Mainstream Science & Reincarnation

completely memories, (only lasting a few seconds...30 seconds to a minute most) of remembering some unimportant moment in my life....I likened it to bubbles suddenly coming up from deep within my brain and farting up to the active surface.....I am age ten and watching a snowflake land on my tongue....or, driving down a road in the city in New Mexico I lived in when I was in my early 20's.....just looking out the window....I can see the sky, feel the movement of the car...ALMOST think what i was thinking....(this is how it gets weird...) almost like I am "omniscient" and can WATCH and BE at the same time
I have no "residuals" from my seizures TO remember....I go to sleep....wake up either in the hospital, (once I was handcuffed to the stretcher in the ER....another story) or I have my husband hovering over me looking scared....and my tongue hurts like hell or I have a broken toe...I remember not a THING in-between...

weird, eh? And I REALLY did believe in past lives and deja vu, (I had experiences...or what I believed were experiences....not just electrical currents in the jelly inside my skull..)

peace

reply to post by Cornczech


It must be awful but I can't say I understand why this would make you stop believing in the possibility of reincarnation ... especially as the memories you have connected with your seizures are 'real' memories ...why would it make you believe pastlife recall is no longer a viable concept ?

I know it's most likely me misunderstanding the connections you've made ... I can be a bit dense that way sometimes.

Woody

To me reincarnation just seems like a logical process in the evolution of the soul. Surely, if there is a purpose for our soul it must to be learn, to experience and to grow, You cannot possibly do that in a single lifetime.

I have always had a "memory" of falling onto spikes of some sort and being impaled. I also have a similar "memory" of drowning and feeling my lungs fill with water. I am also powerfully drawn to Britain and Scotland in particular, as if perhaps I had been a proud Brit in my most recent past life. I admit that they could simply be associations I picked up sometime early in life and am open-minded to that possibility, but they feel very real to me.

reply to post by woodwytch


I guess...(and this is hard for me to verbalize...) I felt that because my brain waves were going all screwy...that as they were firing....or misfiring....these actions were kicking off...like the sloughing off of cells...certain random memories....not mystical at all....just a biological burping....why did I have memories (around the ages of 6 thru 9 or 10) of being a German pilot during WW2? Why did I understand German at that age....but cannot speak nor understand hardly a WORD after age 10? Well.....I cannot answer THOSE things....but the brain is mighty powerful.....but I guess the best seizure experiences were the ones where I saw the world so differently in an post-ictal state...my other best way to describe it (if you've ever done drugs...) how one might see the world when on '___'...E...Ketamine...even, to an extent...really strong pot...I know what I am trying to say is not exactly coming across...but...I just stopped believing in "magical things"...with no proof... to an attitude of.....well.....a lot of weird things have happened after having a grand mal seizure, (and doing a few (gasp) drugs too)...and well..that's biological in nature, those experiences I have had...and so..when I was believing in an EXPERIENCE....a FEELING...a PERCEPTION...perhaps all those moments were all created in my brain somehow....a DIFFERENT kind of perception....am I rambling? Does this make any kind of sense now?

[edit on 3/11/2010 by Cornczech]

Originally posted by bagari
To me reincarnation just seems like a logical process in the evolution of the soul. Surely, if there is a purpose for our soul it must to be learn, to experience and to grow, You cannot possibly do that in a single lifetime.

I have always had a "memory" of falling onto spikes of some sort and being impaled. I also have a similar "memory" of drowning and feeling my lungs fill with water. I am also powerfully drawn to Britain and Scotland in particular, as if perhaps I had been a proud Brit in my most recent past life. I admit that they could simply be associations I picked up sometime early in life and am open-minded to that possibility, but they feel very real to me.

How can you talk of a logical process when we haven't even discovered a ''soul''?
Seems like a big jump in logic.

Originally posted by Cornczech
reply to post by woodwytch

 

I guess...(and this is hard for me to verbalize...) I felt that because my brain waves were going all screwy...that as they were firing....or misfiring....these actions were kicking off...like the sloughing off of cells...certain random memories....not mystical at all....just a biological burping....why did I have memories (around the ages of 6 thru 9 or 10) of being a German pilot during WW2? Why did I understand German at that age....but cannot speak nor understand hardly a WORD after age 10? Well.....I cannot answer THOSE things....but the brain is mighty powerful.....but I guess the best seizure experiences were the ones where I saw the world so differently in an post-ictal state...my other best way to describe it (if you've ever done drugs...) how one might see the world when on '___'...E...Ketamine...even, to an extent...really strong pot...I know what I am trying to say is not exactly coming across...but...I just stopped believing in "magical things"...with no proof... to an attitude of.....well.....a lot of weird things have happened after having a grand mal seizure, (and doing a few (gasp) drugs too)...and well..that's biological in nature, those experiences I have had...and so..when I was believing in an EXPERIENCE....a FEELING...a PERCEPTION...perhaps all those moments were all created in my brain somehow....a DIFFERENT kind of perception....am I rambling? Does this make any kind of sense now?

[edit on 3/11/2010 by Cornczech]

No, you're not rambling at all ... quite the reverse you explained it really well in fact because now I understand where you're coming from and how you got there (from your perspective), and I really appreciate you taking the time to reply to me in such a conceptual way.

Having said that whilst I do understand where you're coming from, I think it's a shame that you've given up on the possibility of the magickal stuff because whilst your outlook has changed you still need to ask yourself ... ' how did you understand German up to the point of being 10yrs old ?

But I understand your sceptisism when you have mind-altering experiences and this I presume is effected by your medication too. I have to say that without my research providing a wide array of confirmations that I certainly would have had serious doubts.

Woody

reply to post by woodwytch


Nonsense. Show James Randi your research, and win $1m dollars. Seriously. If your research is that great, you'd have won a Nobel prize by now.

Stories culled from the internet, and rubbish from psychics and hypnotists is not evidence. It's bull#.

Originally posted by davesidious
reply to post by woodwytch

 

Nonsense. Show James Randi your research, and win $1m dollars. Seriously. If your research is that great, you'd have won a Nobel prize by now.

Stories culled from the internet, and rubbish from psychics and hypnotists is not evidence. It's bull#.

Hello davideous we meet again and you still appear to be singing the same old tune.

You are entitled to your opinion and it might shock you to know that for me it is not about the money or glory ... just about the pleasure of the job. You might also be surprised to know that even people who discount the idea of pastlife memory ... and staunchly believe their recall is down to their fertile imagination ... still gain the same psychological benefits and deeper understanding of themselves and what makes them tick ... as the people who believe 100% that they have lived before.

Having seen many of your posts in a variety of threads I have come to realise that you are a very negative and angry person ... who actually seems threatened by people who happen to have differing ideas to your own ... so I don't expect for a single second that you will be able to grasp the concept of people doing something for pleasure not profit. Therefore, I have no intention of trying to explain myself to someone with such a blinkered view ... as I said before you are entitled to your opinion and I am entitled to not get into a pointless 'to and fro' of opposing posts with you that will ultimately derail the thread. So whilst I will NOT be pressing the 'ignore button' ... I just choose not to respond to anymore of your posts ... I do not like wasting my time. But thank-you for sharing your opinion with us.

Woody

[size=2.5]All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed.

Originally posted by davesidious
reply to post by IrnBruFiend

 

Macroevolution is proven. Speciation has been observed in laboratories, and in the natural world.

NDEs are, by definition, highly subjective, and no actual evidence has been gathered that shows them to be anything other than vivid failings of a brain on the verge of death.

The "big bang" wasn't an explosion, but a rapid expansion of spacetime. The mutations in our genes are random, but the selection of the best ('fittest') is not. I'd suggest reading the theory of evolution before wailing in protest, as it would only serve to help your cause. The logic behind evolution is wonderfully simple, and incredibly graceful.

Your understanding of reality seems fatally flawed.

[size=2.5]Second, it is violently opposed.

Originally posted by davesidious
reply to post by woodwytch

 

Nonsense. Show James Randi your research, and win $1m dollars. Seriously. If your research is that great, you'd have won a Nobel prize by now.

Stories culled from the internet, and rubbish from psychics and hypnotists is not evidence. It's bull#.

[size=2.5]Third, it is accepted as being self-evident.

Arthur Schopenhaur (1788 -1860)

reply to post by woodwytch


I'm neither negative or angry. I'm rational.

OK, so you do it for the "pleasure of the job", but talk to Randi, get the money (which should be easy if you are being rational and employing critical thought), and give the money to charity.

If you don't, you must by definition be one of the following:

Capable of demonstrating your beliefs and lazy or selfish
Incapable of demonstrating your beliefs and not lazy or selfish
Incapable of demonstrating your beliefs and lazy or selfish

Pick one

My ideas are based in reality. Your's seem to be based on wishful thinking and new-age woo-woo-ism. You will never know anything for sure unless you can demonstrate it with the scientific method. To think otherwise is delusional. Luckily the rest of the world, that actually produces worth-while knowledge and understanding, operates rationally.

If reincarnation is real then where do "new souls" come from? The population of the earth is constantly increasing. What if the population decrease? Do you reincarnate into animals?

Originally posted by NegativeBeef
If reincarnation is real then where do "new souls" come from? The population of the earth is constantly increasing. What if the population decrease? Do you reincarnate into animals?

Well, for one, we don`t know if they are new souls. My feeling is, all souls are not always living on Earth at the same time, and we rotate in and out in groups. As for animals, I had to smile at that thought. Many who believe in reincarnation feel that we started out as lower life forms, and worked ourselves up the ladder to being humans. But after thinking about it, I find that there are a lot of animals who are smarter and nicer then some humans are.

Originally posted by NegativeBeef
If reincarnation is real then where do "new souls" come from? The population of the earth is constantly increasing. What if the population decrease? Do you reincarnate into animals?

Good question. That's one of the most common questions past life regressionists are confronted with. I think it's important to understand first of all, that the population of the earth does not equate to the total amount of souls that exist.

Souls exist in a timeless dimension and can choose to reincarnate whenever they like. Souls often just stay for a 'while' in the spirit world and take some 'time off' if you will. It's not all business in the spirit world and many hypontherapists report souls laughing and enjoying themselves between incarnations; Dr. Michael Newton has reported this in his books and on several radio shows.

If the population of the earth increases, then more souls are incarnating into physical bodies. If the population of the earth decreases, then souls are either in the spirit world or incarnating into other forms of life on other planets, for an experience there.

As for animals, I've read varying responses to that from different people in the field of hypnosis. Either:

a) All animals come from the same source as us, and we can indeed choose to live a life as an animal or we already have.

b) Animals may come from a different clutter of souls in the spirit world (which may explain why some past life regressionists have not come across past lives as animals).



[edit on 17-3-2010 by IrnBruFiend]

reply to post by davesidious


Sounds like your in denial. If everything were so easily proven with the scientific method there would be a lot less questions to ask. Sure, the scientific method is a useful tool in understanding our surrounding, but it's only going to get us so far before we can't explain anymore. And before you spout off at the mouth, you really do not know what experiences people have been through, so while the spirit may be something you deny, does not mean it isn't there...

In the movie K-PAX, synopsis on the following link, movies.yahoo.com...# , there is a very interesting quote by the main character at the end of the movie, named Prot, who claims to be of an other planet named K-PAX, although he is in a human's body, the quote is:

"I wanna tell you something Mark, something you do not yet know, that we K-PAXians have been around long enough to have discovered. The universe will expand, then it will collapse back on itself, then will expand again. It will repeat this process forever. What you don't you know is that when the universe expands again, everything will be as it is now. Whatever mistakes you make this time around, you will live through on your next pass. Every mistake you make, you will live through again, & again, forever. So my advice to you is to get it right this time around. Because this time is all you have."
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

This is definitely a concept that I wish to explore and elaborate with others, and it fits the official poster's thread.

Also:

1) Do you think what Prot meant was, that the universe contracts and expands forever, and by him saying, "...everything will be as it is now", that everything, including humans individuals will return exactly as they are in this cycle in the next cycle?

2) In this quote, Prot says, " Whatever mistakes you make this time around, you will live through on your next pass. Every mistake you make, you will live through again, & again, forever.". Is this part of the quote differing from Eastern dharma of reincarnation or just expressed differently? Because in Eastern dharma, reincarnation is not being reincarnated in the same exact body and repeating the same exact actions, but being reincarnated in a body based upon karma, and one must live through their life's karma and learn lessons, in order to eventually achieve enlightenment.

3) In this quote, Prot says: "So my advice to you is to get it right this time around. Because this time is all you have.". I'm uncertain what this part of the quote means, what do you think it means?

4) Do you think this quote concept is more of a metaphoric take on reincarnation and/or life or literally?

Any other elaborations about this quote would be interesting.