Middle class gaining more from mortgage defaults than stock market., page 1

Middle class gaining more from mortgage defaults than stock market., page

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Topic started on 12-3-2010 @ 03:43 PM by jefwane

From Barron's

Fed's Flow of Funds numbers again show average Americans' net worth gaining more by mortgage defaults than asset appreciation.

The rising tide of foreclosures, bankruptcies and so-called "strategic defaults" where homeowners just stop paying mortgages on homes worth less than their associated liability, has become a well-recognized phenomenon

In all, the latest Fed Flow of Funds data suggest that, to the extent middle class Americans' finances are improving, it's because their liabilities are being reduced by default. The gains in asset values are being concentrated by those so-called households with the ways and means to own equities.

Pretty interesting article. I'm all for strategic default if it will benefit someone (consult an attorney and tax professional before attempting it I must implore).

The financial rape and asset striping of the American people continues at full bore.

reply posted on 12-3-2010 @ 04:03 PM by LostNemesis

I am all for people stepping away from their massive debt!!!

The only problem is, now banks are suing and garnishing wages of people that cannot afford to keep their home.

So they lose home, AND % of their income for the rest of their lives.

The working class just keeps taking one beating after another.

America is the pitts.

reply posted on 12-3-2010 @ 04:09 PM by silent thunder

I don't see fairness on any side.

From the corporate side, banks and others have plundered the people's pockets with a myriad of sketchy tricks and shady methodolgies.

From the people's side, too many were lead by greed and unrealistic expectations to buy "too much house" at the top of the bubble. All this cannot be laid at the feet of the corporations -- people need to man up and take some responsibility for their actions. Nobody is "entitled" to a gigantic house they can't affort. It's not a basic human right. Its easy to forget the cocjky arrogance of all the paper "McMillionaires" minted by access to easy credit. People need to learn to save responsibly and live within their means.

So there is fault on both sides. The ultimate blame rests with a culture of greed, materialism, and short-term thinking that hangs like a stench over each level (personal, corporate, and governmetal) of our rancid social three-layer cake.

reply posted on 12-3-2010 @ 04:13 PM by David9176

Right.

Did you know that many of these banks make more money in foreclosures than they would if they remodified the loan?

THEY DON'T GIVE A F and they never have.

"F the middle class" should be their motto.

reply posted on 12-3-2010 @ 04:17 PM by LostNemesis

reply to post by silent thunder

Well I certainly don't blame the people for all of this. They may have acted out of 'greed', but they were very much encouraged to do so.

Society as a whole, has been pushing families to own homes. It is better to make reasonable house payments, and someday OWN the home... than to rent, for about the same cost.

But from what I can see, home prices are simply unreasonable, for anyone who is not rich beyond belief.

Perhaps they BUILT too many homes, and then did whatever they needed to, to FILL them? Owning a home was pushed on us, as the "American Dream", for many years.

We as a people, have been seriously duped, and taken advantage of.... The elite have siphoned all of the wealth out of this country. (imo, anyway - because I sure as hell don't see citizens sitting rich beyond belief, while the bankers are struggling to survive.)

reply posted on 12-3-2010 @ 04:24 PM by David9176

reply to post by LostNemesis

because I sure as hell don't see citizens sitting rich beyond belief, while the bankers are struggling to survive.)

And that is why I've come to really dislike Fox News. Have you watched it lately?

It seems as if every point on that channel is to defend Wall street and anyone else who is not struggling at all...but damn the ones who are!!!

Have you noticed how everything has seemed to twist? First it was damn the bailouts...yet now they defend the very people we bailed out while the rest of the country gets screwed?

It's ridiculous.

reply posted on 12-3-2010 @ 04:25 PM by silent thunder

reply to post by LostNemesis

I endured many years of ridicule from my more "wealthy" friends who bought into this scam while I contined to live in a dumpy place because I knew this would end badly. I pointed out, again and again, calmly and rationally, that people needed to act responsibly and live within their means. I was called a "crank," a "tinfoil hatter," and "bitter and jealous." I was told smugly that I just didn't "understand." There were eye-rolls. I stuck to my guns. I could have "afforded" a place 4 times as big as the hole I was in. But I chose not to join the debt parade because I knew this would happen.

Now why should prudence continue to be punished and reckless overpuindulgence be rewarded, on either the corporate or the personal level? So many who were swaggering around and admiring themselves in the mirror for their "success" and "financial savvy" are now moaning and groaning that this was "pushed on them" by the evil banks. They were happy to think their good fortune was all their own doing in boom times, and often spoke loftily of the merits of the free market and unfettered capitalism as long as they were benificiaries. As soon as times turned tough, it was all "poor me poor me I'm just an innocent babe in the woods...I was duped!" You can't have it both ways -- be you a person with a big credit-card debt or a massive bank seeking taxpayer bailouts.

I have tremendous sympathy for those who have truly fallen through the cracks of the cracking-up system and been treated unfairly. They are many. I have sympathy for those who have lost their jobs through no fault of their own. But I think there are millions of others who need to look in the mirror and acknowledge that they didn't put enough aside for rainy days or act prudently themselves over the last decade.

reply posted on 12-3-2010 @ 04:39 PM by LostNemesis

reply to post by David9176

YouTube Link

This a good example of what ya mean? We must defend the rich!

Faux is not the only one doing this, but yeah.... They swore that protecting and "bailing out" the rich would "help main street, middle class people".

It did not work, and now our representatives are even going as far as to BLAME social programs, that people who paid into all their lines and lost everything, are using, to survive.

They are blaming We The People, the ones that got SCREWED! lol

I love that video, btw.

Perfect example of what the media is up to.

reply posted on 12-3-2010 @ 04:45 PM by LostNemesis

reply to post by silent thunder

Well, sorry to hear about your buddies getting screwed. And Congratz to you for avoiding the get-rich-quick banker fad.

Many people saw this coming, invcluding Peter Schiff. Nobody listened.

You can't accept the fact that the system is broken, without needing to blame the ignorant masses that bought into the fad?

No offense. I don't expect anything less from the ignorant masses, that believe every word told to them by the MSM. Until WE "wake them up", they'll continue to be ignorant to what is REALLY happening - And keep playing the game the elites want them to.

reply posted on 12-3-2010 @ 05:13 PM by David9176

reply to post by LostNemesis

That's the thing about all of this LostNemesis.

Our standard of living is going down the toilet but yet...that's not good enough.

We need to be punched in the groin. We need to feel the pain while these SOB's suck everything the once proud, hard working middle class once had...people who just wanted to make a good life for their kids.

They don't care about us.

Geezus...there are 300 million of us in this country. Why in God's name are we letting the top 1 percent earners of this country dictate and form our opinions?

You, me...and most everyone else are closely related financially...so why aren't we fighting TOGETHER?

Too many are going after the wrong people...the victims...when they should be going after those who put us in this situation in the first place!

reply posted on 12-3-2010 @ 05:39 PM by LostNemesis

reply to post by David9176

Well, what do I say to that?

You summed it up. They have us attacking the VICTIMS. While the elite continue to steal from us all.

Those who watch the MSM should be getting confused - Because themselves and everyone around them are getting screwed. They see their quality of life going downward, while the rich keep taking and taking....

Heh. Always feels like we're 'preaching to the choir', doesn't it?

reply posted on 13-3-2010 @ 02:01 AM by silent thunder

Originally posted by LostNemesis

You can't accept the fact that the system is broken, without needing to blame the ignorant masses that bought into the fad?

As stated in my first post in this thread, I think the blame falls on every level: Government, Corporate, and Personal. We can -- and should -- blame the government and corporations for their role in this, but this does not absolve the people who participated in the system recklessly. Yes, I do blame stupid people. If some fool sticks a knife in an electrical outlet and gets zapped, I don't blame the knife company for not putting a lable on the knife warning him not to do so. When it happens on a mass scale, things are no different.

Again, its not blame "the people" OR blame "the system." Its BOTH. Both carry the weight of blame.

reply posted on 13-3-2010 @ 02:20 AM by ziggy1706

David 9176, i coundt agree with you more man.. that should be thier motto.. 'F the middle class'. Awesome intelligent reply dude