do certain people have a more direct conection to God? I am seeing proof some do.

Originally posted by lifecitizen
And I hope you haven't forked out for health insurance?

I mean, why bother if you can pray and your wifes prayers are answered?

No that's just plain stupid.

Prayer does not divorce a person from the natural world...
...it just engages them with it in a different way.

You are a physical being...
...and the world is full of cures not all known or supported by medical science...
...and who better to solve a biological issue than the Spirit?

We solved a life-threatening illness by being directed to utilize the best of medical diagnostics and natural threatments.

Originally posted by troubleshooter

Originally posted by lifecitizen
And I hope you haven't forked out for health insurance?

I mean, why bother if you can pray and your wifes prayers are answered?

No that's just plain stupid.

Prayer does not divorce a person from the natural world...
...it just engages them with it in a different way.

You are a physical being...
...and the world is full of cures not all known or supported by medical science...
...and who better to solve a biological issue than the Spirit?

We solved a life-threatening illness by being directed to utilize the best of medical diagnostics and natural threatments.

uh huh

so what does god have against amputees?- they can pray till the cows come home but they won't get a new limb

Does he just not like them?

Originally posted by winotka
"Proof"-

I am friends with a woman who is shown by the Holy Spirit if someone is having a boy or a girl before they have an ultrasound.

I have that ability, too. Very strange. A feeling comes over you and you know, then you say what the gender of the child is going to be.

Thanks for the OP…it’s quite inspiring (it’s always encouraging to hear about the miraculous).

It's not just self-fulfiling prophecy. It's beyond the "subjective reality".

Coincidence no. Sincronicity maybe.

Your wife seems to know conciously or unconciously the rules of the game and live by them.

Originally posted by lifecitizen

Originally posted by troubleshooter

Originally posted by lifecitizen
And I hope you haven't forked out for health insurance?

I mean, why bother if you can pray and your wifes prayers are answered?

No that's just plain stupid.

Prayer does not divorce a person from the natural world...
...it just engages them with it in a different way.

You are a physical being...
...and the world is full of cures not all known or supported by medical science...
...and who better to solve a biological issue than the Spirit?

We solved a life-threatening illness by being directed to utilize the best of medical diagnostics and natural threatments.

uh huh

so what does god have against amputees?- they can pray till the cows come home but they won't get a new limb

Does he just not like them?

God probably loves them. Seems you don't.

Who said that being an amputee is "bad"?

God's logic is not man's logic.

Originally posted by crsb123
She honeslty loves and cares for others.

that's the reason why...
for your wife and all others who seem to be directly plugged into GOD.

everyone CAN be
but not everyone IS

many who seem very devoted to their religion are farther from the divine than some who society might deem as "undesirable" or even "sinners."

WHY?

John 14:20-24

specifically, verse 23:

Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.

Jesus said that the ones who kept his commandments are those who love him, and his commandments are simple:

LOVE GOD
LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF

that's all that's required.
no meditation, no cleansing, no fasting, no religious participation

just LOVE
plain old simple brotherly love

sounds easy but obviously not everyone's doing it!

Originally posted by lifecitizen

Originally posted by troubleshooter

Originally posted by lifecitizen
And I hope you haven't forked out for health insurance?

I mean, why bother if you can pray and your wifes prayers are answered?

No that's just plain stupid.

Prayer does not divorce a person from the natural world...
...it just engages them with it in a different way.

You are a physical being...
...and the world is full of cures not all known or supported by medical science...
...and who better to solve a biological issue than the Spirit?

We solved a life-threatening illness by being directed to utilize the best of medical diagnostics and natural threatments.

uh huh

so what does god have against amputees?- they can pray till the cows come home but they won't get a new limb

Does he just not like them?

You are a disability bigot then.

I have had a disability since 1996...
...bit rough for the first three years...
...but I have a life now I could have only dreamed of.

Originally posted by bowlbyville

Thanks for the OP…it’s quite inspiring (it’s always encouraging to hear about the miraculous).

Thank you. I posted this to hear other experiences, share with others and I enjoy other opinions.


I am not sure why some prayers are answered. I have seen healing, that could not be explained by a doctor. We could pray for a million dollars and it would never materialize. I do believe what is important to us is not necessarily important to God.

Parents pray for dying children and they are not answered. Or not the answer we are looking for.

I have learned one thing about prayer, many times we pray for the wrong thing. Instead of praying for a solution to my problem, I ask God to let my problem glorify him and that he may use me to show someone else his love or his true will.

Simple. Some people know how to pray, others do not. When you pray, never pray as if you do not have. Pray as if it is already accomplished.

Originally posted by SpeakerofTruth
Simple. Some people know how to pray, others do not. When you pray, never pray as if you do not have. Pray as if it is already accomplished.

This is true. The prayers are more of a thankfulness and awe than a despration or need. God is glorified and his name lifted up. When you read the Lords prayer it has a distinct pattern.

An acknowledgement of God, and that his will be done. The requests of the lords prayer are simple. Give us our daily bread and forgivness, deliverence from temptation and evil. The prayer finishes with another acknowledgement of Gods power.

Hi CSRB --

I think the so-called 'Lord's Prayer's original 'contents' (i.e. subject matter) are not fully known from the Greek texts that have been handed down to us in the so-called canonically approved 'Greek Gospels' and we certainly do not have any recrords of what other prayers this R. Yehoshua bar Yosef person used or condoned for usage by his disciples during his lifetime in Roman Occupied Palestine.

The 'Prayer' seems to have had originally a larger focus on the COMING OF THE KINGDOM (which seems for political reasons (can you say ROMAN EMPIRE and the RULING DIVINE EMPERORS?) was excised down to a nub in the versions in the Greek canonical Gospels) to basically a single explicit phrase:

('May your kingdom come') -

Jews of all stripes even today often pray along similar lines with a 'fuller' version of the idea: "May the Holy One of Yisro'el, Blessed be He, establish his KINGDOM in your lifetime and my lifetime...').

You seemed to have missed any reference to the KINGDOM in your post when mentioning the elements of the 'Prayer' but it seems to have been a 'core' message which also was partially-retained by the mangled ending tacked on to it in the 1st canonical Greek Gospel - and these Kingdom references which are crucial to a fuller understanding of the earliest Kerygma proclamations of the Bar Enasha and 'the Kingdom of Heaven /Kingdom of God' which allegedly formed the core of the teaching of the 'Good Rebbe' .

The reference is clearly from one of the 'key' Aramaic Sections of the Book of the Scroll of the Prophet Daniel chapter 7:13-14 :

“And in my Visions of the Night, I looked and behold I saw: lo, one like a Bar-Enasha ('Son of Man') - and he was moving towards me riding on the clouds of Heaven, and as began to approach The Ancient of Days, and they brought him before his face(s). And there was given him POWER and GLORY and a KINGDOM in order that all the goyim, even all people and languages should bow down before his face(s) : and his POWER is EVERLASTING, and his KINGDOM shall never be overthrown.”

Being a Daviddic pretender 'in the last days' awaiting the restoration of the 'tabernacle of David which has fallen' to replace 'that Cowering-Jackal Herod' the idea of Kingship ('the Vine of YHWH') was central to the original message of Nazorean Christianity, though curiously missing from most of Pauline doctrine in terms of actual focus.

The larger problem with using the 'Lord's Prayer' as an exemplar of anything a Christain should believ is that the text is mangled and truncated from what appears to have been a much longer prayer.

If you read the two versions of the 'Prayer' that can be partially found in the 2 canonical Greek gospels that bother to retain the 'prayer' at all, you will see that both versions in the Greek are slightly different from each other i.e. by comparing the version in the 1st Greek canonical gospel ('according to Matthew', whoever he was) and the 3rd ('according to Luke' whoever he was)...

In BOTH cases the endings seem to have been doctored to remove any reference to YHWH the clan god of Israel--retaining only references to Abba (or Father).

Have a quick dekko at the 2 contradictory endings to the 'Prayer':

'And Lead Us NOT into the Time of Trial [which is to come] but DELIVER us from BELIAL'

(the 3rd gospel ends here; the 1st canonical Greek Gospel adds:

"FOR Thine in the Kingdom and the Power and the Glory for ever..." &tc.

One should be able to see at once that the 'ending' tacked on to the version in the 1st canonical Greek Gospel hs been slightly doctored gramatically (by ommission) since it opens with a PREPOSITION without an ANTECEDENT:

One cannot begin a whole NEW sentence in Aramaic or Greek with the concept of 'FOR' or 'BECAUSE' - only FOLLOW UP on a PREVIOUS phrase with FOR or BECAUSE ('I like him BECAUSE he has wavy black hair...').

If you read e.g. the parallel ending in the Prayer of Solomon in 1 Chronicles 29:10-13 you can see immediately what part is actually being excised :

BLESSED ART THOU O YHWH THE CLAN GOD OF ISRAEL, FOR THINE IS THE KINGDOM AND THE POWER AND THE GLORY etc.

The same thing happens in a garbled mis-translation quotation from 'The Scroll of the Book of the Testaments of the 12 Patriarchs being the Sons of Yirsro'el to all the Sons of Light in the Last Days' found amongst the garbled fragments of the Dead Sea Scrolls we manage still to possess (that the bat dung didn't eat through in their caves ! )and written about 160 BCE, specifically the Testament of Naphtali, 9:13

'In that Day the Salvation of Israel shall come from the Judaeans' which is garbled in the 4th canonical gospel ('according to John,' whoever he was)

Note how deliberately the reference specifically to ISRAEL is ommitted from the quotation placed into the mouth of the Greek Speaking Iesous in the 4th gospel : the editors were VERY CAREFUL about making sure their Greek Speaking Saviour was UNIVERSAL.

John 4:21: "And Iesous said to her...You Samaratim are used to worshipping that which you do not understand: we (Judaeans) worship what we do understand, for Salvation is of the Jews."

He was clearly using the citation (introduced by "for") of the Testament of Naphtali as a proof-text to back up his assertion that the salvation of the north (Yisroel) shall come from the south (Judaea)...

The same procedure is at work in BOTH versions of the 'garbled' Lord's Prayer in the 2 Greek gospels that quote it (differently).

So you can see from these small examples that we do not have a lot of hard information about the original teaching of the 'Aramaic speaking founder of Christianity' since all we seem to have document wise are Greek translations from originally oral (and highly coded) Aramaic streams of traditions which morphed over time into different 'Christianities', (e.g. the Ebionim, founded by some of the actual disciples) many of whom were diametrically opposed to Pauline Gentile Loving 'Greek speaking' Christianities scattered in Greek port cities in the Empire which more or less survived intact the 1st (failed) Jewish War against Rome (AD 66-72) being as it were safely tucked away in the Diaspora.

Just thought I point a few things out this AM...





[edit on 9-2-2010 by Sigismundus]

Originally posted by troubleshooter

Originally posted by crsb123
I have witnessed over the past 18 years my wifes prayers answered with incredible results. She is a Christian. She leads a womans bible study, attends Church, Prays multiple times daily. She honeslty loves and cares for others. I believe she prays and is convicted by the holy spirit. She takes her prayer time seriouly and even fasts before prayer. Her friends jokingly call he prayers the '30 minute prayers' because some have been answered in as little as 30 minutes. I am always the skeptic on most subjects, but having seen this for myself repeatedly I am convinced that some are more conected to God than others.

Have you had any simular experiences?

I will share some expmples if you are interested in them.

Jesus said, "Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me." Revelation 3:20

The Spirit surrounds everyone like the atmosphere...
...but most refuse to breath.

I do not think that is the point of that Bible verse, I think Jesus literally went around knocking on people's doors trying to eat dinner with them.

That's an easy way to get a free meal...

reply to post by crsb123


I enjoyed reading about your wife and the power of prayer, also another member here wrote a nice piece on prayer.

I know prayer can bring about miracles from God, I've experienced it. There is the seen and the unseen, and God knows both. I have had prayers answered too, w/o a doubt, but your wife sounds like a saint, praying for others like that. What a great person she must be.

hello,Iam new here but, would like to state that it is odd that some people expect GOD to heal amputees, my personal belief is that there is definately a GOD and son JESUS CHRIST and it only takes looking at the proof to realize that! I believe GOD HAS hIS own ideas about how things are suppose to work not left up to the bumbling fools

I would like to say that if you feel that JESUS needed a handout and needed for food handouts you need se- rious prayer for you !; I feel and know that JESUS most gave all and did not come to beg for food!

With regards to the question about healing amputees.....

Have you ever considered that your situation, unique as it is, may be exactly the lesson God wants you to learn?

Everyone has difficulties in life, and I'm certainly not trying to downplay the struggle an amputee goes through. However, I do wonder why you seem to regard it as a "curse" (emphasis mine).

Perhaps the true power of prayer is that it changes our perception of life? Allows us to realize that despite our troubles and imperfections, life can still be enjoyed?

Personally I don't know if people have certain people have a direct connection with god or not.

I do think that some people have the ability to affect reality in subtle and not so subtle ways. Henry Ford said, "If you think you can do a thing or think you can't do a thing, you're right." And look at what he was able to accomplish.

Personally I've done a few things that probably shouldn't be possible to do. And I've done them by sheer force of will. Others might call it prayer.

Out of curiosity. Does your wife seem to be like a magnet that attracts strange occurences to her? Both positive and negative? And she has the ability to do things out of the ordinary?

I think that some of us on this planet seem to have more "gravity" than others and things just seem to be attracted to certain people than would be normal. And on the same token have the ability to do things that normal people can't do.

reply to post by crsb123

She leads a womans bible study, attends Church,

It never ceases to amaze me when people claim to be involved in bible study, what utterly misleading drivel.

I have in the past invited myself along to a few "bible study" groups (elder moo, brother moo) and all they are is a bunch of deluded people with no idea what the hell the bibles are on about, having the more senior deluded saying things like "ah what jesus actually meant was ---" and talking all manner of bollocks.

I tend to find that xtians are more often than not afraid to really "study" the bibles as this would require critical thinking which conflicts with "faith".

More often than not, people that really study the bibles (eg their history and veracity of the claims made etc) tend to become atheists.


The minute you start studying the bibles with an open mind you immediately detect BS and superstition.

Up till this moment in time I've yet to meet or speak to an xtian that didn't believe the bibles are true "before" they actually read anything let alone conduct a through investigative study, what a completely deluded group of people.

reply to post by infobrazil

Who said that being an amputee is "bad"?

The dude what has to drag his ass in the carpet to wipe it did, what utter ignorant arrogant thinking.

Anyone who could look a 20 year old active live loving young sportsman with a broken neck in the eye and make silly claims like it's the jesusyahwhe gods' way of teaching you lesson, is nothing but a thumb sucking pinhead that should immediately trade places.

If you truly believed your god heals the sick you would not need a doctor.

If you truly believed your god answers you prayers you would not need health insurance nor pharmaceuticals.

Why does your god not heal amputees ? Simply because he is imaginary.