Why Blacks embrace their opressors God

reply to post by poet1b


The Muslims were doing failry well until the Mongols and the Turks showed up. The Mongols destroyed what was the most advanced city of its time, Baghdad.

The Ottoman Turks rule then caused the Middle East stagnate even further.

T.E. Lawrence convinced the Arabs to throw off the yoke of the Ottomans during World War I. The Arabs were convinced they would finally have independence, but after the war the French and British took over the Middle East in mandates.

The Cold War after WW2 caused more stagnation in the Middle East as corrupt regimes and revolutions destabilized and stagnated the region.

Only recently in places like the UAE are things starting to turn around.

Its not Islam that is stifiling progress, its the fundamentalists and militants.

Oh and the Chinese had some awesome ships at one time, much better than the Europeans, known as 宝船 or bǎochuán. They were huge and very advanced for their time. They sailed to Africa with them, but a new dynasty came in and decided to isolate China. The ships were then ordered by Confucian scholars to be destroyed.

Originally posted by poet1b
reply to post by siahchi

 

The "Iroquois" were conquerors who conquered a large area of what is now the U.S. Northwest.

Uh, the Iriquois were in the Northeast... First of all, even today, living in the N.E. US is waay different than living in the N.W.

Exactly how democratic can a conquering people be?

I'm not sure, why don't you ask 'ol unkle sam, he would definately know.

Do you have any links to back up this stuff you constantly claim, and wiki is not reliable as evidence.

wikipedia is basic starting point provided at the expense of my time to you so that you may research further since you haven't done your own very thoroughly apparently. The net is not my only source of information unlike many these days I have a huge library and am a voracious reader, as well as fond of traveling. Read a BOOK. It's easier on the eyes...

As far as superiority complexes go, plenty of other cultures have the same problem, it is not something that exists only in western culture. Once again, your prejudices are showing.

Sure, they all do to some extent. !!!!!GO ___insert_favorite_team_here___ !!!!!!!

So did Europeans draw the lines on the map when China conquered Tibet? How about when Japan conquered Okinawa?

Ahh, my friend, the big "C" (along with several others such as the rising "J"...) is going to be the Worlds next superpower, if things continue as they're going. How do you become better @ chess? You have to think 10, 20, 40 moves ahead of the person your playing against, all while factoring in numerous variables. That's how you should do all information, and the most logical conclusion should then become apparent ( one would hope). Play the various scenarios of events out in your head, all of them even those you don't agree with.

Let me get this straight, you see San Francisco as a place that has no respect for people's rights, but Saudi Arabia, or Singapore are just fine and dandy?

You think Saudi Arabia's bad try New York! It's especially bad if your names Amadou Diallo! Or even Chicago (Fred Hamtpon)! Saudi Arabians are all provided with shelter and a monthly stipend (though many independantly wealthy or "middle class" of course, as all cultures stratify themselves) at the expense of the government as a sort of oil "profit-sharing", kinda how Alaskans get a $1,500 a year check.

EDIT to add: Who is wiping out knowledge from other cultures? Westerner's for the most part go around the world trying to preserve ancient cultures from around the world. My daughter studied Native American culture, and there plenty of classes around the country that still teach many native American religions, beliefs, and customs.

Just read this I'm tired of explaining myself to you.

www.chitowndailynews.org...

It is just one cheap shot after another from you.

I'm not cheap! I just know how to get name brands for less... *#hint#* sweatshops are a great place to star lookin' *ahem* Walmart *ahem* www.abovetopsecret.com...

reply to post by siahchi


Yeah, I meant Notheast. True democracy or a loose organization of treaties meant to stop the continuous wars that were waging is more the question. It doesn't change that all of your over the top claims are nonsense. Europeans are no more arrogant than any others.

Indians who live in the U.S., live in the country that provides more opportunity for everyone, where everyone wants to live, so it has been a far superior deal for them than the rest of the conquered people of the world.

To claim one group doesn't do what the others do, is just racist.

Oh yeah, how dare archeologist preserve artifacts that they recovered at their expense and display them in a museum.

It would have been much better for the looters to trash the place, and sell anything they deemed of value to private collectors.

Yeah, cheap shot artist describes you well, you can't even bother to dig up a decent link to try and defend your prejudices.

reply to post by MikeboydUS


The Mongols showed up long before the Muslims began their long continuous series of conquests. Turks were and are Muslims.

Baghdad was one of the most advanced cities at the time the ancient Mongols controlled the area. It hasn't been a major leading center since the times of the Persians, who were Zoroastrians in those days, before they were conquered by the Muslims, long, long ago. You have these things all tangled up.

Here is a thread that is more relevant to what we are now discussing. I suggest to continue this discussion, people interested in this subject go to this thread.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Why does anyone?

Because the one thing humans have that is worth anything or not depending on how you look at it is life.

The way to have complete power over a human being is to control how they live or why they live.

You can make as many different variations of rules or 'holy laws' as you want but humanity will keep on going on.

Thats why religions, ideologies and systems will always fail.

They are not 'the only answers' or necessary for the basic needs of a human being which is the base survival to live.

The human subconscious knows deep down that it's not some demons or god, it's not the unbelievers or enemies fault, you choose to weaken and restrict yourself by the particular brand of rules you choose to follow to 'define' your life.

By becoming a slave to these rules you reach the inevitable and predictable outcomes and confrontations and limitations of the poison you have picked.

You become a divided person, a war rages deep in the back of your mind everyday, you won't know it, but it goes on in the back of your mind. It knows you are holding it back and asks why you are deliberately weakening yourself.

You think, ''I am right'', everyone else is wrong, it has to be that way, if only everyone else followed the same poison the world would be perfect. The war in your mind becomes a war against all those who do not follow the same belief as you.

By striking out at people you find a way to effectively strike inwards at the subconscious that is still screaming out to you as well.

But the true subconscious never stops screaming the truth at you.

People starting hearing it and wake up and the process starts again for the next religion, ideology, system humanity invents to enslave his fellow man with.

reply to post by poet1b


How do I have them tangled up?

The Islamic Golden Age is from 8th to 13th centuries.
Paper is brought to Baghdad in the 8th century.
The first doctorates are issued in Baghdad in the 8th century.
The House of Wisdom is in Baghdad from the 9th to 13th centuries.

The Seljuk Turks are the first to show up in the 11th century and caused all kinds of problems. Its all down hill from here.

The Mongols showed up in 1258 and laid waste to Baghdad.

Osman I forms an independent kingdom from the Seljuk Turks in 1299, founding the Ottoman dynasty.

Islamic civilization never recovered the glory that existed before the coming of the Turks and Mongols.

reply to post by MikeboydUS


What glory, their ability to conquer others?

Please, lay this all out?

They continued to grab slaves from Africa during this time?

Ok...I was just gonna read the post and move on, but now I have to say something. As a black Christian woman I have this to say.....I can't stand when black people blame "the white man" for our problems. If there are black people who are Christians it's because they CHOOSE to be. Just like every other spiritual belief blacks may have, be it Islam,Jewish,Rastafarian,Catholic,Buddhist,Satanism,or ATHEISM ..(etc) ...they believe in what they believe because they CHOOSE to. This is a new day in time....we ALL have the freedom to choose to worship (or not) whatever or whoever we want. I am a Christian because I choose to believe that Jesus Christ died for my sins. No one forced that belief on me and no can take that belief away. Why is it that atheists always attack Christians? And here we have a black atheist that wants to attack black Christians. This is a prime example of what "we" as black people do to ourselves...attack each other,THEN point the finger at the white man and say it's his fault. Truth be told, that's how we ended up in slavery in the first place. If we had of stuck together in the"Motherland" instead of one tribe trying to tear down another then the "white devil" wouldn't have stood a chance against us perhaps. It's time for black folks to stop the pity party and move on...I'm not saying forget,but it's time to move forward and do better.

Wow quite the racist post,seems the OP is going on their assumption,where is it written that Christian religion is a white religion,and as far as blacks thinking it's ok to sell drugs etc,another assumption,I know many black parents who work hard to ensure their children are taught right from wrong,sounds like someone is whining

no one chooses to live as someone else's being; they are forced or coerced.

your assumptions about brains require a predication of thought that is unfamiliar to self; further exacerbating the issue is your use of christianity. are you saying you have studied brains or people black and otherwise and have concluded that upon dissection of a brain that actions are predetermined based on a polarity?

the OP has made her point and people jump around it while fiddling with their interpretation of her presented "facts".

if you believe in group culture "worship" then you choose the group that is nearest your own mind.

Originally posted by Ausar
nowhere is it fit for an unsober alcoholic to lead an alcoholic anonymous meeting.

To think all are created equal is stupid; nowhere in the Bible is this stated. and since life goes on after the Bible there are no natural law observations or temporal laws that state this is true.

Consider for a moment the state of nature; it is rule by the largest, strongest, or the most toxic, or the greater practitioner of slight of hand or trickery (fly trap, pitcher plant, temple woman). When it downsizes it is ruled by adaptive genetics. And nowhere is equality at play.

Yet mankind is an anomaly: ... We are born of the higher orders of increasing complexity with which the universe challenges itself.

We may not even be of basic evolution, but seeded by even more ancient races who could modify genetics -- to put hints about reality into our very fibers! ... Is there a small book at the beginning of our code? .. or is that the repeated instruction for the womb to ready itself .. incoming, now? We don't know .. YET!

Races hoary with age: Races who obsessed over the stars, not just for time calculations of great accuracy; but to see if there was a flash of destruction of home-worlds which could not overcome divisive and competitive mentalities.

But we are also creatures of mind and will and self determination ... and if we choose to posit a system where all are "considered" "Equal before the Law" ... then that is something we might choose to do, to avoid certain other pitfalls which can happen.

A simple analogy is Tibet. The Great City of Tibet was build after a failure or two .. and it received new guardians and forward-ers of the evolution of mankind on the Planet Earth (ancient Indian legend). But these were very
wise people, and people versed in the use of the mind, and the powers which can be accessed by mind, and used over other people. ...


A tyranny of sorcery developed in Tibet. Anyone who was someone had to have their own "trusted" sorcerer to protect them!! This went on for some time, even so far as to accost the dying to try and steal the power of their lives ... and so the priests of Goodness sit and read the Bardo to the dying even to this day .. so they may pass unharried to the next level.


How was it broken .. with the forming of great houses of power lead by the good who cared, and ALL TIBETANS ... that is each household of the land had to send at least one representative to the monastery, to be educated, to learn good vs. evil, and to be watched, as well. Which-ever generation of your house you chose, you had to send one child. And so the power was brought under control. Because the power rests in the living!

Now I ask you ... what would you do with the bankers and the corporations of today?

Originally posted by ButterCookie
It seems insane, even sad to know that most blacks tend to embrace the 'white' Christ/God

Say: "O followers of earlier revelation! Come unto that tenet which we and you hold in common: That we shall worship none but God, and that we shall not ascribe divinity to aught beside Him, and that we shall not take human beings for our lords beside God." [And if they turn away, then say: "Bear witness that it is we who have surrendered ourselves unto Him."
(Qur'an, 3.64)

There's your answer to these complications.

Ive read most of this... and just wanted to throw my .02 in.

Im native American.. enrolled in the Piegan Blackfeet tribe in Montana as are my ancestors. The OP is a whiner and just another person who is not only grossly misinformed, but is a professional victim. Poor you, your ancestors were slaves, (whine) your history is lost, blah blah blah. Join the club and get over yourself. This whole thread offends me greatly.

My paternal grandfather left the rez and I was not a rez baby. My grandfather left becuase it was unhealthy. Family land is good, your blood is good, but he had said many times it had soured.... NOT BY THE WHITES, but by our own people. Your heritage is sour due to your own people and you continue to befoul it.

As some of you may or may not know, there is a racial issue between NAs and blacks. Its very nasty to us how the blacks swim in the blood of their ancestors to get a hand out they call reparations, or get special treatment by smearing the blood of their ancestors on themselves. Its disgusting and your reasons for your racism ( which is blatant and I cant believe ATS entertains this ) are abhorrent to anyone who has any understanding.

FYI .. never lump us in with your "approved" peoples who are so graciously allowed to post on your thread.

I was a "pagan" raised by "pagans". I became a christian because something spoke to my heart and stirred in me. Not an oppressor... oppressors have no power unless you let them... as you obviously have. The oppressors are your own people keeping you deep into slavery and shackles ......and you are simply too ignorant to see it. What stirred in me is a sentient spirit... not a silly human oppressor. Ask yourself exactly WHO is oppressing you..... take a good look in the mirror and at your own peoples.



I cant say it harshly enough mods... this is a disgusting display youve allowed. I refuse to be lumped in with THAT and hope that in the future that I have the good sense not to click on some thing as nasty as this thread. I just felt I had to say something for the other natives so we are not associated with this is in fact we are not...... individually. Your OP here cant figure out what she is for.. atheism or annunaki... or who she wants to allow to speak or who she is against. The one consistent theme is disinformation.. and this is supposed to be a TRUTH site.

Some points on this thread:

It is inaccurate to say black Americans chose Christianity, since most religion is imposed on people by their parents.


The OP has generated much emotion because this issue is emotional and very controversial. But her point, though somewhat offending to many, makes some sense if looked at objectively.

For example, if today someone from another religion and culture kidnapped people here who were of another religion and they forbade you from ever practicing the religion you were brought up in, and forced you to practice their religion, how would that make you feel?
I know we are talking about a different generation, but the fact remains that through generations Christianity has been imposed on blacks somewhat, as any kind of idea can be imposed on people across generations.

On the other hand the fact that so called “Christians” were the ones who enslaved and tortured and brainwashed black slaves during the horrible slave era in the US doesn’t mean all Christianity is blameworthy.

Look at the fact that the greatest fighter against slavery in the US was a white Christian--John Brown, who to me was a true Christian, in that he dedicated his life to freeing a people other than his own.

John Brown was a great man who happened to denounce slavery based on true Christian principles not the distorted depraved fake principles of “Christians" who advocated and had slaves.

if you only know a person by they way they are described to your body does your mind then know that person on its own.while jhon whomever may be documented to you as having been a "real" christian you are further propogating the compounding issue the op is referring.

and to the "na" are you more "na" than a man in israel who calls jesus a false saviour. your issue is a deep-rooted one and to vent your frustrations on "a generic black woman" or the topic creator as the object of your minds hatred says much about your own body.im sure it doesn't have black feet.im sure if the thread creator focused a lime light on "your peoples minds and bodies" she could find much fault in; this for example.data and information is just bits and pieces but for me i see your mind as having an intimate relationship in ways it shouldnt with knowledge that is not a ledge youve come near.once again are you maintaining a healthy body with the mind you have portrayed as the "representative for "na" peoples"?

Originally posted by Ausar
if you only know a person by they way they are described to your body does your mind then know that person on its own.while jhon whomever may be documented to you as having been a "real" christian you are further propogating the compounding issue the op is referring.

and to the "na" are you more "na" than a man in israel who calls jesus a false saviour. your issue is a deep-rooted one and to vent your frustrations on "a generic black woman" or the topic creator as the object of your minds hatred says much about your own body.im sure it doesn't have black feet.im sure if the thread creator focused a lime light on "your peoples minds and bodies" she could find much fault in; this for example.data and information is just bits and pieces but for me i see your mind as having an intimate relationship in ways it shouldnt with knowledge that is not a ledge youve come near.once again are you maintaining a healthy body with the mind you have portrayed as the "representative for "na" peoples"?

Last I checked you arent the OP. But I see you are as deluded. I do not own a casino not have any ties other than blood and being on the rolls. You dont comprehend what you read very well do you?

I do not care what someone like you who hasnt made ONE comprehensible post thinks I am or am not. I claim no representation other than we are not as individuals to be lumped in with someone who cant make her own mind up if she is a Back liberation theologian, an atheist, a uninformed slave, worshipper of the annunaki, or what... other than being sure she is the end all of racial oppression and and entitled to some special treatment for smearing the blood of past slaves and TRUE victims all over herself and claiming some personal current connection to it. JUST LIKE poor rez babies out there who live and die on govt cheese. You can not comprehend what I was saying apparently.


BTW... just like all blacks are the same kind of africans to some other races... I guess all NA tribes are the same to you/others. I have NO idea or affiliation with the Yakama Natiion ( had to look them up) other than knowing that no matter how much money they get from some hokey casino on land that was stolen from them and then returned to them..... like being in a leper camp .. that they are SLAVES too. You simply dont have the corner of the market on racial oppression by any means... and its offensive when some/op/you act as if they do.

[edit on 4-7-2010 by Dixie70]

if you want to be emissary to the construct of mind that is "racial oppression" feel free.but, i ask again; how are you able to maintain your body with your mind in such a state as expressed from your posts?do you want me to believe your body is just as healthy as the op because of the conjecture you set before me from your mind?and do you further want to tell me there is a "we" construct in your mind that is associative of "na" bodies. is this same will you are expressing generational within "your "na" blackfoot tribe"?is it rude for me to ask you how you consider yourself native american; does your mind view the body as native american?is it wrong for a mind that sees a black body to associate with in mind generational and/or ancestral actions committed to a body that is black?do you even know what the thread creator expressed from words and not body but from body identified as black that pertained actions committed to or attributed to a mind that is black?do you view religion as a practice that has no function active within the mind; further does this function pertain the body of a person?some of these questions seem off topic; do they seem that way from a mind that is attached to a body that is not black; or does your body state that your mind is blacker than mine own while my body be such?please mr blackfoot answer me.



[edit on 4-7-2010 by Ausar]

The answer to the OP's question is axiomatic.

Blacks accepted their oppressors God because they had no choice.
Even 150 years removed from slavery most of them are still too ignorant or brainwashed to even form a choice of what religion they want to follow, if any, since their fathers and father’s father were indoctrinated into Christian dogma.

Until the advent of Islam in America, blacks had little choice, since they were exposed only to Christianity. Of course one would have to make a conscious decision like Sammy Davis Jr did and became a Jew, to get away from the Christian faith.

In today’s postmodern secular world it is a possibility that black people can extricate themselves from the primitive dogmatic Christianity that pervades the American culture and move on to a more enlightened religion such as Buddhism, Yogism, or Islam; that is Islam outside of the nutty fundamentalists.