Who doesn't want You to have Guns? Frightened Cowards and "The Man"

Originally posted by olfredbear
reply to post by Rybo666

 

Walmart is having a sale on clues today.
You have not had one in quite some time....you had better get there quick before they run out!!

Very clever... Your mum help you think of that?

What a crock.

There is another group of us who are not cowards (I have marksman and sharpshooter ribbons I earned in the military) but who feel that an armed to the teeth society is neither a safer or healthy society.

I am not opposed to guns rights I just think the gun kooks are taking it to absurd lengths.

No one needs to buy 20 guns at a time. And guns in churches or bars...yeah right...besides the place church is supposed to be a place of peace and people drink and get drunk in bars...oh great a bunch of armed drunks...there is absolutely no proof that guns in either place or many of the other places you fools are pushing for them to be allowed make us one iota safer.

I personally believe that I would be in far more danger from a bunch of macho fools with guns trying to stop someone (say a shooter) than I would be from the shooter himself.

Gun kooks do not make me feel safe. The frontier is closed...we do not need guns everywhere...

not to mention the fact that a society that feels the need to be armed to the teeth is not a healthy society.

Originally posted by Rybo666

I'm English and we cope very well with not owning guns!

I'm English and I don't think we do cope very well without them at all.

We British people have been brainwashed into thinking that Guns are bad. Everytime a shooting goes down anywhere we basically get a 'See guns are bad' type of media report. We never get to see or hear any stories about how guns helped to stop something bad from going down.

At school I was brainwashed into thinking that guns are bad too and only up until a few years ago I too felt that guns were bad. Now after much reading up on the subject, I feel that they are needed in society and if Britain was to legalise them again, I would get one instantly. I want to protect myself and my family with a gun. I wish we had a constitution that allows and protects gun ownership like Americans have.

The first thing many would do here if a burglar was in their home is run and hide in a room and wait for the police to get there. There is a common trend in Britain of relying on 'our superiors in society' to do things for us and it just isn't working. Society is deteriating with a growing proportion of the population scared to go out after dark incase they get randomly picked out by yobs as a easy target to attack for no apparent reason with no reprecussions on them and even the chance of getting a medal of honour (an ASBO).

Fact is that criminals have guns in Britain, law-abiding citizens don't. Giving law-abiding citizens will not make the country more unsafe, it will put some of that fear that average people have back onto the criminals.

Originally posted by Rybo666


I don't understand all this bill of rights and founding fathers bull#! It's just an excuse for Americans to get their own way.

Why, Yes, Yes it is a way for Americans to get thier own way!
That could be why it is called "The Bill of Rights"

Sorry just had to poke at you a bit for that statement... I understand that you were most likely a bit worked up when you wrote it.. hopefully you have a good enough sense of humor to understand how I found it rather humurous.

Also as you stated later that you are from England, May I ask why it seems to bother you so much about an American "right to bear arms" in our constitution??

Or is it the moral issues that such an easily operated, and accessable weapon invariably brings about? no matter what nation, country,etc is being refered to..

[edit on 3-3-2010 by SideWynder]

I'm a 'coward' because I'm afraid of guns?

Sometimes ATS just gets worse and worse! Can you not go and post this kind of rubbish on some hunting website?

Good luck with relaxing your gun laws in bars though, hope that works out well for you!

Originally posted by JohnySeagull

I don't think its so much about feeling safer................

....Imagine if you weren't afraid anymore. Imagine if you weren't scared of death. Imagine if you weren't afraid of dying.

I'm not afraid of dying. I do not need a gun.




peace

While I share your sentiment, in that:

1)Guns don't automatically make one feel safer.

2) Do not fear death, as its inevitable...

But, After being:
1) robbed by gunpoint in front of my teenage home @ 17y.o, in our upper middle class home. My dad was a cop then, and though we called the on duty law...robbers not caught...hell, the detective got there 1hr later....prolly had other similar victims to attend to.

2)robbed, once again @ 17y.o while working @ a local pizza place in...oops...a "nice neighborhood".

3) Heading to a Braves baseball game & having a drunk/irate driver pull a gun from his car, pointing it in my wifes passenger window(from his driver window), after he swerved and grazed MY car? And her looking at me like "help?" (She's anti-gun too and convinced me to leave it home as: blah,blah,blah anti- gun rant)

4) Finishing a business contract with a partner @ a local coffee shop, and upon leaving we get robbed in the parking lot as we got to our cars...my gun in the glovebox, as coffee shop people get nervous when a concealed bulge is bigger than a smartphone.

I myself do not fear death...but I will not leave its approach up to another humans direct discretion. No thanks.

[edit on 3-3-2010 by ahmonrarh]

reply to post by kingmonkey


And NO!!!

You're not a coward because you have a fear of guns(real question: you're admittedly afraid of guns?).

Some people are afraid of DOGS too, but that doesn't make them a coward....a GUN is designed to harm, but thing thing is, it IS NOT autonomous.

User input is required.

Originally posted by Everton
No country should have the public being eligible to access firearms in my opinion. Reason being is they cause harm/distress/souring crime rates and murder. Being armed to protect yourself is a silly idea, just use common sense and avoid gang infested streets at night. I dont see what good can possibly come from owning a weapon.

Really?

Are you a troll? K. I'll bite.

Why should I give up my rights to go about at any time? I have the right to go and do just as I please. if you (violently) try to stop me, I have the right to instruct you so that you will not do so again.

That is the same as saying women should be allowed to be attractive because it invites rape.

You dont want a weapon? Great. More for me. Dont dick with my 2nd ammendment dude.

BTW, where are you from nationally?

Originally posted by Everton
That's because our founding fathers didn't have morals that we share today. They acted on basic insticts, can you imagine a future in which our children have to walk the streets knowing the majority of people around them are armed? It'll just inflict fear and worry in most citizens, at the end of the day i cant imagine any other reason to carry a gun other than to cause harm.

When the President visited open-carry states, do you know he felt safer knowing that he was soo well protected?!! I don't care what that Chris Matthews tries to make of it....fear, yea the only FEAR would be knowing the guns are in the hands of criminals, not law abiding citizens.

Aside from the OP's statement...you should really go to the FBI's crime stats for open-carry versus non-permissive states....shocking how what you perceive is not based in fact.

Originally posted by ahmonrarh
reply to post by kingmonkey

 

And NO!!!

You're not a coward because you have a fear of guns(real question: you're admittedly afraid of guns?).

Some people are afraid of DOGS too, but that doesn't make them a coward....a GUN is designed to harm, but thing thing is, it IS NOT autonomous.

User input is required.

ahmonrarh, to be honest I have never considered myself to be afraid of guns and, upon reflection, I am not afraid of guns. My reply was in response to the OP. It is one thing to have a view on the subject but to suggest that people are cowards because they are against the ownership of guns in your country (assumed) is ridiculous.

I am not from the U.S. and my opinion has therefore been formed with a great deal of influence from stories I have been exposed to in the media. this isn't to say that my opinion is without merit. If I lived in the U.S. I think I would be more afraid of the amount and type of people who have such easy access to guns.

With regards to you have being robbed at gunpoint, my response to that would be - why not work toward having a country free of guns so that it would not be possible to be robbed at gunpoint?

With regards to other posters reference to your constitution. Not wanting to cause offence to anyone, but is it possible that, as your constitution was written in a different era, it is perhaps outdated and parts of it not relevant to your current society? ie. Should it be followed to the letter no matter what?

reply to post by SideWynder


haha no offence taken! Thanks for being mature about it! Yes it is a moral thing that such insanely dangerous weapons could even be perceived as a good thing in any sense.

I can see what people mean about the self defence thing but just get a baseball bat! its alot less likely to kill someone.

A death is a death in any sense and noone should have to live with killing someone regardless wether or not someone deserves it.

It upsets me to think that people are given the right to keep guns especially in the home!

In no way am i saying that someone who breaks into you home does not desrve punishment but thats what the justice system is for! Although i use the word justice very lightly. It's not anyones fault that the system is corrupt other than those in power but being a vigilante is a very bad idea, not to mention illegal!

Many criminals use guns to just scare their victim, the majority of them don't want to kill anyone but if you point a gun in their face they are so much more likely to pull the trigger and try to get you first.

I totally respect other peoples opinions in this matter but personally i cannot not see any logic whatsoever behind it.

reply to post by Rybo666


FEMALE INTERVIEWER:
So, General Reinwald, what things are you going to teach
these young boys when they visit your base?

GENERAL REINWALD:
We're going to teach them climbing, canoeing, archery,
and shooting.

FEMALE INTERVIEWER:
Shooting! That's a bit irresponsible, isn't it?

GENERAL REINWALD:
I don't see why, they'll be properly supervised
on the rifle range.

FEMALE INTERVIEWER:
Don't you admit that this is a terribly dangerous
activity to be teaching children?

GENERAL REINWALD:
I don't see how. We will be teaching them proper
rifle discipline before they even touch a firearm.

FEMALE INTERVIEWER:
But you're equipping them to become violent killers.

GENERAL REINWALD: Well, you're equipped to be a
prostitute, but you're not one, are you?

The radio went silent and the interview ended.
All over America, people were thinking:
"Semper Fi, Marine!"

Copyright Family Guardian Fellowship
Last revision: April 03, 2009 08:45 AM
This private system is NOT subject to monitoring

reply to post by Rybo666


Accidental deaths

Number of physicians in the US: 700,000.
Accidental deaths caused by physicians per year: 120,000. Accidental
deaths per physician.... 0.171
(U.S. Dept. of Health & Human Services)

Number of gun owners in the US: 80,000,000.
Number of accidental gun deaths per year: 1,500 (all age groups)
Accidental deaths per gun owner: 0.0000188

Therefore, statistically,
Doctors are approximately 9,000 times more dangerous than gun owners.

"FACT: Not everyone has a gun, but everyone has at least one Doctor."

Please alert your friends to this alarming threat.
We must ban doctors before this gets out of hand.
So, remember: guns don't kill people - doctors do
Copyright Family Guardian

reply to post by olfredbear


Haha funny! But who's to say that one of the kids likes it a bit too much and gets into guns? Then later on down the line in his/her teens decides to shoot up their school because they don't like Mondays for example.

Kids should not be shown or shown how to handle a gun ever!

Respect to the Marine for saying that live though

Also with regards to your last post statistics mean nothing when a kid gets hold of his dads gun and decides to go all William Tell on their friends.

Also those statistics are flawed as like you say not everyone has a gun but if they did the number of accidental deaths would be much higher i'm sure!

[edit on 3-3-2010 by Rybo666]

[edit on 3-3-2010 by Rybo666]

Originally posted by Rybo666
Many criminals use guns to just scare their victim, the majority of them don't want to kill anyone but if you point a gun in their face they are so much more likely to pull the trigger and try to get you first.

That's may well be true, but also consider that if a perpetrator merely suspects the presence of a gun in the home or being carried by a particular individual, they will quite often more on to an easier, less dangerous mark. Gun owners in rural America have known this fact for years. Its part of the reason why murder rates in rural areas tend to be much lower than in most major metropolitan areas in the United States.

You don't have to *use* a gun for it to serve as an excellent deterrent.

reply to post by vor78


And if the criminal does not know? Then the possibilities are that someone is going to get shot and it does not neccessarily mean it will be the criminal.

It's a case of the fastest finger first.

reply to post by Rybo666


The only power I feel by owning a .22 rifle and a .357 revolver is that I can live off the land by hunting if need be.

I have told the story several times but I have been the "victim" of a home invasion. I awoke to find a strange guy asleep in my bed beside me. I gave him a rude awakening by sitting bolt upright and leaning over a asking in a firm tone (cop voice) what the hell are you doing here?

I never pulled a gun, though I could have. Never drew a fist either. After repeated questions, I determined he was drunk and picked the wrong apartment to a friend's. Wrong building too. I never even called the police and actually shook his hand and introduced myself.

The only though of using a gun or any weapon the entire time was "The rifle is in the closet and unloaded...Sword is across the room by the door. Will have to use bare hands. "

A gun is no more dangerous nor irresponsible than a screwdriver. It all depend on who holds it.

But how the atrocities mentioned compare, is that one person thinks their position is correct beyond others. When in fact it is based on a wrong assumption.

Originally posted by Rybo666

I can see what people mean about the self defence thing but just get a baseball bat! its alot less likely to kill someone.

What about those criminals who carry lethal weapons, a baseball bat isn't going to help if the loser is attacking with a firearm. This brings up another point, what happens if you are attacked by a group? I would sure love a weapon at that time to hold the thugs at bay.

Many criminals use guns to just scare their victim, the majority of them don't want to kill anyone but if you point a gun in their face they are so much more likely to pull the trigger and try to get you first.

Got any data or articles to back this one up? I am sure how many hardened felons you have met(I actually know a few), but many of them do not flinch at violence or death.

This last statement seems to imply a raped, beaten, and bloodied woman is somehow morally superior to a woman standing over the corpse of her would be attacker with a 9mm in her hand...after all they are both still alive if the murderous woman was not a caring a weapon.



I have to say that I love this aspect of living in the US, long live the 2nd Amendment!

reply to post by Everton


Do you think that the only place crime happens is in ghettos? That is certainly not true. There are home invasions, there are robberies, there are crazy people that want to rap and murder people. Wow, that is pretty ignorant to think that way. I think you missed the whole POINT of the article. Did you not see where it said that gun ownership brings crime down. It is a FACT. Does it not make sense that a robber would go into a house where he knew the owners were not armed before he would go into a house where he knew the owner was armed....... It is hard for me to understand where people's logic is sometimes.

Originally posted by Ahabstar
reply to post by Rybo666

 

But how the atrocities mentioned compare, is that one person thinks their position is correct beyond others. When in fact it is based on a wrong assumption.

And is that not what you are doing here? Im not saying i am anymore right than the people on here who support guns! Like i said in a previous post i respect other peoples opinions in this, there is no wrong or right just a bit of common sense i guess, but common sense is generally in the eye of the beholder.

What you think is right might not be and what i think is right may not be either.