generation, as such whilst understandable that it inspires passion, it is one that most merits calm reasoning and methodical debate ... that is the only way any progress towards the truth of the matter (no matter what that truth may be) will be made.

Though folks may hold opposing views, in the search for the unqualified truth, we are all collaborators. Our arguments ammunition to either solidify or dissolve our preconceptions and either outcome should be welcomed if evidenced by sound facts, and yes it is more important to get the truth than to be right ... anything else, we might as well be discussing with mirrors.

Something did happen on that day, and the only chance any of us have to getting to the truth of it is working with each other and not in pre-structured antagonistic positions.

The subject is too important for personal polemics.

"" We have gotten many complaints and observations from members that they would like to post in this forum but don't because of fear of being attacked ""


No disrespect ment , but " fear of being attacked " by words is a little
kindergardenish isn't it ? If someone is that scared of being called a wuss
maybe they should post their comment and move on and not go back in to that particular thread . then wait for somewhere else to go post an opinion .but that's just me and i don't let 911 own my entire life .
thanks .
EDIT-
i think we all know that no matter what is said or what is done ,
We will never know the complete truth about what happened on 9-11 .
do i think it was an inside job ? NO . Do i think there are questions that need to be answered ? YES

[edit on 14-3-2010 by linv5800]

Originally posted by linv5800
"" We have gotten many complaints and observations from members that they would like to post in this forum but don't because of fear of being attacked ""


No disrespect ment , but " fear of being attacked " by words is a little
kindergardenish isn't it ?

No, a childish act is when some use a free service as their own mud pit. Irregardless of the amount of OTHER members that would like to post. And would offer more to the topic in a few posts as opposed to the "childish" bickering now.

If someone is that scared of being called a wuss
maybe they should post their comment and move on and not go back in to that particular thread .

If someone feels like calling someone a "wuss" then ATS is not for you.

reply to post by intrepid


I cannot express how completely elated i am by this collective decision, as it has helped solidify my decision to remain here. I only joined less than three weeks ago, yet in that short time had already come to contemplate not returning. Those feelings were born entirely from the nature of some of the discussions on the 911 topic forum. This topic alone constitues one of the most profound moral, ethical and philosophical dilemas and fileds of research that has ever been laid upon the foundations of our countries roots...liberty and freedom. The convergence of complexities of events that surround 911 call forth the deepest need and desire to uncover the truth...to explore every fascet of ourselves and our society, to plumb the depths of our own natures and ask, will we passively sit, helplessly watching this country and our world descend into the same draconian, fascistic reality that had preceeded it. Will we allow the PTB to succed unchallenged. This topic deserves to be held in the light of the most transparent observation. Let it at least maintain that integrity here, regardless of the opposing beliefs and assumptions. Only if we can examine the event in this way, will we ever arrive at the truth, regardless of how improbable it may be.

Does this truly mean the diatribes of "I'm smarter than ____ and everyone who does not agree with me is braindead sheeple?" will cease?

Originally posted by Watcher-In-The-Shadows
Does this truly mean the diatribes of "I'm smarter than ____ and everyone who does not agree with me is braindead sheeple?" will cease?

One way or another.

reply to post by intrepid


Awesome. It sucks you guys have to come down so hard but some people love to push it.

Argumentum Ad Ignorantiam

Originally posted by hmmmbeer
I would like to see some sort of policy aginst what is effectively spam.

What constitutes "spam" can be rather subjective. However, the staff is empowered to make judgment calls where there is doubt.

We are aware of "stupidity trolling" and other forms of online griefing, and when enough evidence accumulates, may act on it.

Should you see what appear to be such tactics in action a post, please ALERT us and let us know.

Depending on the circumstances, it may take a while to nail down some of the more slippery subspecies of troll, but sooner or later, fate catches up with them.

What If God Was All Of Us?

Originally posted by GorehoundLarry
I don't think we'll ever get away from the rude and "i know all" posts. Everyone thinks they're right and the rest are wrong.

Human nature as a whole is not likely to change anytime soon, regardless of what the AboveTopSecret.com Terms And Conditions Of Use specify.

We know this.

Thankfully, those of us who want ATS to be a great place to discuss 9/11 aren't required to change human nature. All we need to do is follow the rules we have agreed to honor by posting here.

Ideally, your dedicated, hard-working ATS staff will take care of the rest.






P.S. Admittedly not a perfect solution, but hopefully good enough.

[edit on 3/14/2010 by Majic]

Originally posted by hmmmbeer
Very good news. I might add a policy to prohibit simple 'Monty Python Argument Clininc' replies, such as:

I make a point (possibly with a supporting link)

>>Prove it. They never said that.

Point 2... The sky is blue

>> No its not.

etc etc

that was the main weapon of the paid debunkers - not only insults but fill the posts with pages and pages of useless contradictions.

I would like to see some sort of policy aginst what is effectively spam.

Cheers

_____________________________________________________________

I couldn't agree more with this comment.

I agree that it is important to reign in some of the more vitriolic ad hominems, I think the debunking trolls pose more of a distraction to thoughtful and rational debate.

We'll see how this moderation crackdown plays out, I guess. I don't post much on ATS anyway but I seriously doubt I am going to be as polite to someone telling me "down is up" and "water is not wet" etc., as I would be to "my Grandmother sitting in church next to the minister with God looking through the window."

If this "rejuvenation" equates to "no hurt feelings" of some trolling debunker or some paid Fed, then there's no sense in even posting here anymore.

Nothing Personal

Originally posted by waycoolsnoopy
If this "rejuvenation" equates to "no hurt feelings" of some trolling debunker or some paid Fed, then there's no sense in even posting here anymore.

Feelings have nothing to do with it. It is simply a matter of honoring the rules.

Those who do, stay. Those who don't, go.

It ain't rocket science.

You boys are sure gonna make those disinformation artist's jobs a lot more difficult!

I'm so glad to see and appreciate the extra effort the moderators are going to make to clean up the 9/11 forum and get rid of the trolls. Maybe we'll get finally be able to get some work done around here!

Not to mention, it'll be interesting to see if the new civility will make it more inviting for those lurkers (we know you're out there!) to feel comfortable enough to post.

Thanks ATS!

Glad to see these changes taking effect.

Every time I tried to come to this board, I left in a hurry. I didn't really see the point in sticking around when such a large number of topics ended up the digital equivalent of, well, any number of tasteless comparisons I could make that would easily get me banned under the new provisions.

I feel like this board has been wasted potential up until now. Hopefully that will change on the 15th and allow both new and old members the opportunity to discuss the events of 9/11 in a civilized manner, bringing all of the research and evidence that people (trolls aside) come to this board to read about.

Star & flag for sure

reply to post by intrepid


It's about time, honestly, for the most important forum ATS has to be open to everyone.

I've never had an issue with the 9/11 forum and those who attacked me, were left behind.

Seriously, if you cannot debate, civilly, and with well thought out discussions, you obviously have no reason to participate in a forum, let alone the 9/11 forum.

Deny Ignorance.

It means to me, disagree, agree, but do it civilly, and with respect.

It means to me, comment, post, reply, but do it without being an idiot.

It means to me, research, investigate, theorize, but do it through knowledge.

Personally, I believe ATS might want to consider making the 9/11 forum like the Debate forum, where you cannot participate, unless you have the Deny Ignorance status.

For those of us who Write, we have Writer.

For those of us who Debate, we have Fighter.

For those of us who Research, we have Scholar.

I would have zero issues with a Deny Ignorance status or Deny the Lies status.

Something that sets the 9/11 forum area above the rest and makes a mandatory crackdown.

Sort of similar to the Bully Pulpit forum area, you have to abide by stronger T & C.

Personally, ATS's T & C is weak and feeble, but not because I disagree with them, but because I believe those people who cannot abide by those simple requests for compliance as people I would rather not speak to, to begin with.

Come on now people, the T & C are there for everyone, work within them.

9/11 forum or otherwise.

Deny Ignorance.

Obey The Moderator! - Optimus Rhyme


[edit on 14-3-2010 by SpartanKingLeonidas]

reply to post by intrepid


No where else on ATS, since I have been a member here, have I seen actions like this taken against any forum except for the 9/11 forum.


I have seen religious threads with opposing views handled with better civility than the insults between those against the OS and those for it.

This is not only a problem on ATS either, it would seem like I am seeing people separating themselves into these different factions everyday, anywhere I go.

reply to post by linv5800


Well said!!!!!





Mod Note: One Line Post – Please Review This Link.

[edit on 14/3/2010 by Sauron]

This is good news indeed I was looking at another forum the other day (I can't remember which one), but I was stunned at how well people were conducting themselves while discussing the 9/11 topic.

It was as if each person respected the other people, and they were all there to learn from one another and to find out the truth. They were not all agreeing with each other, but when someone said something that someone didn't agree with... well the discussion would sort of go like this:

"Well, I can see how you might thing that, but have you considered this fact....?"

"I thought of that too, but when I was honest with myself I realized that I was just seeing one side of that issue... but there really are other ways to see it..."

"Well, even though I know that conspiracies have indeed happened in the past, I'm just reluctant to believe that so many people would be in on such a terrible atrocity... I mean, how would they pull such a thing off?"

"That's the thing... you wouldn't need that many people in on it from the beginning, especially if you scheduled military "games" at the same time, so that people thought it was all a simulation..."

"Hmmm, you have a point there..."

"Do you all really believe that the government is that capable of pulling of such a thing?"

"Sure, the military is quite capable, and so are the alphabet agencies. It's really not that hard."

"What about the 9/11 Commission Report?"

"What about it? Are you aware of how many facts are missing from that piece of fiction?"

"I don't know about any of that. What are you referring to?"

"Here are some links to look at that will give you a huge list of things that are left unanswered and unaddressed..."

And so on... what I was particularly impressed with is how everyone could express their thoughts, fears, concerns, doubts, and beliefs... all without name calling or insults being hurled. I know this can be done, and when it is done, it is a very productive and mature process.

I look forward to this new direction!

I just want to mention, you say its so people will be less scared to post, wont this have the opposite effect? People will be very afraid that their next sincere post can be misconstrued and permanently banned?

People are natuarally emotional creatures thinking with their hearts in stead of their brains. You can see it on every thread. I would hate to see a long time poster gone because of one time lapse of judgement...

I am glad it will be 'attack the argument not poster' but I think a posting ban even harsh like 1-month would be better, in my life everyone gets a second chance no matter what they do to me, but so it goes...

reply to post by Ridhya


I do agree that a permaban may well seem quite harsh.
Such actions are predominately left for when the post in question is no slip of the tongue, is no semi-innocent misdirected posting style...the type of reply/post that brings the fall of the hammer is predominately one that sticks out like the proverbial canine testes.

Postbans are likely to be the order of the day. Within this thread 2 people have already received such.



Mistakes happen. People slip up. We get that and we understand that. We're all human...absolutely.

That said...there are posters within this Forum who have *slipped* more times than a drunken ice-skater. Posters who have been here for a long long loooong time.
I personally wouldn't be seeing such as an overly innocent slip should they do so.