I KNEW this was going to happen, sooner or later!!!

reply to post by weedwhacker



WW I think I see what you mean, I'll note as I go:

First this

The report found that an FAA manager tape-recorded an hour-long interview with the controllers just hours after the hijacked aircraft crashed into the World Trade Center towers, the Pentagon and a field in Pennsylvania.

So this was an interview with managers, Not communication with airfcraft.

His intention was to provide the information quickly to the FBI. But months after the recording, the tape was never turned over to the FBI and another FAA manager decided on his own to destroy the tape, crushing it with his hand, cutting it into small pieces and depositing the pieces into several trash cans, the report said.

But why did he destroy the tape? Why wasn't the interviews givento the FBI for furthering their investigation and knowledge of the situation?

Originally posted by theability
reply to post by weedwhacker

 

WW I think I see what you mean, I'll note as I go:

First this

The report found that an FAA manager tape-recorded an hour-long interview with the controllers just hours after the hijacked aircraft crashed into the World Trade Center towers, the Pentagon and a field in Pennsylvania.

So this was an interview with managers, Not communication with airfcraft.

His intention was to provide the information quickly to the FBI. But months after the recording, the tape was never turned over to the FBI and another FAA manager decided on his own to destroy the tape, crushing it with his hand, cutting it into small pieces and depositing the pieces into several trash cans, the report said.

But why did he destroy the tape? Why wasn't the interviews givento the FBI for furthering their investigation and knowledge of the situation?

He destroyed the tapes because they contained smoking gun testimony. It would not have done any good to turn it over to the FBI, they know damned well that this is an inside job and have done all they can to cover it up, from the highest levels.

Had those tapes survived they would have shown that the official story is bunk and caused a lot of grief for the perps. No doubt this guy was told by an intel balck bag type to get rid of the tapes to help with the coverup.

There is NO reason under earth to destroy the tapes except to get rid of incriminating evidence. That guy should be charged with a crime for soing so. Then he should be taken to a Fed lockup until he tells us all what the truth is.

This act was purposeful destruction of evidence.

Originally posted by ATH911
First off, the attacks were only halfway done and how would he have known if the WTC attacks were successful when he's still sitting in that room?

Well, if he was behind an orchestration of the attacks and they were "halfway done", it would imply a great deal of success and he would not be sitting there with a look on his face as if his sphincters were tightening.

Second, you really expected him to stay remaining in that room in front of the cameras with a smirk on his face the whole time?

Absolutely. He's in a safe place. Should we expect him to go fleeing to the boiler room?

reply to post by richierich

He destroyed the tapes because they contained smoking gun testimony. It would not have done any good to turn it over to the FBI, they know damned well that this is an inside job and have done all they can to cover it up, from the highest levels.

Sounds about right. For this man to decide what should or shouldn't survive as evidence does show that it was something of importance, since he did decide to destroy evidence within hours of the events surround 911.

Makes sense to me and you, but others see it as not big deal to rid the crimes scene of 'finger prints'.

Originally posted by theability

Makes sense to me and you, but others see it as not big deal to rid the crimes scene of 'finger prints'.

But he allowed it to sit around for months?

Why wait "months" to destroy allegedly implicating evidence?

reply to post by traditionaldrummer



The point would be, sitting on the evidence for months, meaning he hid the tape and never turned it over or revealed it to the FBI.

In other words committing a crime, by obstructing justice and destroying evidence.

But months after the recording, the tape was never turned over to the FBI and another FAA manager decided on his own to destroy the tape,..

Here is the cover-up, by the self admitting that I'm destroying the tape without regard to the criminal case and collection of evience going on.

...crushing it with his hand, cutting it into small pieces and depositing the pieces into several trash cans, the report said.

Then disposing the tape in many waste baskets to ensure that the tape couldn't and wouldn't be found and recompiled back-into original form which obviously would have been bad for someone, or why else go through the steps outlined?





[edit on 29-5-2010 by theability]

[edit on 29-5-2010 by theability]

Originally posted by theability

Here is the cover-up, by the self admitting that I'm destroying the tape without regard to the criminal case and collection of evience going on.

...crushing it with his hand, cutting it into small pieces and depositing the pieces into several trash cans, the report said.

Then disposing the tape in many waste baskets to ensure that the tape couldn't and wouldn't be found and recompiled back-into original form which obviously would have been bad for someone, or why else go through the steps outlined?

Why make an elaborate production of destruction of alleged incriminating evidence? I can't see a cover up occurring in such a public manner. Why not take it home and burn it? Why not throw it off a bridge into a river? etc. etc.

reply to post by theability


theability, I am responding directly to your post, but I would like to address what richierich said, just below yours...which you subsequently seemed to agree with. richierich made a statement based ENTIRELY on opinion. It is not borne out by any facts...

First, your question:

But why did he destroy the tape? Why wasn't the interviews givento the FBI for furthering their investigation and knowledge of the situation?

What was going on, there, was an effort BY THE CONTROLLER's UNION to protect the individuals directly involved from any sort of perceived 'mistakes' of any sort that may have been made, procedurally, during the events.

It is very simple --- the FAA has the "book" procedures, and in reality, not always is it possible to always follow the "book" in every sense, perfectly. Nothing would ever get done, in terms of easing the flow of air traffic, and minimizing delays to the extent that is possible.

The difficulty, in an after-the-fact investigation is that any perception, by FAA management, of any minor mistake on the part of the ATC personnel...something as minor as improper verbiage, for example...could be pounced on and made example of, later. Scapegoating, it's called.

While the idea, initially, to tape the contorller's recollections...and that is ALL that it was!...due to the enormity of the events, and their historical significance sounded like a good idea, the union representative who heard about it grew concerned....he had the SAME controllers, instead, WRITE DOWN their rememberings, in formal report format.

THOSE formal reports WERE turned in, and made available to any investigating agency that wished to see them.

Therefore, the earlier tapes, of a conversational nature, were (in the opinion of this union rep) no longer required.

A rather long-winded explanation, but it's needed to try and show how the real world works...the formal written reports are available, online (I have seen tehm, once...don't remember atm the link address).

Again, this is so innocuous --- but the 9/11 "conspiracy" people will grasp at any little thing they think will "prove" their claims. It is really quite desperate, on their part.

reply to post by traditionaldrummer

Why make an elaborate production of destruction of alleged incriminating evidence? I can't see a cover up occurring in such a public manner. Why not take it home and burn it? Why not throw it off a bridge into a river? etc. etc.

What, why are you asking this? It wasn't elaborate, it was undermining the investigation.


And the for the river part, just because a tape is sumuraged in water, doesn't make it un-recoverable.

The old flight data recorders used tape and got water damaged all the time. The tapes were still retrieved.

Its not hard to figure out TD, seriously, obviously there was something on that tape that this person wanted hidden from evaluation. Or this story would never be.

Originally posted by theability

What, why are you asking this?

Because this really doesn't fit in with the typical scenarios of destroying allegedly incriminating evidence. The accusation of such seems based on flimsy premises.

umm al-Qaeda works for the cia u no its our own guys and for the people the op named i always thought of them as pawns from mk ultra

reply to post by traditionaldrummer


Again are you ever going to use a source?

Because this really doesn't fit in with the typical scenarios of destroying allegedly incriminating evidence. The accusation of such seems based on flimsy premises.

Or are you going to continue like your opinion really matters?



I am still looking for your to support what you say, I know I won't see it. Just go back a few pages.

Again where is it? I have asked in this thread numerous times for you to contribute, yet all I see is the script all over again.

Its a flimsy premise, why because you say so?


Same rhetoric TD different day.





[edit on 29-5-2010 by theability]

reply to post by weedwhacker


WW I can see your point of view, yet from the way I see it, it still smells of something was exposed upon those tapes that was kept from the public and deemed enough to destroy during a criminal investigation. This man isn't the law, who deemed him high authority to destroy evidence during the course of the investigation?

What was on the tape that needed to be silenced?

And your right, maybe nothing was on it, but since the tape is history we cannot make the determination no longer, can we.

reply to post by theability


Perhaps you haven't dug this deep:

....The taping began before noon on Sept. 11 at the New York Air Route Traffic Control Center, in Ronkonkoma, N.Y., where about 16 people met in a basement conference room known as the Bat Cave and passed around a microphone, each recalling his or her version of the events of a few hours earlier. The recording included statements of 5 or 10 minutes each by controllers who had spoken by radio to people on the planes or who had tracked the aircraft on radar, the report said.

Officials at the center never told higher-ups of the tape's existence, according to a report made public on Thursday by the inspector general of the Transportation Department.

A quality-assurance manager at the center destroyed the tape several months after it was made, crushing the cassette in his hand, cutting the tape into little pieces and dropping them in different trash cans around the building, according to the report. The tape had been made under an agreement with the union that it would be destroyed after it was superseded by written statements from the controllers, the report said.

The quality-assurance manager told investigators that he had destroyed the tape because he thought making it was contrary to Federal Aviation Administration policy, which calls for written statements, and because he felt that the controllers ''were not in the correct frame of mind to have properly consented to the taping'' because of the stress of the day.

None of the officials or controllers were identified in the report.

The inspector general, Kenneth M. Mead, said that keeping the tape's existence a secret, and then destroying it, did not ''serve the interests of the F.A.A., the department, or the public,'' and would raise suspicions at a time of national crisis.

The value of the tape was not clear, Mr. Mead said, because no one was sure what was on it, although the written statements given later by five of the controllers were broadly consistent with ''sketchy'' notes taken by people in the Bat Cave. (The sixth controller did not give a statement, apparently because that controller did not speak to either of the planes or observe them on radar.)

*skip*

The quality-assurance manager destroyed the tape sometime in December 2001, January 2002 or February 2002. By that time he and the center manager had received an e-mail message from the F.A.A. instructing officials to safeguard all records and adding, ''If a question arises whether or not you should retain data, RETAIN IT.''

The inspector general ascribed the destruction to ''poor judgment.''

An F.A.A. spokesman, Greg Martin, said that ''we have taken appropriate disciplinary action'' against the quality-assurance manager.

***Ooops...here's the link: bbc911confile.blogspot.com...

So, the manager got into trouble. A great deal of time elapsed, though...and he apparently felt that the written reports would suffice.

He wasn't trying to 'hide' any sort of government 'conspiracy' or complicity in the 9/11 events...he was acting on behalf of his associates.

ALL of the people involved are still alive...ask them.

Really, as I've said, this is nothing...less than nothing, BUT is is fodder for 9/11 'deniers', because they will grasp at everything and anything that can be twisted around to support their increasingly untenable positions.

BTW...I just ran across another book of interest, titled "Tower Stories", a compilation of personal accounts of 9/11 survivors in NYC.

Quite compelling read, and goes long way to dispel so many of the "conspiracy" myths....




[edit on 29 May 2010 by weedwhacker]

Originally posted by weedwhacker

BTW...I just ran across another book of interest, titled "Tower Stories", a compilation of personal accounts of 9/11 survivors in NYC.

Quite compelling read, and goes long way to dispel so many of the "conspiracy" myths....

Read?

Are you kidding?

How do you expect a group that has the attention span of a gnat due to incessant playing of WoW, to be able to sit down long enough to actually read?

Their attention spans are more suited to the 10 minute limit on you tube. Hence the popularity among truthers.

for the record, when you cut a tape up into may pieces and put the pieces into separate. garbage cans it is a cover up by definition.

After you have admitted it is a cover up you can debate the nature of it as you have done so well, but not admitting that its a cover up is either poor comprehension or ignorance by choice.

Originally posted by jprophet420
for the record, when you cut a tape up into may pieces and put the pieces into separate. garbage cans it is a cover up by definition.

No, actually, when some unthinking office drone destroyed legitimate archives becuase he was mindlessly following the rules specified in section A, paragraph B of article C dash D of the whatever code as ratified by whoever, it is beaurocratic ineptitude by definition.

The problem for your conspiracy stories comes in when I point out that I can give you as many examples as you'd like of poor decicion making on the part of the gov't. Can you provide even one example where anyone successfully planted secret controlled demolitions in a building without anyone noticing?

The problem for your conspiracy stories

For the last time either provide what conspiracy story I have presented or don't post about it.

Originally posted by theability

Give me a break, I worked as a paramedic in denver for 10 years. Plus I was a combat medic in the Army for Four years.

So stop telling me about living in protected bubbles and insulting my knowledge of the world.

Oh right, sorry.

I didn't realise you'd lived in Denver.

reply to post by GoodOlDave


Is that you Rockerfeller????



Oh noes quickly blame the conspirators for this one!!!