The Illusion of Free Will

this is for the people that think that human footprints in fossils millions of years old show that civilization has been around for far longer than we think. no, its not god that destroyed them, nor is it people trying to hide the truth. at least thats my take on it.

my take is that if humans were to develop time travel, theortically, their effects would have already happened, therefore meaning the future IS predetermined, and it is all happening at the same time.

for if someone developed time travel, went back in time, and left their mark on something, it would show to us because we are after the time that they traveled to. so it is true that civilization has only been around a short while, and god didnt kill all the people that "turned against his divine light."

free will is an illusion.

Any thoughts?????????

p.s. this is my take.

[edit on 2-3-2010 by LocoHombre]

I understand what you are saying here LocoHombre with your OP and I would take it further and say there are in fact items that have been found in archealogical digs and ones that have turned up all over the world accidentally that have indeed been treated andcalled Out of Place Artifacts hence the acronym Ooparts.
I understand from this then that there have been Time Travellers of sorts whether Terrestrial or Non/Extra-Terrestrial that may have placed these artifacts either accidentally or intentionally to change the current world to an alternate future one.
Though it dosent matter what world timeline we live in it is up to the individual on how much time they wish to decide to be in a state of separation. But yes at the end of the moment in time and space one does however recognizes that the Free will of All that Is is what one ultimately wanted to be one with in eternity.

[edit on 2-3-2010 by Epsillion70]

Originally posted by EnlightenUp
Ese hombre es que loquisimo, ya! No entiendo a nada. Digalo mas claramente, por favor!

My thoughts exactly,

what is your trying to say OP?

Freewill definition:
1. The ability or discretion to choose; free choice:
2. The power of making free choices that are unconstrained by external circumstances or by an agency such as fate or divine will.

I have read the original post over and over again, admittedly I am tired but I cam in to this thread expecting to hear about some devine mystery unveiled in front of our eyes instead we have time travel and footprints?

Please explain.

I have starred and flagged you because I always use destino in order to open the eyes of closed minds. I can give you many many instances of destino, the more aware you are of them the clearer they are.




[edit on 2-3-2010 by franspeakfree]

[edit on 2-3-2010 by franspeakfree]

There is a scientific school of thought that believes all conscious decisions we make have already been pre-determined by our sub-conscious. Anything you decide to do therefore has already been determined for you before your conscious, logical thought processes become aware of it. In this sense then yes, free-will is an illusion, as our waking mind has no real control. I've heard that there's actual scientific study on this topic, I'll see if I can dig up some links.

Your comments however OP seem to deal more with pre-determination involving time-travel, and the actions of travellers impacting the chain of world events. My knowledge/belief of time travel is that future events are malleable, and subject to change. Only the past is set in stone. Paradoxes are inherently illogical, and cannot occur. Anything that were to change in the past would not alter this timeline's future or present, but rather branch into a seperate timeline or reality. In that sense free-will is not an illusion, as we are free to dictate our future. The future has not yet happened.

EDIT for extra paragraph.

[edit on 2-3-2010 by Random_Hero10]

reply to post by Random_Hero10


I do have this twinge of a notion that all these Billy Bob scienphilosophers are madly confuddled on the schemantics of "consciounessity" and "volunarity".

Originally posted by franspeakfree
2. The power of making free choices that are unconstrained by external circumstances or by an agency such as fate or divine will.

See, that's where they flub the whole thing, when divine will is in fact the the will, divine will is free will and not an agency of constraint. The egregious error is positing the divine as an external agency. MMM?

I suppose the free will illusion is no different than a time machine illusion, right?

As long as we're playing, I'm gonna go to the nearest pig farm and watch the swine line up on the runway for their flights.

Besides - if my life is predetermined, I owe someone a kick in the nuts.

Free will, much like everything you will ever experience in your life is an illusion. All time exist at all times, past present and future. Our so called free will is a result of our very small scope of vision which is restricted to the few wavelengths of light we can oberve in the present tense. Since we do no know the future or all possibilities of the future we are stuck with "free will".

well

the truth is that its impossible for time travel TO THE PAST to be possible in my opinion

the only way possible would be if each time you traveled back, you created another universe, and if that was true, then, well, we may be a big computer system

another thing that is possible is that if you travel back everything changes at that same moment, that would mean that time doesnt exist and, well, nothing makes sense, since you would exist in every single msecond in "time", or every moment, that would be weird just to think about it ... so I prefer to not consider ... just like religious people do about science, they think that god is doing everything ... its possible but its just not the best way to understand things

You have free will if you want - but you have to take the consequences for it.

The goal is to lose free will and win the game.

Namaste,

Deckard

reply to post by hhcore


what im saying is only IF not that im sure its true. k? because it is possible, but im also not entirely certain that it could happen.

You have free will. Unless what you want to do is a threat to national security. Then you don't.