The energy that is used to write these threads that express the displeasure of the alleged hate and persecution towards the wonderful UNchrist-like Christians, could be much better spent in creating a thread that attempts to present a more convincing argument to support your set of beliefs then that from the Bible. The Bible is simply a book written by man, CLAIMING, CLAIMING! to be inspired by a divine being which is FILLED with an alarming amount of contradictions, and absolute absurdities mixed with violence, murder, rape, sexism, racism etc, etc, etc. Spending the energy to open threads where your faith can be supported by ANYTHING, ANYTHING! other than such a book of absolute failure would be a much better option to try to convince others that the faith is nothing more than fairy-tale. Just some courteous advice.

here is the contradiction. God created a being that has free will, God also understands pain, torture, etc...God created beings to be tortured endlessly without hope of ever getting back into the good graces of God.

Originally posted by randyvs

Explain to me how the morning star became satan while having no free will.

reply to post by SaturnFX

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The answer is simple, you don't know anything about which you speak.
Because the Angels obviously have free will too. What makes you think they don't ?

"Bless the LORD, ye his angels, that excel in strength, that do his commandments, hearkening unto the voice of his word. Bless ye the LORD, all ye his hosts; ye ministers of his, that do his pleasure."

Personal. Jesus" oh noes the world is ending. It's a ploy, a cheap ploy to sell cds and tickets. But from a song writers point of view, it speaks to that age where we are all trying to find that one thing that is above all. Not necessarily above all celestial things, but your love...i hope that helps.

God is a being of perfection...God hates sin also coincidently.

God created man with free will...Angels are his servants, but Man is special because of this free will stuff he has.

Explain to me how the morning star became satan while having no free will

It is impossible, therefore God meant to create Satan for the specific purpose of being who/what he is.

Now, this means that Gods plan with these free willed things was to give them two paths, one to him, the other to Satan.

here is the contradiction. God created a being that has free will, God also understands pain, torture, etc...God created beings to be tortured endlessly without hope of ever getting back into the good graces of God.

Therefore, God is, by his action, evil. The bible states a good and merciful God, but what good and merciful anything creates torture camps for endlessly torturing people whom didnt follow your rules? I dont care if he/she/it gave all but a single person heavenly bliss...to specifically design a system that allows for such actions is simply evil.

Therefore...God is evil, because he is perfect and he knew this would happen with the creation...to bring something conscious into existance only for a eternity of pain, suffering, and endless death.

If Hell exists, then God is evil, if Hell doesn't exist, then there is no biblical God (because the bible refers to it quite alot)

That's the god I'd believe in.

1.Most "churches" have tax numbers and are therefore about one thing....money.

2. If a church doesnt have a tax number its most likely a cult or some other type of extremist org.

.All "God" based religions are based on what some guy or gal said that "God" told them. (aka divine revelation)

.Besides basics such as there was indeed a city named Sodom, no historic details of the bible can be proven beyond a shadow of a doubt. (no witnesses)

5.Just because an instance touches you and becomes your "God" speaking, ie, the beautiful sky or a yearling deer nursing in the meadow, doesnt mean its actaually diety speaking to you through one of its wonderous creations, just means you thought it was nice and chose to show reverance to it by giving it a label.

How much more sinister could a ruling class be? Control society through the promise of eternal reward, and if that doesnt work, tell them if they dont believe, they will go to HELLLL! And along the way "render to Ceasars what is Ceasars" even though I never thought that verse was telling believers that they had to pay taxes, I thought it was this Jesus character being sarcastic. When he saw the face of ceasar on the coin as pointed out by someone trying to get out of paying taxes, jesus was simply saying this is just a thing , and hey look its got a picture of Ceasar on it so it must be his, give it back to him. Ive read some of the KJB and you know all it ever caused me was pain. The pain of knowing the truth and being forced to act like I didnt. So I burned the one thing my grndmother left me when she passed away, A leatherbound King James Bible full of handwritten notes and highlights she had accumulated over 30 years of study. I failed to accomplish the burning once because someone stopped me. Of course they tried to save it so they coud give it back to me when I came to my senses, and they did. Guess what? As soon as they gave it back to me I did it right, soaked the thing in 10w40 and sparked it up right in my living room fireplace. Stunk up the entire neighborhood. Now no-one will ever be able to read her interperatation of the biggest lie ever perpetrated by man ..ever. They can figure it out for themselves, just like Im sure she did before the end.