Why not just say "Jerusalem"?, page 1
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Topic started on 13-3-2010 @ 12:30 PM by heliosprime
7And when they shall have finished their testimony, the beast that ascendeth out of the bottomless pit shall make war against them, and shall overcome them, and kill them.

8And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified.


www.biblegateway.com...

When referring to the deaths of the two witness in rev 11, why didn't john just write "Jerusalem"? Why the cryptic "which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified.".....?

Unless the great city is NOT Jerusalem as assumed by the phrase "where also our Lord was crucified"......

Egypt means POWER and sodom means evil, vile, corruption of the flesh.....

Perhaps the two witnesses are slain in a modern vile corrupted city such as Washington DC....you cant get more vile or corrupted than DC......there is no city on earth more powerful at this time (the end times).........

Jerusalem is specifically named elsewhere in Rev......so why the cryptic reference? There are 767 specific references to Jerusalem in the KJV of the bibles.....so why the mystery?



[edit on 13-3-2010 by heliosprime]


reply posted on 13-3-2010 @ 01:55 PM by kaleshchand
the phrase "where also our Lord was crucified" could mean where Christianity is no longer followed or maybe banned or where spirituality of any kind is disallowed if taken in a cryptic way. With the recent news/threads on spiritual people having the same brain pattern as schizophrenics I would not be surprised if spirituality was banned or declared to be some type of mental illness.

Though I am not well versed with Christianity so I may be way off, but reading through the link there are some other references which tie this to the U.S.A. (city may be Washington or some military base)

"6These have power to shut heaven, that it rain not in the days of their prophecy: and have power over waters to turn them to blood, and to smite the earth with all plagues, as often as they will."

Is it not assumed that U.S.A has weather manipulation perfected or nearly perfected?

"11And after three days and an half the spirit of life from God entered into them, and they stood upon their feet; and great fear fell upon them which saw them."

Revival after 3 and half days? counsiousness transfer into a robotic/anaroid body? If any country on earth has ability to do something like this it is you guessed it U.S.A.

" 12And they heard a great voice from heaven saying unto them, Come up hither. And they ascended up to heaven in a cloud; and their enemies beheld them. "

Also accepted by many (and very probable) that U.S.A has U.F.O. technology, and contact with aliens.


reply posted on 15-3-2010 @ 09:42 AM by MrXYZ
Originally posted by heliosprime
Originally posted by MrXYZ
Originally posted by heliosprime

Does the term "seperation of church and state" ring a bell?



You're not seriously against the separation of church and state, right?


Considering the term nor phrase exists anywhere in the constitution, it is a false argument from the beginning. As applied by vile God haters, YES i am against such insanity. Devne intervention founded this country and was intermixed in the daily application of gov. When liberal filth took over the courts a new and false appliction of the first ammendment began.

The black robed thugs that imposed murder of the unborn on the nation will be judged by God soon....very soon.....

That alone qualifies for "where also our Lord was cruicified" as a decription of DC.....


So you are fine with basing the state and laws on a FAIRY TALE? There might or might not be a god, no one knows, and no one can prove it. Either way, the God you're following is a horrible little creature and even if he existed, he'd be worse than Satan (and I'm using the word Satan to say he's really really bad...not because I think Satan exists, because we can't prove that either)...so why any non-racist/non-bigot would follow him is beyond me.

The God of the Old Testament is arguably the most unpleasant character in all fiction: jealous and proud of it; a petty, unjust, unforgiving control-freak; a vindictive, bloodthirsty ethnic cleanser; a misogynistic, homophobic, racist, infanticidal, genocidal, filicidal, pestilential, megalomaniacal, sadomasochistic, capriciously malevolent bully. Following him would be like following Hitler for crying out loud.

No offense, but you remind me of the crazy people on Times Square holding signs that say "repent or be doomed".
[edit on 15-3-2010 by MrXYZ]

[edit on 15-3-2010 by MrXYZ]


reply posted on 15-3-2010 @ 04:20 PM by Centurionx
reply to post by MrXYZ


Man I have been seeing this a lot lately, I detect a strong tone of hatred in your text. When I read these, I can't altogether dismiss such claims, although I believe there is a bit more to it than a 'fairy tale". I know what has happened to the bible over the years, and I did not have to read a bunch of internet bulls**t to realize that it is fragmented and poorly translated. Simply reading it one can see such things, however certain parts are bursting with symbolism and esoteric knowledge that is clearly hidden from people such as yourself. And perhaps from the scumbags that twisted the word to fulfill their own personal aggrandizement and agendas as well.

When I hear and read these verbal attacks against The Eternal, I remember text such as "And men cursed the God of heaven." I can only imagine this to get worse...You see, it is one thing to attack religion, but this says Men will HATE God and curse him/it/she. They will lay all the blame on something that is beyond all comprehension, instead of on themselves who have and are manifesting this reality.


reply posted on 15-3-2010 @ 04:48 PM by hippomchippo
Originally posted by Centurionx
reply to post by MrXYZ


Man I have been seeing this a lot lately, I detect a strong tone of hatred in your text. When I read these, I can't altogether dismiss such claims, although I believe there is a bit more to it than a 'fairy tale". I know what has happened to the bible over the years, and I did not have to read a bunch of internet bulls**t to realize that it is fragmented and poorly translated. Simply reading it one can see such things, however certain parts are bursting with symbolism and esoteric knowledge that is clearly hidden from people such as yourself. And perhaps from the scumbags that twisted the word to fulfill their own personal aggrandizement and agendas as well.

When I hear and read these verbal attacks against The Eternal, I remember text such as "And men cursed the God of heaven." I can only imagine this to get worse...You see, it is one thing to attack religion, but this says Men will HATE God and curse him/it/she. They will lay all the blame on something that is beyond all comprehension, instead of on themselves who have and are manifesting this reality.

He doesn't hate God, if there is a God, do you really think it would be like in the old testament? I'm pretty sure thats the god he's talking about.


reply posted on 15-3-2010 @ 05:51 PM by MrXYZ
reply to post by hippomchippo


Of course, definitely the God in the old testament. The God in the new testament, preaching forgiveness, love, and so on is fine by me.

Again, I got nothing against Christianity, everyone is entitled to their belief...and it doesn't matter if it's Christianity, Islam, or Hinduism.

But I DO have a problem with people who think the God of the old testament is a good guy. Imo there's 2 reasons for following that guy's teachings: Either you're a bigot/racist who hates everyone who doesn't share your belief (in which case you're the scum of society), or you're actually scared by the scriptures in the old testament, and only follow them because you "don't wanna end up in hell"...in which case you're dishonest. Either way, those people are generally looking down on anyone who doesn't share their belief. Heliosprime is a great example of that, most of his posts wreak of racism and bigotry. His last anti-Muslim rant even got locked right from the start.

Now think about how the old testament God is potrayed...he's a dictator who kills anyone who doesn't believe, he's actively committing genocide, and many other atrocities. Pretty much what the Nazi's did in WW2, so I don't think comparing Hitler to the old testament God is far fetched. Having said that, I don't think the same stands true for the new testament God, who apparently grew up to be a lot gentler and more understanding. Of course that doesn't fit the agenda of people who are racist and bigots...which explains why they are so fixated on the old testament.

I don't attack people on ATS in general, because everyone's entitled to their opinion and belief as long as it doesn't hurt anyone. But I WILL speak up against racists and bigots.

There's plenty of cool Christians who understand that they shouldn't take things literally, but rather interpret the symbolism in a way that fits modern society. Same goes for Muslims, Hindus, and Buddhists.

I mean, it shouldn't be surprising that a book that was written over 2000 years ago shouldn't be taken literally. Sun Tsu's Art of War that was written eons ago talks about armies and flanking troups...yet thousands of people saw the symbolic value in it, and now a lot of business men us the symbolic teachings to improve their business. The same can and imo should be done with the bible.

[edit on 15-3-2010 by MrXYZ]


reply posted on 16-3-2010 @ 02:11 AM by Centurionx
reply to post by MrXYZ


Sorry, it was not my intention to address you personally on the matter, but people in general, my mistake. Religion and God maybe should not be in the same sentence if you catch my drift. Lemme sleep on it kinda tired.


reply posted on 16-3-2010 @ 03:36 AM by heliosprime
Originally posted by MrXYZ
reply to post by hippomchippo


Of course, definitely the God in the old testament. The God in the new testament, preaching forgiveness, love, and so on is fine by me.

Again, I got nothing against Christianity, everyone is entitled to their belief...and it doesn't matter if it's Christianity, Islam, or Hinduism.



Such dedicated complete ignorance of God, Christ and the scriptures is astounding.......There is no difference between God in the "old" testament and the "new" testament......their is but ONE God. Jesus is his son, messanger of hope, savior, and example of how to lead a perfect human life.

It does matter if you are christian......, islam and hinduism and budda, etc etc, etc are ALL vile false religions of total damnation. And many "so called" christians are also damned for being "lukewarm", for following traditions of man such as easter, christmas, etc, etc, .......

Those who are decieved into "salvation by grace alone" are also decieved. Those who create idols to false gods..."mary and the saints" and other grave images "cricifix" etc......all damned without complete repentance....

Those who believe in the 'rapture" are following the antichrist into damnation.......

"Love thy neighbor" is a commandment of God long before the new testament was written.


reply posted on 16-3-2010 @ 10:18 AM by MrXYZ
reply to post by johnny2127


I totally understand that, and my remarks aren't directed against all Christians. Like you say, it's only the ones that feel the need to judge others that I have a problem with.

Again, I have nothing against Christians, just bigots, racists, and people who feel the need to judge others based on things they can't even prove are right. Especially if they take their "proof" literal instead of using the symbolic value of their "proof".


reply posted on 20-3-2010 @ 10:09 AM by heliosprime
Originally posted by MrXYZ
reply to post by johnny2127


I totally understand that, and my remarks aren't directed against all Christians. Like you say, it's only the ones that feel the need to judge others that I have a problem with.

Again, I have nothing against Christians, just bigots, racists, and people who feel the need to judge others based on things they can't even prove are right. Especially if they take their "proof" literal instead of using the symbolic value of their "proof".


John 14:6 (King James Version)

6Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.


You like so many unbelievers misquote the ole "thou shalt not judge" phrase when confronted with truth you can NOT understand.

It is statement of FACT that those who do not follow Christ and DO as he DID in keeping ALL his father commandments are fallen. Those who chase after false gods (allah, budda, hindi, etc) are doomed.

That IS NOT judgemnet by me but statement of fact from Jesus and God himself....

Only God shall judge, and he has given man the rules by which he will judge mankind.

It appears you only "like" christians who are lukewarm in their faith and will not confront your transgressions.

When confronted with the truth you "judge" yourself and strike out against those who put the mirror in front of you to see your transgressions.

Seek God and know the truth.............
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