Originally posted by whatukno

To me it means that there is something wrong with this country. I have always been taught that there is no such thing as a free lunch. I have always been taught that the way to success is through hard work and determination. I have always been taught that if you do something you love, the money will follow. Lies all of them, but the concept is good, and it made this country one of the greatest countries in the world. But has America lost it's way? Have we given up on the American dream and seek not to better ourselves, but to wait for the bailout?

The problem with America is that you believe the dream that is sold.



Tell all of the above to the elites that put down those who work hard on great new ideas that are destroyed to protect what the eiltes have. They will laugh.
Tell the elites there is no fee lunch after they all got bailed out by the Gov. and the fed. whilst the average hard working freedom loving citizen saw the value of their homes tank, their investments dwindle and their jobs go. again the elites chuckle.
Tell the Elites that the only way to succeed is hard work and they will throw a cheque book at you that they call hard work, but buys what they need done, like electing Presidents, Buying Networks, Invading Countries and destroying opposition.


America has not given up on the dream, it is realizing that it is one big lie told by the few to control the many. The same dream you dwell in debt for, that you consume endlessly for.......that you will idolize presidents, both parties, your armies and your country for.
That is why 36% think socialism is o.k.
The dream is no longer about ME, it is becoming about WE.


Star and Flag 4 the concern evident in your disposition.

[edit on 6-2-2010 by Derised Emanresu]

What percentage of Americans actually know what socialism is?

That shouldve been the first question

I just don't believe that even 33% of Americans have an accurate picture of what socialism is.

Look at the first response where communism/marxism/socialism is compared... Any European must have laughing fits reading such bull#...

Why would Americans know what Socialism is? The last proponents of non-centrist Socialism in the USA stem from the late 20's and 30's.

But whatukno has a point. Americans, in general, are far less reactionary than they are made out to be. At least you give them a choice ( and if they don't expect the world to collapse tomorrow) that is so....

Originally posted by whatukno
I in a sense am pretty liberal. But I don't like those figures, I am not a fan of socialism. I think that if you want or need something, the best way to get it is to work for it.

And it is being worked for. The "welfare queen" myth is just that - a myth. There ls also the fact that because some people abuse the system, does not mean the system itself is bad. There are people who abuse our legal system, would you say that we should avoid even having a legal system because of them? of course not (At least, I hope not).

To me it means that there is something wrong with this country. I have always been taught that there is no such thing as a free lunch. I have always been taught that the way to success is through hard work and determination. I have always been taught that if you do something you love, the money will follow. Lies all of them, but the concept is good, and it made this country one of the greatest countries in the world.

Wait, what? Seriously, what? "I was lied to, everything I listed is false, but it still makes us great"?

Man, that's not true! if anything these myths make us MORE miserable, MORE stressed, sicker, and give us LESS incentive to do our best. it leads us to a blame the victim mentality, even if we're the victim, ourselves.

You know that there's no truth to the whole "Anyone can be a billionaire if they work hard and are determined!" You know that. When people work hard and throw all their determination into their work and STILL don't "make it" the response from you - and themselves! - is that that person is defective. That something is wrong with them, that despite everything, they DESERVE poverty, they DESERVE to be unhealthy, they DESERVE to be homeless, they DESERVE to spend 16 hours a day busting their butts for nothing. And after a while, you swallow the bitter pill that yup, you're worthless, you'll never "make it" so why keep trying?

A happy lie is still a lie, and all lies are harmful. Even little lies about santa clause make your kid go "Well, what ELSE are you lying to me about?"

But has America lost it's way? Have we given up on the American dream and seek not to better ourselves, but to wait for the bailout?

Hate to break it to you but a move towards socialist policies WOULD better America. It would elevate our quality of life, it would stabilize our economy, and it would reduce poverty. Would it be a utopia? 'course not. But it would be an improvement on the predatory, exploitative state we have now.

[edit on 6-2-2010 by TheWalkingFox]

My view is that liberals (true liberals) and conservatives (true conservatives) both want the same thing. Freedom.

A conservative minded person doesn't wish to see a person poor any more than a liberal minded person. A lot of the separation of views just comes from where the help is derived. This is also why the country on a whole is largely middle of the road with slight conservative principles.

Most do not want a far-left country nor a far-right country. Upheaval sets in when the pendulum swings too far in either direction. As of late (past 15 or so years, the politicians in Washington have been trying there hardest to figure out ways to swing it in either direction fully.

Originally posted by brainwrek
What percentage of Americans actually know what socialism is?

That shouldve been the first question

Typical American pro-Socialism:

"Everything will be free. Free food, housing, car, air conditioning, healthcare, guaranteed job where I can sit and play solitaire all day on my free iMac."

Only technology can make liberals and conservatives happy. Eventually everyone will have health care and it will be so cheap that it will be idiotic to argue about it. This is similar to most everything progressives want, the problem is they want it now and don't realize by getting it now it ruins or staves off the possibility of it happening in the not so distant future naturally...

That's my opinion although there are other factors i think...

Originally posted by whatukno
You want 12 kids? Well if you can afford them, go for it. If the education is available for you to get a job that provides you with the means to support 12 kids, then by all means have those 12 kids. Don't expect the taxpayer to support your litter. They will have the opportunity to be educated, they will have healthcare, other than that, it's up to the parent to provide for those kids.

From a blank slate this is fine. But if you cant afford a litter and have one anyway and those kids end up living solely off of the free low quality stuff. Having been further diluted by the litter of even lower quality now than it was.

Meanwhile, the couple who plans and can afford it send their kid off to private school.

Already a massive class gap is forming only because one couple planned and one was reckless. There are far more reckless people than planners. eventually this gets s right back to where we are today with the LCD voting itself the treasury.