Revolution ? No....More like division impoverishment and civil war.

reply to post by kozmo



And I see your scenario already in play.
From my local township which is insolvent and upside down financially,
to my county which has laid off emergency responders and government workers, to metro's like Los Angeles courting bankruptcy, and even my state of Pennsylvania which will be pulling off the greatest magic trick ever by staying afloat till the end of the year.
So we are NOT in disagreement, you've just offered a little more detail.
The forgein troop, Henry Kissinger prophecy you explain would be insane wouldnt it?
It would give us a feeling of what it would be like to be an Iraq citizen right now wouldnt it?
The post anarchy "political round up" hang Mussolini upside down tribunals would deserve popcorn and soft drinks, and once again, I tend to agree.
You added detail, the end result my friend is still the same.
This is going to be birthing pangs like no other.
But I believe its sooner than we think.

Originally posted by HappilyEverAfter
I dont see total anarchy but I see millions of people who are mentally miles away from being able to take care of themselves finding no system in place that they are used to for their survival and resorting to panic.
I dont see an "easy" or "collaborative" bridge.

There is no easy road for those who have consistently abdicated their own responsibility to themselves. However, there is a way, though they will have to take responsibility for themselves. there is no getting around that.

God always provides a way. No, i'm not talking about the church version of God. He's a fapper.

you can get out of the negative feedback loop by making a contract with the creator of the universe. PM for details I don't want to be a blabbermouth evangelist.

Don't worry, our founding fathers didn't want a revolution either, but they came around in time. Aren't you glad they did?

Originally posted by calstorm
Don't worry, our founding fathers didn't want a revolution either, but they came around in time. Aren't you glad they did?

Brother, I'm not in fear of anything involving revolution. I'm simply stating that the majority of talk being done from the bleachers, will not match the actions taken on the field.
And yes I'm glad they did.

Originally posted by Oaktree
reply to post by LostNemesis

 

In a SHTF situation, many people are already admitting that it will be open season on Illegals in the US.

Who are these "many people".

I haven't heard any mention of that.

There's no way that I can assure myself or anyone else for that matter, that the person I'm simply "looking" at is legal or illegal, and should your scenario find itself to reality, killing people because they LOOK illegal would no doubt happen somewhere and that's pretty messed up isnt it?
Illegal from "where"? So many different looks soooooooo many different people.
So yes sir, I can see me protecting myself against something like this.
Just another piece of the pie.

Today's generation is not programmed for a revolution, rather they are programmed to simply wait and watch for confirmation it is happening. Then, they will wait to be told when it is "over" and what has or has not been accomplished. Then, they will change the channel and move on.

Sort of like watching a reality show on TV if you will. Many will not separate the true reality of what is transpiring today and what we stand to lose. I don't think people today -- since many never had to fight for it to begin with -- have the appreciation for the Constitution and our rights.

Much like children that will never know what life was like without TV, CDs, and video games -- the constitution has always been there for them and frankly I don't think many realize how delicate a balance it really is to try and achieve. To maintain democracy, freedom, and equality, one must work at it. Continue to fight for it. And never accept anything less.

With all of the conveniences of modern living, we lose the ability more and more each and everyday to live without said conveniences. I would imagine there are far fewer people today that could survive without electricity than we think. And what would happen if people arrive at the grocery store and find the shelves empty or too expensive to be able to afford? Would they pull themselves together and begin the process of living without such conveniences? Or rather, would they look to those that can still provide for themselves -- either because of wealth or ingenuity or self-sufficiency -- and blame others for their current situation and start stealing and fighting to get what others have worked for?

In the last twenty+ years we have been conditioned to rely on others when we are incapable of taking care of ourselves. Unfortunately, "incapable" has also been exaggerated to include those that simply don't want to take care of themselves. It has created a simmering resentment that I agree, will boil over and divide us into the have and have-nots. At least at first.

We are in a free fall and sadly, many don't realize that this time there is nobody -- or not enough -- people holding the actual net. The balance has shifted to: Who is going to save us? Rather than, how are we going to save ourselves?

reply to post by lpowell0627



VERY well put. It's not that people are incapable or unable, they have become UNWILLING to truly take responsibility and care for themselves.
The reaction time to really be able to live from the land and provide for themselves is so great of a time span and unrealistic that they have truly painted themselves into a corner and HAVE to rely on being taken care of or TAKING from some one else.
Very good points!

reply to post by HappilyEverAfter


Great post, love the last line.

What, again, most people DO NOT understand is that a Government CAN NOT be a Corporation and vice versa. That should be a common understanding. In that the U.S. (federal territory) is traded on the international stock market, and that has been posted on ATS before, IT can not BE a government. All the "laws", which are not laws at all, that the Congress passes MEAN NOTHING to you or I. What is so hard to comprehend there people?

So, yes, people will turn on each other because the people who have the knowledge and have done the research to get themselves out of the quagmire are looked at as screwing up "The System" for those ignorant and lazy. The ignorant and lazy WANT and NEED to keep their comfy little lifestyle going and don't want to rock the boat, so they will do anything, ANYTHING, to stop those of us who know and have taken the steps to crash the system from within.

The system needs to be crushed and rebuilt on honesty and integrity, not to mention COMMON LAW!!! And it can be done, who will help?

Good question.

This is why I have always tried to explain to everyone I bring it up to, that don't just say "I'll see how it goes for you before I do anything like that", NO... I will not speak to you ever again as you are part of the problem and not part of the solution. I don't need to waste my time any longer on people who do not want to shut the damn television off and get rid of that idiotic cell phone and the like. READ and UNDERSTAND YOUR place in this world. Man what a nightmare.

Why can't these people just get it? Many people have posted links to sites with great information, USE IT. Don't trust anything you read, do some research, contact these people and ask questions, I did.

Want to prepare properly for what "might" happen. Better read up.

Good post, made me laugh and made my day as you always do Happy!!!

www.the7thfire.com...

spiritualeconomicsnow.net...

loveforlife.com.au...

Best one.

www.barefootsworld.net...

And so many more......

bad spelling

[edit on 23-2-2010 by daddio]

reply to post by HappilyEverAfter


Although your sentiments on this matter are compelling, I hope this is not what is in store for us. Don't get me wrong, I have done my share of homework and prep work, and I'll be the first to shoot you if you try me for my canned tuna and Hormel chili.

But, looking back through history we see another side of the coin. The American Revolution did lead to neighbor fighting neighbor, but it also led to organization on a mass scale. In some cases it may have brought the people who normally disliked one another, together for a common cause: Liberty. The French Revolution, (although mainly the cause of the bitter cold and starvation among the peasantry) also showed how instead of fighting amongst the general population, they went for the elite who they blamed for their troubles.

I truly hope if things ever get so bad as to cause situations like the aforementioned ones, the people handle it with civility and honor. Rather than anarchy and senseless raping and pillaging. Like someone else mentioned, thats exactly what TPTB want to see, riots and violence, while they calmly sip their champagne and watch it unfold from the safety of their mansions.

[edit on 23-2-2010 by WhiteDevil013]

reply to post by daddio


It truly is a designed complicated mess now isnt it? Key word is designed.
I have been researching and have taken the information I have received and carefully begun to act on it. Once again, it is designed to trip a person up and snare them. And you are 100% correct when you point out that the Fat & Happy will do whatever thay have to, on both ends of stick, to maintain their places.
What I hope is not escaping the viewing audience is that the Controlling end of the fat and happy stick will in fact remain, for a time, "comfortable" while the business end of the stick will scrape, compromise, beg, plead, and even sell themselves out to continue to sit near or on masters lap.
Even if it means turning on family friends neighbors, whomever.
Seriously, the other day, at work, I was told that, ["a state, any state in the union should offer Obama political asylum and protect him because that way he can get the job done that he wants to get done, and that "people" in washington have him scared and are threatening him with harm if he doesnt do what he's told "] and they firmly believe every word.
When I hear sh%& like that I instantly wonder how many other people believe it as well.
The second foot of the financial fiasco is coming down now, commercial ON TOP of residential, there is no rebound or bump to rely upon when as a nation we produce....squat.
"IF" those pulling the strings stick to their tried and true method, we should see something severe enough to derail the process of the mid term campaigns, to drive back in those horns of anger and threatened change and to keep the status quo as close to their norm as possible.
This turd of theirs is swirling the drain and THAT along with loss of control and agenda, has divided the PTB amongst themselves and has divided the citizens.
It's a united marathon not a united sprint.
Staying together is key, now? Can we pull it off?

The thing about revolution is you never know what it is that starts it. Sometimes it's as small as one person getting shot and the whole thing blows up. The global elite would love to know what starts it. Then would know how far to push us. I personally can't wait for it to start. We need to clean out all these lawyers and globalist. BRING IT ON !!!!!!!!!

Originally posted by WhiteDevil013
reply to post by HappilyEverAfter

 

I'll be the first to shoot you if you try me for my canned tuna and Hormel chili.

thats exactly what TPTB want to see, riots and violence, while they calmly sip their champagne and watch it unfold from the safety of their mansions.

[edit on 23-2-2010 by WhiteDevil013]

And as we empty magazine after magazine to protect our tuna and chili and water and family,
Who are the lead catchers going to be?
The civility and honor we would WISH to see, will have passed through our assailants bowels 72 to 96 hours prior to them entering our home.
Hunger and want, and desire to protect family and self, become emotionally charged conditions.
Acting, then asking for forgiveness rather than permission would be common wouldnt you think?
Self Justified ?
And as you point out, sipping 58 rothschild in a mansion somewhere is colonel mustard, lady tata, and a bevy of politicians tisking the behavior of the common man.

Originally posted by kozmo
Well, I largely disagree with most everyone on how this is going to transpire. I don't have a crystal ball nor am I clairvoyant, BUT... I trust my gut and I trust my instincts. I have been paying VERY close attention to what has been happening for the past 20 years and have felt it coming for almost 30. There are others just like me who will agree with what I am about to write....

First will come the shuttering of local governments due to lack of revenue. Services will end, police and fire will be laid off and county sherrifs and state police will attempt to fill the void. Volunteer fire departments will become the norm and widespread cooperation among people within communities will ensue - these will be good things.

Next, county governments, large municipalities and state governments will begin to fail due to lack of revenue. Again, police and fire forces will be reduced and services cut. This will begin the real turmoil as fewer police are available to keep order in pockets or large cities. These pockets will become virtual war zones - gang warfare, looting, fires etc... The national guard will be called in but this will do little to quell the violence. As the NG increases its agressiveness to restore order, they will in fact be contributing to its increase. Martial law will be declared in those urban centers experiencing the most problems.

Instead of actually restoring the peace, it will contribute to more widespread problems. Those capable of leaving the urban centers will - where they go... that will largely determine what happens next. Those escaping the "warfare" in the urban center are likely to move outward toward the suburbs - the wealthier suburbs - looking for food, shelter etc... At this point some odd mix or class and race war will start. In some cases those from the urban centers will unite into groups with the purpose of raiding and marauding. As the struggle in the suburbs intensify, Northcom will mobilize troops to stabilize entire regions. Martial law will be expanded, curfews imposed and the military will take over policing and other civic functions.

For a time, there will be relative calm as basic needs are being serviced and met by the military. However, as the above scenario starts playing out in cities all over the country, the military apparatus will be spread thin. Only the most basic necessities will be provided - and even then, only sporadically. People's patience will be tried and you will start to see instances of domestic terrorism against the military perpetrated by people at the end of their ropes. At first, the mainstream will view these people as terrorists and enemies - later they will embrace them, perhaps even help or join them.

As this scenario drags on even the most passive people will begin to become restless. Feelings of injustice will increase, nerves will fray and some people will begin forming pockets of resistence - peaceful at first - but once the government silences their "Freedom of speech" their "Right to assemble" etc... this will stoke the flames of resistence resulting in a blaze. This is where things will get VERY interesting.

The military will be required to increase its operations against citizens. Several things will happen simultaneously - first, desertions will begin as soldiers leave their posts to go "home" and look after their families. Agreements will be made with our "Allies" for them to provide troops and aid. Carefully orchestrated campaigns of violence will be launched against politicians, corporate and bank executives and any other persons believed to be responsible for the escalating crisis. Things will get realy crazy when foreign troops are policing US citizens on US soil. No need to go into detail - just think about alot of bloodshed.

As a result of this chaos and anarchy, the fact that our military is disintegrating and citizens are dying in staggering numbers, the US military will take its final step and launch a full out coup against the government - taking over ALL political functions. In order to pacify the masses they will a.) pull back all foreign troops and put them into support roles, b.) round up politicans and business people and launch an all-out PR campaign by trying these people in military tribunals for their "Crimes" for the whole country to see.

Believe it or not, it will be this final step that begins to restore some semblance of order. However, no one should expect the world to return to its old ways - no way! People will learn to become much more self sufficient and a true spirit of community will emerge. The military government will then begin to create the framework whereupon a new civilian government will be built. There will be MAJOR fundamental changes made to our founding documents and power will ultimately b e restored to the people.

Obviously there is much, much, much more to this - complexities that don't warrant discussion at this point. But, if I had to offer my most educated guess - and I just did - that is how I see it.

I agree with most of your post. Most of those posting threads about a coming revolution or civil war have been watching far too many B movies and not reading enough history. America is light years away from the nation it was in 1776. I know this fact will break libertarian hearts everywhere, but facts are facts. Yes, there are Tom Paine's, Washinton's and Jefferson's in the population today, but only a microscopic fraction of what was available in 1776.

People are molded by their times, and adult Americans today grew up in a society founded on the New Deal and Great Society programs. Most adult American men NEVER served in the military and would have to rely on watching "Saving Private Ryan" for training. In a matchup with federal forces, I'd give the yokel militia about thirty seconds before a Cobra gunship processed them into potted meat. After the first hideous casualties were broadcast on CNN, 7% of the population would run for their guns and 93% would puke their guts out, then fall in line behind TPTB. After few months, most regions of the country would be "pacified" and return to a "new" normal: martial law and a far more authoritarian state than we have now. Is that really what anyone wants?

Originally posted by flyboyscott68
I personally can't wait for it to start. We need to clean out all these lawyers and globalist. BRING IT ON !!!!!!!!!

I agree it needs purged and cleaned.
Yet unless youre performing enmass surgical strikes at high value multiple targets, what are we bringing on?

I have always felt the same way...

BUT, i also feel like a revolution is badly needed right now. Maybe not the form of revolting that we are all familiar with like violence and things of that nature. But more like not playing the governments little game, like not paying taxes, not paying rent/property tax, not buying gasoline, etc etc. We have to be smart when we decide to revolt.

And for the record it needs to happen NOW!

Originally posted by Office 4256

Originally posted by kozmo

Youre counting on their being a response by our military personnel against us?
I agree we are not in 1776, yet those in 1776 werent in 1492 either.

I actually like your signature, and, to be honest, it seems to go against your post, and has me a little confused.

reply to post by Zeta Reticuli


When a significant percentage of the population quits paying taxes, the federal government will call off the "war on drugs", release the prisoners and free up cell space for large numbers of tax protesters. Doing drugs may be self destructive, but withholding taxes is serious business.

These are all great points and I agree with most of what the OP and Kozmo has said. A few things I'd like to point out:

1) I just can't see a foreign country sending troops in to police U.S. citizens unless there is some type of strong weapons confiscations. It would practically be suicide and would create a situation where Americans would temporarily forget their grievances towards each other and focus on the foreigners. The "enemy of my enemy" is my friend scenario. TPTB would do everything in their power to continue the hate/rhetoric between Americans - engaging a foreign power would only bring us together.

2) I think that the ability for Americans to come together towards a common goal, whether that be for a small community or a great cause has been underestimated here. Sure, there are those who live by everything broadcast on TV but I believe people "wake up" when they have to.

I wonder how many of you used to watch (or still do) Babylon 5? Straczinski's work of fiction was not just some SciFi show, it was a study in what humanity has been, is, and will be. A central theme in the show was highlighted in one episode where Delen (sic?) made mention of what humanity's greatest strength is: we are willing to form communities. A simple concept to us; it was an alien concept to them and many of the other races because their societal structures relied on a caste system.

Cynics will disagree but I believe Americans would do just that. We would form communities and unite against our oppressors. It's in our nature no matter how much deprogramming we've endured since the invention of television. We're going to have some rough times but I believe we'll endure.

Originally posted by Office 4256
reply to post by Zeta Reticuli

 

When a significant percentage of the population quits paying taxes, the federal government will call off the "war on drugs", release the prisoners and free up cell space for large numbers of tax protesters. Doing drugs may be self destructive, but withholding taxes is serious business.

When the population youre taxing doesnt have any money because they dont have any income because they dont have any jobs because their suck hole government and leaders of industry exported them along with their souls characters and testicles, where would the government suggest that tax dollar come from that needs to be paid that needs to be spent on a prison system that they need to operate to hold all the non tax payers?
Perhaps "this" is the failure in the foundation?


[edit on 23-2-2010 by HappilyEverAfter]

Originally posted by HappilyEverAfter

Originally posted by Office 4256

Originally posted by kozmo

Youre counting on their being a response by our military personnel against us?
I agree we are not in 1776, yet those in 1776 werent in 1492 either.

I actually like your signature, and, to be honest, it seems to go against your post, and has me a little confused.

I am nothing if not a realist. I've seen "people's wars" on three continents, and ideology is never the determining factor - training, weapons and money are. As far as my signature goes, I guess despotism is in the eyes of the beholder. Some will judge America on some idealized past that never actually occured. The only way to properly evaluate our government today is to compare it to other governments that exist today. I am a total believer in Realpolitik, and you would probably call me a statist, although I don't self-identify as one.