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Turning your back to the flag?

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posted on Mar, 2 2003 @ 07:08 PM
I don't know if we have any sports fans on this site, but I was wondering if anyone had saw on the news the basketball player that turns her back to the American flag when the National Anthem is played before the game. I'd like to know what the Flag means to her. I'd also like to know how many of her family members died trying to defend the Flag that she has the nerve to disrespect. So many people take for granted what we have in this great land, and it just drives me crazy to see an act of ignorance like this. She claims that it is an anti-war protest. Many people are against this war w/ Iraq, but there are many other ways to show your protest. To turn your back on the Flag is an absolute disgrace and I'll refrain from saying what I think they should do with her. She said "she can't wait for the day when schools are given all the money they need and the military has to hold a bake sale to buy a bomber. " I'm all for education but there are things that have to be done to protect our freedom and if they weren't done in the past, she wouldn't be enjoying the freedom that she does right now. Just wondering what others thought about this.


posted on Mar, 2 2003 @ 07:13 PM
Yes I have been following this too; she is a pure disgrace to our country. I mean, you can disagree with our government and possible war in Iraq but there's plenty of other things she can do then turning her back on the flag (literally) to show her opposition to war. She is turning her back on all our "boys" over seas defending our freedom. She should be ashamed of herself

posted on Mar, 2 2003 @ 07:25 PM
How is that disgraceful?

Even though I disagree with it on some terms it's her way of protesting the war on Iraq.

There's plenty ways to protest the war, and turning your back on the flag IS one of them.

Me, despite my beliefs and what you people might think about me I would never do that. Although I never recite the pledge of allegiance in school because it's unconstitutional, I still stand up in memory of the millions who have died for amerikkka.

posted on Mar, 2 2003 @ 07:31 PM
You both misunderstand.

Many of our fathers, father's fathers, sons, and selves fought for this nation. The ideal fought for was not some simple flag with colors, stars, and stripes (though our flag has more deep meaning and reverence than any other) but the concept and dignity of freedom. Flags are merely symbols, and as important as ours is, it is still just a symbol.

Her ability to express this opinion, as unsavory as it may be, is vitally important to protect, and even embrace. This is the expression of freedom, the very concept over which countless blood was spilled. You (and I) may vehemently disagree with her opinion, and might be disgusted in the manner in which she expresses it. But the ability to express is far more important than the expression itself.

The day she is forced to stop and face the flag is the day we should all fear.

I would gladly lay down my life in the battle to protect her ability to do what she is doing.

Freedom must prevail.

[Edited on 3-3-2003 by Winston Smith]

posted on Mar, 2 2003 @ 07:36 PM
The government is out of control

People have a right to turn their back on the flag or turn it upside down. They're not against america, they are against the ones in control.

The gov works for us, atleast their suppost to

posted on Mar, 2 2003 @ 07:45 PM
Winston, she still continues to do this because of freedom. No one is forcing her away from it, my point was that it is disrespectful. As I said, there are MANY better ways to protest the war than turning her back on the Flag that many many people died for. I realize that the Flag is just a symbol, but I think that is a poor way of protesting war. As I said, I'd be willing to bet that she never lost a loved one defending that same flag.

As for you Ill, I lost all respect for you when in another post you said: "being a draft dodger doesnt mean your a coward.. send me to iraq with a m-16 and i'll use it on american troops ". I'd like to see you try it.

posted on Mar, 2 2003 @ 07:52 PM

Originally posted by Ycon

People have a right to turn their back on the flag or turn it upside down. They're not against america, they are against the ones in control.

The Flag doesn't stand for the ones in control, it stands for America. This is one of the only countries where you could get away with your upside down flag avatar, and live to tell about it. Your just as bad.

posted on Mar, 2 2003 @ 08:01 PM
Winston Smith,

I have had the opportunity to review many of your posts. You have provided many viewpoints on subjects that show you have been around the block a few times. Keep up the fabulous posting.

It is sad that I need to agree with you regarding this embarassing act by a young woman. I don't think she comprehends what the future fallout will be with her actions being displayed today. The simple fact remains that nobody can force her to adhere to constitutional protocol.

I hope that this does not lead to similar or magnified posturing by other individuals. And, as a father of an 18 year old, I don't know how a parent should or could react to this display of absurdity.


posted on Mar, 2 2003 @ 08:07 PM
It's disgraceful because she is turning her back on all of our soldiers defending her freedom. Here these men are putting their lives on the line to defend the red, white, and blue, and she is slapping them in the face. The least she could do is she her respect to the soldiers whether she hates or government or not. I'm glad the media has cracked down on not making much of an uproar on this she doesn't deserve the fame.

posted on Mar, 2 2003 @ 08:10 PM
If she disrespects the flag because she is against this war on Iraq, what makes you think she'll give respect to the soldiers?

the soldiers are the one who are fighting the war, so dont you think she'll be against those soldiers too?

posted on Mar, 2 2003 @ 08:23 PM
But what about our early ancestors of the Revolutionary War who won our freedom? They're the very people who started our freedom and this wonderful country, if it wasn't for them would she have her scholarship and all the opportunities she has now? What about our boys from WW2 who helped defeat Hitler, without our help who knows what could have happened to the US and the world. She's turning her back on all those people. How would you feel if you were a WW2 or Vietnam veteran who volunteered to go into military at age 16 and put your life on the line for our country, having your friends killed before your eyes and all the bloodshed? Going through all that and then to have some punk turning her back to the flag, I would be filled with anger if I were a vet. We should put her ass in some third world country for a month and well see how much she turns her back on the flag.

[Edited on 3-3-2003 by Midnight Mutilator]

posted on Mar, 2 2003 @ 09:05 PM
The flag means nothing unless the Constitution is behind it.She has the freedom to do this.I get pissed off when I see people burn the flag & as pissed as I get,I have to hold my tongue & remind myself that they have the right to do so.Came across a great article a 12 year old girl wrote about the flag.This little girl speaks years beyond her age.Some politicians could learn a thing or two from this 12 year old.This sums up my feeling perfectly.

posted on Mar, 2 2003 @ 09:46 PM
...bloody good on least she has the guts to stand up and speak (even if through her actions), whether the message is palatable or not...

...she can always move to NZ...where she won't get so much grief for her actions/beliefs...

posted on Mar, 2 2003 @ 10:36 PM
Romantico, I'm not disputing the fact that she has the right to do this, she does because she lives in America. All that I'm saying is that our Flag represents our freedom, and she is using her freedom to turn her back on that same flag. I know it is just a symbol, but it seems like she is exercising her freedom to turn her back on freedom. I just don't think she would do this if the flag meant to her what it means to me. Many Americans take their freedom for granted. I dont want to go into personal reasons, but this really bothers me.

posted on Mar, 2 2003 @ 10:50 PM
I have to wonder if this isn't so much about the protest anymore ,as it is the fact that she enjoys being in the public eye.
This is probably her one big moment in life, so why not let her revel in it. Besides in several months from now she'll be another nobody. And she will always be remembered as a person who shunned their flag.

When I first read the post I thought it was a professional player, not some no name college girl. So who cares what she does, if she manages to influence anybody, that's their weakness.

posted on Mar, 2 2003 @ 11:02 PM
may not be the same as she see's it.I don't think that turning your back on the flag means she don't appreciate your freedom.How I view the bible may be different from how you view it.Same goes as the flag.I think people are making too big a deal about this.A year from now this will all be forgotten.We have more important issues to focus on instead of this,IMO.

posted on Mar, 2 2003 @ 11:16 PM

Originally posted by Midnight Mutilator
What about our boys from WW2 who helped defeat Hitler, without our help who knows what could have happened to the US and the world.

well how would 'our boys from WW2' go about if they found out that the very same gov't they were protecting was turning into one of the fascist regimes they were fighting against?
it's becoming more and more self-evident that this nation is slowly, but effectively taking away our civil liberties, which were 'supposedly' guaranteed to us by the constitution... now how do you suppose our veterans would react after they risked their lives for that very same nation?

posted on Mar, 2 2003 @ 11:20 PM
How well do you think this would have gone down, if it had been WW2 and this person turned their back on the flag ? They would probably been beaten senseless and then followed around by the FBI.

posted on Mar, 2 2003 @ 11:36 PM
its 2003.So I could care less about a 'what if' scenario.Besides,that was 60 years ago.We've come along way(well, some ways we're still back in 1941 or 42)

Doesn't mean she's not a good American just because she turned her back on the flag.politics & stuff like this isn't black or white.Thats a very simple way of thinking & its not a very realistic way of thinking.This perosn is gonna be judged because she turned her back on a flag.She could be the greatest person in the world,but some here hate this person they don't know all because it goes against THEIR definition of what is a good american.

posted on Mar, 3 2003 @ 12:22 AM
The actual posturing reminds one of Black Power salutes at the Olympics all those years ago, or the black armbands at the cricket of late: odd the media seem to think the anti-Mugabe armbands are very good things and the back-to-the-fllag is a very bad thing.
I cannot but agree with the idea, however, that forced reverence to a piece of cloth is a dreadful notion.
Attitudes to flags will of course vary (consider the Confederate flag within the USA) or the screeching of the pink hordes when British holidaymakers are made guests of the local penal authorities for damaging Greek flags while on holiday. The British generally have a rather sloppy attitude towards the Union Jack and flags -except in football.
To some it will be a piece of cloth -to be transferred -as a design -to clip-art, T-Shirts and CD labels: to others it is the embodiment of values worth dying to defend. One recalls from military history the enormous importanve attached to capturing or defending flags, or the naval symbolism of lowering a flag.
I'm not sure I wholly sympathise with sports-persons representing their nation (and getting all the benefits that thereby accrue) who then show disrespect - better not to participate, thinks Estragon.
Whether one is ipso facto a "bad American" or a "bad Brit" because of showing disrespect is a difficult issue and must reflect the times as well as the individual. If a German in 1940 did not bow to the swastika, was he or she a "bad" German? How strong and unquestionable are the links: flag-nation-leadership-citizens? Is the gesture of pledging allegiance while a schoolchild a vital part of citizenship, or primitive thought-control.
There are many, many issues to explore here - the sports-person issue, I think, is but a tiny part of the picture.

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