Subjectivity verses objectivity

(Note to Mods) Don't know where to post this particular thread...Maybe it belongs elsewhere?


Hi fellow ATSer's,
I realize my posts and my threads are looking all too subjective/opinionated.

Is there a kind soul or thrice maybe on here that can mentor me in ways to write more objectively? Maybe point me to some sites that teach proper techniques in writing objectively? Although ATS is rich within this site of the likes, I tend to run across things that get me off track.

I can copy and paste from articles as good as the next guy/gal, but when it comes to placing my best foot forward, I realize after the fact I posted something so heinous that my foot goes best when it's in my mouth

Believe it or not, writing for children is less challenging, well, writing fiction pieces anyway. Articles are my weakness. Can someone nice help me gain strength in writing objectively?

Not only will I be helped as a member here on ATS, but also in my course in Childrens Literature. One 'block' I almost encounter daily is writing something that to me seems close enough to stealing from an already written piece. I don't want my stuff stolen, so I make it a point not to steal other author's work.

Like when I get my assignments back from my instructor. She'll take my sentences and edit them, saying; maybe try this...Well, I can't try that because those are your words. See my dilemma? My query is based on EGO. I lack proper discipline, to be brutally honest.

I have some stories I'll post if asked to use as an example, in case anyone is interested. Ask me about "The Legend of Easter Bunny" it is one I didn't send in for editing. Inspired by a kid with a question about "Why does the Easter bunny hide eggs." Then ofcourse, that is a piece of fiction, subjectivity.

OK. All replies will be accepted with a grateful heart. Those not very nice will be considered constructive criticism, unless you really hurt my feelings. Then I just won't like you. Thanks in advance.

Maybe move this to Education & Media forum?

There is more appropriate maybe...

reply to post by loveguy

ways to write more objectively?

Probably the easiest way is to make no definite statements. You may notice, for example, that no sentence in this post appears to say anything definitely. That might be more than is strictly necessary, but in my experience it's usually safe to simply allow room for doubt in your phrasing, and to qualify everything with the suggestion that it is based on one's own perspective and opinion.

Do you need more examples? Perhaps phrasing things as questions would be helpful? How can anyone accuse you of being excessively opinionated when you simply ask questions to get your point across?

But when in doubt, a simple "probably" or "it appears" or "I think that" will usually be enough to keep most people from becoming too annoyed with you.

In my view, subjectivity encompasses the elements (or characters) that interact to form a drama. It reveals a central persona, a sort of essential idea of the consciousness of the author. It illustrates how the dance in this life works (at least as of now). It is, say, a quintessentially human system.

Objectivity, on the other hand, can describe the sequences of causes and effects in a subjective work. Objectivity can also break down and formulate a map of interacting details to describe the make up of certain characters or other elements within a drama. However, objectivity, or logic, always runs into the wall, so to speak. It can only describe the system. It cannot escape it.

In this world, we have subjectivity and objectivity dancing together. The subjective without integration (love?) of the objective always runs in circles. The objective without integration (love?) of the subjective always runs into a wall. Subjective (history?) always repeats itself. Objective (logic, reason, computation) always runs into a wall, freaks out when it hits the wall, and it crashes back into from whence it came (fall of civilizations?)

When the objective and subjective intertwine, it creates a spiral effect. If they seek to integrate and are open and honest with the other (love?), the spiral is that of an upward nature. If they hate each other, are repelled by the other, then they still align behind the scenes, creating a downward spiral effect.

I hope you can read between the lines, because these self-reflections are quite abstract, and they are very personal. I have given this a great deal of thought, honest questing of beliefs, meditation, etc., and this is a communication of how I see these two concepts, both individually and interwoven.

Edit: To directly answer your question, maybe try letting the objective and subjective dance together. You will explain yourself sufficiently to the teacher's desires, and you will also be true to your spirit. You are the creator of the work, after all.

[edit on 10-3-2010 by orwellianunenlightenment]

I should also add that maybe you should look at a few of your subjective works; then, try to see your objectives within them. When trying to be more objective, consider a wide range of subjective mentalities as well, and try to integrate these concepts. There is nothing purely objective or subjective. In my view, an "objective" piece of writing merely tries to describe a larger system, trying to integrate as many subjective mentalities as possible. It is trying to see it not just through your own eyes and ears and self, but through as many eyes and ears and selves as is possible for you. You then, through reason and logic, explain this system which you have perceived.

Originally posted by LordBucket
reply to post by loveguy

 

ways to write more objectively?

Probably the easiest way is to make no definite statements. You may notice, for example, that no sentence in this post appears to say anything definitely. That might be more than is strictly necessary, but in my experience it's usually safe to simply allow room for doubt in your phrasing, and to qualify everything with the suggestion that it is based on one's own perspective and opinion.

Do you need more examples? Perhaps phrasing things as questions would be helpful? How can anyone accuse you of being excessively opinionated when you simply ask questions to get your point across?

But when in doubt, a simple "probably" or "it appears" or "I think that" will usually be enough to keep most people from becoming too annoyed with you.

Thank you.
It's me that is being critical of my threads/posts. I guess I got this fear or whatever that threads die when I add my input. And with school too, I have to keep revising. I know that focus should be utilized. Your input has helped thus far, thanks. I like the question form of conveying points. Thanks again.

Originally posted by jjjtir
Maybe move this to Education & Media forum?

There is more appropriate maybe...

I considered that but I won't be linking any media. Thank you though,

reply to post by loveguy


I didn't ask you to link any media.

That forum is also about Education, not solely Media.

I think LordBucket said it pretty well.

Just want to add:

There is a fine line between showing conviction in your assertions while maintaining objectivity, and writing too subjectively about your own views. No one's writing is perfect and there are areas we can all improve in. Just practice as often as you can and try to word your sentences so that they make no definitive statements. Also, imply (not necessarily write it out) through your writing that input with substance from others is welcome and you are willing to admit you might be wrong.

[edit on 10/3/2010 by Dark Ghost]

reply to post by orwellianunenlightenment


Wow!
I'm going to have to keep coming back to your post, for it is abstract. It maybe points me to that I need to research the definitions of each, because I think you might have confused me into thinking one means what the other means, vice-versa! Thanks!

Edit to add; Subjective is authors viewpoint. Objective is whatever is exterior to the mind. Like what my friend orwellianunenlightenment said.



[edit on (3/10/1010 by loveguy]

reply to post by jjjtir


Again, thank you for your input.
And, you have succeeded thus far in getting me off track.
The first time is shame on you.
The second time is shame on me.
There won't be a third time, friend.

reply to post by Dark Ghost


Yup.
I was thinking along those lines as I was replying to jjjtir.
First, I was thinking He/She was trying to bust my chops. Now I'm thinking He/She may actually be helping me, inadvertently or intentionally.


Removed a sentence.

[edit on (3/10/1010 by loveguy]