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5 most important factors behind the UFO phenomenon

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posted on Feb, 21 2010 @ 01:02 PM
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Here are the 5 most important factors or propositions regarding the UFO phenomenon, according to Dr. Jacques Vallee who, in my opinion, is the world's foremost authority on UFOs.

(QUOTE) (from his acclaimed book, DIMENSIONS)


1. The things we call unidentified flying objects are neither objects nor flying. They can materialize, as some reliable photographs seem to show, and they violate the laws of motion as we know them.

2. UFOs have been seen throughout history and have consistently received (or provided) their own explanation within the framework of each culture. In antiquity their occupants were regarded as gods; in medieval times, as magicians; in the nineteenth century, as scientific geniuses; in our own time, as interplanetary travelers. (Statements made by occupants of the 1897 airship included such declarations as "We are from Kansas" and even "We are from anywhere.....but we'll be in Greece tomorrow.")

3. UFO reports are not necessarily caused by visits from space travelers. The phenomenon could be a manifestation of a much more complex technology. If time and space are not as simple in structure as physicists have assumed until now, then the question "Where do they come from?" may be meaningless; they could come from a place in time. If consciousness can be manifested outside the body, then the range of hypotheses can be even wider.

4. The key to an understanding of the phenomenon lies in the psychic effects it produces (or the psychic awareness it makes possible) in its observers. Their lives are often deeply changed, and they develop unusual talents with which they may find it difficult to cope. The proportion of witnesses who do come forward and publish accounts of these experiences is quite low; most of them choose to remain silent.

5. Contact between human percipients and the UFO phenomenon always occurs under conditions controlled by the latter. Its characteristic feature is a factor of absurdity that leads to a rejection of the story by the upper layers of the target society and an absorption at a deep unconscious level of the symbols conveyed by the encounter. The mechanism of this resonance between the UFO symbol and the archetypes of the human unconscious has been abundantly demonstrated by Carl Jung, whose book FLYING SAUCERS makes many references to the age-old significance of the signs in the sky.


(UNQUOTE)

I am in total agreement.

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[edit on 21/2/2010 by ArMaP]




posted on Feb, 21 2010 @ 01:59 PM
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I preach about number three quite often.

Mostly because we do not, under any circumstances, have a perfect grasp on science. We do not know everything, and anyone into quantum theory will tell you we have just scratched the surface when it comes to most science.

That is why we still have incurable diseases. That is why we cannot travel beyond our solar system. That is why we cannot cure mental illness. The answer lies beyond what we are capable of. The answer will not come from a major breakthrough. It is a constant building of knowledge. And we have only been around X number of years. Out of the X number of years we have existed, we have only RECORDED our knowledge for Y number of years.

Now, if we truly do not understand most science, then it is more than possible that anything...and I mean anything....is possible. More so, it is PROBABLE.

We just dont know it yet.



posted on Feb, 21 2010 @ 02:03 PM
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Thanks for posting the OP. It is amazing how many people have never considered this possibility. It may be due to many not reading the classic UFO books in our MTV era.

T

[edit on 21-2-2010 by Tiger5]



posted on Feb, 21 2010 @ 02:34 PM
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Originally posted by Norio Hayakawa
Here are the 5 most important factors or propositions regarding the UFO phenomenon, according to Dr. Jacques Vallee who, in my opinion, is the world's foremost authority on UFOs.

(UNQUOTE)

I am in total agreement.



These five points made by Dr. Vallee also summarizes my personal belief on the entire UFO phenomenon.
This is the reason, in my opinion, why there will be no DISCLOSURE by the governments.
Sure, any government call release ALL their files on UFO sightings.
But simply releasing the files on UFO sightings will do absolutely nothing unless they are explained to the public. The public will clamor for an explanation of what UFOs are.
The government can only explain things in terms of physical, solid, tangible, empiral evidences. The government will not explain things in terms of the paranormal or religious manifestations. They are not in that business.
This is why DISCLOSURE (if there will be such a thing) will only come from the entities themselves or from a paradigm-shifted mankind (which still has not happened yet).
Some people believe that a change in people's worldview or beliefs systems or paradigm will suddenly or gradually begin from December 21, 2012. We will have to wait and see if that is so.

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posted on Feb, 21 2010 @ 02:44 PM
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reply to post by Norio Hayakawa
 
Vallee brought a great deal of credibility to the subject of UFOs. Despite this, I feel that he developed a tendency to spiritualise the phenomena and talk with certainty where 'possibility' was more appropriate.

Take the assertion that UFOs have been seen in our skies throughout history. Possibly, not certainly. I often see blanket statements that they've been known for up to 50, 000 years...how? Cave paintings and myths aren't conclusive...they lend themselves to interpretation. How were bolide meteors identified prior to the middle ages? Ezekiel's wheels again, open to interpretation.

'Neither objects or flying?' Again, he's definitive. 20th Century reports often are explicit in their descriptions of some UFOs being physical, 'nuts n bolts' objects and flying.

A good guy, but he could have been clearer that he was expressing opinions and speculation.



posted on Feb, 21 2010 @ 02:44 PM
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These five points made by Dr. Vallee also summarizes my personal belief on the entire UFO phenomenon.
This is the reason, in my opinion, why there will be no DISCLOSURE by the governments.
Sure, any government call release ALL their files on UFO sightings.
But simply releasing the files on UFO sightings will do absolutely nothing unless they are explained to the public.

..................................................................................

Yep, here we go again with governments releasing documents, so what, just more sightings.

I keep saying it here at ATS, FORGET THE SIGHTINGS, THE COVER UP
IS WHERE THE CONSPIRACY IS.



posted on Feb, 21 2010 @ 02:45 PM
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3. UFO reports are not necessarily caused by visits from space travelers. The phenomenon could be a manifestation of a much more complex technology.


Oh yeah... It may not be aliens, it may be time travlers lol. You know whaT? It may be dragons and unicorns too.



posted on Feb, 21 2010 @ 03:08 PM
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Originally posted by zaiger
Oh yeah... It may not be aliens, it may be time travlers lol. You know whaT? It may be dragons and unicorns too.


Take any technology out of its historical context and a case could be made for unicorns and dragons.

400 hundred yeas ago, if I was to tell an average peasant, "Hey come here and look how these alchemists have grown a man's ear on the back of a rat." And them tell him the next day that they put it on the man who lost an ear in battle. What do you suppose the peasant would think and say? "You're in league with unicorns and dragons!"

You mock ideas that try to squeeze technology beyond our comprehension into our everyday context. There's no proof that the technology down the road or from another planet or dimension, couldn't make an appearance here in our now. If Einstein found it worth while to invest his time into the in and outs,of time travel who are we to dismiss it to the unicorns and dragons. Unless of course you are a physics savant keeping company with the Hawkings of the world.



posted on Feb, 21 2010 @ 03:35 PM
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reply to post by sparrowstail
 


Well said and leaves no room for me to expand upon.
Mockery is a juvenile manner and I thank you for brandishing such eloquence in your response.

Spirituality used as a fulcrum in the UFO phenomenon tends to get a lot of negative response as well. The greatest thinkers of our history have constantly linked science and spirituality. Approaching this subject without being armed by this knowledge, or at the very least acknowledging a legitimate relevance of spirituality, would also be juvenile.

b



posted on Feb, 21 2010 @ 04:38 PM
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reply to post by Bspiracy
 


What I find interesting is that on so many accounts of ET interactions /remote viewing, etc. whether true or not, "They" have a tendency of emphasizing our spirituality and how we need to grow in those capacities. This seems to be a frequently occurring characteristic whenever there is communication. I guess we really do need work as I'm sure a prerequisite for joining the other advanced/interstellar societies is co-existing as a species without violence, rampant crime, and colossal injustice.

I am a firm believer of the yin and the yang or polarity of the universe, it can be observed and quantified quite easily, and how this obviously is the case with our experience and brain hemispheres.

My question then is how much of our reality and it's interpretation is based on the physical and how much is based on the spiritual? It seems to me that these two are way out of balance. So much so that the term spirituality can't seem to enter rational conversation without raising "kook alarms" or the old "giggle slide" . I think we will find one day that the two are interrelated and each are co dependent on the another. The greatest achievement of science will be fully understanding our spirituality and vice versa.

p.s Thanks for your kind words.

sparrow



[edit on 21-2-2010 by sparrowstail]



posted on Feb, 21 2010 @ 06:07 PM
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reply to post by sparrowstail
 




You mock ideas that try to squeeze technology beyond our comprehension

Beyond our comprehension??? That is just an excuse to squeeze any theory that is not based on facts into the mix. Unicorns and dragons are beyond your comprehension that is why you do not understand it.



There's no proof that the technology down the road or from another planet or dimension, couldn't make an appearance here in our now. If Einstein found it worth while to invest his time into the in and outs,of time travel who are we to dismiss it to the unicorns and dragons. Unless of course you are a physics savant keeping company with the Hawkings of the world.


There is no proof that UFOs are not unicorns and dragons either. You can dismiss my unicorns and dragons claim but there is no more proof of UFOs being time travlers than there is of UFOs being unicorns.



posted on Feb, 21 2010 @ 06:20 PM
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reply to post by sparrowstail
 

I see it as thus:
Spirituality and Science are directly related and are both parts in the culmination of reality IMO. Reality will still exist without someone recognizing Science or recognizing Spirituality.

Example. Tribes of the amazon long rooted in spirituality only progress so far. In the same manner as someone who has lost their left leg they only hop so far or go so high up the side of an embankment.

Same goes for science. The recent times show a lot of people have chopped of their RIGHT leg of spirituality but they still hop right along and act like it doesn't matter.

This is what I mean by the union of science and spirituality. With both legs we can run into the future and jump over the next embankment which may possibly have someone standing on the other side saying "GREAT JUMP" now lets take a stroll..

I definitely agree there needs to be a balance because not only do you need both legs to run and jump, but they also need to be relatively the same length.

b



posted on Feb, 21 2010 @ 07:18 PM
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Originally posted by zaiger
reply to post by sparrowstail
 




You mock ideas that try to squeeze technology beyond our comprehension

Beyond our comprehension??? That is just an excuse to squeeze any theory that is not based on facts into the mix. Unicorns and dragons are beyond your comprehension that is why you do not understand it.



There's no proof that the technology down the road or from another planet or dimension, couldn't make an appearance here in our now. If Einstein found it worth while to invest his time into the in and outs,of time travel who are we to dismiss it to the unicorns and dragons. Unless of course you are a physics savant keeping company with the Hawkings of the world.


There is no proof that UFOs are not unicorns and dragons either. You can dismiss my unicorns and dragons claim but there is no more proof of UFOs being time travlers than there is of UFOs being unicorns.


Yeah I know, but I'm not the one who took issue with the op's content.
Why are you here talking about the "Gospel according to Proof" with the words UFO and Phenomenon in the title of the thread? It's not like the ufo board comes with a money back proof guarantee.

It seems that your use of fantasy based critters is an attempt to demean not to make any sort of valid claim except that of mastering the obvious. If there was all this proof you speak of then there probably wouldn't be a conspiracy thread dedicated to it would there?

But now were talking about unicorns and dragons. Well done great contribution to furthering the discussion. If you find this so ridiculous why associate yourself with it unless just to lob dragon and unicorn grenades?

What are your thoughts on the whole field of Ufology? Are there any good cases out there?? Or are you a "Don't bother me with the facts, I've already made up my mind" kind of guy?

[edit on 21-2-2010 by sparrowstail]



posted on Feb, 21 2010 @ 07:33 PM
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reply to post by Bspiracy
 


Nice analogy with the legs. I guess the key will be how do we balance the two? How do we cultivate the harmony that should exist with our duality. In this world of competition and immediate survival, combined with the constant bombardment of false media propaganda, anything that borders on abstract thought is deemed superfluous, useless, or hoaky. As if our current state of affairs couldn't improve any!

[edit on 21-2-2010 by sparrowstail]



posted on Feb, 22 2010 @ 12:17 AM
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reply to post by sparrowstail
 



Or are you a "Don't bother me with the facts, I've already made up my mind" kind of guy?

No.... I was pointing out that there are NO facts that point to UFOs being time travlers.



What are your thoughts on the whole field of Ufology?

That UFOlogy would stand 1/2 a chance to be recognized as a legitimate studdy if it was not for the people that tie in made up nonsense like:
UFOs are time travlers
UFOs are light beings from the __th dimension
we need to attune to the ____consciousness to blah blah blah

I have no prblem with the facts about UFOlogy what i have a problem with is when people try to sneak their made up BS and unfounded theories.



posted on Feb, 22 2010 @ 05:35 AM
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reply to post by zaiger
 


Time traveling? or dimension shifting? not sure it's another theory (it's in the gray basket) but there is a large body of research that is trying to explain or theorize how some ufo's simply appear then disappear. Especially the tether incident how they show up then disappear as if moving through space and time according to some other set of laws.

I guess dimension shifting or time travel seems to fit for some due to the lack of any other rational explanation except some sort of cloaking technology.



posted on Feb, 22 2010 @ 09:27 AM
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reply to post by Kandinsky
 


"Vallee brought a great deal of credibility to the subject of UFOs. Despite this, I feel that he developed a tendency to spiritualise the phenomena and talk with certainty where 'possibility' was more appropriate."

You may be interested in following your thread just to see the way your words have been used.

I get what you mean but as usual I must ask how many of the poster have actually red Valee. Your comments really cause me no issue but just look at the number of poster who have not red Valee???

Anyway if I were to rephase your use of the word spirituality thus:

Teh essence of the UFO phenomena that Vallee was writing about was effectively a mystical expereince that occured under an alternate state of awareness. Alternate states of awareness are populalrly called trances...

The bulk of the genuine UFO experiences seem to occur under such a state. We should remember that psychic entites can leave physical evidence behind.

Valee wrote before temporal lobe seizures had been discovered.

Anyway I do not believe the ET hypothesis. I am a Sci fi buff and would love to believe but for me there is no proof.

The world is a poorer place without ETs but there we go.

T



posted on Feb, 22 2010 @ 10:27 AM
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Originally posted by Norio Hayakawa
Here are the 5 most important factors or propositions regarding the UFO phenomenon, according to Dr. Jacques Vallee who, in my opinion, is the world's foremost authority on UFOs.

(QUOTE) (from his acclaimed book, DIMENSIONS)


1. The things we call unidentified flying objects are neither objects nor flying.

I cannot believe this statement. A)if they are not 'objects' then what term would be appropriate? To my mind any thing which exists can be objectified, right from innanimate matter to human beings. It happens all the time!
B) They arent flying? Ok, then lets hear what they are doing? They are certainly occupying the places between the ground and the edge of the sky , I cant really see why the distinction is worth making. The point still stands that the UFO which are sighted by pilots seem to have manouvres and speed which outmatch anything we here on earth are at present capable of. Wether the technical description of 'flying' is correctly applied or not, seems of little import when the available facts seem to suggest that objects which return a radar signal, have been recorded by the military in the past, at speeds up to and maybe exceeding 26,000 kph, executing moves which would kill a human pilot in an instant. Perhaps the quoted expert is technicaly correct that these things do not use aerodynamism for thier travel. I think he is wrong to make a smart aleccy deal out of it though.



. If time and space are not as simple in structure as physicists have assumed until now, then the question "Where do they come from?" may be meaningless; they could come from a place in time.

Just for the sake of clarity , scientists have never suggested , or assumed that time and space are in ANY WAY simple in structure, behavior, or by any other measure by which they can be examined. While I agree that theres a chance that UFO and the things inside of them could well be from another dimension, or area of time and space I cannot allow the suggestion that time and space are simple structures to go unchecked. Its a ridiculous suggestion, and its utterly false to even imply such a thing.


[edit on 22-2-2010 by TrueBrit]





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